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Author Topic: Dominification of DCSS?  (Read 3607 times)

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popsofctown

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Dominification of DCSS?
« on: February 17, 2014, 07:02:30 pm »
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I decided to make this a separate thread since it's more dominion related and people might be interested in the design concepts without a specific interest in Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup.

Both DCSS and Dominion are games that you can play solitaire, and it functions just fine for that.  Dominion has a great way of combining the solitaire experiences to make things more interesting, even if there are no attack cards.

DCSS currently has no multiplayer functionality at all.  They frequently mention tournaments, but if you look and find out how the "tournament was structured", it was largely a competition of who sat in front of a pc the longest to grind the most wins within two weeks.


The only easy way of adding interactivity I can think of would be to replicate the "strategy selection" phase of Dominion. 

Two players go into a chatroom, where a script is running.  The script repeatedly offers pairs of initial settings, along with monotheistic or duotheistic god restrictions.

Each player secretly messages the script which of those options it finds better.  In the likely event they choose the same thing, the pair is thrown away and a new pair is generated, until the players disagree.

Once the players disagree, each player gets the settings he chose and gets a small finite number of attempts at a high rune count (I'm thinking 3).  Only the best run counts, and whoever got the most runes wins (with some kind of tiebreaker).

The reason I don't think you should count the weak runs is that it would over-emphasize consistency.  Consistency is already inherently emphasized, if you consistently get to Lair you have 3 times the chance to get a unique weapon in Lair that carries you to a high runecount win than if you didn't.

It would go something like:

Human Fighter who only worships Cherybdas or Xom OR Naga Venom Mage who only worships The Shining One


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Grujah

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2014, 07:11:01 pm »
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I was to suggest something similar, like we all play same thing for a week and the best guy wins, but anything works as long as it is challenging and has competitive element. Your idea is cute, I actually do like it.

And things more playable than NaVM of TSO, please :D
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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2014, 07:45:18 pm »
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Well in my example, both players would probably secretly pick the human instead of the NaVM.  So that gets thrown out, and a new pair is generated.

It's possible to choose between two bad options but that could be fun.
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Grujah

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2014, 07:54:05 pm »
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Yeah, I do know, and I am ok with picking between two challenging/bad options, but as long as they are "playable".

Also talking about "high rune count" and "win" is funny, cuz I am still to actually get to Zot :D

Anyway, /in.
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heron

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2014, 08:03:11 pm »
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I would play.
Are you allowed to remain atheist? In that case NaVM^nobody is pretty even with HuFi^Chei.
I think you probably will have to allow atheism since sometimes you don't find an altar.
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Grujah

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2014, 08:07:49 pm »
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Well, I guess NaVM^TSO is just that, you either play NaVM and get TSO very briefly and immediately resign or eschew poison and play it as some other class. Though I don't find much use in discussing this further.


You are always guaranteed the altar to all "usual" Gods till D:9 (Either in Temple or Dungeon levels). Usual Gods = everything sans Lugonu (guaranteed in Abyss), Jiyva (Guaranteed in Slime) and Beogh (you can convert via Orc Priests).


Edit: and yeah, number of runs limit might be "less grindy" than time limit, but does it work on honor system or do we have to play online? I'd be hard pressed to play online, honestly :/
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 08:12:07 pm by Grujah »
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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2014, 09:02:23 pm »
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If it's just us we can definitely use honor system.  I was hoping to sell it to the fancy DCSS people eventually though, and they would verify it amongst eachother with the online.  It lags like a mug, but I play there because I can access my game from any PC.

I might want to get a lot better at the game before throwing down the gauntlet.

RE: atheism, yeah, atheism is fine, I don't want to ban atheism.  Forcing players to actually worship a god that doesn't get along well with their species is sufficiently different from normal gameplay that I would want to avoid testing that "skill".  Playing Naga with a Demigod restriction is different from normal gameplay but it's not totally bizarre.


For the record, I think you may be wrong.  TSO doesn't act wrathfully if you leave him to become an atheist, and you can use poison once you're atheist.  Thus, you could worship TSO for a brief period in midgame, get enough piety to obtain a blessed weapon, then abandon him and spam poison as much as you like.  You could do this during an undead section that gets you lots of piety and where poison wouldn't help anyway.
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Grujah

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2014, 10:32:17 pm »
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We need

a) more pps
b) this in forum games
c) start it soon actually :D
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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2014, 12:55:26 pm »
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pps?

I wanted to 3rune win first, but, do you think if we advertise in forum games we can pick up a couple more people? If so I would not want to win yet because that would put me further ahead.
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heron

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2014, 06:59:22 pm »
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Maybe instead of just giving two totally separate choices it should give 3-4 options each for species, background, and god, to allow for more choices.
Do you think this would be a good idea?
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Grujah

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2014, 07:01:18 pm »
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pps should have been "people".

I think more narrow is ok.
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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2014, 11:38:24 pm »
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Maybe instead of just giving two totally separate choices it should give 3-4 options each for species, background, and god, to allow for more choices.
Do you think this would be a good idea?

I think that increases the luck factor.  You want the actual difference betweeen the species-background and god chosen to be as large as popular.  The best strategy for getting that is to repeatedly present two choices that are very different in actual power level and waiting for someone to screw up and pick the wrong mega loser.  Giving species/background/god clusters means you're picking items from the same set of species-background-god combos, but they are biased upwards since players can pick the best one.  And when you bias upwards, that means on average their actual power level will be closer together.

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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2014, 04:28:11 pm »
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I think we should keep wanderer out of the mix, it's not recommended for any species and it "hides" some of the initial conditions and hurts the system.  Chaos warrior is legit though.  Xom's not that random if you study him.
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popsofctown

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Re: Dominification of DCSS?
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2014, 06:58:09 pm »
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Maybe we could try a 4 player round robin if/when walrus is comfortable with the game somewhat.  Rounds will probably take a long time and all.
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