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[ednever]

Hey Doug-
Could you put up some sort if donation box on Iso that accepts credit cards (PayPal, square, something)

If you do I will send you some cash.

Isotropic is fantastic. Now that it's going away i'd love to donate something to you for your work.

I will likely be giving goko my money for a far inferior product. Only right I should give something to you.

Thanks again for building isotropic. Best free thing on the Internet since google.

Ed
Ps. Google: if you ate reading this I will not be making a donation to you. I think you are doing fine with the ads and the self driving cars and all that.

[HiveMindEmulator]

Now that you wrote this, you will always see sponsored ads asking you to donate money to Google.

[andwilk]

Beat me to it.  I'd like to make a donation as well.

[sherwinpr]

Or maybe we could pool some funds together and buy a worthwhile, memorable gift?  No idea what though.

[WanderingWinder]

Clearly, a chicken.

[PSUmvp]

dougz@isotropic.org is a registered user on paypal...

In addition to any donations that we would like to make to dougz, we should also ask our companies to make contributions for him taking down the site next week.  The productivity they will all start to get out of us will be well worth the donation

[() | (_) ^/]

.

[Voltaire]

dougz@isotropic.org is a registered user on paypal...

In addition to any donations that we would like to make to dougz, we should also ask our companies to make contributions for him taking down the site next week.  The productivity they will all start to get out of us will be well worth the donation

So true AND so sad.  Good times.

Yeah. Compared to text-view Iso, it's preeeeeeeetty obvious Goku is a game.

[() | (_) ^/]

.

[Brando Commando]

I took the initiative and just blind sent him some $ via the paypal e-mail. BTW, PayPal has an option where you can send it as a "payment" or a "gift". It seems to me that we are not "paying" him the money but "gifting" it.

Accept the challenge! The fact that he hasn't even posted on here to help this process along makes it even nicer to give him a nice little something.

[jamuspsi]

..yeeeeah, except I'm not gonna send money blind.  That's kinda silly.

But seriously dougz, I've gotten at least as much entertainment out of iso as several games I bought on steam, so let's see a gracious acceptance on here!

[Captain_Frisk]

I would do it except that I'm nervous that dougz won't accept it and then paypal will keep it... and lets face it - I'd probably rather burn my money then give it to paypal.

[polonkus]

I would do it except that I'm nervous that dougz won't accept it and then paypal will keep it... and lets face it - I'd probably rather burn my money then give it to paypal.

There is a Doug Z_____ with a mailing address in Palo Alto which is easily googled.
Just sayin'.

[Kirian]

I would do it except that I'm nervous that dougz won't accept it and then paypal will keep it... and lets face it - I'd probably rather burn my money then give it to paypal.

There is a Doug Z_____ with a mailing address in Palo Alto which is easily googled.
Just sayin'.

Or you could probably get away with just mailing it to Google's main campus with his name on it.  Especially since that's what he used on isotropic's registration...

[Ozle]

Or you could send it to:

DougZ
C/O Ozle
<insert my address here>

[dougz]

Ok, ok, I'll be as gracious as I can.  :-)  It's totally not necessary — the site was a labor of love, mostly — but dougz@isotropic.org is indeed my paypal account and I stopped turning down free money years ago.

The Palo Alto address is no longer good; I moved a couple of weeks ago (remember downtime followed by a week of frequent disconnects?).  It should still forward, actually, or you can email me for my address if you prefer avoiding paypal.

[() | (_) ^/]

Ok, ok, I'll be as gracious as I can.  :-)  It's totally not necessary — the site was a labor of love, mostly — but dougz@isotropic.org is indeed my paypal account and I stopped turning down free money years ago.

The Palo Alto address is no longer good; I moved a couple of weeks ago (remember downtime followed by a week of frequent disconnects?).  It should still forward, actually, or you can email me for my address if you prefer avoiding paypal.

Thanks, Doug.

[syzygy]

Thanks for confirming the address Doug.  Spoils incoming...

Thanks so much for your hard work on isotropic.  It's an amazing feat and wonderful contribution to the Dominion community. 

[Captain_Frisk]

$100 incoming.

[noey21]

I would like to say thank you also.  When my wife was overseas we played a few games a few times a week.  Made the communication much easier.  A gift is on it's way.

Also, thanks for KILLING many boring hours at work (my fmaily doesn't appreciate it it as I got much better than them saving my losses for this)

[Reyk]

+1
You made me discover the real Dominion :-) - gift on the way.

[jamuspsi]

Me too

[Robz888]

I also plan on giving. I'm not sure we all realized how great a thing you gave us until now. Thanks for everything, Dougz.

[Kahryl]

Man. I would pay $25 a month easy to just keep playing what's already developed. But no, the modern economy demands some overproduced slow thing that's blocked at work with music and buggy moving parts and lots of kinds of fake money and microtransactions. Sigh.

Competence and quality seem to have so little monetary value for some reason. I don't know why that is but I'll help a little by giving $100 to Dougz and 0 to Goko.

[minakichan]

Cool beans, will send a gift. I love your work-- thank you, and I will miss text mode Dominion! (Although I'll be starting a job I'll actually like, so I suppose that's good timing.)

On a complete side note, I don't really think of my appreciation of isotropic as part of a zero-sum-game where Goko has to lose out-- sure, it kind of sucks now, but I don't think it will in the future. I think the idea of not supporting the official product solely because the unofficial isotropic is so much better is a bit dangerous to unofficial, unlicensed labors of love, no? It gives some credence to the idea that these unofficial fan-created versions actively take away potential revenue for actual IP holders, which lead said holders of other properties to crack down and kill off potential awesome fan projects like isotropic. In a parallel and only slightly different universe, RGG shut down isotropic long ago because of this threat.

Not giving Goko money because they're lousy is one thing, but if isotropic's existence itself influenced that decision-- if, had isotropic not existed, we were all so desperate for online Dominion that we hurled cash at Goko without a thought-- then I think it's our responsibility as consumers to support the spirit of fan creation and prevent IP holders from viewing them as a threat. It's in the same way that pure pirates who never purchase music or movies can't make the argument that piracy leads to more eyeballs and thus more sales; as someone who does pirate things, I feel somewhat obligated to also support various media industries as much as I can, so that I can at least personally justify my behavior. isotropic's definitely no pirate project, but I think you get the idea.

Just my two cents...

[Tombolo]

The awkward flipside to that argument is how much would we care about dominion without isotropic?  Yes, Isotropic is the reason I am a bit underwhelmed by Goko, but Isotropic's also the reason I give a Scout about Dominion in the first place.  Had I not stumbled across Iso, Dominion would still be that pretty fun game I played once and would kinda like to play more but lol fifty bucks.  I'm not really sure what I am getting at, though.

(I am still PROBABLY going to throw some money at Goko if they can get themselves together)

[Kahryl]

The awkward flipside to that argument is how much would we care about dominion without isotropic?  Yes, Isotropic is the reason I am a bit underwhelmed by Goko, but Isotropic's also the reason I give a Scout about Dominion in the first place.  Had I not stumbled across Iso, Dominion would still be that pretty fun game I played once and would kinda like to play more but lol fifty bucks.  I'm not really sure what I am getting at, though.

(I am still PROBABLY going to throw some money at Goko if they can get themselves together)

Ditto the sentiment. I played physical Dominion once with my buddies on vacation a year ago, thought it was pretty fun, found isotropic much later. I'm addicted to iso, not Dominion. After it folds, I'm done. And not just to throw some sort of righteous temper tantrum.. Dominion itself just isn't compelling enough to go through all the trouble and expense.

[Kirian]

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

[polonkus]

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

How about a kickstarter for DougZ to publish Isotropic server code with the copyright-infringing elements removed?
Then someone can put up fan-iso using cards from the variants forum.

[Captain_Frisk]

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

How about a kickstarter for DougZ to publish Isotropic server code with the copyright-infringing elements removed?
Then someone can put up fan-iso using cards from the variants forum.

I think he has.  Someone else can find it.

Androminion is open source.

[dor]

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

How about a kickstarter for DougZ to publish Isotropic server code with the copyright-infringing elements removed?
Then someone can put up fan-iso using cards from the variants forum.

I think he has.  Someone else can find it.

Androminion is open source.

Here

[Polk5440]

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

How about a kickstarter for DougZ to publish Isotropic server code with the copyright-infringing elements removed?
Then someone can put up fan-iso using cards from the variants forum.

Ooooohhh.... Pseudo-Dominion with fan cards? Maybe even the ones that win rinkworks's contest? I'd free ride off of someone's hard work on modifying Isotropic for that!

Maybe I'd even do a little more than free ride...

[Grujah]

Like.. Zombinion?

http://boardgamegeek.com/image/586115/dominion-seaside?size=large

 

[polonkus]

Like.. Zombinion?

http://boardgamegeek.com/image/586115/dominion-seaside?size=large

 

Not a fan of the art style but that is awesome.

[andwilk]

We need to kick rinkworks' card-design contest into high gear so we can start churning out more cards!  I love the idea of making a new "Isotropic" using the fan cards that win the contest.  Honestly, I'd be more likely to play that than Goko at the moment.

[Dsell]

We need to kick rinkworks' card-design contest into high gear so we can start churning out more cards!  I love the idea of making a new "Isotropic" using the fan cards that win the contest.  Honestly, I'd be more likely to play that than Goko at the moment.

Some part of me wants to make this a kickstarter just to see how much money we can send to Doug altogether.

How about a kickstarter for DougZ to publish Isotropic server code with the copyright-infringing elements removed?
Then someone can put up fan-iso using cards from the variants forum.

I could actually really get behind the idea of a long-term f.ds project of building a game like Dominion with fan cards created by us using isotropic's interface. We could use the set design contest and some other well-tested and well-respected fan cards as the initial basis and incorporate more fan cards over time as they're balanced and coded. I would love to help out with this by helping design and test cards and would be willing to donate some money to a kickstarter if it's something people are genuinely interested in. I'd be curious to hear from Dougz and Donald X. about this idea. I think of it as a tribute to the best game I've ever played, but I don't want it to be perceived as a rip-off of the original game.

Maybe this is all too far-fetched anyway, but I'm just brainstorming here. I'd love to hear others' thoughts!

[Schlippy]

If we had some active coders, that would be a great tool to mass test and debug fan sets and would boost the quality of fan sets a lot.

[Tombolo]

Provinces with Friends!

[eHalcyon]

If we actually start a project of making an online dominion populated solely by fan cards, we'll need to work out all the unused vanilla cards.

[Tombolo]

I wanna see a +Card/+Buy.  I don't know why, but I do.

[Kahryl]

You mean Wharf?

I wanna see +Card/+$

[Tombolo]

Don't confuse the issues with the facts!

[blueblimp]

Making an alternative server with fan cards doesn't seem on the up-and-up to me. Even though it's not using the card data from Dominion, it'd still be using the same ruleset, so it's still something awfully similar to real Dominion (just with worse card design). For example, the value of the expansion Seaside is not just the new cards it introduces, but also new rules like for Duration cards. If you make a fan card that's a Duration, then it's inherently derivative of Seaside, even if only a little bit.

I wouldn't see any problem if the point were to help design and test fan expansions, but the way it's being discussed in this thread is as an isotropic replacement and Goko alternative, which to me puts it in rip-off territory.

Also see the thread http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=3232.0, where Donald X comments:

As usual I have zero interest in discussing exactly to what degree you can rip off Dominion and get away with it legally. Let's just pretend here, among friends, that no-one would do such thing, that any Dominion-inspired game anyone here made would be sufficiently different that of course I would wish them well and so much for that.

Now, a Dominion-inspired game, that would be interesting. Also a lot of work, and hard to make a good one. Donald X had been designing games for around a decade when he created Dominion.

[eHalcyon]

Fair point.

[Tombolo]

Clearly we should bribe DougZ to implement Tanto Cuore instead.

[Kirian]

I have nothing to add to blueblimp's post.  That pretty much sums it up.

[minakichan]

Clearly we should bribe DougZ to implement Tanto Cuore instead.

Always kind of wondered how Arclight got away with it... Maybe because the cards are weaker and the game is therefore not quite as fun.

So it should be okay if isotropic is "Dominion, but not as good!"

[Dsell]

Well for me it would definitely not be an alternative to IRL Dominion or Goko...I will for sure be getting Goko after the security issues and whatnot are fixed. I would think of this as a by the fans, for the fans tribute to the game we love...but all that said I can see how it might look like a rip off and that's the last thing I'd want to to be. I certainly wouldn't want to do it if DXV didn't like the idea.

[anlin_wang]

The awkward flipside to that argument is how much would we care about dominion without isotropic?  Yes, Isotropic is the reason I am a bit underwhelmed by Goko, but Isotropic's also the reason I give a Scout about Dominion in the first place.  Had I not stumbled across Iso, Dominion would still be that pretty fun game I played once and would kinda like to play more but lol fifty bucks.  I'm not really sure what I am getting at, though.

(I am still PROBABLY going to throw some money at Goko if they can get themselves together)

I agree. Me and a few of my friends discovered Dominion at college and the only reason we ever seriously got into the game and the community was through isotropic. Without it I think pretty much all of us are just done with this game other than IRL with the base set and Prosperity that we have.

But I still will throw some money at Dougz though.

[Tombolo]

I kinda wanna give Donald some money too if the Goko thing winds up not working out for me.  I haven't bought the real cards (no point- my only interested friends already own them) but I have gotten a bunch of mileage out of his game.

[Wingnut]

Clearly we should bribe DougZ to implement Tanto Cuore instead.

Always kind of wondered how Arclight got away with it... Maybe because the cards are weaker and the game is therefore not quite as fun.

So it should be okay if isotropic is "Dominion, but not as good!"

They got away with it because the game is a really different variant if delved into. Base set Tanto Cuore and base set Dominion are really different game strategically even if some of the card effects are similar and the goal is similar.

[minakichan]

Clearly we should bribe DougZ to implement Tanto Cuore instead.

Always kind of wondered how Arclight got away with it... Maybe because the cards are weaker and the game is therefore not quite as fun.

So it should be okay if isotropic is "Dominion, but not as good!"

They got away with it because the game is a really different variant if delved into. Base set Tanto Cuore and base set Dominion are really different game strategically even if some of the card effects are similar and the goal is similar.

I have Base and Expanding the House for Tanto Cuore, but aside from a little weirdness with private maids, chambering, and buildings, they really just feel like they could be a different expansion of Dominion (but of course, more expensive), certainly nothing as weird as the stuff coming in Dark Ages.

I guess I just feel like I don't have to adjust my thinking much to play Tanto Cuore (although I hear the same cannot be said of moe Nazi girl Dominion Barba Rossa, so I'm looking forward to that!)

[GendoIkari]

Also see the thread http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=3232.0, where Donald X comments:

As usual I have zero interest in discussing exactly to what degree you can rip off Dominion and get away with it legally. Let's just pretend here, among friends, that no-one would do such thing, that any Dominion-inspired game anyone here made would be sufficiently different that of course I would wish them well and so much for that.

Indeed. That quote from Donald (and similar things he's said) is the reason that, even though I said in another thread that I'd like a non-public version of Iso just to play with my wife at home, I wouldn't do it, even if I were offered to source code.

[Chuckleslovakian]

Ok, ok, I'll be as gracious as I can.  :-)  It's totally not necessary — the site was a labor of love, mostly — but dougz@isotropic.org is indeed my paypal account and I stopped turning down free money years ago.

The Palo Alto address is no longer good; I moved a couple of weeks ago (remember downtime followed by a week of frequent disconnects?).  It should still forward, actually, or you can email me for my address if you prefer avoiding paypal.

Finally decided to send a little money today. Thanks for hosting it for so long.