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Author Topic: Inflation  (Read 3885 times)

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rinkworks

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Inflation
« on: July 19, 2011, 10:05:22 am »
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In the Secret History of Seaside, the blurb for Cutpurse begins:

This started out as "Cards cost $1 less this turn, then $1 more until your next turn." That doesn't have the same timing as the other duration cards - it goes away at the end of the previous player's turn, rather than at the end of your turn. The developers didn't like that.

Inspired by this idea and appreciative of the logistical dilemma, my brother managed to create a card that has this effect without the inconsistency:

Inflation
$5 - Action/Duration
+$3.  Place on token on the Inflation mat.  While there are tokens on the Inflation mat, all cards (including cards in players' hands) cost +($) equal to the number of tokens on the Inflation mat.  At the start of your next turn, remove one token from the Inflation mat.

(Note:  The +$3 is really only a net gain of +$2, and worse if you use multiple buys.  It's also not labelled an "Attack" card due to the rules weirdness it would cause with Reactions.)

The idea is that, like Trade Route, you only have one shared mat amongst all the players.  Using the tokens on the mat, rather than simply counting the number of Inflation cards out, allows the duration of the effect to last until the beginning of the player's next turn, rather than the end of it, while the card itself still gets to follow the rules of all the other duration cards.  (Haven has a similar quality.)

After a few playtest games (during which we discovered the card should give +$3 instead of +$2 to make it sufficiently worthwhile to play, as then it feels more like the standard Mountebank/Militia/Cutpurse attack-with-a-terminal-silver card), we were both quite pleased with how it played.

A potential problem is that using TR/KC on it, or playing multiples with Villages, can really slam an opponent's next turn.  We were expecting that problem, but even in a kingdom where we deliberately included lots of possibilities for playing multiples, it still didn't feel that bad -- certainly not as bad as the brutal punishment that chaining Torturers or Mountebanks will do.
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tlloyd

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2011, 11:53:48 am »
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At $5, this card is almost strictly superior to Merchant Ship (with the exception being a multiple-buy turn), which also costs $5 and gives a +$2 benefit but doesn't impede your opponents' purchases. So I think Inflation would have to be either a $6 card or only give a net $1 benefit.

I thought of a similar card (which I called Tariff):
"Now and at the start of your next turn: +$2
While this is in play, cards cost $1 more."

Note that this avoids the potential over-powered problem with KC/TR. I like your idea to use a common mat and coin tokens to track the current tariff/inflation level, but it seems like you could just as easily count the number of Tariff/Inflation cards in play.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2011, 11:57:32 am by tlloyd »
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minced

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2011, 12:28:05 pm »
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This is a very interesting mechanic, but it penalizes +buy and rewards big money in many circumstances. I will, however, note that it has awesome interactions with apprentice. Trash a curse for +1 card or trash an estate for +3 cards!

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rinkworks

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2011, 03:30:22 pm »
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tlloyd: The confusion with counting Tariff/Inflation cards in play is just that (at least in the case of Inflation) the card remains in play longer than its effect does.  At the start of your second turn after playing an Inflation, the inflation effect goes away, but the card sticks around (dropping the prcie of Peddler, for example) for the remainder of the turn.  In a case where someone has two Inflations going -- one played the previous turn, and one played this turn -- it just seemed easier to use tokens to do the accounting.

I do like your anti-TR/KC wording.

minced:  That's a great observation about Apprentice.

During our practice games, the best antidote seemed to be not so much big money as Remodel/Remake/Expand/Upgrade, which don't have any net effect with Inflation.  Of course these aren't always (or even usually) going to be available in any given kingdom with Inflation in it.
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rinkworks

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2011, 04:04:05 pm »
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At $5, this card is almost strictly superior to Merchant Ship (with the exception being a multiple-buy turn), which also costs $5 and gives a +$2 benefit but doesn't impede your opponents' purchases. So I think Inflation would have to be either a $6 card or only give a net $1 benefit.

I put some thought into this, and I think I'm not too worried.  The second-turn effect of Merchant Ship shouldn't be underestimated.  Without it, Merchant Ship becomes no more than a terminal silver -- strictly inferior to Chancellor, in fact, which is weak even at $3.  In fact the +$2 on the second turn is more powerful than on the first turn, as you don't have to use a card slot or spend an action to get it.
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tlloyd

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2011, 03:45:13 am »
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In case anyone's still interested in this general idea, I just realized that increasing the cost of all cards would be strategically interesting in games with trash-for-benefit cards. In particular, both your own and your opponents' Apprentices and Bishops would benefit from Tariff/Inflation (Salvager technically does as well, but the net effect is null).
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2011, 09:20:08 am »
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There's also some cool stuff you could do with a massive engine deck involving inflating, salvaging, and then bridging... but if you could do that, you'd probably just want to play multiple bridges.
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drg

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2011, 03:00:17 pm »
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At $5, this card is almost strictly superior to Merchant Ship (with the exception being a multiple-buy turn), which also costs $5 and gives a +$2 benefit but doesn't impede your opponents' purchases. So I think Inflation would have to be either a $6 card or only give a net $1 benefit.

I put some thought into this, and I think I'm not too worried.  The second-turn effect of Merchant Ship shouldn't be underestimated.  Without it, Merchant Ship becomes no more than a terminal silver -- strictly inferior to Chancellor, in fact, which is weak even at $3.  In fact the +$2 on the second turn is more powerful than on the first turn, as you don't have to use a card slot or spend an action to get it.

I believe the person suggesting it's strictly superior to merchant ship thinks you get $3 on *both* turns, although I don't believe that is your intent with the card, I could see it being taken that way.
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rinkworks

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2011, 03:15:27 pm »
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Oh!  Now it all makes sense.  Yeah, you only get the $3 on the first turn.  On the second turn, all you get to do is remove the token you put on the mat the previous turn.

I did some further playtesting with this, by the way, and it seems to be quite sound.
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tlloyd

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Re: Inflation
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2011, 01:50:56 pm »
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First off, credit to Minced for noticing the interaction between Inflation and Apprentice - I must have missed that comment.

Second, DRG is right that I was interpreting Inflation as giving the coin benefit on your next turn as well. I now understand why Rinkworks thinks the coin tokens would be simpler. However, the card would be improved and simplified by changing both of these aspects. If Inflation's effects (both +$3 and price +$1) impacted both this turn and the next, then tracking price level would be as simple as counting Inflation cards in play--no tokens needed.

Of course you would then have to price it above $5 to avoid completely outclassing Merchant Ship, or you could go with my Tariff idea and price it at $5 but only give a net +$1 benefit (+$2 and prices +$1).
« Last Edit: August 13, 2011, 02:14:02 pm by tlloyd »
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