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thirtyseven

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22 cards that need your input
« on: June 25, 2012, 03:57:29 pm »
0

I don't plan on playtesting these cards, but I'd still like to get constructive feedback on them, whether it's about card name, wording, price, balance, awesomeness, terribleness, originality (or lack thereof), etc. They are in price order, and if a card price changes I will rearrange it accordingly. Thanks in advance for helping me improve these cards!

Baked Goods
$0 Treasure
+$2
Trash this card.


I feel like this idea isn't new... would it work?

Drone
$2 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If this is in your hand during your Buy phase, +$1, +1 Buy.


Similar to Pawn; I like the idea of withholding a card from play and having it still be useful.

Deuce
$2 Action
Choose one: +$2; or gain a Silver.


I wanted a card that would give the choice of a later benefit or an immediate benefit.

Feedbag edited wording
$3 Action-Reaction
+$2
----
When you discard this or trash this except during a Clean-Up phase, you may reveal this. If you do, +2 Cards.


The only Reaction card I made. Is it balanced? I feel it could be way too weak on most boards and possibly too strong on some boards...  :-\

Refurnish
$3 Action
Trash a Treasure card from your hand. Gain a Victory card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.


More of a late-game benefit... would it be too little too late?

Gilded Village
$3 Action
+2 actions
Reveal your hand. +1 Card for every Gold in your hand.


Village that is mostly weaker, sometimes on par, and sometimes stronger than Vanilla Village, and obviously encourages buying Gold.


Dealer
$3 Action
Each player chooses a card in his hand. The person to your right reveals their chosen card, then you reveal yours. +$1 per total cost in coins of those cards. Each player passes his chosen card to the left. You may trash a card from your hand.


In my opinion this adds more strategy to an already great card in Masquerade.

Homesteader edited wording
$3 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Reveal your hand. If you reveal any Estates, +1 Card.


I just like interactions with Estates.  :)

Comradery edited wording
$4 Action
+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Card; or reveal your hand. For each Comradery revealed, +$2.


Inspired by Minion, and like Minion, you want as many Comraderies as possible. 2 in hand at once gives you $2, 3 in hand at once gives you $6. I'm wondering if price and card balance are okay here.

Old Hag
$4 Action-Duration
+2 Cards
If another player reshuffles his deck before the start of your next turn, he gains a Curse on top of his deck.


A Duration-Curser! This is a regular Duration card in that it doesn't get cleaned up until the end of the player's next turn, but I didn't know how to put that information on the card, or if it even needs that wording at all. I wanted to make other players take the reshuffle in consideration even more than they do. I have no idea how strong or weak this card would be in practice, just that the earlier you get it, the better!

Dilemma
$4 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: gain a Silver; gain 2 Estates.


I love the idea of a card that gives an early or late-game benefit. It's 2 Estates instead of 1 because I don't think just 1 would be significant enough. I made this a cantrip to further differentiate this card from Deuce, if I remember correctly. What do you think?

Mutator
$4 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it's an Estate, Copper, or Curse, gain a Silver; otherwise, gain a Gold.


This is one of my favorite cards of this bunch, sort of inspired by Transmute.

Cheapskate
$4 Action
Choose one: gain a card costing $2 and a card costing $4; or gain a Silver and a card other than Silver costing $3.


I feel like this would be a fun Workshop-related card. I think this would be really strong in Garden and Silk Road games, which is great because I love alt-VP!

Streets of Gold
$4 Victory
Worth 1VP per every 2 Golds in your deck, rounded down.


Simply an alt-VP dependent on Gold... what do you think?


Conquistador
$4 Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player reveals their hand, trashes any Gold in their hand, and gains that number of Silvers, putting them into their hand.


I'm afraid this attack will often not do too much, and is discouraging buying Golds a good idea?

Prohibiter
Action-Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Each other player discards a Gold (or reveals a hand with no Gold).


Another Gold-discouraging card... is this card better or worse (design/balance-wise) than Conquistador?

Silo edited wording
$4 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed cards costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.


This card would suuuck with most or all top-deck attacks. Other than that I like the idea of drawing some cards and leaving some good cards on the deck.

Gilded Witch
$4 Action-Attack
+2 Cards
Reveal your hand. If you have any Gold in your hand, each other player gains a curse.


Here's a card that encourages Gold-buying. The cursing effect will have a slow start. The +2 Cards will help Gold collision somewhat. I'm curious as to what you think of this card.

Entrepreneur
$4 Action
+1 Buy
Gold is worth $1 more this turn.


Shaky on this card, which is too similar to and weaker than Coppersmith (except with heavy trashing?), but maybe the +Buy would make this card sometimes worth it? Would it be better or broken at $3?


Placer Mine
$5 Action
You may reveal a Gold from your hand. Gain a copy of it. You may trash any number of Coppers from your hand.


I love the name Placer Mine, and I love how it can do different things for you at different times, or sometimes even both things at once. Is it better priced at $4 or $5?

Golden Village
$6 Action
+2 Actions
When you buy this, gain a Gold.


Inspired by Border Village, one of my favorite cards.

Acreage
$7 Action
Trash this card. Gain a Province. Each other player gains an Estate.


Just missed the $8 needed for a Province? Have no fear! :P Estates could be bad for other players (early game) or good for them (late game), and I like how this card changes over time in that respect. But the problem is, if you have $7, how often would you take this over Gold?
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 12:38:58 pm by thirtyseven »
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I'm only a mid-level player, so I may be wrong...

Drab Emordnilap

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2012, 05:18:39 pm »
0

I had typed up a big long response to all the cards, and then my computer lost power before I submitted it. I'll redo it when I get home tonight.
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Fragasnap

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2012, 05:38:20 pm »
+4

First thoughts and reactions:

Baked Goods
$0 Treasure
+$2
Trash this card.
Free one-shot Silver? With extra buys it would probably be a pile to empty pretty quickly. I like it, I think.

Drone
$2 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If this is in your hand during your Buy phase, +$1, +1 Buy.
Wording:
Drone

+1 Card
+1 Action

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, reveal your hand: +$1, +1 Buy for each Drone in your hand.
$2 ACTION
Interesting concept, but I don't think I would often if ever keep it in my hand for only a single coin bonus though.

Deuce
$2 Action
Choose one: +$2; or gain a Silver.
I struggle to find anything to say about this card. Both effects are painfully weak and uninteresting.

Feedbag
$3 Action-Reaction
+$2
If you discard or trash this card, +2 Cards.
Okay, so what about when I discard this during Clean-Up. Do I get a 7 card hand next turn when I discard this from play or do I discard the top 2 cards of my deck. The draw isn't even optional so it has to be done. Let me suggest some simplification:
Feedbag

+$2

When you discard this or trash this except during a Clean-Up phase, you may reveal this. If you do, +2 Cards.
$3 ACTION - REACTION
It could be decent, but I'm not terribly excited to see it just for its bland action effect.

Refurnish
$3 Action
Trash a Treasure card from your hand. Gain a Victory card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.
A worse Remodel as I see it. It seems like it would largely serve as another placeholder card to show up and never be used in a lot of games.

Dealer
$3 Action
Each player chooses a card in his hand. The person to your right reveals their chosen card, then you reveal yours. +$1 per total cost in coins of those cards. Each player passes his chosen card to the left. You may trash a card from your hand.
It's a Masquerade without a draw that encourages you to pass something good but still asks each other player to pass the worst thing in his hand. It just makes me wish for Masquerade.

Homesteader
$3 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If you reveal any Estates from your hand, +1 Card.
Wording:
Homesteader

+1 Card
+1 Action

Reveal your hand. If you reveal any Estates, +1 Card.
$3 ACTION
I like both Laboratory variants.

Comradery
$4 Action
+1 Action
For every Comradery in your hand, +$2.
If there are no Comraderies in your hand, +1 Card.
Wording:
Comradery

+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Card; or reveal your hand. For each Comradery revealed, +$2.
$4 ACTION
Seems more swingy and frustrating than Conspirator.

Old Hag
$4 Action-Duration
+2 Cards
If another player reshuffles his deck before the start of your next turn, he gains a Curse on top of his deck.
First: As a Duration card, this is discarded during the first clean-up phase because it is the last turn that it will do anything. More importantly, I love Duration cursers, but this isn't a terribly novel idea. It will usually miss its mark because players won't shuffle while it's in play and the player often can't control when that will happen (and if they can, this discourages playing Actions). In addition, this would stack rather terribly in multiplayer.

Dilemma
$4 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: gain a Silver; gain 2 Estates.
Not much of a dilemma. Gain Silvers early, gain Estates later. This would be killer with Silk Roads, but is otherwise doesn't look like it would do much.

Mutator
$4 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it's an Estate, Copper, or Curse, gain a Silver; otherwise, gain a Gold.
I would drop this down to $3. Gaining a Gold is pretty strong, but you have to trash a card that you would likely otherwise want to get the Gold and a 1 card trash for benefit isn't going to do anything for slimming your deck.

Cheapskate
$4 Action
Choose one: gain a card costing $2 and a card costing $4; or gain a Silver and a card other than Silver costing $3.
Gardens would be happy to see this card, but otherwise, I can't see myself buying this card.

Conquistador
$4 Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player reveals their hand, trashes any Gold in their hand, and gains that number of Silvers, putting them into their hand.
It's hard to trash players' cards with Attacks. Swindler and Saboteur are very careful in doing so and even still lots of people hate the cards. There is something to be said for this card discouraging big money, but a terminal Silver that trashes every Gold in each player's hand seems like quite a lot of damage to wreak in one action, even if it does replace those Golds with Silvers. If it only replaced one Gold, then the attack would likely be hard enough to hit with to not completely over power Treasures.

Prohibiter
Action-Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Each other player discards a Gold (or reveals a hand with no Gold).
Ow. Cutpurse (the obvious comparison) hurts a lot because, as an opener, it hits the Coppers you're either using to buy more cards or attempting to trash. This thing, being a cantrip, rather painlessly slaps Golds out of players' hands. If you give it a different bonus and allow players to draw cards for losing a Gold it might be okay, but a free possible $3 hit to your opponent's next turn is not cool.

Silo
$4 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed Treasures costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.
At first blush, this seems fine: Non-terminal draw that leaves Golds, Platinums, and Harems on the deck. Then I remembered that Silvers aren't too shabby. This and a metric ton of Silvers could easily take over a game.
I would recommend leaving something that must inherently be in a deck on top of the deck: Victory cards or cards costing less or more than some number.

Entrepreneur
$4 Action
+1 Buy
Gold is worth $1 more this turn.
Coppersmith is weak and Coppers are the most numerous treasures in our starting decks. I think it would be extremely difficult to get the density of Golds necessary to make this card even partially useful.

Placer Mine
$5 Action
You may reveal a Gold from your hand. Gain a copy of it. You may trash any number of Coppers from your hand.
I can't think of a scenario I wouldn't rather have Mint. The only thing that makes this better (different, rather) is that it can trash Coppers after it is bought.

Golden Village
$6 Action
+2 Actions
When you buy this, gain a Gold.
This is rather contradictory. It wouldn't work in most draw engines (since that card draw is a huge part of what makes village cards decent), but it gives you Gold as though it wanted to work in draw engines. I'd have to see this one in play.

Acreage
$7 Action
Trash this card. Gain a Province. Each other player gains an Estate.
There should probably be an "if you do" clause to prevent players from going up 15 points by playing this with King's Court, but I otherwise like this "seven coins for a Province" idea.

Gilded Village
$3 Action
+2 actions
Reveal your hand. +1 Card for every Gold in your hand.

Streets of Gold
$4 Victory
Worth 1VP per every 2 Golds in your deck, rounded down.

Gilded Witch
$4 Action-Attack
+2 Cards
Reveal your hand. If you have any Gold in your hand, each other player gains a curse.
Do we really need to encourage buying Gold? I can't think of many games where I didn't want to buy as many Golds as I could-- these would simply make an already powerful treasure even stronger.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2012, 05:40:41 pm »
0

...
+1 just for how you formatted your cards.



I have not read through everything yet, but I assume the simplest thing for drone is to just make it an action/treasure that has different effects depending on how it's played.

Tables

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2012, 06:22:23 pm »
+1

Baked Goods
$0 Treasure
+$2
Trash this card.

You're right that this isn't new. It generally used to be called 'Fool's Gold', back before Hinterlands, sometimes Fairy Gold or other such things, usually as a $2 for a one shot +$2 treasure or $3-4 for a one shot +$3 treasure. The most interesting thing about this card is it lets you happily use up extra buys, probably running a pile out in the process. I think it might be overpowered considering that.

Quote
Drone
$2 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If this is in your hand during your Buy phase, +$1, +1 Buy.

This doesn't really make sense currently; you need some way to play it during the buy phase (treasure with wording change) or reveal it (reaction). After that, it could be an interesting card. It's a copper with +1 buy if you need it, or just a cantrip if not.

Quote
Deuce
$2 Action
Choose one: +$2; or gain a Silver.

Seems okay. Perhaps a little powerful for a $2 but probably okay. Somewhat interesting.

Quote
Feedbag
$3 Action-Reaction
+$2
If you discard or trash this card, +2 Cards.

Hmm... I think it might be a little too strong for it's cost. Perhaps if you discard it, you can choose to trash it, and if you trash it, you get +2 cards? Also needs a dividing line.

Quote
Refurnish
$3 Action
Trash a Treasure card from your hand. Gain a Victory card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.

It's a very gimped Remodel. Remodel is already pretty meh. I think this would be extremely niche, and not worth buying almost ever.

Quote
Gilded Village
$3 Action
+2 actions
Reveal your hand. +1 Card for every Gold in your hand.

This will be almost never better than a generic village. You'd need a Gold density of at least 25% for this to average better than a village, which... doesn't happen.

Quote
Dealer
$3 Action
Each player chooses a card in his hand. The person to your right reveals their chosen card, then you reveal yours. +$1 per total cost in coins of those cards. Each player passes his chosen card to the left. You may trash a card from your hand.

Overpowered. Open with this and as long as you draw an Estate, you get at least +$3 or +$4 from it (you get a Copper, which is +$1 or a $2 card or beter revealed).

Quote
Homesteader
$3 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If you reveal any Estates from your hand, +1 Card.

Hmm... wording needs a little improvement (you may reveal an estate from your hand. If you do, +1 Card). Otherwise seems fine.

Quote
Comradery
$4 Action
+1 Action
For every Comradery in your hand, +$2.
If there are no Comraderies in your hand, +1 Card.

Seems pretty okay. Two in hand gets you $2 and 1 more card, which is... eh for $4 cards. Three gets you $6 and one more card. It would probably be a bit like Conspirator, often ignorable but often dominating. I think it might be able to get too good too easily though - imagine getting up to e.g. 6 in hand. That's $30 right there. And that's not too hard in a decent engine.

Quote
Old Hag
$4 Action-Duration
+2 Cards
If another player reshuffles his deck before the start of your next turn, he gains a Curse on top of his deck.

Seems... very swingy and possibly political. Thing is, you have SOME control over reshuffles, but not that much. 90% (number plucked from thin air) of reshuffles happen on a turn inevitably, and can't really be stopped. So this really ends up being +2 cards, some players happen to get curses maybe.

Quote
Dilemma
$4 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: gain a Silver; gain 2 Estates.

Dilemma doesn't seem like a good name, I'd say there's rarely going to be much Dilemma with this. Otherwise... eh. It's a cantrip silver gainer, probably pretty good generally.

Quote
Mutator
$4 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it's an Estate, Copper, or Curse, gain a Silver; otherwise, gain a Gold.

Seems pretty fun. I like it.

Quote
Cheapskate
$4 Action
Choose one: gain a card costing $2 and a card costing $4; or gain a Silver and a card other than Silver costing $3.

I've had a similar idea to this. It seems somewhat weak in general but too good on Gardens/SR boards.

Quote
Streets of Gold
$4 Victory
Worth 1VP per every 2 Golds in your deck, rounded down.

It encourages you to buy Golds. Once you have at least two Golds, you can probably buy Provinces somewhat reliably. I... can't see many cases this would be worthwhile.

Quote
Conquistador
$4 Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player reveals their hand, trashes any Gold in their hand, and gains that number of Silvers, putting them into their hand.

Hmm... I don't think it would discourage Gold buying that often because the card generally don't do that much. It might encourage good alternate $6's and $5's, which is a good thing,  so I wouldn't worry.

Quote
Prohibiter
Action-Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Each other player discards a Gold (or reveals a hand with no Gold).

Cantrip Buy which can sometimes do a huge amount of damage. I really don't think games with this would be fun.

Quote
Silo
$4 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed Treasures costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.

Sorry, I think I've misunderstood this. It seems like it's a card that's normally +2-4 cards, +1 action, with only good cards being left on your deck (okay, you don't draw Gold or Platinum, but if you leave them on deck they're there for next tunr anyway...) Which is probably worth... $6 or $7? So I think I've made a mistake somewhere interpreting this...

Quote
Gilded Witch
$4 Action-Attack
+2 Cards
Reveal your hand. If you have any Gold in your hand, each other player gains a curse.


I like it. Seems reasonable, it's probably weaker than most cursers, because it's slow to start, and cursers get a lot weaker after about turn 7-8, after decks get bigger and already strong enough, when this would begin to start getting reliable

Quote
Entrepreneur
$4 Action
+1 Buy
Gold is worth $1 more this turn.

Probably very weak at any cost. I thought about it with Silvers before but realised it's far too hard to get enough Silvers to make it even vaguely comparable to Coppersmith, even with +1 Buy it'd be meh. And this is of course harder to get going.

Quote
Placer Mine
$5 Action
You may reveal a Gold from your hand. Gain a copy of it. You may trash any number of Coppers from your hand.

It's a gimped Mint with a copper trashing ability. I... kinda think it's meh at $5. But at $4 it's probably too good. It's probably okay at $5, even if it's not that great.

Quote
Golden Village
$6 Action
+2 Actions
When you buy this, gain a Gold.

Hmm... basically you can get a flat +2 actions card whenever you want Golds (well almost). It's certainly not weak, but it's not something that blows be away.

Quote
Acreage
$7 Action
Trash this card. Gain a Province. Each other player gains an Estate.

This has an unfortunately very small window when it's really interesting. When you want Provinces a lot over Gold, but the game's unlikely to end next shuffle cycle. Early game, it's a delayed 5VPs that hurts everyone else... actually, that's probably interesting enough on it's own. Hmm...
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

One Armed Man

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2012, 07:31:45 pm »
+1


Deuce
$2 Action
Choose one: +$2; or gain a Silver.


It seems like a waste of a terminal for most of the game. At the point you don't worry about it being terminal anymore, either option is still pretty ineffective. Design: 6/10

Feedbag
$3 Action-Reaction
+$2
If you discard or trash this card, +2 Cards.


How does this work against Militia/Margrave/Goons discard attacks? Wouldn't you discard this, draw 2, and then continue discarding?

Refurnish
$3 Action
Trash a Treasure card from your hand. Gain a Victory card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.


Weak and uninteresting because of the limitations on a weak card. Design: 4/10.

Dealer
$3 Action
Each player chooses a card in his hand. The person to your right reveals their chosen card, then you reveal yours. +$1 per total cost in coins of those cards. Each player passes his chosen card to the left. You may trash a card from your hand.


Does this stack with number of players? With 4 or more players, passing 2 coppers and 2 estates would be +4 coin, 4 estates is $8!

Homesteader
$3 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If you reveal any Estates from your hand, +1 Card.


This is almost a Lab in games without Estate trashing. It is nigh useless in games with estate trashing. Chains of this with a haven would be good. I am not sure whether to dislike this card. Design: 8/10

Comradery
$4 Action
+1 Action
For every Comradery in your hand, +$2.
If there are no Comraderies in your hand, +1 Card.


I like this card. It might cause a race for it, but unlike Minion, it doesn't discourage getting high value treasures like Gold. With Ironworks or Workshop or games with lots of trashing, this is likely dominant strategy. Design: 9/10

Old Hag
$4 Action-Duration
+2 Cards
If another player reshuffles his deck before the start of your next turn, he gains a Curse on top of his deck.


Too random for my tastes. Maybe it triggers if the opponent plays an Attack card instead? Design: 5/10.

Dilemma
$4 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: gain a Silver; gain 2 Estates.


If this card feels slightly too weak to anyone, you can always make the gained Silver go to the top of the deck. Design: 7/10.

Mutator
$4 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it's an Estate, Copper, or Curse, gain a Silver; otherwise, gain a Gold.


This is one of my favorite cards of this bunch, as well. 10/10.

Cheapskate
$4 Action
Choose one: gain a card costing $2 and a card costing $4; or gain a Silver and a card other than Silver costing $3.


There are a lot of different sub-categories to consider with this card. If there are relevant cards at all three slots, this card becomes very good. Otherwise, it is nearly useless. Design: 7/10.

Streets of Gold
$4 Victory
Worth 1VP per every 2 Golds in your deck, rounded down.


It takes 6 Gold to make this worth 3VP. That is to compete with Duchy. I think it is slow in nearly every Kingdom. I can't think of a way to improve it except giving 2VP for every 3 Golds. Design: 4/10

Conquistador
$4 Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player reveals their hand, trashes any Gold in their hand, and gains that number of Silvers, putting them into their hand.


I recently put up a similar card. You will hit nothing nearly all of the time. People will change their buying habits. If it does hit a gold, it reduces their current hand output by $1, the value of their deck by $3, and gets you $2, causing a 6 cost card swing, essentially. It should be changed to only hit one Gold at a time. Design: 5/10. Even still, Prohibiter is a worse idea.

Prohibiter
Action-Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Each other player discards a Gold (or reveals a hand with no Gold).


Gilded Witch
$4 Action-Attack
+2 Cards
Reveal your hand. If you have any Gold in your hand, each other player gains a curse.


This seems to mostly be a BM+Guilded Witch strategy. Get Guilded Witch/Silver. Get Gold whenever you can. After the first Gold, get a second Guilded Witch. Win. In engines, or whenever traditional curses are used, it isn't great. Design: 6/10.

Entrepreneur
$4 Action
+1 Buy
Gold is worth $1 more this turn.


Shaky on this card, which is too similar to and weaker than Coppersmith (except with heavy trashing?), but maybe the +Buy would make this card sometimes worth it? Would it be better or broken at $3?

Placer Mine
$5 Action
You may reveal a Gold from your hand. Gain a copy of it. You may trash any number of Coppers from your hand.


This obviously needs the text "If you do, gain a copy of it." Why can't this card copy Silvers? The answer is likely that it would be too similar to Mint. Design: 6/10.

Golden Village
$6 Action
+2 Actions
When you buy this, gain a Gold.


I love Border Village, too. So this gets Design: 9/10.

Acreage
$7 Action
Trash this card. Gain a Province. Each other player gains an Estate.


If this card is too weak, it could be changed to place Estates on the top of player's deck. Would that make it an Attack? Is it an Attack already? Design: 8/10
Sorry about the grading out of 10; it helps me process my thoughts. Most of the best design space for these kind of low-complexity cards has probably been tested by Donald X. I am sure some of the low rated ones can be improved. I like a lot of these ideas.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 07:45:24 pm by One Armed Man »
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thirtyseven

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2012, 09:13:59 pm »
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Wow, thank you so much for all the feedback so far, keep it coming!

Fragasnap, concerning the +1 Coin of Drone not being good enough, what if it were +$2 instead of +$1? Should it then be priced at $3? Tables, how is Fragasnap's rewording of the card?

With Deuce, I valued simplicity over complexity, perhaps to a fault here. I'm fine with a Base-like card, but I certainly see it's not... The Most Interesting Card in the World  8)

I like your rewording of Feedbag, Fragasnap. I forgot about having a clean-up clause. I agree the action effect is bland, so perhaps you or I or someone else can find a better card in this set to attach the reaction to, and scrap this card. With discard attacks, One Armed Man, my intent was for the player to draw 2 cards then and there, and not have to re-discard them unless another discarding attack was played. Does that need to be put on the card, and if so, how should I word it? Finally, does anyone agree with Tables that this is too powerful for its cost? I disagree, but I could certainly be wrong.

Homesteader and Comradery I will reword as suggested. I wasn't initially worried about Tables' concern about Comradery being "too good," but with King's Court and a good draw it would be absolutely brutal. What do you all think?

Yes, Dilemma is a poorly-named card; I knew that when I made up the name. Any ideas for a new name? One Armed Man's idea of top-decking the Silver is an interesting idea, since Dilemma is a cantrip and another Dilemma would draw it into your hand. Would the card be better (design-wise) if this change were implemented? I'm a little afraid people would choose the Silver option more often, and perhaps almost always, if it top-decked.

I'm fine with making Mutator cost $3 instead of $4. How does everyone else feel about the price of this card? (Glad you all like this card, btw!)

I agree with One Armed Man that Guilded Witch is too Big Money oriented. Any ideas on how to fix that?

Cards I'll have to give more thought to: Old Hag, Conquistador, Prohibitor, Dealer, Silo, Placer Mine (to make it less similar to Mint).

Cards I'm scrapping: Refurnish, Gilded Village, Streets of Gold, Entrepreneur.
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popsofctown

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2012, 10:30:10 pm »
+1


Drone
$2 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If this is in your hand during your Buy phase, +$1, +1 Buy.

2$ Action Treasure
If it's your action phase, +1 card, +1 action.  If it's your Buy phase, +1$ +1 Buy.
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Deuce
$2 Action
Choose one: +$2; or gain a Silver.


I wanted a card that would give the choice of a later benefit or an immediate benefit.
This is too strong for 5/2 openings imo.
I also don't think it does what you want it to do.  You're really choosing between later benefit or later benefit - either you will get a Silver later, or you will get a 6$ card instead of a 4$ card later.  It's going to start happening one reshuffle later no matter what.
To get a card that has that sort of tempo feel you're after, I think you want something involving a mat and/or duration.
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Feedbag
$3 Action-Reaction
+$2
If you discard or trash this card, +2 Cards.

Try to make it better than terminal silver without specific support.
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Refurnish
$3 Action
Trash a Treasure card from your hand. Gain a Victory card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.

One the one hand, it's kind of embarrassing to have suggested a nerfed Remodel.  On the other hand, what little worth we get out of Remodel is admittedly quite centered around Gold>Province and Silver>Duchy.
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Gilded Village
$3 Action
+2 actions
Reveal your hand. +1 Card for every Gold in your hand.

Maybe throw Silver in too?

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Dealer
$3 Action
Each player chooses a card in his hand. The person to your right reveals their chosen card, then you reveal yours. +$1 per total cost in coins of those cards. Each player passes his chosen card to the left. You may trash a card from your hand.

As others have pointed out, you didn't count this out in your head right at all. Clean it up and it's an interesting trash for benefit card.  Pass Walled Village to your opponent's Big Money deck.

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Homesteader
$3 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
If you reveal any Estates from your hand, +1 Card.


I just like interactions with Estates.  :)
Who doesn't?
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Comradery
$4 Action
+1 Action
For every Comradery in your hand, +$2.
If there are no Comraderies in your hand, +1 Card.

I think this is definitely not overpowered.  I would counter whoever accused it of stacking with itself too well by pointing out Bridge and Highway stack with themselves and make the game interesting in how they do it.  3 is a Silver, a Silver, and an active Conspirator.  That's fine.  Anything past that is Bridgeville, and we like seeing when NV enables Bridgeville and when Young Witch can gum up Bridgeville and such and forth.

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Dilemma
$4 Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: gain a Silver; gain 2 Estates.

I like the idea but find this to be too strong. Early on it's an Ironworks with 2 of the bonuses instead of just 1, and Ironworks is a strong card.  Then later it has the VP utility so that easily pushes it over the edge.
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Cheapskate
$4 Action
Choose one: gain a card costing $2 and a card costing $4; or gain a Silver and a card other than Silver costing $3.

Just from an aesthetics standpoint I'd like for the 3$ option to allow anything, even if you have to add a "differently named" clause.

Conquistador
$4 Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player reveals their hand, trashes any Gold in their hand, and gains that number of Silvers, putting them into their hand.

I feel like this ends up being less interesting than it looks.  You can tweak BM decks to run with more 5$ terminals and fewer Golds to adapt to your opponent's Conquistadors, so buying Conquistador to begin with isn't worth it because your opponent could just adapt, and then no one touches it. 

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Prohibiter
Action-Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Each other player discards a Gold (or reveals a hand with no Gold).

Worse designwise imo, Conquistador reminds me more of Noble Brigand and because of that makes me feel like it can have a healthier countering relationship with Treasure. (with but a tweak)
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Silo
$4 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed Treasures costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.

This has to be a typo or a brainfart.


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Placer Mine
$5 Action
You may reveal a Gold from your hand. Gain a copy of it. You may trash any number of Coppers from your hand.

Maybe at 3$.  It wouldn't matter whether it costs 3$ or 4$, you'd only want one.
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Golden Village
$6 Action
+2 Actions
When you buy this, gain a Gold.

I think it needs +1$ and then it's good.  I-see-what-you-did-there, but totally removing BV's card draw is too weak, replacing it with a $ seems just right.
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Acreage
$7 Action
Trash this card. Gain a Province. Each other player gains an Estate.

7$ cards have a different design philosophy than any other price.  They tend to change the game by making players race to them, or they need to be 7$ so they won't stack with themselves overly much.  Arguably Forge is 7$ to keep it from being obtained gamebreakingly early, but people lucksack spike to it anyway so I kinda disagree with that. This is none of those things, so I think it needs to be 6$ or not exist.  As you say, it should be a choice between this and Gold.
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One Armed Man

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2012, 10:47:04 pm »
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Wow, thank you so much for all the feedback so far, keep it coming!

Fragasnap, concerning the +1 Coin of Drone not being good enough, what if it were +$2 instead of +$1? Should it then be priced at $3? Tables, how is Fragasnap's rewording of the card?
No cost of Drone should have +2 coin. That makes it better than Silver, or at least Woodcutter.

Homesteader and Comradery I will reword as suggested. I wasn't initially worried about Tables' concern about Comradery being "too good," but with King's Court and a good draw it would be absolutely brutal. What do you all think?
I don't see too much wrong with it. King's Court Minion can be crazy too.
What if it was Comrade:
4 cost- action
+1 action
You may discard a Comrade.
If you do, +5 coin.
Otherwise, +1 card.
I'm fine with making Mutator cost $3 instead of $4. How does everyone else feel about the price of this card? (Glad you all like this card, btw!)
If Mutator costs 3, then one of the best cards to transform into Golds is other Mutators. I don't think that necessarily makes it too strong.

I agree with One Armed Man that Guilded Witch is too Big Money oriented. Any ideas on how to fix that?
What if Gold wasn't the catalyst for the cursing but a Bane.
Hexing Witch
cost 4 Attack Action
+2 Cards
Each other player can place an Action card from his hand on the top of their deck or reveal a Gold from his hand. Each other player that does neither gains a Curse card.
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rinkworks

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2012, 09:47:20 am »
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Silo
$4 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed Treasures costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.


This card would suuuck with most or all top-deck attacks. Other than that I like the idea of drawing some cards and leaving some good cards on the deck.

On the contrary, this is almost certainly the most powerful card in the game.  Maybe you meant for it not to have +1 Action?  As is, this is a super-lab.  I mean, if you open with this, it's a guaranteed +4 Cards, +1 Action, which is the equivalent of playing three Laboratories at a cost of less than one.  If you buy a couple Golds, that's okay too, because you'll still draw a ton of cards and set up your next turn as well.  With a (small) stack of Silos and a couple Golds, you can alternate between probably-Province-buying Gold hands, and probably-Province-buying Everything Else hands.

But you really wouldn't need to bother with the Golds, because maybe two of these plus a Silver or two would reliably buy a Province every turn and be resilient to the greening besides.

Take the +1 Action off, and you've got a $5-$6 Smithy variant that's probably balanced well enough since you can't chain them together.  So I half wonder if this is what you intended anyway.
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Kahryl

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2012, 11:45:00 am »
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Like others have said I'm pretty sure Silo was meant to come out differently than it did. But in case you're serious about that design space I think either of these two versions would be fun (changes in bold):

Silo
$4 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed cards costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.


Silo
$7 Action
+1 Action
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Place revealed cards costing $6 or more on the top of your deck, in any order. Draw the other revealed cards into your hand.


So it acts as either a super-smithy or super-Lab as long as you obey the edict of putting STUFF into your deck instead of boring Gold and Provinces. The $7 is probably stronger for its price than the $4 version, but it can't draw itself so needs support.
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thirtyseven

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2012, 12:42:07 pm »
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I wanted Silo to be a beefed-up Scout, since Scout often gets ripped for being the weakest card in the game. But I made it way too strong, as many of you have pointed out! I'll use Kahryl's first revision, which will be open to further tweaking.
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One Armed Man

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Re: 22 cards that need your input
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2012, 12:12:17 am »
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I would love to see Scout with +2 actions. It needs the help, so if only it could have been made a village.
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