Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1]

Author Topic: Card Idea: Broker  (Read 2708 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Card Idea: Broker
« on: December 04, 2012, 04:22:34 pm »
0

Quote
Broker
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. +$2.

While this is in play, when you trash a card, +$1.

Made to work with one-shots, but could be very useful in any game with heavy trashing. It also has a niche usage as vanishing money (for Library, etc.). Opinions? Any ideas on a better top half for the card?
Logged

ShinKyo

  • Steward
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29
  • Respect: +13
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2012, 05:38:29 pm »
+1

Nice card!
I have a suggestion to make it self-supporting:
Quote
Broker
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Action
Trash a card.
-------------
While this is in play, when you trash cards with an action card, +$1.
Don't know exactly if the wording is precisely enough. First it should be a slow trasher which is at least not terminal. Often very useful. Then every time you trash cards (the number of trashed card doesn't matter to limit the effect) with an action card (also this Broker) or another card you'll get one coin. It is also stackable what makes it strong, maybe it should cost 5, too. In this version you won't get the coins with a Loan for example but that would make the playing and counting easier.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2012, 05:41:24 pm by ShinKyo »
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2012, 05:43:11 pm »
0

Nice card!
I have a suggestion to make it self-supporting:
Quote
Broker
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Action
Trash a card.
-------------
While this is in play, when you trash cards with an action card, +$1.
Don't know exactly if the wording is precisely enough. First it should be a slow trasher which is at least not terminal. Often very useful. Then every time you trash cards (the number of trashed card doesn't matter to limit the effect) with an action card (also this Broker) or another card you'll get one coin. It is also stackable what makes it strong, maybe it should cost 5, too. In this version you won't get the coins with a Loan for example but that would make the playing and counting easier.

Hmm, I like the 'when you trash cards' functionally, but I'm not sure it's intuitive for most players. I'll have to think about the rest of this version a bit more. I worry that it's a bit too close to Forager.
Logged

ShinKyo

  • Steward
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29
  • Respect: +13
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2012, 06:15:20 pm »
+1

Nice card!
I have a suggestion to make it self-supporting:
Quote
Broker
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Action
Trash a card.
-------------
While this is in play, when you trash cards with an action card, +$1.
Don't know exactly if the wording is precisely enough. First it should be a slow trasher which is at least not terminal. Often very useful. Then every time you trash cards (the number of trashed card doesn't matter to limit the effect) with an action card (also this Broker) or another card you'll get one coin. It is also stackable what makes it strong, maybe it should cost 5, too. In this version you won't get the coins with a Loan for example but that would make the playing and counting easier.

Hmm, I like the 'when you trash cards' functionally, but I'm not sure it's intuitive for most players. I'll have to think about the rest of this version a bit more. I worry that it's a bit too close to Forager.
Yeah, you're right. Perhaps this wording would be better: '..., when you trash any number of cards with an action card, +$1.' I didn't think about the forager. It seams similar in some points but overall it's clearly different cause only you get the bonus not all in dependence of the trash and it's stackable. You could do interesting considerations about how to use it most efficient.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2012, 11:09:56 am »
0

Well, not a lot of interest in this one, which is fine. I have been posting a lot of cards lately, trying to find the best one for a specific slot.

I think this card needs a little something extra for when there's no trashing available.

Quote
Broker
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. +$2. Look at the top card of your deck; discard it or put it back.

While this is in play, when you trash a card, +$1.
Logged

ShinKyo

  • Steward
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29
  • Respect: +13
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2012, 11:35:29 am »
+1

I think this card needs a little something extra for when there's no trashing available.
And because of that I thought the card needs the trash function for itself (similar to graverobber and many other cards). I would never buy that card for 5 if there is no trasher available and if there's a trasher then the filter-bonus is of little use anyway. But that's not too bad. But isn't a start with chapel not a bit too strong and also swingy? What about Forge or Count? I really would limit it to max +$1 or +$2 per trashing.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2012, 11:43:01 am by ShinKyo »
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2012, 11:55:22 am »
0

I think this card needs a little something extra for when there's no trashing available.
And because of that I thought the card needs the trash function for itself (similar to graverobber and many other cards). I wouldn't never buy that card for 5 if there is no trasher available and if there's a trasher then the filter-bonus is of little use anyway. But that's not too bad.

Right, that was my thinking. The filter bonus is more useful when there isn't trashing.

Quote
But isn't a start with chapel not a bit too strong and also swingy? What about Forge or Count? I really would limit it to max +$1 or +$2 per trashing.

That's what I thought, too, but after consideration I don't think it's that bad when compared to what's already out there. Consider a Chapel/Market Square opening. That can get you a Gold on turn 3 or 4 if they collide. If Broker and Chapel collide, you get a $5 of your choice. That's often going to be better than a Gold, but not by much. Sometimes it'll be worse. There is the argument that you actually need a 5/2 split to open Broker/Chapel, whereas anyone can open Chapel/Market Square. Also, if Chapel and Broker don't collide, it's a heck of a lot better than if Chapel and Market Square don't collide. Still, I don't think this is any more swingy than a lot of other 5/2 openings, like Mountebank/Chapel or Mint/Fool's Gold.

As for Count, you'd have to buy Broker and Count, two $5 cards, then have them collide together in a hand with no other cards you want to keep. Sure, you could put a card back on your deck, but that means you'll only trash 2 cards and will only be able to buy a $4 card after trashing.

With Forge, you're not going to trash a massive number of cards with it more than once or twice per game. If you can draw a Broker or two, and Forge, and a bunch of cards to trash, and some +Buy (to spend all the Broker money) into your hand at once, you deserve to buy some Provinces.

I'm going to playtest this some more soon and it could be that you're 100% right about it being too powerful a combo. I'm hoping that the fact that Broker doesn't give +Cards (limiting the number of cards you can mass-trash), and the fact that there's a lot of competition at the $5 level will make it a good, but reasonable option.

EDIT: If it does turn out to be too powerful, I will look for a way to limit it somehow. The 'when you trash cards with an Action card' wording seems a little fuzzy to me, though. 'When you trash cards' is technically well-defined, but not intuitive. 'With an Action card' isn't necessarily clear. I'll try to brainstorm something with a similar effect.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2012, 11:57:58 am by LastFootnote »
Logged

Drab Emordnilap

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1832
  • Shuffle iT Username: Drab Emordnilap
  • Luther Bell Hendricks V
  • Respect: +1887
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2012, 12:26:04 pm »
0

When DON'T you trash cards with an action card? Or are you specifically trying to rule out Counterfeit and Farmland?
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2012, 12:30:04 pm »
0

When DON'T you trash cards with an action card? Or are you specifically trying to rule out Counterfeit and Farmland?

Don't forget Loan. Also, there's a one-shot Treasure card in the set I'm designing this for. There are probably other official examples I'm forgetting as well.
Logged

ShinKyo

  • Steward
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29
  • Respect: +13
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2012, 12:31:18 pm »
+1

Yeah, I think you're right. The cases where you can trash more than one card with Broker(s) in play are rare and you can probably do it only a few times per game. Maybe it could be a hard work to count and remember all coins after playing Loans and Counterfeits. Only in an RL-Game of course. But that's sadly the only way to play all the good cards from this forum.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Card Idea: Broker
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2012, 01:33:46 pm »
0

Yeah, I think you're right. The cases where you can trash more than one card with Broker(s) in play are rare and you can probably do it only a few times per game. Maybe it could be a hard work to count and remember all coins after playing Loans and Counterfeits. Only in an RL-Game of course. But that's sadly the only way to play all the good cards from this forum.

Yeah, the tracking issue is my biggest concern at this point. Hopefully play testing will show that it's not a big deal, but if it is, I may have to scrap the card entirely.
Logged
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.134 seconds with 20 queries.