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Author Topic: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!  (Read 231624 times)

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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2325 on: August 27, 2012, 10:22:15 pm »

Here are the initial roles.  I'm just going to describe them in simpler terms.  You should be able to view general versions of all the roles in the Trash QT, if you are so inclined.

Axxle, cayvie and Tables were Black Market.  They got to choose among 3 powers that were different each night.  Rolecop investigations were supposed to show them as whatever they chose, but I screwed this up with Galzria when I reported Axxle as a Black Market instead of as a Spy.  I don't think it made a huge difference.

All three BMs knew each other, but weren't sure of alignments.  Originally they weren't going to know each other, but I accidentally CC'd them all instead of BCC.  So I let them know each other and added a mini-game (if they all pick the same thing they all get +3VP, if only two pick the same thing, those two both lose -1VP).  I added in a couple of mechanics that ultimately weakened the town -- particularly, Tables became IW-aligned (his existence unknown to Galz) and Axxle became "mostly Deck aligned" -- on a night when he had -5VP or worse, he would be allowed to choose to become Curse-aligned Curse Axxle2 (forsaking his role).  The Curse role had no powers whatsoever.

Captain_Frisk was Scrying Pool.  This was one of the major Deck power roles, giving CF the option to be a Cop, Watcher/Tracker or Rolecop.  The Cop option would give him +3VP if he found scum.  This was probably too powerful.  The Watcher/Tracker let him target two players instead of just one, and it came with guaranteed +1VP.  The Rolecop option would give history.  I think this was the strongest option, though CF never used it (as of this writing -- it is currently day 9).

If I were to rebalance this game, I would significantly nerf this role.  Besides being very powerful, it is also very swingy.  If scum had managed to take control of it, they could have used it to supreme effect.

CF played extremely well with this role, but I think it would have been possible to talk him down.  The conspiracy theorist in me would not have dropped the possibility that CF was the last Curse-aligned player, and that the string of successful investigations and lynches was just an elaborate ruse to secure his place as an investigation immune scum cop.  In fact, this kind of epic bus was an early plan of the real Curse Faction.  It was too bad that role madness kept them from ever initiating that grand scheme.

Robz888 was Festival.  This was the other major Deck power role, but its effect was not so obvious since Robz was locked up in IW really early.  The main aspect was not protective!  Festival was the town's double-voter.  Robz only used it Day 1, then he was in IW, and when he was freed he never used the double vote again (as of day 9).  I believe that the curse Faction actually speculated that Robz was a double voter, but never acted on that suspicion.  This was another swingy power.

shark_bait had another protective role, Trader.  The target's VP loss that night and the next day (excluding lynch) would be halved, and Trader would receive the other half as +VP.  I think this was decently balanced, though it was never very influential.

yuma was Embargo and I think this was one of the more elegant roles I devised.  The Embargo token would effect the day and the next night, which means anyone paying attention would always be aware of who was Embargoed.  The hint was that the token would be displayed in the day start post and then again in the night start post.  Embargo also had a small and unreliable investigative property in that it would give yuma +1VP if he Embargoed a Deck-aligned player.  His initial Embargo on Axxle gave +0.5VP due to Axxle's mixed alignment.

Grujah was Young Witch, the daypuncher, and he got a little sucked in by the +VP he could have earned with his role, ultimately coming off super scummy and getting lynched for it twice.  The purpose of the role was to do some serious scumhunting and lead the charge against someone.  If you successfully make a strong case and get lots of people to join your wagon, you get +VP.  If you fail to lead the lynch, well, you still daypunched the person you thought was scummy.  I think this role was fine as well.

timchen was Ambassador, which worked like a self-sustaining Vig.  timchen thought it was rather weak, but I believe it is quite strong.  Being able to healed oneself for 2VP is nice, and being able to dish out -2VP is good too.  I think this was a fairly well balanced power.

Eevee was Secret Chamber, and this was almost certainly too powerful.  Eevee was basically unstoppable at night.  In retrospect, I should have made it susceptible to non-role attacks, i.e. the -VP inflicted by the Curse Faction in general.  I should also have made it susceptible to Masquerade.

Galzria was Ironworks-aligned Ironworks, and I believe his faction is fairly well understood at this point.  I had not anticipated such an early revolt by Robz (I figured it would have been a bit longer before it happened).  The IW became a much bigger distraction than ever intended.  The intention was that Galz would obtain his majority and then die with a win.  The recruits would have been freed at that point.  Galz's death let Tables assume "power" of a sort, in that he still needed to be killed to finish off the IW for good.

By the way, Galz didn't die from lynch because he was made stronger with each recruit.  Each instance of damage he received was divided by the size of the IW at that time, to a minimum of -1VP.

The Curse Faction was Insomniac, Dsell, Voltgloss and Lekkit.  Their initial roles were Masquerade, Mountebank, Possession and Noble Brigand, respectively.

Masquerade lets you target up to 3 others (including the dead) and rotates roles among the targets.  This was meant to be a major source of Role Madness, and also a major reason why the game wasn't balanced.  It could easily have shifted strong roles to one side.  Mountebank was very simple and worked fine.  Not too powerful, not too weak.  Possession was a delayed rolecop+cop with the fun side effect of inflicting custom post restrictions.  I should not have made it quite so strong an investigative tool -- it left the Cursers unwilling to part with it.  Noble Brigand was a +VP stealer that would inflict -1VP if there was nothing to steal OR if the target was a Curser.  This made NB stronger if not used by a Curse member.  For example, jo's use of it on Axxle (night 8) stole the +VP Axxle would have received from Robz and killed him with -1VP to boot.  Lekkit also had innate investigation immunity.

The Cursers had some really great plans at the start, but they got swept away by the madness of Grujah and timchen, and then the Ironworks.  They spent too much time setting up a grand scheme that never got off the ground (if they had successfully started the epic bus, the game might have had a very different result).  Possession was used on each other a few times to try to throw off trackers, but that insurance was not really needed.

One clever thing they did was keep Masquerade within their ranks.  I hadn't expected that and was kind of worried that they would break the game by systematically seizing the strongest roles.  Unfortunately for them, the Ironworks fiasco had them thinking that IW was a major power role (Galz convinced everyone that he could in fact use the powers he acquired).  The end result was that Lekkit got stuck with a crippled Ironworks power.

They missed the two power roles for various reasons.  Robz got locked up by IW so his double voting was never made known (and that was also partially obfuscated by an early BM power that also gave double voting, and which was chosen by all three BMs).  CF only seemed to be a tracker at the start, so they weren't so concerned with him either.  For a while, they thought I was trolling them by making Lekkit immune to cop investigation!

Though it seems like the Curse Faction was crushed decisively, I actually think the game was much closer than that.  A few slightly altered decisions and it would have been a very different story.

jotheonah was the Almighty Trash Pile.  This was the "Serial Killer" of the game.  He was immune to quite a few things -- IW did not stop him from using his powers, and Masquerade couldn't touch him (though it could touch his "restless dead"). 

Each night he could choose two of the powers in the Trash.  I think jotheonah was too Deckish during the day, outing Insomniac and later reminding everyone (most importantly, reminding CF) that Ins had claimed to help Volt.  During the night, jo was not quite devious enough.  I think he should have stolen CF's power with Masquerade when he had the chance, since jo was not investigation immune.  Rather, investigating him would turn up curious results (not giving an alignment, showing his use of two powers.)  And of course, Festival would have been invaluable to him.

Luckily, the people who accused him flipped scum, giving him a bit of credit.  By the time people realized what he was, he had gained enough powers to be nearly unstoppable.  Night 9, all the Cursers were dead and jo gained the ability to distribute (through them) -14VP!  That’s actually quite huge.  And then the Black Market wrapped around and he managed to get Lighthouse, making him immune to lynch.  The Jester came up after that, giving him yet another free day.

At the end, Eevee made a costly mistake when there could have been a no-death night.  With that, the town could still have lynched jo.  But alas, it was not to be.
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jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2326 on: August 27, 2012, 10:22:34 pm »

Yeah my role had balance issues. I also could still use my powers while in the cult.

But for the first few days, it felt like SK wincon without SK powers. And I didn't know I was going to inherit the curser's curse powers.
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Dsell

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2327 on: August 27, 2012, 10:22:47 pm »

The most frustrating thing (aside from being copped) was that as we were dying we were telling the TRUTH. We decided that we were the most helpful mafia team ever, and we only killed one person, the cult leader! :)

...who would have died anyway because of how many people targeted him that night.
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Dsell

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2328 on: August 27, 2012, 10:26:53 pm »

But I loved this game so much. I seriously loved it. Dying for the first time was sad though. :(
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jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2329 on: August 27, 2012, 10:28:18 pm »

ANd I definitely played WAAY too deck, but it did work out. Also, my Black Market uses were just supposed to investigate as "Black Market." eHalc messed that up.
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cayvie

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2330 on: August 27, 2012, 10:28:40 pm »

we lynched correctly days 3, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, and 11.

:(

:( :(

sorry, i think i played very well, and i think town played very well. i'll get over it, but this feels like a kick in the stomach.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2331 on: August 27, 2012, 10:28:59 pm »

Fun moments:

- Tables dropping all sorts of hints to try to get recruited by Ironworks and Galz noticing them all but not recruiting Tables out of fear that he was Curse and would compromise his QT to the others.

- timchen brazenly lying.  He came clean in the end though!

- Tables picking Wishing Well from the BM to use Ironworks... on the same player that Galzria targeted.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2332 on: August 27, 2012, 10:31:11 pm »

we lynched correctly days 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10.

:(

:( :(

sorry, i think i played very well, and i think town played very well. i'll get over it, but this feels like a kick in the stomach.

You guys did play well.  jo just became an unstoppable behemoth and had some lucky draws.

Possibly the place to improve play -- deciphering the poems.  If you read them now, they should seem much clearer.  In particular, the last few poems almost completely outed jo because they kept referring to the "restless dead" and the grave (i.e. the trash), and jo was the only one who had anything to do with the trash.
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Galzria

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2333 on: August 27, 2012, 10:32:09 pm »

Curse was so scared of the IW. ;D

I'm sad eHal's comment made me take Joth over Volt (my original choice cause he was scum) on KC night. I would've held 3.5 of 4.5 cursers at that time! :)

I knew Dsell was, and I knew Volt was. I suspected Joth was scummy too. Props to Insomniac who I was just lucky to have. I didn't know you were scum. I was about 50% on Axxle, which is great seeing as he was kinda curse.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2334 on: August 27, 2012, 10:34:03 pm »

Fun moments:

- Tables dropping all sorts of hints to try to get recruited by Ironworks and Galz noticing them all but not recruiting Tables out of fear that he was Curse and would compromise his QT to the others.

- timchen brazenly lying.  He came clean in the end though!

- Tables picking Wishing Well from the BM to use Ironworks... on the same player that Galzria targeted.

Great IW minds think alike...
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2335 on: August 27, 2012, 10:37:35 pm »

How long have the cursers had me figured out?
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Dsell

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2336 on: August 27, 2012, 10:38:16 pm »

Curse was so scared of the IW. ;D

I'm sad eHal's comment made me take Joth over Volt (my original choice cause he was scum) on KC night. I would've held 3.5 of 4.5 cursers at that time! :)

I knew Dsell was, and I knew Volt was. I suspected Joth was scummy too. Props to Insomniac who I was just lucky to have. I didn't know you were scum. I was about 50% on Axxle, which is great seeing as he was kinda curse.

How did you know I was curse? Besides my general scumminess which was intentional. I figured making myself look scummy then explaining it all away with the ultimate result of not massclaiming (which seemed very important to us at the time) might work out. Obviously several people were suspicious initially, but I figured they would understand when I explained what I had done.
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Eevee

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2337 on: August 27, 2012, 10:38:53 pm »

Was I supposed to realize this? It's not like I want to be the guy who always screws over his own team THIS majorly.

Oh well, in before people start pre-emptively lynching me in day 1 to avoid having me alive later.
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Dsell

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2338 on: August 27, 2012, 10:39:19 pm »

How long have the cursers had me figured out?

Well I thought you were acting legitimately scummy way back when and would have set you up for a lynch...when you figured out insomniac. But basically when I possessed you and got "No result" and "Saboteur and Noble Brigand."
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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2339 on: August 27, 2012, 10:39:36 pm »

How long have the cursers had me figured out?

The night after the day you were possessed, they got investigation results.

For everyone else -- The Trash Pile investigated strangely.  Its role would return as whatever two things he picked.  His alignment would return as "no result."  So the Cursers saw that and knew something was up.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2340 on: August 27, 2012, 10:41:27 pm »

Was I supposed to realize this? It's not like I want to be the guy who always screws over his own team THIS majorly.

Oh well, in before people start pre-emptively lynching me in day 1 to avoid having me alive later.

No, it was an easy mistake to make.  In your place, I would either have assumed it was something bad (since it was coming from jo) or redirected it to cayvie as a sort of "neutral" move.
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jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2341 on: August 27, 2012, 10:46:58 pm »

SO this is basically he first F.DS serial killer win, and the first time I've ever won a game.
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cayvie

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2342 on: August 27, 2012, 10:52:07 pm »

SO this is basically he first F.DS serial killer win, and the first time I've ever won a game.

first f.ds cult win too!
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cayvie

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2343 on: August 27, 2012, 10:52:37 pm »

SO this is basically he first F.DS serial killer win, and the first time I've ever won a game.

first f.ds cult win too!

oh wait bm II
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jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2344 on: August 27, 2012, 10:53:55 pm »

there is so much angst in this curse QT. Volt, I now totally understand you backing out of my game.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2345 on: August 27, 2012, 10:57:28 pm »

Apologies to the Curse faction for several days of Suck due to CF's outstanding detective work.

Apologies to the Deck for an unexpected loss -- although you still win, kind of!
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Galzria

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2346 on: August 27, 2012, 10:59:36 pm »

Curse was so scared of the IW. ;D

I'm sad eHal's comment made me take Joth over Volt (my original choice cause he was scum) on KC night. I would've held 3.5 of 4.5 cursers at that time! :)

I knew Dsell was, and I knew Volt was. I suspected Joth was scummy too. Props to Insomniac who I was just lucky to have. I didn't know you were scum. I was about 50% on Axxle, which is great seeing as he was kinda curse.

How did you know I was curse? Besides my general scumminess which was intentional. I figured making myself look scummy then explaining it all away with the ultimate result of not massclaiming (which seemed very important to us at the time) might work out. Obviously several people were suspicious initially, but I figured they would understand when I explained what I had done.

It had to do with things said during the day that could only have been known before hand by information being passed from the inside. You and Volt both committed that crime as I recall.

Plus, you were both legitimately scummy. But from my perspective you knew things you shouldn't. Don't recall what exactly though.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

cayvie

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2347 on: August 27, 2012, 11:01:33 pm »

haha.

the game was pretty fun overall; there certainly were plenty of memorable moments

this has convinced me that lying as town is even worse in Role Madness games--it's so complicated, and each piece of misinformation makes the puzzle that much harder to put together.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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jotheonah

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2348 on: August 27, 2012, 11:04:07 pm »

lol, whoever named me Golem in the Curse QT - I was considering fakeclaiming that instead of Pearl Diver. Great minds indeed.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Role Madness Mafia I GAME OVER, everyone wins sort of!
« Reply #2349 on: August 27, 2012, 11:05:21 pm »

there is so much angst in this curse QT. Volt, I now totally understand you backing out of my game.

Appreciated.  It's cool, I'm having fun there in my unofficial troll/backup-backup-mod role.  :)

PPE: Golem was my thought!
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