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[Watno]

Does anyone remember what exactly Donald said about cards that allow you to play treasure in your action phase? Did it imply that that's not what this expansion will have? It's what I'd expect if he didn't.

[Kirian]

Autumn starts on March 1 etc.

March 1? Now that is weird. Shouldn't it be on an equinox?

Not necessarily.  It would make more sense for "midwinter" to actually be in the middle of winter.

A couple things about this. First, you are talking solstice, whilst I was talking equinox. Not super relevant. Second, 'midwinter' is a day which has colloquially been applied to the day on which the solstice occurred, but I certainly wasn't advocating such a term, nor do solstices need to be tied to them by any means. Third, it's a semantic argument - I mean, what defines winter? One could argue that winter is defined such that the astronomical event stands in the middle of the season. Or you could talk about it being cold. So, the thing you have to remember is that whilst the days get shorter or longer in relation to the movement of the sun, the shortest day of the year is not the coldest (well, rarely it is by fluke, but...). It's the same reason that the hottest part of a day is generally in the afternoon, and not at noon. It may be maximally heating at noon, but it continues to heat up for a bit afterwards.

Also remember that the Celtic culture, from whom we originally took the terms midsummer and midwinter, reckoned the seasons differently, with the feast days that they (and neopagans) called Samhain (the origin of Halloween), Imbolc (the origin of, of all things, Groundhog Day), Beltane ( related to May Day) and Lughnasa (near 01 August) being the start of their seasons.  In that context, Midsummer (summer solstice, ~20 June) is very close to the actual middle of summer (15 June by this reckoning).  Many other European cultures of the middle ages reckoned the season in the same way.  Some in China, Japan, and Korea reckon the seasons similarly, though with the season changes falling somewhere between the 5th and the 10th of each month, making the summer solstice even closer to midsummer.

Meanwhile, meteorologists use yet a different definition, the one Jimmmmm was talking about: spring starts on 01 March, summer on 01 June, and so on.

Meanwhile meanwhile, temperatures in ANZ and southern S. America, due to their climates, have hot seasons that start earlier--hence, they usually use 01 June for the start of summer.

So, to recap:

~01 May: start of summer in the Middle Ages and neopaganism
~05 May: start of summer in parts of SE Asia
01 June: start of summer for meteorologists and ANZ residents
~20 June: start of summer for astronomers, North Americans, and most Europeans; traditionally, midsummer.

[enfynet]

It's 150 cards. All cards not used for kingdom cards or their randomizers are blank.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/951319/how-many-cards-in-this-one

He doesn't say how many. It could be anything from 0-7 based on what we know about Kingdom Cards.

[eHalcyon]

If you go by temperature, my spring won't start for another month or so.

Also, we don't have summer.  We have road construction/repair.

[Watno]

It's 150 cards. All cards not used for kingdom cards or their randomizers are blank.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/951319/how-many-cards-in-this-one

He doesn't say how many. It could be anything from 0-7 based on what we know about Kingdom Cards.

But it does mean that there will be nothing like a "goal card".

[werothegreat]

It's 150 cards. All cards not used for kingdom cards or their randomizers are blank.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/951319/how-many-cards-in-this-one

He doesn't say how many. It could be anything from 0-7 based on what we know about Kingdom Cards.

But it does mean that there will be nothing like a "goal card".

I was about to say "why do we need more blanks?" but I actually used a blank the other day when I discovered I was missing a Smithy.     So I took a blank and wrote "smithy" on it.

[Kirian]

If you go by temperature, my spring won't start for another month or so.

Also, we don't have summer.  We have road construction/repair.

Michigan I assume?

(Down here just south of the MI border, we also have Michigan seasons.)

[eHalcyon]

If you go by temperature, my spring won't start for another month or so.

Also, we don't have summer.  We have road construction/repair.

Michigan I assume?

(Down here just south of the MI border, we also have Michigan seasons.)

Farther north, in Alberta.

[A Drowned Kernel]

With the whole coin token thing, I'm thinking we're going to get a number of cards that are very "simple", which is interesting. If all the rules for how the coins work is in the rulebook, you can have an action card that's just like "+1 coin token" or something.

[Beyond Awesome]

With the whole coin token thing, I'm thinking we're going to get a number of cards that are very "simple", which is interesting. If all the rules for how the coins work is in the rulebook, you can have an action card that's just like "+1 coin token" or something.

I doubt we will get many simple cards, 3 at most would be my guess. Donald has already stated Guilds is the most complex expansion ever.

[werothegreat]

Well, it's less complex than Cornucopia, at least in terms of code on iso, though that might just be the Prizes bumping Cornucopia up.

[cactus]

http://www.riograndegames.com/games.html?id=448

Jobs, everyone’s worried about jobs. Whatever happened to tilling the fields in obscurity? The economy is just a trick, like stealing someone's nose, but lately people seem to have seen through it, like when you realize someone hasn’t really stolen your nose. So now everyone’s joining a guild, learning a craft, and working on a masterpiece - a painting so beautiful it blinds you, or a cheese grater so amazing that you never eat cheese again. The only people left tilling the fields are the ones doing it ironically. The guilds cover everything - ironic tilling, butchering, baking, candlestick making, shoemaking, cheesemaking, cheese destruction. Your advisor is convinced that somehow, control of the stonecutters is key to world domination. Very well. You will have stone handled so expertly that the world trembles before you.

This is the 8th addition to the game of Dominion. It adds 13 new Kingdom cards to Dominion. It has coin tokens that you can save to spend later, and cards you can get more out of by paying extra for them.

There are a few good lines in this blurb.... now if only Goko had hired the guy who wrote this to write the script for the adventures. 

[dondon151]

Donald X. writes the descriptions.

[SirPeebles]

Kirian's talk of Celtic pagan astronomy reminded me of this recent comic from Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal.  It also fits in with this thread's cheese subtheme.

[eHalcyon]

Always include the extra!

[Archetype]

The "coins used later" reminds me of a fan card I saw a long time ago.

It went something like:

Orchard?
Cost: 5
Treasure

$2
Whenever you gain a card while this card is in play, put a Fruit Token on your Basket Mat.

FAQ: Fruit Tokens can be spent during your Buy Phase for +1$.

I thought it was a really cool idea, and am excited that it's becoming the theme for an expansion! Thanks LastFootnote!

[Davio]

I think strings of €7 Duchies are pretty annoying, so looks like help is on the way

[philosophyguy]

So on the overpaying theme, what about a card like (not balanced):

Super Village - $3
+1 Card
+2 Actions
When you buy this card, if you pay at least $2 more than the cost, you may play an additional Action card immediately.

[LastFootnote]

So on the overpaying theme, what about a card like (not balanced):

Super Village - $3
+1 Card
+2 Actions
When you buy this card, if you pay at least $2 more than the cost, you may play an additional Action card immediately.

I think playing an Action card during the buy phase is unlikely.

[philosophyguy]

I think playing an Action card during the buy phase is unlikely.

Well, it would certainly add a new strategic depth to terminal draw. If you draw an action dead, you can overpay for your village and still play it.

[ftl]

It seems plausible. Would have to be phrased differently - "go back to your action phase, +1 action" or something like that. That way you're not playing an action during your buy phase, you're just going back to your action phase. (As it is, if you just played an action during your buy phase, that would probably be unhelpful, since you wouldn't be able to play any more actions OR play any more treasures, since you've already bought a card).

[ftl]

In general, I bet the formula of

[vanilla-ish card]
When you buy this, you may spend [$x] extra;
if you do, [on-buy effect]

will be used more than once. You have a wide selection of standard on-buy effects to stick on to there. A card with an on-buy Navigator ability? An on-buy Scheme? an on-buy  trasher? I think Donald has previously said that an on-buy Militia was tried out and was hated, so we won't see that. Or of course more exotic stuff like the return-to-action-phase, or saving up coins to spend later.

[eHalcyon]

It seems plausible. Would have to be phrased differently - "go back to your action phase, +1 action" or something like that. That way you're not playing an action during your buy phase, you're just going back to your action phase. (As it is, if you just played an action during your buy phase, that would probably be unhelpful, since you wouldn't be able to play any more actions OR play any more treasures, since you've already bought a card).

What world that mean for the buy phase then? When you finish your action phase the second time, would you be able to play more treasure? Do you automatically get another buy, or only if you played a +buy
Going back to the action phase still adds a lot of rules weirdness. It's possible, but still unlikely, imo.

[SirPeebles]

I think playing an Action during your buy phase like this is OK.  Certainly preferable to warping back to the Action phase temporarily.  Unless there's some broken interaction that I'm missing.

This also raises the question of cost balancing with overpaying bonuses.  On-gain/on-buy bonuses demand a premium, perhaps the clearest examples being cards like Nomad Camp, Border Village, and Cache which are virtually identical to differently priced cards if you disregard the on-gain bonus/penalty.  Does there need to be any such price adjustment for an overpaying bonus?  My guess is no.

Cheese Destroyers Guild
$3 Action

+1 Card
+2 Actions

When you buy this, if you spend $2 extra you may trash a card from your hand.

[werothegreat]

Cheese Destroyers Guild
$3 Action

+1 Card
+2 Actions

When you buy this, if you spend $2 extra you may trash a card from your hand.

This makes my head hurt because it's strictly better than Village, but not.