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[Galzria]

I've voted No, for pretty much already stated previous reasons. I'm not on it, and TINAS is. One of those I KNOW hurts Resistances chances, the other I suspect does. Combined, I see no reason to vote for this assignment at this time.

Can you explain why you distrust TINAS?

He has consistently and relentlessly tried to twist my words. I never (despite his assurances) asked, or suggested that people vote down Assignment 4 on Mission 1.

Instead, I said "If presented the chance" I could prove my RO status. And that is a VERY different statement. I was more than clear (in the original post, and subsequently) that I did NOT expect it to get that far.

While a few people (eH, Robz) noted it as a strange comment, neither kept returning to it, trying again and again to suggest my statement had been more along the lines of the former example, rather than the latter (in fact, eH has noted on multiple occasions that he understood completely what I had said).

Thus, I must be inclined to suspect someone who would go so far out of their way to discredit me, by twisting my words to suit his own needs.

[WrathOfGlod]

I get what you are saying, and my estimate of P(TINAS Spy|Galzria not Spy) has gone up, but i still think you are more likely to be a spy than TINAS

[eHalcyon]

So here's the thing -- Assuming that TINAS, WoG and Robz all approve the mission, I am now the swing vote.  And I want to vote for this team.  I started writing up a big post rationalizing why I should vote yes for this team.  But the further I got with it, the less certain I was, and now I think I'm going to vote no.

I still find TINAS most trustworthy (despite Galzria's contention, though it is noted and it puts me just a little on edge) and Morgrim the least.  Everyone else is hovering around neutral... Robz is a few points up because of Morgrim's no vote to my team proposal, and same for WoG (though Morgrim's second "no" vote carries less weight because it could be for the sake of consistency). 

I'm torn on Galzria.  I have a Resistance read on him, but I can't pinpoint any particular tells that make me think that.  The problem is that I have a similar, stronger read on TINAS.  The conflict between them is tricky.  High level spy technique so that, when one is outed, the other has immense trust?  Two Resistance members with bad reads on each other?  Or (most likely, I think) one of the two actually is a spy.  But in that case, I trust TINAS more than Galz right now.

All this is too say that, if I exclude myself, this team of 3 is what I'd pick as well.  But excluding myself is really bad.  I want to rationalize it away, but I can't get around it.  But if I reject this team, I have no idea who WoG will nominate, or Morgrim if we get to that point.  Those prospects might be worse.

So is there any other strategic consideration that should push my vote one way or another?  If the team goes through and the mission passes, hurrah, but if it fails, maybe it's worth it to know that there is a spy among the people I'd felt most positive about.  I'd really appreciate insights from everyone on this.

Unless someone makes a case for why I should push it through, I think I'm going to vote no.

[eHalcyon]

Robz is a few points up because of Morgrim's no vote to my team proposal, and same for WoG (though Morgrim's second "no" vote carries less weight because it could be for the sake of consistency). 

To clarify -- I meant to say that WoG is also a few points up, but still below Robz, because Morgrim voted no on Robz' proposal.

[WrathOfGlod]

I voted no for the same reason you are planning on it, I wanted to be on the team. However I have a chance of getting on the team while you don't (I plan on putting myself on the team if made leader and Morgrim is a likely spy so you won't get on the team unless you are a spy).

[eHalcyon]

I voted no for the same reason you are planning on it, I wanted to be on the team. However I have a chance of getting on the team while you don't (I plan on putting myself on the team if made leader and Morgrim is a likely spy so you won't get on the team unless you are a spy).

You could put me on the team. And it's more likely for Morgrim to take me if he's spy than if he's resistance since he'd probably avoid his partner. Thanks for your thoughts on this mission. They are interesting...

[eHalcyon]

Not allowed to discuss it, but I am no longer suspicious of Morgrim.  In fact, I no longer have any clue when I should be suspicious of Morgrim.  Ugh.

Accordingly, I no longer view Morgrim's no votes as incriminating or affirming of anything.  TINAS is still positive for his mission 1 posts, but Robz is neutral again.  Morgrim is now neutral.  WoG is still neutral.  Galzria is closer to neutral than before because part of my suspicion was due to Galzria defending Morgrim early on (when Morgrim strangely voted yes, Galzria tried hardest to make sense of his explanation).

So I'm neutral on nearly all fronts now, from an analytical standpoint.  From gut instinct I distrust Robz and WoG more now, simply because they haven't made much of an impact in the discussion so far (or at least that's how I feel).

This also means that almost all the reasons I entertained for approving this team are gone now, and I'm OK with letting Morgrim take control.

[Tables]

Mission 2.2 proposed by: Robz888:
Team Proposed: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888
Voting YES: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888
Voting NO: Morgrim7, Galzria, eHalcyon
Result: Yes - 3, No - 3
Proposal Fails

WrathOfGlod is the new leader. WoG, please propose a team

(Edit: New format is like the old one, but it's generated better. Yay for behind the scenes changes!)

[WrathOfGlod]

Who do people want me to send. I am putting myself on the team but am open for people to give reasons for teams

[Thisisnotasmile]

I'm happy for you to make exactly the same proposal.

[Galzria]

I'm happy for you to make exactly the same proposal.

So am I.

[eHalcyon]

I'm happy for you to make exactly the same proposal.

So am I.

Because it will probably fail again?

I have no suggestions for now, though I'd like to be on the team of course.

[Robz888]

WOG, I really liked the team I proposed, and it was close to passing... Perhaps you, and then either me or TINAS, and... ?

[eHalcyon]

I'd rather see who Morgrim proposes.  Though maybe that won't help us at all, given his super unreadability. 

[WrathOfGlod]

I like the team too but it is guaranteed to fail and then we have to vote for Morgrim's team so is it worth it?

[eHalcyon]

Is there still significant reason to be wary of Morgrim here?  I can't discuss it but... MIII...

And anyway, if we really don't want Morgrim's team, we can have Galzria veto it and let TINAS propose...

Er, actually, Galzria said he wants to avoid giving TINAS final decision on the team OR control of the plot card, which means he's going to have to accept this mission.  But if it has TINAS on it... um.  I don't know.  Refer to posts #157 and #173.

So you could propose the same team and there is a chance Galzria will approve it.

Either way, I prefer seeing what Morgrim does.  I will vote no unless I am on the team.

[WrathOfGlod]

I propose the same team
WrathOfGlod, Robz888,ThisIsNotASmile

[Morgrim7]

I propose the same team
WrathOfGlod, Robz888,ThisIsNotASmile

Disapprove. I wanna be on the team!!!

[Galzria]

I propose the same team
WrathOfGlod, Robz888,ThisIsNotASmile

Was that an actual proposal, or suggestion/idea?

[eHalcyon]

Needs ##bold to be official, WoG. 

[WrathOfGlod]

##I propose WrathOfGlod, Robz888,ThisIsNotASmile

Sorry about that

[Tables]

I'll take Morgrim's vote above as an official no and the post at 4am GMT (post 191) as the start of the vote deadline timer

[Morgrim7]

Bad news guys.  Am phone posting, do not have time to say much. Will be gome for at least 24hrs. so I am sending.a pm to Tables with my proposal amd vote if necesaary. sorry again, guys, I am flying to Japan.

[WrathOfGlod]

Bad news guys.  Am phone posting, do not have time to say much. Will be gome for at least 24hrs. so I am sending.a pm to Tables with my proposal amd vote if necesaary. sorry again, guys, I am flying to Japan.

Going to Japan to coordinate with your government handlers? xD
(Have fun in Japan, always wanted to visit there)

[Morgrim7]

Bad news guys.  Am phone posting, do not have time to say much. Will be gome for at least 24hrs. so I am sending.a pm to Tables with my proposal amd vote if necesaary. sorry again, guys, I am flying to Japan.

Going to Japan to coordinate with your government handlers? xD
(Have fun in Japan, always wanted to visit there)

In tje airport at my layover. No, I am going to live there.