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Author Topic: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware -- GAME OVER, SCUM WIN  (Read 225645 times)

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Eevee

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #700 on: March 23, 2013, 09:45:02 pm »

In my experience Jimm is an excellent scum player (this is from blitz games). I don't know what way that sways me, but just putting it out there.

I haven't had a chance to reread, but I'd be looking at sparky/Jimmm/Insomniac/mcmc.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #701 on: March 24, 2013, 11:30:29 pm »

Argh this is moving so slow.
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ashersky

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #702 on: March 25, 2013, 02:41:36 am »

vote: Insom

We need to get this game going again.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #703 on: March 25, 2013, 09:18:36 am »

Could we have a vote count, I'm willing to vote for Jim, which may stir things up more.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #704 on: March 25, 2013, 09:42:35 am »

I think my vote is already on insom.
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Ozle

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #705 on: March 25, 2013, 09:46:49 am »

Ok, Where do we go now?

Nothing else is coming up out of night actions by the looks of it.

Who are viable Lynches?
Insomniac or Jimmm? Because im happy with either of them.

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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #706 on: March 25, 2013, 11:29:56 am »

So it looks like our options are turning into Jimmmm or Insomniac. I personally think that forcing a decision between those two players is a bit premature. Specifically I want to take a closer look at mcmc. Mcmc has been given something of a pass by most of town: the following excerpt is from lio and is an example of the general feel toward mcmc I believe.

Quote
mcmc is actually my biggest town read right now. like I said before, he was the only one actually against the kooshie lynch. His stance of claiming stuff seemed odd as scum, and most of all, his play seems different from DS9 and another dinner party, both of which he was scum in, and one of which I was scum with him in. I remember realizing right around his lynch in DS9 that his play was very similar to in another dinner party. It's different here.

Here lio provides a few reasons for why he thinks mcmc is townie and why he is his strongest read.

1. he was the only player defending kooshie. In the past this would be a scum signal. Defending a partner? But as of late bussing has become much more vogue. However, I think the tide may be starting to turn away from bussing. This is especially relevent when taking previous games into consideration. The past two games have been won by blatant scum defending scum action going on. Robz on mcmc in MXIX and yuma on EFHW in MXX. Whereas bussing has lost games of late. yuma on Glooble in MXIX, cayvie on Lekkit in MXVII. As such I have a much greater scum read on people that defend against scum lynches, not town reads.

2. any stance on claiming I think generally has no bearing on alignment because scum will generally express the opinions that they would have had if they were town.

3. He is playing a different game. This I am not so sure of. Especially w/o specifics being given.


Other reasons I am a bit suspicious of him...

1- He had a scumread on mail-mi. While I won't give mail-mi confirmed town status, I think he is pretty close to it, because he was the other viable lynch option and I just don't see scum allowing two of their players to become the focus day1. That would just be terrible play I think. As such, mcmc had a scum read on an almost IC.

Dissmissive yuma is unlike the town yuma I know, scum read for you. Not because of your position but the way you said it.

Quote
Yuma and mail-mi are fine lynch targets for me today.
In fact, vote: Mail-mi he seemed to change the thing he was doing that made me find him scummy. Whether that is scum trying to reel in his scumminess or town becoming towny as the game goes on I have yet to tell. But for now I am happy with this.

2 - I found his vote on me for being dismissive to be somewhat scummy. It was like he was looking for an excuse to vote for me and then jumped on it once he found it.

3 - he is also on the active enough to not attract notice but not super super active. This isn't a huge reason, but I think is where scum generally lie.

Now, obviously I want raerae to get in on this because apparently she has super human abilities to read mcmc. And I am not necessarily going to vote for mcmc at this juncture, partially because I am still somewhat VLA--only using my old appt's internet while I am supposed to be cleaning... and I won't have internet in the new appt for a few days--but also because I am not sure if mcmc is a beter lynch candidate than Jimmmm. I think he is a better one than insomniac.

Robz--is it possible to change the OP subject to Day2 and then on day3, etc in subsequent days. It helps a lot when trying to do Print screen searches to know what day it is. Thanks!
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #707 on: March 25, 2013, 11:53:28 am »

In response yuma, when kooshie flipped town my scum read on mail-mi was gone, as I said in a previous post.
This is turning into MXXI...  I'm starting to think either liopoil or kooshie is scum...  Right after liopoil makes a big case on kooshie...
here is the kooshie quote

Actually, in disagreement w/ sudgy, i think liopoil is acting very similar to herself in the newbie game (he was scum.) Vote: liopoil

and here is the mail-mi vote.

Looking at this it also looks like scum distancing while pushing two town lynches.

I remember, this was my case on mail-mi. Well kooshie turned out to be scum. So my case is kinda gone, scum!mail-mi wouldn't set up a double lynch involving his scummate. Need to look at sudgy because I thought he was scummy too. Jimm is my top scum read now, just feels off to me, and I don't think I have ever seen scum!Jimm.

I said exactly what you did.

Also I agree the jimm, insom is not the only people we should look at. I do find jimm scummy for independent reasons which I stated, I wanted a vote count because i would vote for him to cause some more discussion which I think we can then use to look at more people. I will go back and review my other suspicions after my exam today.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #708 on: March 25, 2013, 11:56:12 am »

Got it so everytime I have a weekend I'm gonna get voted for even when I am just as active as everyone else. Just vote me out of this game already this is ridiculous.


Anyways having looked back. Vote: Sudgy

I think he is the most likely to be scum.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #709 on: March 25, 2013, 11:57:21 am »

Got it so everytime I have a weekend I'm gonna get voted for even when I am just as active as everyone else. Just vote me out of this game already this is ridiculous.


Anyways having looked back. Vote: Sudgy

I think he is the most likely to be scum.

probably going to support this, I thought he was scum yesterday but need to go back and check why and my other scum read was null and void today.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #710 on: March 25, 2013, 12:12:52 pm »

Got it so everytime I have a weekend I'm gonna get voted for even when I am just as active as everyone else. Just vote me out of this game already this is ridiculous.

Insom.... I am not going to vote you and will be pretty vocal against your lynch. I know you are frustrated and know that you are busy outside of this game. But if you are town, please don't reenact your lynch in MXX because 1. if you are town, you are a strong player and we need you. 2. if you are town, we don't want to lose our advantage we already have over scum. I dont' think I will be voting for you today unless you self vote. So please don't?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #711 on: March 25, 2013, 12:14:34 pm »

I for one will not be voting for sudgy today. He was on the Kooshie wagon and today I think our focus needs to be off wagon. Unless there is some sort of scum slip or some sort of investigation or crazy role shenanigans--which does not appear to be the case today--I will only be voting off wagon.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #712 on: March 25, 2013, 12:24:43 pm »

ins, I cant speak for others, but my issue with you isnt your low activity on weekends, it's the fact you didnt participate in lynching mafia yesterday. I don't think I'll be voting outside you/mcmc/sparky/Jimmm today, just got to decide between you four. My feeling says sparky, and I know I cant do rereads for at least a couple of days so

vote: sparky

yuma, why explicitly not Insomniac?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #713 on: March 25, 2013, 12:31:24 pm »

ins, I cant speak for others, but my issue with you isnt your low activity on weekends, it's the fact you didnt participate in lynching mafia yesterday. I don't think I'll be voting outside you/mcmc/sparky/Jimmm today, just got to decide between you four. My feeling says sparky, and I know I cant do rereads for at least a couple of days so

vote: sparky

yuma, why explicitly not Insomniac?

he reads like the frustrated townie insomniac I have seen soooo many times (MXIV, MXX). Like I said, he could be faking it. But I don't think he is faking.
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Ozle

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #714 on: March 25, 2013, 12:32:02 pm »

Im worried that everyone off wagon is happy to vote off wagon (which includes me)...when everyone agrees something then there is always bound to be scum in there.

Even more annoying that Xerion effectively stole my hammer now as it puts me off wagon. Although I suppose that narrows down the suspects for me.

I reckon we probably have two scum off wagon, but definitely believe we have one.

There isnt much to choose between the rest, and no one is really Under pressure so not much to be gained there.

We still have lots of time left before the deadline runs out so no need to rush this
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #715 on: March 25, 2013, 12:56:05 pm »

We still have lots of time left before the deadline runs out so no need to rush this

We've started eating into bankable time, so we should consider setting a soft deadline. Not a big issue yet, but something to start thinking about.

Robz can we get a vote count?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware (Day 2)
« Reply #716 on: March 25, 2013, 02:05:54 pm »

Vote Count 2.3

Insomniac (3) -- sudgy, mail-mi, ashersky
Jimm (2) -- Ozle, Jorbles
sudgy (1) -- Insomniac
sparky5856 (1) -- Eevee

Not Voting (7) -- sparky5856, mcmcsalot, yuma, Jimm, liopoil, Lekkit, raerae

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. The game ends on April 29th at 7:00 PM.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #717 on: March 25, 2013, 03:22:46 pm »

okay just want to mention there are now 8 alive that were on wagon and 6 alive that were off wagon. Why is off wagon such a better place to look. I mean I understand odds are all 4 scum didn't bus, but even if 2 bussed the odds aren't crazy better off wagon then on.

@Yuma: I will vote for the person I find most scummy and if we assume 2 scum on wagon and 2 off, being off wagon does not make you scummier. So your resistance to vote on wagon is interesting to me, as well as not voting for insom, especially seeing you were off wagon. You have narrowed your pool of will vote for to 4 people mcmc, jimm, ozzle, sparky. You are assuming 2 of which are scum, people(ash) keep coming up with these pools where they have a 50% chance or higher of finding scum out of very little. With a game of 14 people I find that crazy, now I don't necessarily find you scummy for this I am just worried about it and want the information out there.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware (Day 2)
« Reply #718 on: March 25, 2013, 03:25:00 pm »

Vote: Jimmmmmm.

I've given my reads. I'll take another look at mcmc and sudgy though. I still do not think insom is scum.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #719 on: March 25, 2013, 03:58:51 pm »

If you guys want the gold key, give me all your money.

I'm going to Vote: ashersky because of the reasons people have stated.  This is 50% RVS though.
Previously to this lekkit and insom voted ashersky for inflating his post count/extending rvs and not being normal town ash.
I also said this but didn't vote.
Ash, what he is doing is how he gets a post count that is double that of anyone else. However what he is doing is quite frustrating and likely to get a response out of people. Scum is very hard to catch when they are sitting at there computer making sure everything they type is towny. Frustrated posts however are often typed quickly and are a much easier place to catch scum.

If this was someone else, I would say town read however the post count inflating he has done really serves to make him a difficult lynch target which is something ash does not find a helpful quality in town.
Ash responds in this way.
vote: mcmcsalot

That one is real.

Inflating my post count?  Hilarious.  Check the post counts of the games I've been in recently.  I've been the top poster in three or four, without silly posting.  So your accusation reeks of scum building a bad case on a good lynch.

Yes, I am a fine lynch for D1.  We all are.  I created a situation where it is easy to vote for me.  Now, all of town has a number of interactions/opinions to look at when I flip town.

I guarantee scum is currently voting for me.  Mcmc is scummiest, mail-mi's most recent vote is terrible.  There have also been some towny reactions, too.

Also, I am the king of crazy claim ideas, and I think map claiming is bad on D1.
Now I have gone over before but this is a ridiculous statement in more ways then one. Having a usually high post count doesn't change the fact that posting repetitive one liners inflates your post count. I cannot stress enough "creating a situation where it is easy to vote for me" and saying "I guarantee scum is currently voting for me" Is CRAZY if you make it easy to vote for you, confused townies looking for scum are going to vote for you.

And here is sudgy unvoting because that was a towny reaction to the vote on him
Unvote.

The 50% of RVS was actually wanting to see ashersky's reaction.  His reaction seemed towny enough to me.

Here is an interesting post about insom, need to check what his stance on insom is now.
Actually, Liopoil is acting differently than I remember when he was scum...  This makes me think he's town.  This could change later though.

I voted for Insomniac because I'm trying to get him to post.  I don't like LaLL that much, while it can be useful sometimes (and lurking is scummy), I would rather lynch someone else.  If Insomniac suddenly was at L-1 or something, I would unvote.

I voted for Insomniac because I wanted to get him to start posting.  I thought that was clear when I voted, but when people started freaking out about it I said why.  I'll Unvote for now though.

Okay, he now votes kooshie, finally because she is lurking...the same thing he said was not a good reason to lynch someone a few posts back.
I think I agree enough with Liopoil to Vote: Kooshie.  She doesn't lurk like this usually.

Now day 2 he post this about insom
Is Insomniac usually this lurky?  I'm kind of suspicious of him from that, and Jimmmmm too.  He wasn't lurky in my earlier game with him (even though he was only alive D1)

So thats about everything, ugh I really wanted this to show more than I am getting from it. I guess sudgy I find sudgy scummy for flip slopping on vote for a lurker. Also, his vote on kooshie was the 4th vote, he then didn't post till kooshie's lynch was imminent. If scum is going to get stuck bussing D1 thats how it would happen. He is now voting for insom for lurking and that his reaction was scummy.
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Lekkit

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #720 on: March 25, 2013, 04:24:46 pm »

okay just want to mention there are now 8 alive that were on wagon and 6 alive that were off wagon. Why is off wagon such a better place to look. I mean I understand odds are all 4 scum didn't bus, but even if 2 bussed the odds aren't crazy better off wagon then on.

First, your math is wrong. We know for a fact that all all 4 scum didn't bus. Since one of them was lynched.

If 2 scum bussed then the odds of lynching scum are better on wagon than off. I don't think 2 out of 3 scum was on the wagon, though. I think there was 1 scum on the wagon and 2 off wagon. That makes it 1/8 scum on wagon and 2/6 off. I kind of agree with yuma that off wagon is better, but I still think there was scum on the wagon, and therefore it would be pretty bad to just ignore that. Even temporarily.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware (Day 2)
« Reply #721 on: March 25, 2013, 04:27:47 pm »

I agree that there is scum both on and off wagon, like there was in the games Yuma cited. I'm not so sure that it is more likely that there is two off wagon than two on-wagon.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware
« Reply #722 on: March 25, 2013, 04:36:31 pm »

If you guys want the gold key, give me all your money.

I'm going to Vote: ashersky because of the reasons people have stated.  This is 50% RVS though.
Previously to this lekkit and insom voted ashersky for inflating his post count/extending rvs and not being normal town ash.
I also said this but didn't vote.
Ash, what he is doing is how he gets a post count that is double that of anyone else. However what he is doing is quite frustrating and likely to get a response out of people. Scum is very hard to catch when they are sitting at there computer making sure everything they type is towny. Frustrated posts however are often typed quickly and are a much easier place to catch scum.

If this was someone else, I would say town read however the post count inflating he has done really serves to make him a difficult lynch target which is something ash does not find a helpful quality in town.
Ash responds in this way.
vote: mcmcsalot

That one is real.

Inflating my post count?  Hilarious.  Check the post counts of the games I've been in recently.  I've been the top poster in three or four, without silly posting.  So your accusation reeks of scum building a bad case on a good lynch.

Yes, I am a fine lynch for D1.  We all are.  I created a situation where it is easy to vote for me.  Now, all of town has a number of interactions/opinions to look at when I flip town.

I guarantee scum is currently voting for me.  Mcmc is scummiest, mail-mi's most recent vote is terrible.  There have also been some towny reactions, too.

Also, I am the king of crazy claim ideas, and I think map claiming is bad on D1.
Now I have gone over before but this is a ridiculous statement in more ways then one. Having a usually high post count doesn't change the fact that posting repetitive one liners inflates your post count. I cannot stress enough "creating a situation where it is easy to vote for me" and saying "I guarantee scum is currently voting for me" Is CRAZY if you make it easy to vote for you, confused townies looking for scum are going to vote for you.

And here is sudgy unvoting because that was a towny reaction to the vote on him
Unvote.

The 50% of RVS was actually wanting to see ashersky's reaction.  His reaction seemed towny enough to me.

Here is an interesting post about insom, need to check what his stance on insom is now.
Actually, Liopoil is acting differently than I remember when he was scum...  This makes me think he's town.  This could change later though.

I voted for Insomniac because I'm trying to get him to post.  I don't like LaLL that much, while it can be useful sometimes (and lurking is scummy), I would rather lynch someone else.  If Insomniac suddenly was at L-1 or something, I would unvote.

I voted for Insomniac because I wanted to get him to start posting.  I thought that was clear when I voted, but when people started freaking out about it I said why.  I'll Unvote for now though.

Okay, he now votes kooshie, finally because she is lurking...the same thing he said was not a good reason to lynch someone a few posts back.
I think I agree enough with Liopoil to Vote: Kooshie.  She doesn't lurk like this usually.

Now day 2 he post this about insom
Is Insomniac usually this lurky?  I'm kind of suspicious of him from that, and Jimmmmm too.  He wasn't lurky in my earlier game with him (even though he was only alive D1)

So thats about everything, ugh I really wanted this to show more than I am getting from it. I guess sudgy I find sudgy scummy for flip slopping on vote for a lurker. Also, his vote on kooshie was the 4th vote, he then didn't post till kooshie's lynch was imminent. If scum is going to get stuck bussing D1 thats how it would happen. He is now voting for insom for lurking and that his reaction was scummy.

vote: mcmc

2 reasons--this post is scummy (is this about sudgy or me?) and yuma's case. 

I will unvote if raerae says you are town.
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Jimmmmm

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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware (Day 2)
« Reply #723 on: March 25, 2013, 04:40:00 pm »

I'll hopefully get time to catch up today or tonight.
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Re: Mafia XXII: Bankers Beware (Day 2)
« Reply #724 on: March 25, 2013, 04:43:23 pm »

I agree that there is scum both on and off wagon, like there was in the games Yuma cited. I'm not so sure that it is more likely that there is two off wagon than two on-wagon.

Because with two on a scum wagon with 4 scum it's MUCH more difficult to make another wagon form. With 2 votes you can make something happen, but 1 is a lot less. And I think it's really bad play from scum to bus hard day 1 in a game like this.
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