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[catsclaw]

How many Quarries do you buy on this set?  How many Markets?  I bought Upgrades, hoping to thin my deck and draw the Market with the Quarries, but I never hit them at the same time.  My opponent managed to hit two Quarries with two Markets, and from then on I never managed to catch up.

What's the right strategy here?

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201207/16/game-20120716-073548-56ab4c8a.html

[DStu]

How many Quarries do you buy on this set? How many Markets?

Would like to see the log, but I'd guess 2 or 3 Quarries, and as many Markets as I get before I get too nervous and take Cities.

[catsclaw]

Sorry about that.  I added the log.

I started with a Market, and then bought a couple Upgrades.  My opponent started with an Upgrade, then bought a couple Markets.  I assumed with two Quarries I'd eventually hit one with the Market, especially if I was thinning my deck with the Upgrades, but it never happened.

[DStu]

Trashing is a bit difficult here, because you want to win Market/City-spilt, and Upgrade gets into the way there. But you want to draw your Quarries together, best with Markets. So I think 3 Quarries, because just two are not likely to collide. Question is if to take an Upgrade, probably yes. But only one. Nothing nice for $3, so upgrade Copper->null, to increase chances of colldiing Quarries.
Then Markets, how many depends on the game. You want as many as possibles, and you want to empty the stack for the Cities, but you don't want to empty the stack if your opponent already has more Cities than you. And you don't want the 8th Market if that means you loses the Citysplit. So this is a bit game-dependent.

Embassy is kind of nice to make pace, and to find Quarries. And to give Silvers your opponent does not want. But when to buy it? After some Markets? Before them? After the Cities? I don't know.

[carstimon]

I think you want to buy the upgrade in the turn 3/4 shuffle.  Your market is only useful if you get it with your quarry.  Your upgrade is useful in every possible turn 5/6/7 hand.

Opponent is lucky to get $5 action/quarry instead of $5 action/silver in turns 3/4.  Turn 9 is kind of lucky but comes from opponent having 3 markets and 3 quarries.  I think it's just all downhill from there.

I like DStu's idea of upgrading copper->null instead of estate->silver, as long as it doesn't take you down from $5.

[zahlman]

Trashing is a bit difficult here, because you want to win Market/City-spilt, and Upgrade gets into the way there. But you want to draw your Quarries together, best with Markets. So I think 3 Quarries, because just two are not likely to collide. Question is if to take an Upgrade, probably yes. But only one. Nothing nice for $3, so upgrade Copper->null, to increase chances of colldiing Quarries.

This reminds me, anyone want to write a Quarrry/(Market | GM) article?

[dondon151]

Question is if to take an Upgrade, probably yes. But only one.

I solitaired this a little bit and I'm pretty sure that taking 2 Upgrades before Markets is faster than just 1 Upgrade. Question is if that ends up sacrificing a Market or City split, which I'm not sure of.

[DG]

Isn't the big market/city chase just too slow without some cheap drawing cards?

[DStu]

Isn't the big market/city chase just too slow without some cheap drawing cards?

There's Fairgrounds and Monuments, so the BM-Embassy or whatever must get all the Provinces (or pile a third pile) to win. Embassy is maybe a bit more resilent against greening, but you have some time. Without at least one of them I wouldn't go for the Cities, but with them you should have enough time to build the engine.
And if you really get 10 Market 10 Cities, you can easily get 4+ Monuments (for free because of Quarries) and expect to play them most of them time.

Don't know how often BM-Embassy wins against that, it certainly will some times, but when it loses, it's really not a fun way to lose...

[Geronimoo]

Simulator likes this strategy (which convincingly beats most Big Money variants)

Open Quarry/Silver (or Embassy which you want asap for fast cycling), get all the Markets you can and a second Quarry (3 is too many). When Markets are gone, get all the Cities, then start greening while getting a few Monuments. If the other guy is draining Provinces fast, leave them alone and take Fairgrounds. All the extra buys should also allow you to get the Fairgrounds up to 6VP.

Simulator HATES Upgrade in this deck (but doesn't play the card well, so not certain it's that bad).

Code: [Select]

<player name="Market/City/Quarry"
 author="Geronimoo"
 description="">
 <type name="UserCreated"/>
 <type name="Engine"/>
 <type name="Bot"/>
 <type name="Province"/>
 <type name="Competitive"/>
 <type name="Combo"/>
 <type name="TwoPlayer"/>
   <buy name="Fairgrounds">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="City"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Province">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="City"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Duchy">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Fairgrounds"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Estate">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Fairgrounds"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Embassy">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Embassy"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Market"/>
   <buy name="Quarry">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Quarry"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="City"/>
   <buy name="Monument">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="City"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Silver">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Silver"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
</player>


[zahlman]

Simulator likes this strategy (which convincingly beats most Big Money variants)

Open Quarry/Silver (or Embassy which you want asap for fast cycling), get all the Markets you can and a second Quarry (3 is too many).

I'm surprised; I'd expect a third to be important to increase the chance of collision and get the Markets quicker, since there's only quite light trashing here (and none in the cited strategy). But I guess with Market and Embassy for cycling it works out okay? Or else you can buy them quickly enough at $3 anyway...

When Markets are gone, get all the Cities, then start greening while getting a few Monuments.

I'm not surprised that beats the big-money variants, but draining the Markets while opponent picks up Cities seems dangerous...

Simulator HATES Upgrade in this deck (but doesn't play the card well, so not certain it's that bad).

Yeah, well, after Estate->Silver, what are you going to Upgrade? Quarry->City?