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Author Topic: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 6 Started. PM for QT.  (Read 148475 times)

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Robz888

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1025 on: August 28, 2012, 06:05:51 pm »

I feel really bad for everyone who isn't following the thread right now...  this explosion is going to look really weird.

Welcome to mafia 8 where everyone accuses everyone in the span of 2 pages!

Who are the people not talking right now? Eevee, Yuma, Theorel. There's the scum, got 'em!
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1026 on: August 28, 2012, 06:18:07 pm »

I feel really bad for everyone who isn't following the thread right now...  this explosion is going to look really weird.

Welcome to mafia 8 where everyone accuses everyone in the span of 2 pages!

Who are the people not talking right now? Eevee, Yuma, Theorel. There's the scum, got 'em!

Not sure if Robz flailing as mafia, Robz joking or Robz failing to offer a plan for how to use night actions ifwhen he flips town (MV).
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1027 on: August 28, 2012, 06:18:46 pm »

(I do actually know it was a joke)
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

Robz888

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1028 on: August 28, 2012, 06:29:44 pm »

It was one of those rare Robz mafia jokes.
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O

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1029 on: August 28, 2012, 06:30:51 pm »

It was one of those rare Robz-mafia jokes.
FTFY
obvscumslip
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1030 on: August 28, 2012, 06:35:32 pm »


yuma(1): Eevee
Captain_Frisk(1): Robz888
Robz888(1): O
O(1): Galzria

Not Voting(5): yuma, theorel, ehunt, Captain_Frisk, Insomniac

with 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.

Deadline is Friday 31th, 10pm.

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O

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1031 on: August 28, 2012, 06:40:53 pm »

Got quiet quickly.... I've lost some desire to post.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1032 on: August 28, 2012, 07:03:24 pm »

Three separate things

1. The recent unpleasantness: All of my narratives are broken... is this right? Galz is proposing an O/Frisk alignment, and O is proposing a Galz/Robz alignment? Seems like this is something easier to chase down with evidence than with yelling. A case on Frisk built early day two; what did O say? A micro-case on Galz built like fifty billion times, what did Robz say? Voltgloss made a case on Robz yesterday, what did Galz say? Why did O defend Robz from Voltgloss's attacks (in either scenario the O/Frisk or the Galz/Robz scenario, why did he do this)?

2. Eevee: your case on Yuma is not the sort of case I like to vote on (it's based on personality rather than voting patterns). The argument seems to be that Yuma's play is similar to games in which Yuma was scum. Can you point to a game where yuma was confirmed town and played differently? (Has Yuma been town in any completed game?) What do all of the people who are fighting right now think of Yuma?

3. Before I forget it, some important theory talk:

a. If somebody claims cop or jailkeeper, and somebody else is IC, should IC out himself? I am leaning towards no, that town should just be really hesitant to believe such a claim. I was quite surprised when theorel said the opposite at the beginning of the game day. I tried to start a discussion but it didn't continue because it got drowned out by the ehunt-has-overly-strong-opinions wagon.

b. Should vig claim? I think it's clear the real vig should counterclaim any fake vig-claim. Otherwise vig should stay silent. Even after vig has used two shots, vig functions as "named townie" if still alive.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1033 on: August 28, 2012, 07:06:45 pm »

Hey I am here and reading all the most recent pages while also trying to go back and reread some stuff... I think I will post as I find things rather than do one big page...
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1034 on: August 28, 2012, 07:22:34 pm »

one of these questions is simple enough - galz voted for Robz day II, argued with him, called out logical fallacies he made. Maybe Galz was big-time bussing, but I doubt it. I think the Galz/Robz scumteam proposal is unlikely. O/Frisk is going to be a lot harder to disprove since Frisk posted very little of use for the first two game days.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1035 on: August 28, 2012, 07:26:00 pm »

Frisk FOS'd O twice but didn't vote O (but Frisk didn't vote or FOS much). He also FOS'd and even voted for me today for saying nice things about O, which isn't that consistent with a scumbuddy (but is possible).

So in either of these cases I guess it's conceivable that they are scumbuddies but it sounds to me like both of these pairs are unlikely.
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O

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1036 on: August 28, 2012, 07:27:04 pm »

Three separate things

1. The recent unpleasantness: All of my narratives are broken... is this right? Galz is proposing an O/Frisk alignment, and O is proposing a Galz/Robz alignment? Seems like this is something easier to chase down with evidence than with yelling. A case on Frisk built early day two; what did O say? A micro-case on Galz built like fifty billion times, what did Robz say? Voltgloss made a case on Robz yesterday, what did Galz say? Why did O defend Robz from Voltgloss's attacks (in either scenario the O/Frisk or the Galz/Robz scenario, why did he do this)?

Voltgloss was scummy to me. He has since flipped town, so I put more sway into his arguments. Yesterday I didn't vote for Robz because even though Robz was scummy to me, he was scummy for different reasons than Volt et al, so I thought volt might be misdirecting people as scum. 
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yuma

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1037 on: August 28, 2012, 07:55:45 pm »

So this is a post to bring Voltgloss back from the dead. As I mentioned before I was completely and totally wrong about him.

Let's see what he had to say that I pushed aside because of my suspicions of him.

He gets a very early scum read on Eevee
Quote
I suspect Eevee for the hedging and the repeat bandwagoning.  And the buddying to theorel but NOT ehunt is odd.  They were both doing the same thing but Eevee buddied up to one, not the other.
He criticizes his top two suspects Eevee and Lekkit for
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And my top two suspects just abdicated responsibility for their vote.  Setting themselves up to claim, on future days:  "You can't say I'm scummy for voting to lynch that poor townie on Day 1, I was just doing what {insert name here} told me to do!"

Don't fall for it, people.
Then again on Eevee for killing the person that suspected him most day 1
Quote
yes I know "but WIFOM the mafia could have decided to frame Eevee by killing the person who suspected him most" but you know what?  I lose these games by out-thinking myself.  So I'm trying to dial back and operate at the first level of thought, see where it leads.  The first level of thought here:  cayvie suspected Eevee, Eevee is scummy, cayvie is now dead.  So I'm voting Eevee.  Let's see what happens.
Nice plug for me, where he expresses suspicion of Lekkit and theorel for voting for him suspiciously
Quote
I actually don't suspect Yuma.
and he eventually votes for theorel (I had completely forgotten about this suspicion)

And then he changes his vote to Lekkit but at the same time says this
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If Lekkit is Town, this suggests Insomniac, Galzria, and Eevee are also Town.
He then has a huge post about Galz, but doesn't actually vote for him
Quote
The answer:  either lynch Lekkit or lynch Galz.  If one flips scum, go after the other next.
He also expressed that insomniac didn't look good but didn't have much to say substantially about it

And then he has his big post about robz but has this to say first
Quote
And yuma:  I see and understand the reasons for your suspicions.  I agree I have been moving my vote and suspicions around to various targets.  This has been in an effort to provoke and gauge reactions both from the targets of those votes, and other people's reactions to those building (or not) wagons.  I realize it can be read as Volt being "all over the place."  Because I am.  But with, I think, good reason.  And the results of that research are in - and in my mind they point to one person.
His big post on robz was summarized as such
Quote
Bottom line:  Robz is a little too agreeable this game.  A little too willing to support others' analysis.  Not enough original analysis of his own.  He's being really helpful!  Supportive!  Trying to move others' lynch-analysis along!  ...and it's all become slowly, but steadily, worrisome to me.

Yeah, I think this is M-II Robz, hoping to lead me (and others) down the garden path again.  I don't want to fall for it a second time.
He then tries to consolidate the town and get a lynch going and settles on Lekkit.

So this presents an interesting scenario. His suspects were throughout day 1 and 2: eevee, insomniac, galz, theorel, lekkit and robz.

As much as I disliked the wagon on robz day 2. his behavior today combined with volt's reads on him, his drunk hammer, in addition all he has done today has been to say that insomniac must be town and defend himself. He has done very little in the way of proactively hunting scum. Yes he has voted for frisk, but that vote was based on so little substance.

I will vote: Robz people still aren't commenting about me despite Eevee's and ehunt's request.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1038 on: August 28, 2012, 09:32:27 pm »

{crickets chirping}
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theorel

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1039 on: August 28, 2012, 10:11:51 pm »

Well, that was interesting.
And yuma again repeats what Frisk said a little bit ago, now he's pushing the Robz/Insomniac angle.  Frisk and yuma are coming off hugely scummy, maybe they're a scum-pair hoping to act in tandem in such a way that we can never suspect them both because it'd be too obvious?  I dunno, but it's pretty ridiculous.

@Frisk's disbelief that 3 town wagons could go at the same time.  It's not really that complicated, because town starts town-wagons often enough.  One scum joins one wagon, another scum joins another one, and then finally the third scum says "nope, won't join either".  Boom, three town-wagons.  Let's look at MIV day1 (which is analagous to this games day2): first wagon pops (town), second wagon joth (town), third wagon Axxle (town)...and there was scum on each of them, but town started all of them.

@O: seriously?  you think Galz-Robz are scum-buddies?  So your story goes like this: Volt accuses Robz and Galz says, "This is exactly how scum-Robz said he'd act...BUS".  Then they go to night, and Galz is like, "hey, you lived Imma gonna defend you now by pushing random wagons on other people." 

@ehunt:
THEORY DERAILMENT
I'm just uncomfortable killing a claimed PR without proof.  I really don't like the idea that night falls and I'm staring at a screen that says "your one-shot cop is dead", because the scum decided to veto Innocent Child.  Let's see, here's my view on the PRs:

In my view, the vig is pretty much an IC at this point.  If he shoots, we shouldn't lynch, so it's trading one town-directed kill for another.  However, as long as he has his shot, no one else can claim vig (since he can safely NK them).  However, we know that when the vig claims he'll die that night, so we only get the benefit of the cleared town for one day.  Similarly with the IC.  But, if both claim at once, we get the benefit of both for one day, and the benefit of one for the second day (since scum can only take out one each day).  So, in my view IC and vig should claim the same day.  I could be wrong on that, I'd be interested in others' input.

Now, what if someone claims cop?  Well, either they're a legit townie, or scum fakeclaiming.  IF they're fakeclaiming, we lynch them and hey great, we got the scum.  IF they aren't then their investigatee dies at night.  And next day we're back to 0 unconfirmed town next day.  If vig claims, he dies that night, and well, hopefully we lynched scum that day, otherwise we lost.  If we expect an IC to counter-claim, this dire situation can't happen...and if scum decided to leave IC out of the game, we get 3 confirmed town...that's gonna be a pretty good day.  So, the bad-side is if the IC is in the game, and has to claim to kill the fake.  Well, that's a lot like a cop revealing to take out scum, so it can't be that bad right?  But what is it exactly?  Let's see: assuming the double-claim above, vig claims as well.  We get a confirmed scum-lynch.  Next day, we have one confirmed town and one less scum.  If that day was today, we'd be at 7 players, 2 scum, 1 confirmed town, and 4 more trying to hit scum, with no PRs.  And, well that's not as great as 5 town with 2 hidden power roles, but is it even bad?  I feel like the first situation is bad enough that I'm willing to chance this one to avoid it...but that doesn't make it a closed case...it's just how I feel.  I'll readily admit to being a pretty conservative player in pretty much all games, so that's certainly playing a role here.

Anyways the topic at hand: Frisk and yuma both acting exactly as I would expect if they're scum.  (I already stated this earlier, that I expected them to have derailed town-lynches yesterday into Lekkit-lynch, and then push for them today).  I can't pick out one as scum over the other, but regardless of all else, I think we should lynch one of them today.
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O

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1040 on: August 28, 2012, 10:34:44 pm »

@O: seriously?  you think Galz-Robz are scum-buddies?  So your story goes like this: Volt accuses Robz and Galz says, "This is exactly how scum-Robz said he'd act...BUS".  Then they go to night, and Galz is like, "hey, you lived Imma gonna defend you now by pushing random wagons on other people." 

Yes, that's exactly correct. I'm not quite sure where your issue is here? Scum bus scumbuddies D2 all the time, especially if they have time to back off.

But my vote isn't on Galzria, it's on Robz. I've already said Galz could be townie.

I'm not really seeing how frisk/yuma are coming off as a scumpair, either. Maybe care to back up your point instead of relying on superlatives to make it sound convincing?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1041 on: August 28, 2012, 10:37:24 pm »

@O: seriously?  you think Galz-Robz are scum-buddies?  So your story goes like this: Volt accuses Robz and Galz says, "This is exactly how scum-Robz said he'd act...BUS".  Then they go to night, and Galz is like, "hey, you lived Imma gonna defend you now by pushing random wagons on other people." 

Yes, that's exactly correct. I'm not quite sure where your issue is here? Scum bus scumbuddies D2 all the time, especially if they have time to back off.

But my vote isn't on Galzria, it's on Robz. I've already said Galz could be townie.

I'm not really seeing how frisk/yuma are coming off as a scumpair, either. Maybe care to back up your point instead of relying on superlatives to make it sound convincing?

Scum bussing scum D2 when there are two other wagons available (one confirmed town) is ridiculous. Maybe that's where Yuma's issue with it lies?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1042 on: August 28, 2012, 10:39:41 pm »

@O: seriously?  you think Galz-Robz are scum-buddies?  So your story goes like this: Volt accuses Robz and Galz says, "This is exactly how scum-Robz said he'd act...BUS".  Then they go to night, and Galz is like, "hey, you lived Imma gonna defend you now by pushing random wagons on other people." 

Yes, that's exactly correct. I'm not quite sure where your issue is here? Scum bus scumbuddies D2 all the time, especially if they have time to back off.

But my vote isn't on Galzria, it's on Robz. I've already said Galz could be townie.

I'm not really seeing how frisk/yuma are coming off as a scumpair, either. Maybe care to back up your point instead of relying on superlatives to make it sound convincing?

Scum bussing scum D2 when there are two other wagons available (one confirmed town) is ridiculous. Maybe that's where Yuma's issue with it lies?

MIV scum bussed me (correctly) over going for you. There WEREN'T two wagons available until it got redirected back to Lekkit magically.

Actually, that's a point of interest. Who was key in derailing Robz/Insomniac and leading us to lekkit? hopefully not dead townies because that'll be depressing.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1043 on: August 28, 2012, 11:02:05 pm »

Scum bussing scum D2 when there are two other wagons available (one confirmed town) is ridiculous. Maybe that's where Yuma's issue with it lies?

Sorry galz, I am not understanding what you are trying to say here. care to clarify for me? What is my issue?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1044 on: August 28, 2012, 11:08:55 pm »

Scum bussing scum D2 when there are two other wagons available (one confirmed town) is ridiculous. Maybe that's where Yuma's issue with it lies?

Sorry galz, I am not understanding what you are trying to say here. care to clarify for me? What is my issue?

That O's case (or belief) that scum Galz would push a wagon on his scumteammate (Robz) to quite arguably the brink of tipping into a lynch, when there were two other viable wagons to be on at the time (one of which is confirmed town) - is rather ridiculous.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Robz888

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1045 on: August 28, 2012, 11:27:07 pm »

As much as I disliked the wagon on robz day 2. his behavior today combined with volt's reads on him, his drunk hammer, in addition all he has done today has been to say that insomniac must be town and defend himself. He has done very little in the way of proactively hunting scum. Yes he has voted for frisk, but that vote was based on so little substance.

I will vote: Robz people still aren't commenting about me despite Eevee's and ehunt's request.

I agree that I look scummy based on Volt's read and my hammer. And I understand why Volt thought his case against me was good: my agreeableness and hedginess on Days 1 and 2. I can't really argue with that.

But I think it's considerably unfair to say I have done "little in the way of proactively hunting scum" today. I wasn't as helpful as I could have been on Day 1 (V/LA somewhat), and on Day 2 I did mostly follow along with theories that I thought were good (Volt's for a while, and eventually Theorel). But I am contributing today; I am proposing theories that explain the situation we are in: A fairly quiet, civil town, where lynches are hard to push through, where we in fact got the first-ever No Lynch, and where no one came out gunning for me or Insomniac today. My explanation is that the mafia are among the laid back, quieter personalities, who aren't pushing any lynches too hard, which is why we get what we have. And I'm growing to believe this theory more and more precisely because now that I'm talking about it, I have these people finally coming after me. Not at the start of today, when there was just as much credible evidence against me, but now that I'm hitting on something.

So a big, big Finger of Suspicion to Frisk, Yuma, and Eevee, who I think are the people most likely to fit this profile. I'm already voting Frisk. If anybody wants to make a case that one of these others are more likely, I'm willing to hear it.
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1046 on: August 29, 2012, 12:52:05 am »

Ooh, I sleep just a little bit and you guys go crazy! I like it.

The only game I've played with town-yuma was murder mystery, and there he died day 1 so didn't really get a very good feel of how he plays town apart from the fact that it mildly suggests he plays it somehow differently.

Robz & others, do you agree that O is most probably town if I'm town (given how he turned the suspicion away from me day 1)? I understand you are not willing to clear O based on that because you can't know my alignment, but am I wrong to do it?

I don't particularly like Insomniac as a target. Robz, Frisk and yuma are my top three. Yuma and Frisk have played super similarly. Yuma's behavior I think is in line with his behavior as mafia early, the problem with Frisk is I feel he often plays the he has here. While I don't agree that either Robz or Insomniac has to be scum, out of them Robz is coming off way worse I think which also is weird because Ins always reads scummy to me. Who did I not mention yet? Theorel is playing like he usually does, being analytical and liking his theory talk. I don't get a super towny feeling from his posts, he definitely would be playing like this if he was scum too. Galzria I'm still not wanting to lynch because he derailed my lynch earlier so I feel other targets are for sure scummier. Have ever seen ehunt play scum?
I'm happy where my vote lies (yuma).
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theorel

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1047 on: August 29, 2012, 06:31:36 am »


I'm not really seeing how frisk/yuma are coming off as a scumpair, either. Maybe care to back up your point instead of relying on superlatives to make it sound convincing?

I'll get there.  The post last night was an intuitive leap, not a case.  Seeing yuma agree with Frisk after 2 pages exploded based on Frisk posting the same thing, and with both of them doing what I suggested earlier in the day I thought they would do as scum just struck a serious cord.  To explain the intuition:
When I read through yuma/Frisk, because I thought there was likely one scum there, I had to keep checking myself because everything yuma did Frisk seemed to do too.  They weren't sheeping (they've noted this earlier in the day), because they didn't always act in the same order.  So, I couldn't decide between them which was town and which was scum.  Then after yuma's post I thought, "what if they're scumbuddies" and suddenly everything fell into place.  Things just made sense. 

They redirected to Lekkit yesterday together after two town-led wagons were going (I know they were town-led because I led Insomniac's as town, and volt led Robz' as town...a few people even expressed that sentiment during the day yesterday).  Between Lekkit and the Robz/Insomniac business they keep feeling a day behind the rest of the town, like they're not ready to adjust to how the town views the game post-lynch and NK.  They've been pretty invisible so far this game, I don't think either had come under serious suspicion before now.  This fits with a more complacent scum, trying harder to stay out of the limelight than lynch town, which I've been noting we have since mid day2.  Anyways, I'll try to review and pull quotes, build a case.  But my intuition tells me they're scum-buddies and I trust my intuition.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1048 on: August 29, 2012, 09:58:47 am »

Well - this is getting interesting.

So now we have a few folks seeing scum pairs (or at least one scum) in (Captain_Frisk, Yuma, Eevee). 

@Insomniac - do you want to come in and yell at this analysis of leading town to focus on a small subset?

I guess I'll have to wait for theorel's case - but the accusation of being a day behind town doesn't feel right to me - in each of my megaposts - including where I derailed the Insomniac / RobZ wagons to join yuma - I re-read the thread as well as did a Control-F read on the individuals in question.  So - maybe feeling me referring to older things that the various individuals have said, instead of relying only on the latest and greatest?

@Galz: would you care to respond to my accusations that you misrepresented my stance on insomniac / robz? (post #976)
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

yuma

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Re: Mafia VIII: Pirates of the Pearl Coast - Day 3 Started. PM for QT.
« Reply #1049 on: August 29, 2012, 10:04:06 am »

Phone post at work: well I am glad to see some movement from this town. But why is it that the movement never happens when I am online. I am however a bit frustrated it is moving in the wrong direction-toward me-but I am confident you all will see that you are wrong before a lynch occurs.  I should point out that I feel I am being accused on two contradictory fronts. The first is from eevee who stated that I was incapable of finding my own reads and only sheeped off others. I once responded to that but never received a reply from eevee. The other is from theorem which says that I am coming up with and pushing wagons on my own but at the same time as frisk. Which one is it guys?

I went through the game a few times and from day 1 & 2 had mixed reads on everyone. From that I decided to go back and look at things from a confirmed townie pov. And that pointed to robz especially in line with his day 3 behavior and his hammer which is strikingly similar to o's hammer in m5.

As for frisk. As I have said before because we have shared reads it is hard for me to see his as scummy. Because I am not scum. But perhaps if many of you aresaying my behavior is scummy then I must assume that his is as well.

As for scum teams? This is mind boggling that it is evevbeing suggested. Try finding one scum is hard enough. When I do die from a lynch or a nk and turn up town don't think for a second that this clears frisk--although if he is the first to die and is town I imagine you will feel the same way about me.

And this is getting long for a phone post... There are many other individuals in this town that are floating under the radar. In a way all of us but robz and insomniac are.
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