Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Eevee]

I'm sorry manda, it's actually super unfair of me to ask you you to vote for someone you think is town or be lynched yourself. But cant help it, both you and Galzria look too scummy to me.

[Young Nick]

Through #1218. I get home and in front of a computer tonight. Here is some food for thoughtvsince it's been silent today: Timchen looks scummy to me for two reasons.
A. He wasvgunning for galzria since the start of day two.
B. His initial logic for clearing eevee is preposterous. No consideration of sb and autodimissal of pps.

Longer post later. Sorry for iPad related typos.

[timchen]

Oh God. I can just answer you this. No need for a longer post.

A. Galzria from the start of d2? In a sense yes. Thing is, I believe there is scum among the 4 early frisk-wagoner. It just felt too strange for me for the 2 scum to stay completely away from the wagon of a townie for that long. I could only choose between Galzria and PPS, and I found Galzria scummier.

But after he accused and insisted me pairing with eevee with faulty reasonings, I cannot find other explanation for his play except he is scum. And that is why I was gunning him like forever.

I dunno why you thing gunning him throughout is scummy. Maybe you think as a townie I shouldn't be that sure. But I already gave you my reasons. I believe my reason is sound enough. If you think I am scum and was fabricating those stuff up, please tell me where my arguments went wrong.

B. Have I not explained why I didn't consider sb in that argument? He is just not there until the last minute. In my theory it does not make any proper sense for a scum jumping on the wagon in the last minute (probably hour in reality) while the other has been shouting not to vote for frisk for a long time. And about PPS, I admitted straight that I do not currently think that he is scum (but that can be a potential pitfall of the argument.)

But I think the most important thing to notice is, that is just an argument and a probabilistic statement. I do not require you to believe it. (Unlike my case on Galzria which if you don't buy I would like you to point out where my logical error is.) So the only scummy reason for me to fabricate this argument is that me and eevee are the scummy pair.

Do you buy this pairing? Do scum just pair up themselves together to lynch a random townie (Galz in this case) like this? I agree it is possible that one of us is scum. But if that is the case, my logic for clearing eevee cannot be a reason to support either him or me is scum. (As a scum why do I have to lie to save a townie.)

[Young Nick]

I understand why you gun for him after your spat. Before this though, you say that you focus on other people with the intention of seeing how Galzria responds. This seems like you are setting him up for failure and that you aren't giving other people their proper attention. (This is all pre-fight, of course.)

And I understand your logic for S_B and PPS, but that still doesn't make it look any less scummy. I don't buy it. Your arguments for these, unlike your stuff against Galzria (for the most part), do not make much sense and do not hold under scrutiny. What I read is that you are being unfair to Galzria and Eevee, marking them as scum and town, respectively, for poor reasons.

Or, I should say, in the Galzria case, gunning for him for poor reasons before the whole dispute.

It makes you look very scummy. You also do a good job of over-writing the issue. I doubt you are intentionally trying to do this, but it is just as bad as confusing people, something that you accuse Galzria of doing.

----

Now I find Galzria's lack of posting at times (like immediately prior to the fight) to be very suspicious and am not a huge fan of him switching between you, Eevee, and manda, but I honestly would say he has given me a better town vibe than you have. And both of you look scummier than manda and Eevee in this whole dispute.

I actually find PPS to be the agitator more so than Eevee or manda, which is interesting, because IIRC he accuses them two of fulfilling the very same role.

Obviously I doubt both timchen and Galzria are mafia, but I would be most surprised if neither of them were. I think manda should be considered equal to S_B in scumminess due to their play styles. I recognize that I could fall in that category, as well, but now I can and will contribute, what with being all caught up and in DC again.

I will refer to my notes and post anything interesting from them later tonight or sometime tomorrow.

[timchen]

I understand why you gun for him after your spat. Before this though, you say that you focus on other people with the intention of seeing how Galzria responds. This seems like you are setting him up for failure and that you aren't giving other people their proper attention. (This is all pre-fight, of course.)

You can say that I am trying to set him up for failure, but of course, he can only fail if he is scum!
I am not other people proper attention (PPS, sharky so to speak?) because I have higher priorities in finding mafia between you and Manda. Galzria was just a side purpose in the beginning, but somehow in the end we he took over you two. I didn't really expect that from the start.

And I understand your logic for S_B and PPS, but that still doesn't make it look any less scummy. I don't buy it. Your arguments for these, unlike your stuff against Galzria (for the most part), do not make much sense and do not hold under scrutiny. What I read is that you are being unfair to Galzria and Eevee, marking them as scum and town, respectively, for poor reasons.

Or, I should say, in the Galzria case, gunning for him for poor reasons before the whole dispute.

As I said the eevee-town-theory is just an argument. It did not mean I was over with eevee from then on. It just meant I felt comfortable to find one scum among you and manda first. And I have said several times I am entirely okay if people don't buy that. By the argument itself I think it is fair to say it does not make me any scummier unless I am pairing with eevee.

I have also clarified this a few times. I am NOT gunning for galzria in the beginning. The eevee argument does not point at Galzria as a specific scum. It does however show I suspect Galzria more than PPS, which was something I wanted to hide at that time. And I only went on Galzria when somehow his response to the reveal of my eevee theory was beyond my expectation of a townie.

Now I find Galzria's lack of posting at times (like immediately prior to the fight) to be very suspicious and am not a huge fan of him switching between you, Eevee, and manda, but I honestly would say he has given me a better town vibe than you have. And both of you look scummier than manda and Eevee in this whole dispute.

This is interesting... because I seem to remember that you have said otherwise. What changed your thoughts?

[Young Nick]

I have also clarified this a few times. I am NOT gunning for galzria in the beginning. The eevee argument does not point at Galzria as a specific scum. It does however show I suspect Galzria more than PPS, which was something I wanted to hide at that time. And I only went on Galzria when somehow his response to the reveal of my eevee theory was beyond my expectation of a townie.

Now I find Galzria's lack of posting at times (like immediately prior to the fight) to be very suspicious and am not a huge fan of him switching between you, Eevee, and manda, but I honestly would say he has given me a better town vibe than you have. And both of you look scummier than manda and Eevee in this whole dispute.

This is interesting... because I seem to remember that you have said otherwise. What changed your thoughts?

Regarding the first quoted section: I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that you brought up manda and myself as a way to see Galzria's response and possibly use this against him. So this is before your Eevee theory, which as stated, I dislike for other reasons. So, in a sense, you were gunning for him from the start, though this was unrelated to your case on Eevee's innocence.

As for why I changed my mind: Mainly the two reasons I have stated. They just seem like something the Mafia would plan for during the night:
"Hey, I think one of us should gun for someone right off of the bat."
"But who should you gun for? What should I do?
"I'd say you should stay back and lay low. How does me hunting for Galzria sound?"
"Good, but don't make it too obvious."
"Alright, I'll start off looking towards a few others and use his reaction against him."

Galzria, meanwhile, just seems to call out the breadcrumb. I don't find his play to be all that great, but I dislike your argument against him. It makes sense, yes, but it is very self-centered. Outside of some of his points against you, the only thing that makes him scummy is his more recent wagon-switching in order to get someone lynched. And I can justify this as trying to avoid a no-lynch. Meanwhile, I admit that it is ridiculous that it took so long for him to see your side in your argument with him, but I can see why he was so outraged. This is not to say I agreed with his stance. I merely understood how he took said stance.

So, I'll do the typical exercise: from Mafia to town: Shark_Bait, timchen, Galzria, pingpongsam, manda, Eevee, Young Nick. Shark_Bait is a bit of a separate case from you two and his should be discarded because no one seems to care. It won't help towards a lynch. My thoughts against him are not due to lurkiness but his play prior to that. As stated earlier, pingpongsam has been the enabler for your argument. I understand his play style is to spark up responses like these, but I can see it as Mafia trying to invoke chaos. manda and Eevee are relatively equal in my book. For some reason I don't have much of a read on Eevee despite his contributions throughout d2. A re-reading of some of his posts would be nice. That he really tried to reign timchen in during his emotional phase where he gave his own (timchen's) vote to Galzria is noteworthy, even if I can not yet say if that is a Mafia or town maneuver.

Some re-reading (especially of manda and Eevee) and posting of my d2 iPad observations are next on my to-do list, and hopefully I can do both before the lynch deadline.

[Galzria]

Alright, got in late, and I'm exhausted. I know the deadline looms, but I feel that I've exhausted anything I can really say. I don't support a Manda lynch, because I'm simply not sure if she's scum or town, and if it's the latter then it's game over because Timchen will hand the win to the Mafia on day 3 by voting for me.

S_B's vote is currently on Eevee, and if there was anybody here that I would feel confident enough risking the above situation on, it would be Eevee. I absolutely think that he's scum for the reasons I've laid out previously. Which of y'all is his partner, I don't know.

Still, since I believe that we will be unable to lynch Eevee, then I fully support my own lynch today so that we can break the deadlock with Timchen, and at least provide the town a chance at recovering tomorrow. It's a really sucky situation, and it blows that the best move for a townie would be to self-vote himself to a lynch, but it seems to me to be the only logical and reasonable course . As it stands now, if we don't lynch me here, we're in Lylo, and if we do lynch me here we're in lylo... But I would rather be in lylo with a 40% to hit scum rather than 28.5% chance.

We must not no-lynch however, under any circumstances. It would leave 6 alive, meaning all 4 town would have to vote correctly together tomorrow, or else we fall to 4 left and a 2-2 split, resulting in a loss.

[pingpongsam]

Still, since I believe that we will be unable to lynch Eevee

After some consideration of yours and YN's views I am not totally disinclined to lynch Eevee. That is, I'm not writing anybody entirely off the lynch list. With the timchen/Galzria double vote and YN's vote there's only 1 vote needed to put Eevee on the gallows.

I've never dismissed Sharky as a Mafia, I've just recognized that he was a worthless aim as no one else paid his play any credence. His recent sustained absence and true lurk has reinforced that he may well be Mafia for me. YN has maintained vote on him. However, I don't see his lynch as being productive for the next day's play.

While manda has given me no reason to lighten my views on her I can see that her lynch also fails to be productive for the next day's play.

While I can't argue with the logic in YN's observations on timchen I also maintain that he is Town, without a new development to the contrary I don't think I could be swayed to lynch timchen.

So, with no emphasis on who I find to be Town/Mafia but strictly my willingness to lynch in order to have the best chances of getting the right reads tomorrow:
Galzria, Eevee, timchen, Young_Nick, Shark_Bait, manda

My Mafia to Town barometer:
manda, Shark_Bait, Eevee, Young_Nick, timchen, Galzria.

So discarding the SB/manda lynches as being too uninformative the best candidate for a productive lynch I feel most likely to actually hit scum would be Eevee.

[Young Nick]

@PPS: Could I maybe convince you of his Mafia-status? All we need for a lynch would be you, me, and Galzchen. I find it would be equally as informative as a Galzria lynch, if you view both as town.

Anybody else here, including Galzria, would you be up for a timchen lynch?

[pingpongsam]

Yeah, maybe I wasn't clear enough but I was saying that Eevee's not my favorite lynch but I would be willing to lynch him knowing that it would be informative and that there is the real possibility of hitting Mafia.

[Eevee]

Wow. I'm the next lynch target? Blaaaaarggghhh.

a) if Galzria was town, I think he would have been hammered already unless both mafia were already voting for him


It's just baffling how you lot can think I'm the best lynch target, dont even know how to defend myself.

Although, Vote: shark_bait is the third lynch (Galz and manda being the others) I'd be find with. And as Galzria in a very pro town manner pointed out, nolynch is just utterly idiotic here.

[Voltgloss]

Vote Count 2-14

Galzria (2): Galzria, timchen
manda2014 (1): pingpongsam
Eevee (1): shark_bait
shark_bait (1): Eevee

Not Voting {2}: manda2014, Young Nick

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch

Lynch deadline: Monday, August 13, at 8:00 p.m. forum time (EDT) TEN HOURS TILL DEADLINE

[Eevee]

No wait, seeing the vote count it should obviously be Vote:Galzria. L-1 guys, 10 hours to go.

[timchen]

@YN: your conspiracy theory is just not really what a mafia will do. The problem is that the mafia cannot be sure what the response will be. And specifically, why do the mafia want to target Galzria specifically anyway? That only restricts themselves. Say if that was indeed the plan and Galzria did not respond as what he did, what should the mafia do? Forcing a nonexistent case on Galzria is suicide.

On the first thing, I have explained several times what my intention was, but you certainly have the right to view the events in any way you like. I guess I have to say so be it. But just keep one objective fact in mind: even if I decided to gun for Galzria in the beginning, it is because that I believe there has to be one scum between him and PPS (Because I know I am not scum); and I only target him exclusively after his insistence on his faulty theory on me. I really do not see anything wrong with this.

That being said, you can take your own choice. Lynching me is better than lynching manda and find her town; that way Galzria just wins instantly. Just promise me you'll go after Galzria after I flipped. (But this way I have no chance to know whether I am wrong against Galzria, unfortunately before the game ends.)

Guys, here's my take. I am only willing to lynch Galzria, me, or Manda. I still think Galzria is scum and I cannot imagine Galzria partners with eevee or PPS or YN (with YN this will just be too smart! Come out and support his partner only on the last day!). I will keep my promise so if Galzria is scum and we mislynch a townie which is not me then we instantly lose. If insisted on Manda is the one I am willing to bet on the to have a reasonable chance to be scum.

But my vote still goes where Galzria instructs me to vote.

[pingpongsam]

This wagon sat here long enough 2 days ago. There's nothing more to discuss.

I don't see this thing moving to another target in the time frame we have.

I've already outlined my reasons, I think he may well flip town but I also think we get enough information to hit scum tomorrow.
That no one else will press the button makes me think Galzria may be scum anyhow.

My 1st hammer, ever:
Vote: Galzria

[Galzria]

And I am indeed town.

[Voltgloss]

Galzria has been lynched.  He was a Vanilla Townie.  Flavor and final votecount to be posted this evening.

Night 2 has begun.  Commands are due in 48 hours, by Wednesday, August 15, at 11:30 a.m. EDT.  If I receive all commands before the deadline, Day 3 may begin early.

This thread is now LOCKED.

[Voltgloss]

Day 2 final votecount below.  Day 3 starting post coming up momentarily.

Vote Count 2-15

Galzria (4): Galzria, timchen, Eevee, pingpongsam
Eevee (1): shark_bait

Not Voting {2}: manda2014, Young Nick

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch

Galzria has been lynched.  He was a Town Vanilla.

[Voltgloss]

Five noseless individuals woke from a collective shared nightmare.  It was Galzria, alternately screaming and laughing as he helped timchen and two others tear out his own entrails.  Strangling a man to death with his own intestines had proved rather more difficult - and slimy - than any of them had anticipated.

At least they had nice weather today.  The sun was shining, the birds were singing, the dogs were having a nice snack of putrefied corpses.  All was right with the world.

Wait, corpses plural?

Sure enough, the local Hunting Party had let their dogs run wild after a successful drunken hunt, and the dogs had found, not just Galzria's ruined husk, but that of a newly deceased noseless.  Turning the body over, the remaining five gasped at his identity.

timchen has been slain.  He was a Town Vanilla.

Day 3 Start!

Not Voting {5}: Eevee, Young Nick, manda2014, shark_bait, pingpongsam

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch

Lynch deadline: Wednesday, August 29, at 12:00 noon EDT

This thread is now UNLOCKED.

[pingpongsam]

Holy cow, a Town timchen surviving the night would be the easy lynch target for pushing the Galzria wagon so hard yesterday.

The only logic I see in this pair of kills is in removing 1 each from the D1 on/off wagon.

Maybe the meta-game here is to kill off the vocal players? So far, it seems like manda, Sharky and to some degree, YN are on vacation. It feels as if Town has been actively pursuing Town as Mafia has sat in the shadows and watched.

Maybe Mafia smelled a timchen honeypot? I was definitely going to be heavily scrutinizing any early voters on him today.

[Young Nick]

I assume honeypot means someone whose lynch would be too obviously a good idea? As in, it would be so obvious to lynch timchen that only a member of the Mafia would suggest to do it at the start of d3.

[Young Nick]

And I hope that you guys could tell from my posts on Sunday night that I back, literally and figuratively. I have read everything and am in DC and thus can contribute much more than in the last week of d2.

[pingpongsam]

I assume honeypot means someone whose lynch would be too obviously a good idea? As in, it would be so obvious to lynch timchen that only a member of the Mafia would suggest to do it at the start of d3.

I wouldn't say "only" but his lynch was so attractive that I'd expect Mafia not to resist themselves. It appears to me they gave up an easy end-game lynch, though. I am currently pondering why that might be.

[Eevee]

Okay, beginning of the day feelings, from towniest to scummiest:
Young Nick > pingpongsam* > shark_bait > manda

shark_bait's posted somewhere that laptop died, and he that he won't be able to participate much at the moment. In case that goes on for this entire day, we have to be able to reach majority without him. Luckily I think there is a good chance he is mafia, so him not voting might even help town.
My feelings on manda have not changed, I think she would be our best lynch. Young Nick is giving me a town vibe, PPS is too but maybe a tad less so. I'd actually be up for a shark_bait lynch too, he won't be able to talk so he can't help us much if he is town (not being talkative is one thing but actually losing his vote is huuuge).

About Galzria's wagon yesterday: timchen and Galzria are dead (and town), I very well understand why PPS voted for him (town timchen and town Galz and town Eevee did too), he did seem scummy and we kind of needed to get out from the ridiculous situation timchen got us into. Boy will I haunt him for saying "I'm 100% sure Galzria is scum"..

Oh, and we might still have a power role too! If we have a cop who knows something, don't come out just yet but wait if you can steer the town into the correct lynch without claiming. If we have a doctor, obviously no claiming then.

*Table tennis is super fun btw! I totally forgot what PPS stood for.


But yeah, thoughts? I want manda or shark_bait lynched, I'd need some heavy convincing to vote for PPS or Young Nick.

[pingpongsam]

I've been up for a manda lynch and the recent events haven't done anything to dispel my notions on her.

I definitely want to hear a weigh in from everyone before I see votes going up though. We are at a 3 vote LyLo so let's not get too hasty.