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[sitnaltax]

Ok, that was a pretty good comeback... so we know the price will be > 0, will you tell us if it's going to be upfront or monthly fee?

I asked the developers about pricing when I demoed the game and at least the ones I talked to weren't very clear about the pricing; I'm not sure if anyone is. They suggested that there would be some minimal level that's available for free. I indicated that I would prefer to just pay a flat sum and not worry about being nickel-and-dimed, and they seemed to indicate that that's a common desire that they were taking into account. But of course, who knows what the final cost structure will look like after everyone has had their say.

[Morgrim7]

Is it possible to play against a computer? If it isn't, is it possible to set the skill level? That would be interesting.

The developers I chatted with said that AIs would be available and suggested that they would be user-creatable as well. They also suggested that quickmatch between players would somehow take level into account; I didn't ask any specific questions about the matchmaking or rankings 'cause I figured that's stuff that's still very likely to change.

What I meant to say was will it be possible to set the level of the computer, but do you know, after chating with the developers?

[sitnaltax]

Is it possible to play against a computer? If it isn't, is it possible to set the skill level? That would be interesting.

The developers I chatted with said that AIs would be available and suggested that they would be user-creatable as well. They also suggested that quickmatch between players would somehow take level into account; I didn't ask any specific questions about the matchmaking or rankings 'cause I figured that's stuff that's still very likely to change.

What I meant to say was will it be possible to set the level of the computer, but do you know, after chating with the developers?

My best guess is yes. Outside of the ingame interface, the UI listed some sort of "Campaign" mode that wasn't working on the demo systems. If the AI is indeed pluggable, it's easy to imagine an advanced UI vs. one that's less sophisticated, or even programmed to make questionable/reckless plays.

[Morgrim7]

Is it possible to play against a computer? If it isn't, is it possible to set the skill level? That would be interesting.

The developers I chatted with said that AIs would be available and suggested that they would be user-creatable as well. They also suggested that quickmatch between players would somehow take level into account; I didn't ask any specific questions about the matchmaking or rankings 'cause I figured that's stuff that's still very likely to change.

What I meant to say was will it be possible to set the level of the computer, but do you know, after chating with the developers?

My best guess is yes. Outside of the ingame interface, the UI listed some sort of "Campaign" mode that wasn't working on the demo systems. If the AI is indeed pluggable, it's easy to imagine an advanced UI vs. one that's less sophisticated, or even programmed to make questionable/reckless plays.

This will be interesting to se what the "highest" level will do on some boards.

[ftl]

I suspect that it would be interesting from an AI point of view and not from a playing-dominion point of view; I strongly suspect that even the best AI would be worse than the top players here... If they manage to make an AI that is better or even on par with Stef, Obi-Wan, WW, Geronimoo, etc., I will be very, very impressed.

I like the fact that they'll have a Campaign mode. One thing which Isotropic does not do at all is provide a way for new people to get in to the game, besides just jumping in to the deep end with the sharks and spending half a zillion games being blindsided by cards you've never seen before. It's either that or spend lots of time reading forums or strategy guides before starting. I think it is a very good idea to have some sort of sequential mode, where you start off playing with just the base set, and gradually add more cards until you know what you're doing - much easier for people to get in to the game that way, IMO. Or some equivalent way of ramping up from newbie to 'have at least seen most of the cards that could come up randomly'.

[jsh357]

I suspect that it would be interesting from an AI point of view and not from a playing-dominion point of view; I strongly suspect that even the best AI would be worse than the top players here... If they manage to make an AI that is better or even on par with Stef, Obi-Wan, WW, Geronimoo, etc., I will be very, very impressed.

I like the fact that they'll have a Campaign mode. One thing which Isotropic does not do at all is provide a way for new people to get in to the game, besides just jumping in to the deep end with the sharks and spending half a zillion games being blindsided by cards you've never seen before. It's either that or spend lots of time reading forums or strategy guides before starting. I think it is a very good idea to have some sort of sequential mode, where you start off playing with just the base set, and gradually add more cards until you know what you're doing - much easier for people to get in to the game that way, IMO. Or some equivalent way of ramping up from newbie to 'have at least seen most of the cards that could come up randomly'.

There's a campaign mode?  I must have missed this

[ftl]

sitnaltax just mentioned it a few posts up

[jonts26]

I suspect that it would be interesting from an AI point of view and not from a playing-dominion point of view; I strongly suspect that even the best AI would be worse than the top players here... If they manage to make an AI that is better or even on par with Stef, Obi-Wan, WW, Geronimoo, etc., I will be very, very impressed.

If they made an AI that could play at lvl 25 on iso I'd be impressed.

[Galzria]

For a campaign mode style, it wouldn't seem improbable that they could:

A) Set the boards (non random)
B) Set the "AI" to get a certain amount of shuffle luck

You could control interaction (no attacks, or certain other cards), and you could make the "AI"" get the worst shuffle luck possible, or the best. You leave it up to the player to beat THAT, rather than a program.

Ideal? No. But it could be a place to start so that you "recreate" play at all levels.

[greatexpectations]

campaign mode could just be fancy terminology for solo challenges.

[WanderingWinder]

... you can play an exciting online game of Dominion with Donald X. at Origins

Looks like I should have figured out a way to go to origins...

[sitnaltax]

I suspect that it would be interesting from an AI point of view and not from a playing-dominion point of view; I strongly suspect that even the best AI would be worse than the top players here... If they manage to make an AI that is better or even on par with Stef, Obi-Wan, WW, Geronimoo, etc., I will be very, very impressed.

If they made an AI that could play at lvl 25 on iso I'd be impressed.

It's true. On the other hand, you should be able to write an AI that performs well, if not 40+ caliber, for a prespecified board. And really... the campaign for public use shouldn't require you to be able to beat the ten best players in the world.

[Kirian]

But I'd rather them push release back than to release a product below their standards.

This.  Good to hear some more info, and it sounds like an indication that they're still a ways away from finishing.

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Oh, really, the app is going to be absolutely perfect then? Good to hear!
Seriously why are you this way? If I had any desire before to ever buy another product from you I certainly wouldn't now.

Bad troll!  Stop shooting at the messenger, dammit!

[nightdance]

If Donald's happy, I'm happy.

[kn1tt3r]

The thing I'm mostly concerned of is the playing pace, which was annoyingly slow at BSW, especially for some card (like Menagery, where the hand is revealed every time with some fancy slow animation). Now these graphics remind me a bit of the BSW surface, and I really hope that playing a card will work like instantly and without being "nicely" animated.

[Donald X.]

The thing I'm mostly concerned of is the playing pace, which was annoyingly slow at BSW, especially for some card (like Menagery, where the hand is revealed every time with some fancy slow animation). Now these graphics remind me a bit of the BSW surface, and I really hope that playing a card will work like instantly and without being "nicely" animated.

Animation speed will be an option somewhere. For me personally, as they have it now, at "fast" it's good, at "very fast" it's too fast, and at "normal" it's too slow. The only thing here is, whatever you have it set to, in a game with humans, you're limited to the slowest player - it doesn't matter how fast it shows the animation for you if they aren't doing anything because they're waiting for theirs to finish. So ideally this will be a criteria for matching people up or something. Anyway yes, they have "nice" animations, it was an issue for me too, and they added faster ones.

[kn1tt3r]

The thing I'm mostly concerned of is the playing pace, which was annoyingly slow at BSW, especially for some card (like Menagery, where the hand is revealed every time with some fancy slow animation). Now these graphics remind me a bit of the BSW surface, and I really hope that playing a card will work like instantly and without being "nicely" animated.

Animation speed will be an option somewhere. For me personally, as they have it now, at "fast" it's good, at "very fast" it's too fast, and at "normal" it's too slow. The only thing here is, whatever you have it set to, in a game with humans, you're limited to the slowest player - it doesn't matter how fast it shows the animation for you if they aren't doing anything because they're waiting for theirs to finish. So ideally this will be a criteria for matching people up or something. Anyway yes, they have "nice" animations, it was an issue for me too, and they added faster ones.

Sounds like a reasonable solution, since I understand that this is sort of a compromise between real "gamers" and casual players who obviously like nice animations and slower paced play.

[barsooma]

But I'd rather them push release back than to release a product below their standards.

This.  Good to hear some more info, and it sounds like an indication that they're still a ways away from finishing.

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Oh, really, the app is going to be absolutely perfect then? Good to hear!
Seriously why are you this way? If I had any desire before to ever buy another product from you I certainly wouldn't now.

Bad troll!  Stop shooting at the messenger, dammit!

Really? You don't find his comment at all offensive after over a year of slipped release dates and enforced silence?

[WanderingWinder]

But I'd rather them push release back than to release a product below their standards.

This.  Good to hear some more info, and it sounds like an indication that they're still a ways away from finishing.

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Oh, really, the app is going to be absolutely perfect then? Good to hear!
Seriously why are you this way? If I had any desire before to ever buy another product from you I certainly wouldn't now.

Bad troll!  Stop shooting at the messenger, dammit!

Really? You don't find his comment at all offensive after over a year of slipped release dates and enforced silence?

No. I really really don't. You find it OFFENSIVE?

[barsooma]

But I'd rather them push release back than to release a product below their standards.

This.  Good to hear some more info, and it sounds like an indication that they're still a ways away from finishing.

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Oh, really, the app is going to be absolutely perfect then? Good to hear!
Seriously why are you this way? If I had any desire before to ever buy another product from you I certainly wouldn't now.

Bad troll!  Stop shooting at the messenger, dammit!

Really? You don't find his comment at all offensive after over a year of slipped release dates and enforced silence?

No. I really really don't. You find it OFFENSIVE?

Maybe aggravating is a better word than offensive... although I did enjoy seeing it in reply to your comment.
It's too bad your face is so firmly planted upside DVX's posterior, I would have enjoyed seeing you two get in a slap fight.

[Grujah]

Ever waiting for some other software? Blizzard Games? Duke Nukem Forever? Anything really.

(We) Software Engineers are the worst kind of people when it comes to dealing with deadlines. 

[WanderingWinder]

But I'd rather them push release back than to release a product below their standards.

This.  Good to hear some more info, and it sounds like an indication that they're still a ways away from finishing.

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Oh, really, the app is going to be absolutely perfect then? Good to hear!
Seriously why are you this way? If I had any desire before to ever buy another product from you I certainly wouldn't now.

Bad troll!  Stop shooting at the messenger, dammit!

Really? You don't find his comment at all offensive after over a year of slipped release dates and enforced silence?

No. I really really don't. You find it OFFENSIVE?

Maybe aggravating is a better word than offensive... although I did enjoy seeing it in reply to your comment.
It's too bad your face is so firmly planted upside DVX's posterior, I would have enjoyed seeing you two get in a slap fight.

I understand you probably don't grasp this, and you probably won't take my word for it, but you can agree with someone, on a lot of things, without being an apologist for them. Happens a lot when both of you just take a reasonable look at things.
Aggravated also describes how I feel about it, but I don't let it get to me so much. And my aggravation isn't with Donald because... what do you want *him* to do really? They don't want him to talk about it, really, why should he? I mean, they should let him, but that's not on him, it's on them. So it's between you, and them. He's in business with them, to an extent, he's going to pick them. Is he doing the thing that's best for him? Yup. Do I have a problem with that? Nope.
Also, and you might not understand this either, I don't like offending people. I try not to do it.

(BTW, it should be DXV, not DVX).

[Insomniac]

I don't see how it's aggrevating or offensive at all. He gave us information on it. Yes it doesn't have all the expansions or even the right symbols at the bottom. That's not DXV's doing. I'm actually hopeful for the implementation if the worst thing they do is have a few wrong symbols.

Anyways to keep it short thanks for the information I look forward to more as we approach release.

[barsooma]

I don't see how it's aggrevating or offensive at all. He gave us information on it. Yes it doesn't have all the expansions or even the right symbols at the bottom. That's not DXV's doing. I'm actually hopeful for the implementation if the worst thing they do is have a few wrong symbols.

Anyways to keep it short thanks for the information I look forward to more as we approach release.

Do you mental giants understand the purpose of quoting?

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Obviously I'm not complaining about him finally providing some information, I'm say that his denigrating tone towards hypothetical suggestions aggravates me, particularly in light of the poor job the publishers and developers have done so far in terms of releasing either a product or information.

if you think it's OBVIOUS that every OBVIOUS flaw in an alpha will be fixed by release time, then it's OBVIOUS you have no experience with software development.

[werothegreat]

I don't see how it's aggrevating or offensive at all. He gave us information on it. Yes it doesn't have all the expansions or even the right symbols at the bottom. That's not DXV's doing. I'm actually hopeful for the implementation if the worst thing they do is have a few wrong symbols.

Anyways to keep it short thanks for the information I look forward to more as we approach release.

Do you mental giants understand the purpose of quoting?

Being able to see the trash, like every other thing anyone will helpfully point out in that cute outraged way people have, is obv. needed and will obv. be done, obv., and no you are not the first one to think of this, hypothetical helpful outraged person.

Obviously I'm not complaining about him finally providing some information, I'm say that his denigrating tone towards hypothetical suggestions aggravates me, particularly in light of the poor job the publishers and developers have done so far in terms of releasing either a product or information.

if you think it's OBVIOUS that every OBVIOUS flaw in an alpha will be fixed by release time, then it's OBVIOUS you have no experience with software development.

They have testers for that.  You haven't even played the game.