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[shraeye]

Between ashersky/Axxle who is SK?  I believe this is the question I'm answering.  I would suspect Axxle, who claims the easy VT claim (knows he can't be counterclaimed since all the other Wands have been pointed out).  Ashersky I'm suspicious of being a werewolf.  When I think back to Eevee's crazy claims, ashersky was in there saying things that didn't make sense to me at the time.  It seemed like he was misunderstanding/contradicting Eevee's claims a bit and possibly Eevee didn't claim as they had planned in their QT.

Archetype also moved to slow down the lynch, but only after Eevee claimed SK and Archetype thought town could get some use out of a SK kept on a tight leash, I don't recall him slowing that lynch down at all prior to that.  Townread on Archetype.

[ashersky]

Also, per my ongoing VLA, away from computer at the zoo today.

[shraeye]

I think Arch needs to claim, given his statements, and now clear backtrack on Axxle.

Let Galz lead the claiming.  I'm much much more certain of his alignment than yours.

[ashersky]

I think Arch needs to claim, given his statements, and now clear backtrack on Axxle.

Let Galz lead the claiming.  I'm much much more certain of his alignment than yours.

Wasn't really leading, so much as my opinion.

[ashersky]

I think Arch needs to claim, given his statements, and now clear backtrack on Axxle.

Let Galz lead the claiming.  I'm much much more certain of his alignment than yours.

Plus didn't he tell Arch to full claim already?

[shraeye]

I think Arch needs to claim, given his statements, and now clear backtrack on Axxle.

Let Galz lead the claiming.  I'm much much more certain of his alignment than yours.

Plus didn't he tell Arch to full claim already?

I dont remember.

[Galzria]

So, my belief us that Ashersky is the Ace of Wands, and it's quotes like the below that lead me to that conclusion:

That would be Galz right? He's proven that he's the Strongman Vig, so he's named townie at this point.

Well, unless Eevee is lying and is a regular mafia/werewolf card holder, and Galzria is also lying and is actually an MA with strongman abilities.

This idea that Eevee would somehow be lying (even though he was proven BP), and not MA but instead a regular WW/Mafia (and not even SK as CLAIMED) makes absolutely NO sense.....

..... Unless Ashersky was responsible for killing Voltgloss, and thus KNEW (without being able to claim as such) that Eevee couldn't have done so. This leads to all sorts of theories (like the above) trying to justify what Eevee might be, and what that means about me. And if you go back and read, Ashersky was not at all shy on hedging about how Eevee could still be any number of things.

So new assignment is for everybody to go back and reread Ashersky with this thought in mind. The moment Eevee claimed to have killed Voltgloss, SK!Ashersky knew something was amiss.

Tell me your thoughts.

Then consider that if true, his "investigation" results are just completely made up - who's going to counter him? Even if he "clears" a WW, it's not like they're going to counter-claim.

After you've done that, reread Archetype from a WW partner to Eevee perspective, and give me your thoughts on that as well.

--If you have investigative results that pin a player as scum, feel free to release them at this time. Otherwise, NO claiming.-

[Galzria]

After everybody weighs in on Ashersky, we will do a massclaim. I hate doing so, as I agree we should have more VT than PR's, but too many people want it to be completely scum driven, so I have to accept there's probably something worth hearing.

There are 9 people left alive.

1. Galzria - Strongman Vig
2. Ashersky - Seer
3. Axxle - VT
--- The following should be claim order, AFTER people have weighed in on Ashersky---
4. Archetype
5. Shraeye
6. Grujah
7. Lekkit
8. Sparky
9. Cuzz

[Grujah]

So, my belief us that Ashersky is the Ace of Wands, and it's quotes like the below that lead me to that conclusion:

That would be Galz right? He's proven that he's the Strongman Vig, so he's named townie at this point.

Well, unless Eevee is lying and is a regular mafia/werewolf card holder, and Galzria is also lying and is actually an MA with strongman abilities.

This idea that Eevee would somehow be lying (even though he was proven BP), and not MA but instead a regular WW/Mafia (and not even SK as CLAIMED) makes absolutely NO sense.....

..... Unless Ashersky was responsible for killing Voltgloss, and thus KNEW (without being able to claim as such) that Eevee couldn't have done so. This leads to all sorts of theories (like the above) trying to justify what Eevee might be, and what that means about me. And if you go back and read, Ashersky was not at all shy on hedging about how Eevee could still be any number of things.

So new assignment is for everybody to go back and reread Ashersky with this thought in mind. The moment Eevee claimed to have killed Voltgloss, SK!Ashersky knew something was amiss.

Tell me your thoughts.

Then consider that if true, his "investigation" results are just completely made up - who's going to counter him? Even if he "clears" a WW, it's not like they're going to counter-claim.

After you've done that, reread Archetype from a WW partner to Eevee perspective, and give me your thoughts on that as well.

--If you have investigative results that pin a player as scum, feel free to release them at this time. Otherwise, NO claiming.-

If you think my consistent stance of caution and taking time with our MA claims yesterday somehow makes me an SK, then I don't even know how to respond.  Why do people make assumptions that other people will come to a specific conclusion based on assumed information?  Shall I call you Voltgloss?  You know I was always suspicious of you, and that is every game.  You are one of the masters of these fake claim crazy gambits, so I wasn't taking you on as the leader 100% yet.  I don't think we have much choice now, and with a full claim, everyone can chime in.

Further to your argument, think about the other piece of information I had yesterday.  My role.  If we hadn't lynched Eevee, I would have investigated him.  Because if he was lying, I thought the chances he was lying about a lot of things were high, and I could catch him for town.  Instead, we got the lynch and flip, so I investigated the person who seemed most willing to save him, Arch.

As for Axxle as SK, it's definitely possible, but I don't know for sure.  He's definitely the only candidate for Ace of Wands, though.  It's also possible that every other person who hasn't claimed in the other Ace SK.

I think Arch needs to claim, given his statements, and now clear backtrack on Axxle.

FWIW, i remember similarly cautious Vig ash from MXII. buuut....

Between ashersky/Axxle who is SK?  I believe this is the question I'm answering.  I would suspect Axxle, who claims the easy VT claim (knows he can't be counterclaimed since all the other Wands have been pointed out).  Ashersky I'm suspicious of being a werewolf.  When I think back to Eevee's crazy claims, ashersky was in there saying things that didn't make sense to me at the time.  It seemed like he was misunderstanding/contradicting Eevee's claims a bit and possibly Eevee didn't claim as they had planned in their QT.

Seems possible, as I pointed out, he was not that push for Eevee as most of us were. I know he just gave a reason in post I've quoted, but still - I don't think there was a point in checking Eevee, when a) you wouldn't really know that much, we didn't know if he was SK or WW or what - and you only investigate WW and b) it was so obvious with Galz flavor that Eevees has QT = scum.

I've thought about it some more, and I reconsidered some things.

So no, I don't KNOW Axxle is scum anymore. I'm fairly certain though. I'm starting to warm up to the idea of ashersky being scum. 1 of the 2 is most likely scum.

Yeah, I guess I'm not as much as an IC as I thought I was. But that's fine, I don't mind that much.

So what made you change your mind?

(Other than you being unable to make a fakeclaim that will explain your knowledge.)

[Archetype]

I dont know if I can explain why do you Grujah. Both you and Lekkit seemed convinced I'm scum.

[Grujah]

I dont know if I can explain why do you Grujah. Both you and Lekkit seemed convinced I'm scum.

Didn't answer my question, though. Also broken sentence.

[sparky5856]

So, my belief us that Ashersky is the Ace of Wands, and it's quotes like the below that lead me to that conclusion:

That would be Galz right? He's proven that he's the Strongman Vig, so he's named townie at this point.

Well, unless Eevee is lying and is a regular mafia/werewolf card holder, and Galzria is also lying and is actually an MA with strongman abilities.

This idea that Eevee would somehow be lying (even though he was proven BP), and not MA but instead a regular WW/Mafia (and not even SK as CLAIMED) makes absolutely NO sense.....

..... Unless Ashersky was responsible for killing Voltgloss, and thus KNEW (without being able to claim as such) that Eevee couldn't have done so. This leads to all sorts of theories (like the above) trying to justify what Eevee might be, and what that means about me. And if you go back and read, Ashersky was not at all shy on hedging about how Eevee could still be any number of things.

So new assignment is for everybody to go back and reread Ashersky with this thought in mind. The moment Eevee claimed to have killed Voltgloss, SK!Ashersky knew something was amiss.

Tell me your thoughts.

Then consider that if true, his "investigation" results are just completely made up - who's going to counter him? Even if he "clears" a WW, it's not like they're going to counter-claim.

After you've done that, reread Archetype from a WW partner to Eevee perspective, and give me your thoughts on that as well.

--If you have investigative results that pin a player as scum, feel free to release them at this time. Otherwise, NO claiming.-

I think I need to reread everybody given I haven't been here for like half the game, so this is a good call. In response to ash's quote there, yeah there was no situation where Galz is a lying MA and Eevee was a regular mafia/WW, cause how does that explain the failed daykill by Robz? It took me a while to realize this, but Eevee WAS obvscum at that point, and everyone should have felt it, at least eventually.

Archetype is, well, acting weird with his hedging. The way he responded to my question, it sounded like he had direct evidence that Axxle was SK, now he's saying never mind.

[Archetype]

I dont know if I can explain why do you Grujah. Both you and Lekkit seemed convinced I'm scum.

Didn't answer my question, though. Also broken sentence.

Sorry phone posting. do = to.

[shraeye]

So, my belief us that Ashersky is the Ace of Wands, and it's quotes like the below that lead me to that conclusion:

That would be Galz right? He's proven that he's the Strongman Vig, so he's named townie at this point.

Well, unless Eevee is lying and is a regular mafia/werewolf card holder, and Galzria is also lying and is actually an MA with strongman abilities.

This idea that Eevee would somehow be lying (even though he was proven BP), and not MA but instead a regular WW/Mafia (and not even SK as CLAIMED) makes absolutely NO sense.....

..... Unless Ashersky was responsible for killing Voltgloss, and thus KNEW (without being able to claim as such) that Eevee couldn't have done so. This leads to all sorts of theories (like the above) trying to justify what Eevee might be, and what that means about me. And if you go back and read, Ashersky was not at all shy on hedging about how Eevee could still be any number of things.

So new assignment is for everybody to go back and reread Ashersky with this thought in mind. The moment Eevee claimed to have killed Voltgloss, SK!Ashersky knew something was amiss.

Tell me your thoughts.

Then consider that if true, his "investigation" results are just completely made up - who's going to counter him? Even if he "clears" a WW, it's not like they're going to counter-claim.

After you've done that, reread Archetype from a WW partner to Eevee perspective, and give me your thoughts on that as well.

--If you have investigative results that pin a player as scum, feel free to release them at this time. Otherwise, NO claiming.-

I'm going into travel mode, I will put this reread on my todo list and try to get to it by sunday.

[Lekkit]

I hope to be able to reread Ash today. Will be somewhat vla after lunch (my time) today and should be back on monday.

[Lekkit]

Reread ash, but didn't really get the SK vibe Galz was talking about.

Archetype on the other hand could very well be a WW. If so then asher is definately scum.

[Archetype]

Reread ash, but didn't really get the SK vibe Galz was talking about.

Archetype on the other hand could very well be a WW. If so then asher is definately scum.

I could only be a WW if ashersky is scum.

[Grujah]

Reread ash, but didn't really get the SK vibe Galz was talking about.

Archetype on the other hand could very well be a WW. If so then asher is definately scum.

I could only be a WW if ashersky is scum.

We do not know if Alpha werewolf is investigation immune, though. 

[Archetype]

Reread ash, but didn't really get the SK vibe Galz was talking about.

Archetype on the other hand could very well be a WW. If so then asher is definately scum.

I could only be a WW if ashersky is scum.

We do not know if Alpha werewolf is investigation immune, though. 

Aw, that is true. And there could be some redirection.

[Lekkit]

Arch cant be Alpha. Hes not a wand.

[Axxle]

Is a mass claim happening? I think Galz was leading it right? He's the most obvtown of all of us.

Ash needs to die eventually to verify his information, but might as well force the WW to do it since they can't risk him staying around investigating them.  Ash, don't reveal who you target each night until the day after, otherwise we'll have too much WIFOM.

[Axxle]

I'm going to have to figure out something else too look for other than Eevee protecting through since asher seems like he'll die anyway, and Archetype is verified non-WW for now.  Maybe off wagon would be a good place to look anyway.

[Galzria]

Alright, time to follow up on this. I've put my thoughts RE: Ashersky out there, and I think it'll be important to keep in mind. But let's see where this leads us for now:


1. Galzria - Strongman Vig
2. Ashersky - Seer
3. Axxle - VT
--- The following should be claim order---
4. Archetype
5. Shraeye
6. Grujah
7. Lekkit
8. Sparky
9. Cuzz

I want Role, Card, Results to Date, and reasons why choices were made.

Also, top scum pick at this moment.

[Axxle]

Off wagon: Eevee, ashersky, Cuzz, Archetype, yuma

Crossing Archetype and ashersky for reasons stated previously.

I think Cuzz is a WW by PoE.

I'll look at Volt interactions on Day 1 later to find Mafia, or do we want to lynch Mafia today?

[Galzria]

Off wagon: Eevee, ashersky, Cuzz, Archetype, yuma

Crossing Archetype and ashersky for reasons stated previously.

I think Cuzz is a WW by PoE.

I'll look at Volt interactions on Day 1 later to find Mafia, or do we want to lynch Mafia today?

I have reason to suspect that there are no Mafia left - but each night will bring its own confirmations. This is based on the fact that we know that there's a SK, and we know that there's a WW left - but there was only 1 kill last night. Even with Yuma being a Ninja-Doctor, if all 3 existed, there should've at least been 2.

Granted, the last Mafia (since it's rather inconceivable that there would be 4 total), if he exists, might have chosen not to kill, or might have a Role that if he uses prevents him from NK'ing. However, at this time, I'm leaning towards there are none left. My best guess with the information we have is that there is 1 WW and 1 SK left - but 2 WW's would not surprise me.