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[eHalcyon]

But you're thinking of it as getting a ruin compared to getting nothing.

I think +1 Card, and even +1 Action are both better than a truly blank card (or a Curse or an Estate).

So maybe the rule for Ruins is more utility than a curse, less utility than a card you would spend money on.

IMO, +1 Action is just barely better than a blank card.  It is only better in edge cases -- TR, KC, Conspirator, HoP, etc.  Otherwise, it is functionally equivalent to a Confusion.  You might as well not be able to play it.

+1 Card is better than +1 Action in that, if you have an extra Action at the end, you can play it and get the next card.  It eats an action, sure, but it still hurts less than a Confusion that just takes up room.

+$1 is similar in that it eats your action in exchange for a Copper.

+1 Buy gives something potentially useful as well.

+1 Action is the worst one in almost all cases and would basically be a Confusion card.

[WanderingWinder]

I'm pretty sure +1 Buy is the only one you might buy, seeing as it's the only one not every board has.  +$1 is a worse copper, +1 Card wastes your action, +1 Action wastes a card.

Pedantic Man!
Not every board draws you cards. Well, you say, it only gets the one card back, so that does nothing - true... normally! But there are two cards for which you actually get to draw EXTRA cards this way: Golem and King's Court. So, with no other +cards, but you COULD build some enormous actiony enginey awesomesauce, except that there are NO +CARDS CARDS AT ALL (like, no cantrips, no nothin' - I guess there are some kinds of +action cards that aren't cantrips, a la lighthouse, festival, fishing village), and there is at least one of golem and king's court, in that situation, you might want those ruined smithies (or whatever they will be called.






What do you mean that will never happen? Didn't stop them from printing Scout!

Hey, in Harem/Nobles games, you'll be very glad of a Scout.  And they can help you get those Estates in hand for Chapel/Remodel/Ambassador.

Hey, you know what, I've actually played a billion, er, around 11,000 games, and you know what, even in these situations, the vast majority of the time, no, no I wasn't glad of scout. Or a couple times I was glad that my opponent wanted it.
But I'm not so much saying that it never ever ever happens, only that a hypothetical free terminal +1 card card is good as often.
Yeah.

Okay, almost as often.

[jotheonah]

Whoever suggested Ruined Black Market (which only and always contains Scout) already won this game.

[jotheonah]

Breaking News from RGG guys:

There is going to be one more Dominion Expansion following the Guilds. It will be called Dominion: Scout Still Sucks. It will contain 500 cards with the theme "Cards that don't make Scout any better" and the subthemes of "Cards that don't care about Scout" and "Cards that actually make buying Scout a lot worse."

[rinkworks]

Ruined Envoy?  Reveal the top card of your deck.  The player to your left chooses one to discard; put the rest in your hand?

[werothegreat]

Ruined Possession.  The player to your left takes an extra turn after this one, in which you can see all cards he does, just to spite you.  When he trashes a card, he can choose to set it aside, putting it in his discard at the end of his turn, if he feels like it.  Also, he can play Outpost to infinity.

[Insomniac]

Insomniac plays a Graverobber
...trashing a Cultist
......Drawing 3 Cards
......Gaining a province
Insomniac buys a province.

[jotheonah]

I mentioned this before, but I'm intrigued by the Ruins/ Scrying Pool interaction. Coupled with some villages, or failing that Vaults, I could see it as a way to make your deck being flooded with tiny terminal actions into an asset.

[clb]

I mentioned this before, but I'm intrigued by the Ruins/ Scrying Pool interaction. Coupled with some villages, or failing that Vaults, I could see it as a way to make your deck being flooded with tiny terminal actions into an asset.

And Poor Houses! (which I think you mentioned before, and also counts as a tiny terminal, along with the ruins.)

[Listerfiend]

Ruins are better than curses for your opponent much of the time because they are actions.

Library can skip over ruins but not curses. Seems like a decent counter to them in general.
Transmute can trash them for Duchys.
They power up Vineyard.
Scrying Pool likes them.
Graverobber can trash them.
In general they are a little better for Cornucopia cards that care about differently named cards. Menagerie, Harvest, Fairgrounds.

They are worse for a few cards.

Shanty Town is worse than it already is.
Farming Village and Golem pass over curses but hit ruins.
Rabble will discard your opponents ruins.
Hunting Party won't skip over differently named ruins.

[jotheonah]

Ruins should give us a new Max Fairgrounds score, if anyone cares to calculate it. And Menagerie is gonna be a decent counter to ruins attacks.

[werothegreat]

Ruins should give us a new Max Fairgrounds score, if anyone cares to calculate it. And Menagerie is gonna be a decent counter to ruins attacks.

10 + 1 (bane) + 4 (treasures) + 4 (victory) + 1 (potion) + 5 (tourney) + 5 (ruins) + 1 (curse) = 31

31/5*2=12 each.

I'm ignoring Black Market for sanity's sake.

[GendoIkari]

Ruins should give us a new Max Fairgrounds score, if anyone cares to calculate it. And Menagerie is gonna be a decent counter to ruins attacks.

No point to calculating Fairgrounds at the moment; in the middle of a new set being previewed. How many cards would you count from the new set? We don't yet know how many differently named cards Dark Ages has for sure.

[werothegreat]

Odd thing - Poor House cannot serve as a Bane...

[ftl]

I bet this has been mentioned, but ruins are going to be an amazing pile to pile out with goons. Costs 0 and doesn't give negative VP like curses!

[play2draw]

Ruins should give us a new Max Fairgrounds score, if anyone cares to calculate it. And Menagerie is gonna be a decent counter to ruins attacks.

No point to calculating Fairgrounds at the moment; in the middle of a new set being previewed. How many cards would you count from the new set? We don't yet know how many differently named cards Dark Ages has for sure.

True. Considering that this set has 35 kingdom cards instead of the usual 25, and five of these cards are Ruins, it wouldn't surprise me if another five cards are Shelters.

[werothegreat]

Ruins should give us a new Max Fairgrounds score, if anyone cares to calculate it. And Menagerie is gonna be a decent counter to ruins attacks.

No point to calculating Fairgrounds at the moment; in the middle of a new set being previewed. How many cards would you count from the new set? We don't yet know how many differently named cards Dark Ages has for sure.

True. Considering that this set has 35 kingdom cards instead of the usual 25, and five of these cards are Ruins, it wouldn't surprise me if another five cards are Shelters.

Ruins aren't Kingdom cards.

[LastFootnote]

True. Considering that this set has 35 kingdom cards instead of the usual 25, and five of these cards are Ruins, it wouldn't surprise me if another five cards are Shelters.

Ruins aren't Kingdom cards.

Yeah, the 35 Kingdom cards don't include Ruins or Shelters.

[play2draw]

Good point. I take it back.

[aaron0013]

Not sure if anyone has suggested this yet but a ruined gardens would be awesome!
-1 point for every 10 cards in your deck.

It's like a sometimes-super curse!

[jonts26]

But the ruins do partially explain why we need 500 cards for only  35 kingdom cards. Still 100 MIA, though.

[jsh357]

Didn't Donald say Dark Ages would have cards you can only get from other cards?  I'm guessing that explains the missing ones...

[WanderingWinder]

But the ruins do partially explain why we need 500 cards for only  35 kingdom cards. Still 100 MIA, though.

Well, some of those 100 are victory cards, which get 12 instead of 10.

[WanderingWinder]

Didn't Donald say Dark Ages would have cards you can only get from other cards?  I'm guessing that explains the missing ones...

This was largely speculated, but I don't remember Donald ever saying it.

[jsh357]

Here it is:

This is the 7th addition to the game of Dominion. It is 500 cards but is not a standalone. It adds 35 new Kingdom cards to Dominion, plus new bad cards you give to other players (Ruins), new cards to replace starting Estates (Shelters), and cards you can only get via specific other cards.