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[PenPen]

Tom Vasel reviews the expansion and I don't think he likes it too much? I dunno (he puts it mid-rank for expansions). I wonder if the waiting for other players to finish their turn thing is an issue...anyone has any experience yet?

[medchem30]

I can't watch the video right now, but I can say that the turns take about as long as with other expansions.  I wonder how many DA games Tom played since some setups will take longer than others. 

Also, I guess I can see it taking longer for people who are not familiar with the card text of the new cards or for people who get caught up with analysis paralysis since there are quite a few triggered effects on cards introduced with DA.  Certainly, I would not introduce DA right away to some of my friends who are not familiar with Dominion in general.  It's a bit more complicated than some of the other sets just because there are quite a few triggered effects to think about.  Still, I don't see how more complicated should mean it's worse.  I think it's an amazing set.  Then again, I tend to pick up combos and memorize card text easier than most folks I play with.

[jsh357]

Another thing to consider is probably that since Tom plays a metric ton of games for his job and with his family (considering his Top X lists and amount of reviews) there's a good chance he has a different perspective than players who focus more on one or two games.  As a Dominion addict, I have found the change of pace in DA games highly refreshing and would definitely consider it one of the best sets.

[werothegreat]

I mainly watch his reviews because it's nice to see YouTube videos about Dominion - I usually don't agree with much of what he says, because it's like he's trying to sound knowledgeable about it, but you can tell he's not intimately familiar with the game as some of us on here are.  It's a little painful at a times.  Also, his voice is kind of annoying.

I just reviewed the reviewer!

[Beyond Awesome]

I think his review probably has a lot of merit for the more casual Dominion player. For someone that is really into Dominion, like those of us on the forum, we can have a deeper appreciation for the complexity and changes Dark Ages offer.

I think DA might be the best set yet.

[Hockey Mask]

I love at 14:45 where Tom says that Dark Ages is confusing and his daughter melody shakes her head no.

[werothegreat]

I love how he just completely ignored Band of Misfits.

[michaeljb]

Still drives me a little crazy every time someone says "hand" when they mean "deck"...

[michaeljb]

Any Dominion credibility he had is lost here.

[werothegreat]

Any Dominion credibility he had is lost here.

"THIS IS GAME-CHANGING.  LIKE PIRATE SHIP."

As much as I love Pirate Ship, it's not game-changing.  And I think Band of Misfits, Procession and Fortress are far more game-changing than Rats.

[Grujah]

Well, in multiplayer maybe?

I dunno, I play mostly 2p.

[jsh357]

Yeah, to be fair, Pirate Ship IS a game changer in 4p.  If Tom primarily plays 4p, he might not be aware that it's usually weak in 2p.

[michaeljb]

Yeah, to be fair, Pirate Ship IS a game changer in 4p.  If Tom primarily plays 4p, he might not be aware that it's usually weak in 2p.

True. Also like you pointed out in your earlier post (which I hadn't read until after I had finished watching the review and posting my own comments here ) since he plays so many games he's not going to have the expertise on this particular one that we forum regulars do.

[Tables]

Pirate Ship is definitely game changing at first. I'd say a good 75% of Dominion gamers who hadn't read these (or similar) forums first thought it was pretty crazy at first. Especially those who primarily play F2F, where multiplayer is more common.

[^_^_^_^]

Obviously the daughter loves it. That's all that matters.

[kn1tt3r]

I find the Tom Vasel reviews quite interesting. He represents a whole different kind of player than you find in this forum, because he views it from the real life play perspective, which also influences his oppinion on some expansions.

I mean, he dislikes Alchemy, he's not that fond of Cornucopia (which is quite popular in the online community), and now he complains a bit about the confusion and the long turns Dark Ages creates. Well, i have the feeling he's completely right. Alchemy and Cornucopia can be quite annoying in real life (play Hunting Party, draw card, reveal hand, skip cards, draw one in hand, play Hunting Party, draw card, reveal hand .......), which is not a big thing at all online.

And Dark Ages WILL create confusion. Things that online implementations will track for you can be quite a headache in real life. Just look at the simple example in the rulebook and you might understand what I mean.

[Davio]

TV is entitled to his opinion and I actually find it more interesting to see what a less experienced player thinks. We, the experts, have a whole different view on DA.

I like that he touched on the subject that DA made the game less pure. Dominion was all about equal chances and cards for both players, Cornucopia with Tournament changes that and now we have Ruins and Knights and such and even more possible openings with Shelters (although I doubt that changes a lot, could be with YW-Tunnel).

I'm really looking forward to playing with DA, because I think it's a lot of fun, but I agree with him that it diverts from the original intent.

[werothegreat]

I mean, he dislikes Alchemy, he's not that fond of Cornucopia (which is quite popular in the online community), and now he complains a bit about the confusion and the long turns Dark Ages creates. Well, i have the feeling he's completely right. Alchemy and Cornucopia can be quite annoying in real life (play Hunting Party, draw card, reveal hand, skip cards, draw one in hand, play Hunting Party, draw card, reveal hand .......), which is not a big thing at all online.

Both Hunting Party and Menagerie are a bit of a bitch in person, particularly once your hand gets to a certain size.  Cartographer also fits into this.  However, I love playing Alchemy in person - Possession is certainly frustrating, but no more than it is online.

[mistergross]

Tom was pretty clear about not liking the 'reveal' cards. After playing three 2-player DA games, I can easily see the criticism from a more casual Dominion player. YMMV, but Wandering Minstrel and Ironmonger (used in the base/Intrigue recommended sets) slow the game down a ton IRL. At least, if you're in love with engine building. There was a great deal of 'feels-like' 2-player solitaire in those games.

I'd be interested to hear from Donald what portion of his playtesting was online vs. IRL. The secret history revealed many cards that were scrapped because of dry spells. I'm not saying I dislike the cards (love 'em when the context is right), but curious.

In other news, 'game-changer' /= strong card.

[Octo]

I suspect Tom Vasel doesn't play Dominion online at all (or at least didn't with Dark Ages). I suspect most people don't in fact

Tom is like any reviewer - you have to figure out where they are coming from over the course of a few reviews, and then parse the review with that in mind to get any information that's useful to your own perspective. I'm excited for DA, but also he touches on some of my own concerns about the set - namely complexity/fiddly-ness/not for the new player. These won't put me off entirely, but they are a consideration for me. As mentioned, cards like Hunting Party are annoying IRL in frankly so much so that people never find out it's true potential - everyone gets tired of waiting for the dude doing it usually so he doesn't buy too many - and in fact many engine decks have a hint of that.

[michaeljb]

Epic lulz from the comments:

I still think that there is only one truly "broken" card in Dominion... (Venture), so it's still my fave game, I think!

[Grujah]

How did he get Venture out of everythign?