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[Eevee]

It's more than just a "general feel". Manda's suspicion of me felt towny, your general play style has fitted the usual mafia profile this far. Those are specific reasons. Hard to get much more concrete on day 2 without investigative results, especially considering your voting behavior is essentially identical.
Others feel Galzria is town here?

[timchen]

No.

[timchen]

Unvote for now just in case eevee is right on target and a quick hammer is possible.

[Eevee]

Unvote for now just in case eevee is right on target and a quick hammer is possible.

Humm... you had your vote on Galzria and it was the only vote on him?

[manda2014]

Finally back online and there's a lot of new stuff, so I'll try to respond to everything, but probably in several shorter posts rather than one long one.

Everyone, did you think yesterday was going to end in a nolynch or did you think someone was going to hammer in the end? Especially the people who were online when the actual hammer dropped (not too long before the deadline I think?).

I was pretty certain someone was going to hammer in the end. To my knowledge, we haven't had a D1 no-lynch on f.ds so far, and I really doubted we'd start with this game, to be honest. I don't like the idea of a D1 no-lynch, because it gives the mafia a headstart without providing the town with a whole lot of information. I wasn't online when the hammer dropped, but I was back online before the deadline and I would have hammered if I needed to.

[manda2014]

Unvote for now just in case eevee is right on target and a quick hammer is possible.

Humm... you had your vote on Galzria and it was the only vote on him?

Pretty sure Timchen's vote was on me...

[manda2014]

Eevee keeps restating the fact that all of D1 he was "just trying to save a townie," so he's not sure why there's any suspicion on him. While it's true that he pushed to save Frisk all day, how do we know that he didn't do that just so he could point to it D2 to show how pro-town he is? As others have stated, it was pretty clear to me that someone was going to hammer. Eevee didn't need to jump on the wagon when others were pushing it and chances of a no-lynch were slim.

That being said, I would like to hear timchen's secret reasoning before I settle on Eevee for a vote.

[manda2014]

I'm gonna be out for several hours doing family stuff. I'll keep up from my phone and maybe post some short stuff if I get a chance.

[Eevee]

Eevee keeps restating the fact that all of D1 he was "just trying to save a townie," so he's not sure why there's any suspicion on him. While it's true that he pushed to save Frisk all day, how do we know that he didn't do that just so he could point to it D2 to show how pro-town he is? As others have stated, it was pretty clear to me that someone was going to hammer. Eevee didn't need to jump on the wagon when others were pushing it and chances of a no-lynch were slim.

That being said, I would like to hear timchen's secret reasoning before I settle on Eevee for a vote.

As I earlier said, I definitely didnt think someone was going to hammer if I didnt. I was quite sure we were going to have a nolynch actually, I remember being proud for making it happen (when the only other option was a Frisk lynch obviously).

I think saying "I dont think arguing for Frisk's life yesterday clears Eevee completely" is reasonable. However, I would like to ask how on earth is the guy who tried his hardest to save a townies life yesterday suddenly your favourite lynch target today? What happened in between? What have I done that is so scummy? Can you give me/us a little more than "I think Eevee is scum"? FWIW, I still read manda as probably town.

[pingpongsam]

I'd like to take this opportunity to reiterate that I am and have been voting manda.

[timchen]

@eevee: I think the reason why you are suspicious is that usually a townee also won't go all out to save another townee, simply because he has no way to be sure. And now your statement of your estimation of no lynch is starting to look bad...

But why did Galz lurk so much in this game? Currently I am actually fine lynching him fulfilling frisk's last wish...

[Eevee]

@eevee: I think the reason why you are suspicious is that usually a townee also won't go all out to save another townee, simply because he has no way to be sure. And now your statement of your estimation of no lynch is starting to look bad...

But why did Galz lurk so much in this game? Currently I am actually fine lynching him fulfilling frisk's last wish...

Vote: Galzria

Totally forgot it was also Frisk's last wish. That was the small push I needed to do this. Maybe a little voting action will get Galz out of his shell?

[timchen]

Vote: Galzria

[timchen]

but please, no one quick hammer.

[Eevee]

but please, no one quick hammer.

This obviously. Any quickhammer, accidental or not, will be treated as scumclaim.

[pingpongsam]

but please, no one quick hammer.

This obviously. Any quickhammer, accidental or not, will be treated as scumclaim.

Pretty convenient position to take if you are scum, lol. Well, we're the first 2 on the bus, anyone after us looks scummy. I mean, I don't necessarily disagree, just sayin...

[Eevee]

but please, no one quick hammer.

This obviously. Any quickhammer, accidental or not, will be treated as scumclaim.

Pretty convenient position to take if you are scum, lol. Well, we're the first 2 on the bus, anyone after us looks scummy. I mean, I don't necessarily disagree, just sayin...

Its not like ANY hammer is prohibited. But hammering before Galzria gets a chance to respond would be pretty freaking damning either way, dont you think? Given we have people playing their first games, I think it's good to remind everyone that you should always check the vote count before voting.

[Voltgloss]

Vote Count 2-6

shark_bait (1): Young Nick
manda2014 (1): pingpongsam
timchen (1): Galzria
Galzria (2): Eevee, timchen

Not Voting {2}: manda2014, shark_bait

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch

Lynch deadline: Monday, August 13, at 8:00 p.m. forum time (EDT)

[Eevee]

For the lazy, 4 to lynch, 2 votes on Galz atm.

Without my warning, scum could have quickhammered (assuming neither of me and timchen is scum obv) and just claimed "I didnt realize". I think we would have lynched the hammer-guy anyways in that case, but cant hurt to make it clear to everyone how close to the lynch we are here.

[timchen]

Ok, my case on eevee:

This originates from my d1 argument that if frisk is not scum, then eevee/YN/shark should not be. That argument based on the assumption that scum should have no obvious reason not to vote for frisk, upon repeated request when there are at least 3 townies on the wagon.

But after frisk said I'm crazy I realized there is one potential flaw: the scums do not play alone. So it is possible that scum have orchestrated a strategy such that they will split on a forming wagon. And since they cannot communicate during day, it is possible that they will just commit to the strategy.

In particular, in my eyes for eevee's play to make sense as a scum, it must be a coordinated play. It doesn't really make sense to throw away your flexibility as scum when it is completely unnecessary. Therefore if eevee is scum, there has to be a person on the wagon for long (me, galz, PPS) who is also scum. Furthermore, the two players must have planned in advance to play like that.

I know I am town (even though I can imagine from others eyes it might be possible that eevee and me are the scum pair), Galz and eevee had enough arguments d2 that have convinced me that they are not a pair, and PPS usually gives me a town read. Even if I assume he is scum I can hardly see him and eevee commit to such play.

So given that I assume that eevee's play has to be planned to be make sense, and there are no players on the wagon he could have made such plan with, my conclusion is therefore that eevee is likely town.

(Also, actually as you can read from here my suspicion now is Galz+X, where X is either YN or manda. My previous hideous attitude was trying to hide my suspicion on Galz and tried to see if I could see his response to other's wagon with no relation to himself. Now that he just responded that by lurking I guess that plan didn't quite work.)

[timchen]

Indeed. The warning is just to eliminate the excuse for scum in case they are in for a quick hammer.

[Eevee]

FWIW, in a vacuum that is something I might see myself orchestrating with galzria. If he proposed it, I'm more of a "lets just wing it!" type of a player.

Back to this game: timchen, we really seem to think alike. Man it would blow if you flipped mafia, but I'm almost Frisk-level confident that is not going to happen.

My reads, from most town to least town:

timchen,    manda,   PPS,   Young Nick/shark_bait, Galzria.

[timchen]

Sorry eevee, your frisk-level confidence does not say much for me. For me it still looks like post-confirmation bias. 

[Galzria]

I have no response to make, and really won't say much more. I've already claimed VT, which I assure you that scum already know having likely investigated me after my refusal to claim yesterday. My biggest case today was made on PPS, but I had mistaken identity, in that I meant Timchen at that time (based on his soft-claim, which others read as such as well, but he's now backed down on after being called out). I've also fully explained exactly why Eevee will have played exactly like he has as Scum, and I'm glad to see that Manda has seen exactly the same things I have.

I'm not going to clutter up my D2 posts, as I am absolutely sure in my reads and the cases that I've made, and it will lead to town winning if you sheep them after my lynch. Eevee and Timchen are your scum pair.

[timchen]

Good job Galz. So you actually accepted to be lynched first?