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Author Topic: Theme speculation  (Read 11898 times)

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werothegreat

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Theme speculation
« on: March 06, 2013, 12:25:34 am »
+1

What sort of theme will there be?  The large expansions tend to introduce a new mechanic (durations, victory tokens, when-gain effects).  While Alchemy introduced the Potion, the cards themselves were simply Action-centered, and Cornucopia just had variety-centered cards.  So my thought is that Guilds will not introduce a new mechanic, but focus around a heretofore unfocused-on aspect of the game.  Someone has bandied about the idea of the discard pile for the theme - what else could it be?  Interaction?  Buys?

Now, we can't rule out a new mechanic - Donald X did say (and I'm paraphrasing) that this one was going to be wacky.
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2013, 12:50:46 am »
0

I definitely think there will be some kind of new mechanic.  This is solely based on comments Donald has made when he talked about deciding to do this expansion instead of Seaside 2.
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DG

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2013, 01:08:02 am »
+2

I'm guessing there will be worker cards and guild cards. Workers have their own action but you can use a guild to give them a special action. Workers will be a new supply pile, always present for guilds.
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Davio

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2013, 05:43:39 am »
+1

Neat idea, DG.

How do you imagine this would work?

Like: your basic worker is +1 Card, +1 Action but if you play a Workers Guild first they all become Villages?
Or if you play a Merchants Guild they all become Peddlers?
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Drab Emordnilap

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2013, 09:28:08 am »
0

Crazy idea --

Worker - $0
Action

+1 Action
+$1


You get 7 of them, instead of your starting Copper (depending on the percentage of Guilds cards in your Kingdom). Guilds's theme is "playing actions". Peddler and Conspirator would be examples of on-theme cards.
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RTT

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2013, 09:35:54 am »
0

Crazy idea --

Worker - $0
Action

+1 Action
+$1


You get 7 of them, instead of your starting Copper (depending on the percentage of Guilds cards in your Kingdom). Guilds's theme is "playing actions". Peddler and Conspirator would be examples of on-theme cards.


noone would buy smithy and other terminal draw anymore

i think this would be a bit boring (espacialy online) and leads to longer turns
example for a turn 1:
Quote
...plays a worker getting 1 action and 1$
...plays a worker ...
...plays a worker ...
...plays a worker ...
...buys a peddler

noone would buy a smithy or other terminal draw anymore and conspirator and scrying pool would be owerpowered
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 09:37:42 am by RTT »
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Drab Emordnilap

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2013, 09:37:33 am »
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I'd like to think that Guilds was designed long enough ago that specific online interface quirks weren't a consideration. In person I'd plop down a hand of workers the same way I would a hand of Copper.

Also, yes, Smithy would be worse, but Shelters makes cards that care about Estates, Victory Cards, or the cost of cards in your deck worse. Colony games make lots of cheap cards worse (even Silver).
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 09:38:55 am by Drab Emordnilap »
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Davio

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2013, 09:56:45 am »
0

I like "cards that influence other cards played after this card" as an idea.

So in my previous example the Guilds, if played first, would modify the Workers.

Another simple way to do this would be:

SomeCard
+1 Action
+$1 for every Action played after this

Or a bit more difficult:

SomeOtherCard
+1 Action
Every time you play an Action after this, you may discard a card. If you do: +1 Card.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2013, 10:00:41 am »
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The thing is, we know Guilds has 13 Kingdom cards. Unless some of the have fewer than 10 cards, there's only 7 cards left over. I doubt we'll see a Worker stack.
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2013, 10:34:19 am »
0

I must have a completely different definition for Guild from outside the gaming community because nothing you guys are saying makes sense to me. :-/
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AHoppy

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2013, 04:59:06 pm »
0

The thing is, we know Guilds has 13 Kingdom cards. Unless some of the have fewer than 10 cards, there's only 7 cards left over. I doubt we'll see a Worker stack.

My thought is the 7 extra cards are 7 different guilds.  you have to do something special to earn those cards.  Like the first person to buy a province has to take the builder's guild card, and maybe it isn't a very great one.  Or the first person to play a certain number of actions or money cards gets some action guild or banker's guild.  Not sure what the guilds will do, But I think it would be cool having different objectives to work towards.  So like engine vs. big money, you could go for the actions guild, which would be able to enable an engine on a board otherwise dominated by BM.  The banker's guild would make BM more competitive on a action heavy board.  There could be an alt vp one as well.  Now obviously they all wouldn't be useful in every game, but maybe they would make multiple paths more viable on boards more dominated by a particular deck type.

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2013, 05:44:37 pm »
0

Maybe the Guilds are distributed at random and give different alternate Victory conditions.
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AHoppy

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2013, 06:24:04 pm »
0

That would be pretty cool too.  or something like the guilds from 7 wonders where only a few of them are available.  And maybe instead of gaining them by being the first to achieve something, it could be "you can't buy this until you do X"

SirPeebles

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2013, 06:30:53 pm »
0

Regarding the name, he did say that he made the cards first, and then gave the name, rather than vice-versa.  I feel that the only expansions titles to date which really reflect the new mechanics are Prosperity and arguably Cornucopia (although it originated as just being harvest festival themed.)
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eHalcyon

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2013, 07:22:18 pm »
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The thing is, we know Guilds has 13 Kingdom cards. Unless some of the have fewer than 10 cards, there's only 7 cards left over. I doubt we'll see a Worker stack.

My thought is the 7 extra cards are 7 different guilds.  you have to do something special to earn those cards.  Like the first person to buy a province has to take the builder's guild card, and maybe it isn't a very great one.  Or the first person to play a certain number of actions or money cards gets some action guild or banker's guild.  Not sure what the guilds will do, But I think it would be cool having different objectives to work towards.  So like engine vs. big money, you could go for the actions guild, which would be able to enable an engine on a board otherwise dominated by BM.  The banker's guild would make BM more competitive on a action heavy board.  There could be an alt vp one as well.  Now obviously they all wouldn't be useful in every game, but maybe they would make multiple paths more viable on boards more dominated by a particular deck type.

So kind of like Achievements in Innovation?  That would be neat.
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2013, 04:30:23 am »
0

I agree that Guilds will utilize the 7 extra cards, but I think there will be only 6 guild cards (one for each player for up to a 6 player game). I think the seventh card will be a blank. And I also kind of think that they may be items that are gained by revealing cards in hand as an action. Players will be limited to 1 Guild per game. Thus:

Barons' Guild – Reveal 5 Estates to gain this card.
Nobles' Guild – Reveal 4 Duchies to gain this card.
Royals' Guild – Reveal 3 Provinces to gain this card.
Silversmiths' Guild – Reveal 7 Silvers to gain this card.
Goldsmiths' Guild – Reveal 5 Gold to gain this card.
Villain's Guild – Reveal 3 Curses to gain this card.

The cards themselves will be slightly unbalanced (like Prizes) but also more focused on what earned the player the Guild. Thus...

Reveal an Estate. If you do, gain a Gold.
Reveal a Duchy. If you do, gain a Silver and an Estate.
Reveal a Province. If you do, gain a Gold and a Duchy.
Once per turn as an action, trade a Copper for a Silver.
Once per turn as an action, trade a Silver for a Gold
At game end, all Curses are worth 1 Victory Point.
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Davio

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2013, 05:47:51 am »
0

The thing is, we know Guilds has 13 Kingdom cards. Unless some of the have fewer than 10 cards, there's only 7 cards left over. I doubt we'll see a Worker stack.

My thought is the 7 extra cards are 7 different guilds.  you have to do something special to earn those cards.  Like the first person to buy a province has to take the builder's guild card, and maybe it isn't a very great one.  Or the first person to play a certain number of actions or money cards gets some action guild or banker's guild.  Not sure what the guilds will do, But I think it would be cool having different objectives to work towards.  So like engine vs. big money, you could go for the actions guild, which would be able to enable an engine on a board otherwise dominated by BM.  The banker's guild would make BM more competitive on a action heavy board.  There could be an alt vp one as well.  Now obviously they all wouldn't be useful in every game, but maybe they would make multiple paths more viable on boards more dominated by a particular deck type.
Again a pretty cool idea.

I love how these guilds automatically help the strategy you're already going for.

Another one for rushes could be: If you gained 2 or more cards this turn, gain [ThisGuild]. And [ThisGuild] would be something like: +1 Action, gain a card costing up to $4 or something.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2013, 06:12:32 am »
+1

Silversmiths' Guild – Reveal 7 Silvers to gain this card.
thats....a lot of silvers.
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AHoppy

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2013, 07:16:45 am »
0

what about this:  Instead of earning the guilds, there is a draft for them at the beginning of the game.  That might end up being too unbalanced, since there aren't enough guilds for everyone to get the one they want, but in that case it would require you to plan ahead more than usual since you'll pick the guild best suited to the what you think the best strategy will be

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #19 on: March 07, 2013, 05:18:04 pm »
0

Maybe the "guilds" in the name are collaborations between players, and the new game mechanic would be something like an attack, only beneficial instead of harmful.  Something like a card would be marked "ACTION - ASSIST" and for example could say "+2 cards +1 action, +1 card for another player you choose."  And perhaps there would be a new REACTION card that can be revealed when a player that isn't you plays an assist on someone who isn't you that gives you twice the benefit.  Granted, this wouldn't add much to two-player games.
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2013, 05:31:08 pm »
0

Maybe the "guilds" in the name are collaborations between players, and the new game mechanic would be something like an attack, only beneficial instead of harmful.  Something like a card would be marked "ACTION - ASSIST" and for example could say "+2 cards +1 action, +1 card for another player you choose."  And perhaps there would be a new REACTION card that can be revealed when a player that isn't you plays an assist on someone who isn't you that gives you twice the benefit.  Granted, this wouldn't add much to two-player games.
I don't think Donald X. would make political cards on purpose.

I'm betting that "Guilds" won't be an actual mechanic (unless this is confirmed already and I have missed it).
« Last Edit: March 07, 2013, 05:34:19 pm by Awaclus »
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2013, 05:45:39 pm »
+1

I think it's been mentioned, but messing with the discard pile seems like it would be a reasonable mechanic. Dark Ages had stuff which messes with trashing, so why not discarding? A few more on-discard abilities like Tunnel's, cards which count your discard pile or gain copies of cards in the discard pile or stuff like that.

Would have nothing to do with 'guilds' the name, but that's okay.
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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2013, 06:20:24 pm »
0

In the secret histories, are there any cards that are mentioned to have come from the last two expansions that we haven't seen yet?
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AHoppy

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2013, 07:31:47 pm »
0

I think it's been mentioned, but messing with the discard pile seems like it would be a reasonable mechanic. Dark Ages had stuff which messes with trashing, so why not discarding? A few more on-discard abilities like Tunnel's, cards which count your discard pile or gain copies of cards in the discard pile or stuff like that.

Would have nothing to do with 'guilds' the name, but that's okay.

I don't like this idea.  Just because things already got complicated with the keep track rule from dark ages, I feel like discard rules would get even more complex.  besides, we already have hermit, inn, scavenger and I suppose chancellor that mess with your discard.  Wouldn't Donald have saved those for guilds then?

werothegreat

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Re: Theme speculation
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2013, 12:59:37 am »
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So, in the Donald X interview thread, he pretty much let slip that there definitely is a new mechanic for this expansion.
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