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[jotheonah]

Vote Count 2-13

Galzria (1): popsofctown
O (1): SwitchedFromStarcraft
jotheonah (4): Dsell, Tables, Robz888, Axxle
popsofctown (3): Galzria, jotheonah, Glooble
Glooble (1): O

Not voting {2}: Grujah, Captain_Frisk

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Lynch Deadline:  Monday, June 25, 9:59 a.m. EDT

So it looks like we stalled again.

I'm looking at the above and I'm struggling.  Galz's pops argument I found convincing - but I look at the rest of the wagon (the scumtwins) and I get nervous.  The J wagon has less suspicious characters (pops' scumcusations of Axxle2 not withstanding)

Those on the J bandwagon - If we lynch J - and he turns up town - what have we learned? Where do we go next?

Those on the popswagon - I assume if he flips town we lynch Galz?

If he flips town, we look back at this monstrous thread and we sheep pops's reads somewhat. Those reads highly don't include Galz, so I'm not sure. Cause I'm still really sure one of them is scum. Dang.

Yeah, probably lynch Galz. How many mislynches are we from LyLo? Can we afford to be wrong if they're both town? The nightkills should be somewhat instructive at this point. Also, who the heck is the SK?

I have an increasingly strong scumread on pops, and I think that more pressure votes on him will make it more apparent to the rest of you. But then, my reads are terrible. But I really like Galzria's, like I said, and I'm heartened that we agree. Maybe you guys will lynch me if pops flips town? Actually maybe you'll lynch me if pops flips scum, given how much he's defended me. It does hurt to be voting for one of the few people who consistently defends my towniness.

But I'm not going to hop on my own wagon and I don't think O or Glooble is scum.

Several people have expressed lukewarm interest in a Grujah wagon. I could dig it. Or if a Galz lynch picked up steam I could go that way. Otherwise, it's gotta be pops.

[Captain_Frisk]

If J comes up town, I would consider Glooble town.  I think mafia-Glooble would have been fine being linked with J-town since if mafia-Glooble was lynched he'd take J-town down with him, and if J-town is lynched we'd trust mafia-Glooble more. 

So - J flips town - this clears Glooble in your head - and then what? 

DSell isn't going to answer any prodding, and Tables posts so infrequently I wouldn't expect to see him either.

@RobZ - If J is town - how does your read of the situation change?

[Voltgloss]

DSell isn't going to answer any prodding

Just to clarify: 

- I have not prodded Dsell because he is on V/LA, returning in a few days if I recall correctly.
- If a lynch occurs while Dsell is still on V/LA, Night 2 will be extended until around 18-24 hours after Dsell's return.

[Captain_Frisk]

DSell isn't going to answer any prodding

Just to clarify: 

- I have not prodded Dsell because he is on V/LA, returning in a few days if I recall correctly.
- If a lynch occurs while Dsell is still on V/LA, Night 2 will be extended until around 18-24 hours after Dsell's return.

Agreed - I meant prodding from me / Galz regarding what the plan would be if J is lynched, not Mod Prodding. Should have been  more clear.

[Galzria]

DSell isn't going to answer any prodding

Just to clarify: 

- I have not prodded Dsell because he is on V/LA, returning in a few days if I recall correctly.
- If a lynch occurs while Dsell is still on V/LA, Night 2 will be extended until around 18-24 hours after Dsell's return.

Agreed - I meant prodding from me / Galz regarding what the plan would be if J is lynched, not Mod Prodding. Should have been  more clear.

I know it's been noted before, but just looking at Jo's last post:

"I'm good with lynching Galz"
"I want to lynch Pops"
"Someone mentioned a Gruj wagon. I'm good with that"

All in one post. Jo has the ultimate "anybody but me" syndrome... And it comes across so irksome.

[Axxle]

All in one post. Jo has the ultimate "anybody but me" syndrome... And it comes across so irksome scummy.

[jotheonah]

DSell isn't going to answer any prodding

Just to clarify: 

- I have not prodded Dsell because he is on V/LA, returning in a few days if I recall correctly.
- If a lynch occurs while Dsell is still on V/LA, Night 2 will be extended until around 18-24 hours after Dsell's return.

Agreed - I meant prodding from me / Galz regarding what the plan would be if J is lynched, not Mod Prodding. Should have been  more clear.

I know it's been noted before, but just looking at Jo's last post:

"I'm good with lynching Galz"
"I want to lynch Pops"
"Someone mentioned a Gruj wagon. I'm good with that"

All in one post. Jo has the ultimate "anybody but me" syndrome... And it comes across so irksome.

Seriously? Cause if you read the whole post I actually go through all the wagons, list several that I won't participate in (glooble and O) and rank the others somewhat in order of pereference.  So sue me for trying to facilitate a lynch.  You can't just pull out the parts of my post where I express willingness to lynch certain people, ignore the parts where I express unwillingness to lynch other people, and then say that I'm Mr. Lynch Lynch Lynch.  I could do the same thing with recent posts from CF, Robz, even probably you, Galz.  This is confirmation bias at it's worst.

[jotheonah]

BTW, Axxle's super-sarcastic tunnel on me is super not cute.

[Galzria]

All in one post. Jo has the ultimate "anybody but me" syndrome... And it comes across so irksome scummy.

I was actually very conscience NOT to use that word, because one thing Pops DOES have right is confusing "disliked playstyle" and "scum" (in the sense that scum = mafia".

I think Pops is scummy. I think Jo has been... Well, irksome.

Jo COULD be scum. Robz claims that Pops has been to obvious (to be Mafia), but has no issues lynching Jo, who has dug himself deeper holes than anybody else. These two altering statements from somebody I trust has me a bit concerned.

Why would Robz defend Pops?

It's just... Really confusing. I broke away from my gut instinct D1, which said to lynch Jo. Instead I followed a false read into lynching Axxle1. Given my track record on reads in M-II, it's no surprise I would be a little more uncertain now.

Pops is my strongest scum READ. Jo is who my gut says to lynch. So yeah, I'm trying to figure out NOW what would be gained by voting against my reads, should Jo flip town.

Then again, O would probably tell me I'm over thinking it. In M-I and M-III, success came down to the roles getting results. That takes time. Pops conceivably COULD be a PR (he hasn't reached L-1 with imminent hammer yet, which is where he would claim). Jo HAS claimed VT already, so if he's Mafia, he can't fakeclaim at this point...

Gah! Yes, this post rambled. Just stream of conscience.

[Axxle]

You were pointing out that J was incredibly survivalist, which is a scum tell.

[jotheonah]

All in one post. Jo has the ultimate "anybody but me" syndrome... And it comes across so irksome scummy.

I was actually very conscience NOT to use that word, because one thing Pops DOES have right is confusing "disliked playstyle" and "scum" (in the sense that scum = mafia".

I think Pops is scummy. I think Jo has been... Well, irksome.

Jo COULD be scum. Robz claims that Pops has been to obvious (to be Mafia), but has no issues lynching Jo, who has dug himself deeper holes than anybody else. These two altering statements from somebody I trust has me a bit concerned.

Why would Robz defend Pops?

It's just... Really confusing. I broke away from my gut instinct D1, which said to lynch Jo. Instead I followed a false read into lynching Axxle1. Given my track record on reads in M-II, it's no surprise I would be a little more uncertain now.

Pops is my strongest scum READ. Jo is who my gut says to lynch. So yeah, I'm trying to figure out NOW what would be gained by voting against my reads, should Jo flip town.

Then again, O would probably tell me I'm over thinking it. In M-I and M-III, success came down to the roles getting results. That takes time. Pops conceivably COULD be a PR (he hasn't reached L-1 with imminent hammer yet, which is where he would claim). Jo HAS claimed VT already, so if he's Mafia, he can't fakeclaim at this point...

Gah! Yes, this post rambled. Just stream of conscience.

Look at that, Galzria talked about lynching two different people in one post! That anyone-but-me syndrome he has is just terrible.


...is a thing that no one will day about Galzria.

[jotheonah]

*say

[Galzria]

My reads in M-III, sorry. Dropped an I.

[Tables]

Well, Galz vs. Pops was interesting. After reading both Galz post and Pops reply, both cases were well made (Galz attack and Pops defence, that is), and it's actually made me think the most likely scenario is that both are town, and the mafia were happy to sit back and watch, and now happy to simply push one or the other. Whose jumped onto the wagons so far? Hmm.

My vote is already on Joth, and his recent play has just been more and more mafia like. Sit back, wait for a good wagon. Jump on the wagon. Talk, post token analysis until someone calls you, make some vague defence, possibly attack them back. Wait for nothing really to happen. Glooble's twin thing is interesting, but... I know that in mafia, you can come pretty close to decieving yourself if you're good (I've written whole paragaphs explaining why I think someone is mafia in other games, before remembering that I'm the mafia and they're definitely town). And if you can decieve yourself, well, I suspect you can decieve your twin. It's a bit of a non-sequituer I know, but I think it's possible. And there's always the chance both Joth and Glooble are scum, anyway.

My vote is now firmly fixed on Joth, for now. Pops I'm still suspicious of, but as I said before, I'm beginning to think this big quiet period was because the mafia were waiting for a town vs. town debate to spark up.

[jotheonah]

You were pointing out that J was incredibly survivalist, which is a scum tell.

I really don't know how you could be LESS survivalist than I've been this game. I OFFERED TO LYNCH MYSELF. In what universe is that survivalist?

The things that Axxle says about me. They're not legitimate things. They're just ... Stir the pot stir the pot drive the wagon drive the wagon. Does nobody else see that? Do I need to post his iso?

[Galzria]

Ugh. More and more defensive as the pressure mounts.

Alright. I'll trust my gut this time, and because he's driving me up the wall. If I DON'T vote Jo, and he's scum, I'll never forgive myself if he goes on to win. If I don't vote Pops and he goes on to win,  at least I'll feel outplayed, but not foolish.

Vote: Jotheonah

[jotheonah]

Am I this invisible right now? That no one is even going to consider what I have to say? Look at Axxle's iso and tell me you see a helpful town player! Like half his posts today are one-liners that egg on my wagon. Of the remaining half, most are also one-liner snipes.

[Voltgloss]

Vote Count 2-13A

Galzria (1): popsofctown
O (1): SwitchedFromStarcraft
jotheonah (5): Dsell, Tables, Robz888, Axxle, Galzria
popsofctown (2): jotheonah, Glooble
Glooble (1): O

Not voting {2}: Grujah, Captain_Frisk

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Lynch Deadline:  Monday, June 25, 9:59 a.m. EDT

[jotheonah]

And I'm sorry this is being seen as defensive. Perhaps this will help?

Unvote.

Vote: jtotheonah

When I flip town, lynch Axxle and/or whoever drops this hammer.

[Robz888]

And I'm sorry this is being seen as defensive. Perhaps this will help?

Unvote.

Vote: jtotheonah

When I flip town, lynch Axxle and/or whoever drops this hammer.

I'm at an event but ugh kill him please, I am so sick of this.

[jotheonah]

I mean will someone with an ounce of sense look back at the last page and a half and tell me that the case against me, that I named more than one person at the phase of the day when we're trying to negotiate a lynch, makes sense? Or that Axxle has actual contributed a single helpful thing since replacing in, in particular a single comment about me that contained an original thought?

I'm totally down with being lynched, but get ready to look back tomorrow on the votes that got you there. Try to find the real scumhunting beneath them.

[Captain_Frisk]

And I'm sorry this is being seen as defensive. Perhaps this will help?

Unvote.

Vote: jtotheonah

When I flip town, lynch Axxle and/or whoever drops this hammer.

I want to hmmer on principal. Not going to iPhone hammer though.

[Captain_Frisk]

I mean will someone with an ounce of sense look back at the last page and a half and tell me that the case against me, that I named more than one person at the phase of the day when we're trying to negotiate a lynch, makes sense? Or that Axxle has actual contributed a single helpful thing since replacing in, in particular a single comment about me that contained an original thought?

I'm totally down with being lynched, but get ready to look back tomorrow on the votes that got you there. Try to find the real scumhunting beneath them.

If you are town j, then unvote and make them work for it

[Robz888]

I mean will someone with an ounce of sense look back at the last page and a half and tell me that the case against me, that I named more than one person at the phase of the day when we're trying to negotiate a lynch, makes sense? Or that Axxle has actual contributed a single helpful thing since replacing in, in particular a single comment about me that contained an original thought?

I'm totally down with being lynched, but get ready to look back tomorrow on the votes that got you there. Try to find the real scumhunting beneath them.

EXACTLY

If you are town j, then unvote and make them work for it

[Tables]

As town you really have no reason to self vote. As mafia, nobody is going to care about your 'lynch hammer' logic and this could end the day.

Also implicitly insulting everyone voting for you isn't generally a good move. For any alignment. Axxle hasn't been especially helpful lately, but he's also been pointing out scummy things about you. I can't blame him for it.