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[nkirbit]

If we're going to lynch someone in the background, I'd much rather it be Xeiron.  Mail-Mi had a scummy reaction to Ash's "case" on raerae, but I think Xeiron's reaction was way similar scummier.  Mail-mi was a little odd about asking who he should re-read, but I'm much more troubled by Xeiron's challenge of Theorel's math.  The "How do you know" line that TA and mail-mi highlighted is much more scummy to me than simply "who should I reread".  I think town!mail-mi would ask who to re-read a lot.. I'm not sure that town!xeiron uses the phrase that he did.

I need to start proofreading better

[ashersky]

Quotefails!

Vote: TwistedArcher I guess is a better play than not vote here. My vote is very much for sale still, though.

Eevee, how does this vote for TA match up with what you said two posts before it, here:

I don't see myself voting for anybody who's been in the foreground during day1. 

I've been manifesting this for god knows how long. I agree. The problem is that in this game I think almost everyone is "treding lightly" and not being overly aggressive. Ashersky I guess is the boldest, but he is the one guy that could very conceivably play scum like that.

TA is foreground, man.

I'm not sure what the "this" Eevee has been manifesting is, but he doesn't actually indicate agreement with Shraeye, or say he'll only vote for background players.

What are your thoughts on the two words I bolded there?  For reference, they are "I agree."  That usually indicates agreement.

Oh semantics? Like. I agree, lynching the guy who just disappears and doesn't post for 4 days is not our best shot at getting mafia. Nor is the guy who typed "I agree" and then "I only partially agree" to the same thing later. I agree scum is generally in the background, the guys you don't even remember are playing (because scum tries really hard to not mess up while town often posts without giving it too much thought.)

However, a lot of the things TA did I found subtly scummy. Now he did something I thought was very towny in defending mail-mi.

I was asking EFHW, not you.  EFHW claims you didn't agree with shraeye.  I claim you did agree with shraeye.  Because you did, in fact, agree with shraeye.

Funny reaction from you there, given the post wasn't even directed at you...

[Twistedarcher]

Seriously though, if you have a minute, go read mail-mi's re-read of Eevee in Pirates, and then read his re-read of Xeiron here. Every post he made on Eevee in Pirates was him trying to cram a scum read in when he could. This one DOES NOT read the same way.

Give me a post number!

725 and 732

[nkirbit]

I don't see why his annoyance at the tracker references is scummy.  I mean, it's probably just a frustration thing... I wasn't even alive day2, and reading those I had a reaction to them.  But mail-mi would probably be a little annoyed by those references regardless of his alignment here, right?  I don't see why his reaction is scummy.. he said he was voting because he was annoyed with you, and I do believe he was in fact annoyed with you.  What's scummy there?

I think voting simply because you are annoyed is at the very least anti-town, and can easily be an easy excuse to vote for town.

Don't you think making the same joke that you know is going to annoy a couple of players in the game is anti-town, as well?

Scum!Mail-mi could be saying "Man, I'm annoyed at these jokes, I'm going to use my annoyance as an excuse for my vote on Ash".  But was that vote ever really going to take off?  I just don't see the incentives there.

I can also see scum!ash saying "I'm going to continue to make these jokes to provoke reactions from a certain subset of players, and when they lash out at me, I'm going to save there reactions to use later in a case".  That seems possible as well.. and more likely to work successfully!

Granted, what I really think happened is that you were joking around, and mail-mi reacted because he was annoyed.  It's a null tell on both of you.  But certainly not a scum-tell on mail-mi for me, at all.

[Eevee]

I thought it was!


Actually, about mail-mi. When you want to do a reread of someone as a "chore" to help town, it's pretty natural to choose the person with the lowest post count. Like, I can see mail-mi thinking "I have some spare time now, I want to help!" and asking who to reread, then realizing someone might suggest ashersky or TA, realizing the amount of effort rereading them would take and deciding to choose the target himself, landing on one of the easier tasks. And then, people with low post counts often seem scummy, and it's kind of natural to want to validate your work by having it bring results, so the vote makes sense too.

[Eevee]

I'm actually leaning towards suspecting Xeiron the most, interesting.

I know I've asked town who to reread (as town) in similar situation, so definitely not reading that as scummy.

[ashersky]

I'm actually leaning towards suspecting Xeiron the most, interesting.

I know I've asked town who to reread (as town) in similar situation, so definitely not reading that as scummy.

X gets the same "always scummy" treatment as mail-mi, I think.

[EFHW]

I was asking EFHW, not you.  EFHW claims you didn't agree with shraeye.  I claim you did agree with shraeye.  Because you did, in fact, agree with shraeye.

Funny reaction from you there, given the post wasn't even directed at you...

It looks like I misread.  I thought the "I agree" referred to whatever he was saying he has manifested for a long time.  I read manifested as in "I am like that a lot", but maybe he meant "I have said that a lot".

So, given that he did agree and then voted for TA, what makes it scummy?  I know it's a contradiction, but what would make scum contradict themselves here more than town?

[nkirbit]

Speaking of background players, Theorel hasn't posted in like 60 hours.  Is he V/LA or something?

[ashersky]

Post count!

archetype - 50
ashersky - 124
Eevee - 69
xieron - 12
raerae - 50
mail-mi - 48
TA - 109
chairs - 22
shraeye - 40
Ahoppy - 42
EFHW - 85
spiritbears - 66
theorel - 29
nkirbit - 73

[ashersky]

Speaking of background players, Theorel hasn't posted in like 60 hours.  Is he V/LA or something?

He's about as active as he always is in mafia games.

[nkirbit]

I'm actually leaning towards suspecting Xeiron the most, interesting.

I know I've asked town who to reread (as town) in similar situation, so definitely not reading that as scummy.

X gets the same "always scummy" treatment as mail-mi, I think.

What are your views on a Xeiron lynch?

[mail-mi]

Post count: look at that. X, chairs, and theorelin the 10s to 20s, the next lowest being Ahops at 42. Chairs is vla. Theorel has a lot of content. X has no excuse.

[Twistedarcher]

I'm actually leaning towards suspecting Xeiron the most, interesting.

I know I've asked town who to reread (as town) in similar situation, so definitely not reading that as scummy.

X gets the same "always scummy" treatment as mail-mi, I think.

What do you think of the points mail-mi made in his re-read? Do you agree or disagree with them?

[ashersky]

I think X is scummy, too.  It isn't like he's a bad lynch or anything.

I think there's more to go on for the mail-mi case.  I won't stop an X lynch, but it'd be surprising for him to be scum.  If this was his first scum game, I'd expect him to be more excited, and therefore posting more to stay alive.

[nkirbit]

Vote: Xeiron

I do agree that we should lynch someone in the background.  Out of those people, Xeiron is my preferred lynch.

[nkirbit]

I think X is scummy, too.  It isn't like he's a bad lynch or anything.

I think there's more to go on for the mail-mi case.  I won't stop an X lynch, but it'd be surprising for him to be scum.  If this was his first scum game, I'd expect him to be more excited, and therefore posting more to stay alive.

Hasn't Xeiron been scum before?  I remember reading a game where he was scum.

[Twistedarcher]

Ash, Eevee, EFHW (anyone else who's around right now), are you all still against a SB lynch? It's my preferred lynch today, but if it's not going to happen, I will move my vote to Xeiron. But I'd much prefer to lynch Spiritbears.

[ashersky]

I think X is scummy, too.  It isn't like he's a bad lynch or anything.

I think there's more to go on for the mail-mi case.  I won't stop an X lynch, but it'd be surprising for him to be scum.  If this was his first scum game, I'd expect him to be more excited, and therefore posting more to stay alive.

Hasn't Xeiron been scum before?  I remember reading a game where he was scum.

Hmmm.  Maybe?

[Eevee]

I'm not against spirit lynch, I'm actually very null on him come to think of it.. which is a scum trait, ding ding.

[ashersky]

Ash, Eevee, EFHW (anyone else who's around right now), are you all still against a SB lynch? It's my preferred lynch today, but if it's not going to happen, I will move my vote to Xeiron. But I'd much prefer to lynch Spiritbears.

I'm neutral on sb.  Could go either way.

[ashersky]

You know the problem with an X lynch?  Zero info gained from his flip, either way.  I mean, that's a good reason to lurk if you are scum, but still.

The only real interaction we have is mail-mi's re-read.  And if X is scum, mail-mi got lucky or is bussing.

[Twistedarcher]

Then vote him! He still hasn't provided adequate answers to my questions, or any answers at all. I know the personal stuff is getting in the way (and sorry SB, I really don't mean this personally at all), but I still do like my case. I can repost it if it makes it so people don't have to dig through the thread to find it.

[ashersky]

Then vote him! He still hasn't provided adequate answers to my questions, or any answers at all. I know the personal stuff is getting in the way (and sorry SB, I really don't mean this personally at all), but I still do like my case. I can repost it if it makes it so people don't have to dig through the thread to find it.

You are asking us to vote a neutral read over our scum reads.  That doesn't sound odd to you?

[Eevee]

You know the problem with an X lynch?  Zero info gained from his flip, either way.  I mean, that's a good reason to lurk if you are scum, but still.

The only real interaction we have is mail-mi's re-read.  And if X is scum, mail-mi got lucky or is bussing.

Obviously there would still be information. Who voted, who didn't?

The "If he was scum, he'd be more excited and post more" argument kind of does give me some pause about xeiron though. Changed my mind, don't want him lynched I don't think..