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Author Topic: Why "playing around" is worth it  (Read 1846 times)

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ednever

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Why "playing around" is worth it
« on: December 14, 2012, 11:53:51 am »
+1

Here is the set:
Apprentice, Baron, City, Explorer, Fishing Village, Mining Village, Remodel, Smugglers, Stables, and Venture

What's the strategy?

What if you open 5/2?

I decided right from the start to try something I thought was pretty exotic. Usually when I do that it crashes and burns (rarely it results in a new go-to combo like Develop-Vineyards. Usually it amounts to a mess and losing 7 provinces to 1). This time it wasn't a good two-card combo, but really cool 4-card (maybe 5-card) one. It even involved a strategy of remodeling coppers into Estates - which is usually a HUGE mistake.

Here the game if you want to cheat:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/14/game-20121214-084908-888fb922.html

Ed
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Kahryl

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2012, 12:28:17 pm »
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Didn't look.. I'm guessing Explorer Remodel Baron Venture Apprentice? Remodeling coppers boosts your Venture returns since they hit better cards, and feeds Baron. Explorer feeds Venture (sorta), Apprentice eats Estates (which really only replaces itself) to cycle to your Explorers and Barons?
« Last Edit: December 14, 2012, 12:29:20 pm by Kahryl »
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HiveMindEmulator

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2012, 12:35:33 pm »
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I'm not sure the Remodeling Coppers really did that much for you. It got some Apprentice fuel and is probably better than nothing, but not a huge deal. You might have done just as well with a Baron to buy extra Apprentice fuel instead, though the Remodel helps with turning Explorer Gold into Provinces. The key to the strategy was Explorer in a simple big drawing deck. Regarding your fool opponent's strategy, I screwed up by getting way too many Stables and no Apprentice, so I ended up stuck with Stables I couldn't play.
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Kahryl

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2012, 02:51:11 pm »
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"Estate as Apprentice fuel" is a fallacy though. It costs you 2 cards and 1 action point to gain.. 2 cards and 1 action point. The hand you end up with is exactly the same as if you hadn't had Estate or Apprentice at all. Estate is still a good target for Apprentice in order to get RID of Estates, but buying Estates to target is just spinning your wheels.
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DsnowMan

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2012, 04:40:02 pm »
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It even involved a strategy of remodeling coppers into Estates - which is usually a HUGE mistake.

Pretty sure this was not the important part of your strategy. Stables + Apprentice to make sure your Explorer meets your Province, then Apprenticing or Remodeling golds is nice and fast.
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GigaKnight

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2012, 07:35:52 pm »
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"Estate as Apprentice fuel" is a fallacy though. It costs you 2 cards and 1 action point to gain.. 2 cards and 1 action point. The hand you end up with is exactly the same as if you hadn't had Estate or Apprentice at all. Estate is still a good target for Apprentice in order to get RID of Estates, but buying Estates to target is just spinning your wheels.

I agree with this, but he didn't buy Estates - he Remodeled Coppers into them.  It kinda works as fuel + thinning, where thinning is the important part.  Apprenticing a Copper just gets rid of it; you don't do that unless your Action phase is basically over.  If you can instead Apprentice an Estate (that used to be a Copper), then you got a little card draw boost from the Copper (in an albeit roundabout way).  Seems like a nice little touch in this case but, yeah, it's not the foundation of the strategy.
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DG

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Re: Why "playing around" is worth it
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2012, 08:25:16 pm »
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Quote
I decided right from the start to try something I thought was pretty exotic

To my mind this was standard good play for all the cards involved, using each to its strengths, with some improvisation to get around a mismatch between the remodel and apprentice.
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