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[Cuzz]

I don't think Cuzz'question is any scummy, we needed to start a conversation and this topic starter is as good as any

We did need a topic starter, but this is the kind that leads town to say too much and hand the game to scum.

Tell me the exact mechanism by which answering my original question leads town to say too much and hand the game to scum.

Why would you ask me that? I feel like people are reacting unusually strongly to a single early Day 1 vote. Why is that?

Why would I ask someone to say what they mean when they say stuff is what you’re asking?

To be crystal clear, it’s the same reason I always want people to say what they mean, which is to find out if they have a genuine reason to say what they say or not.

In your case, I can’t tell if you truly believe that the topic I brought up could “hand the game to scum” (seems a little far fetched to me) or if maybe you were trying to shut down a conversation that you actually think could be harmful to scum.

If I’m scum, then I’m doing the thing you’re accusing me of and hence I already know what mechanism you’re talking about, so answering my question shouldn’t be a problem. You’d just be sharing your insights about my scum ruse with your fellow townies, which would be pro town!

[faust]

Vote Count 1.2

LaLight (1): mcmcsalot
mcmcsalot (1): Galzria
Cuzz (3): Robz888, Awaclus, EFHW
EFHW (2): LaLight, WestCoastDidds

Not Voting (5): Cuzz, scolapasta, jotheonah, Swowl, shraeye

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to exile. Day 1 ends on September 25, 2024, 10:45:00 am.

[shraeye]

Having slept through the night, I feel this is right

Vote: LaLight

[shraeye]

And it rhymes!

[LaLight]

And it rhymes!

i knew choosing this username will bite me in the butt eventually!

[EFHW]

Ugh, I had to scroll through three or four times to find Robz's vote. I thought there was just Awaclus. Jumping on third is different from jumping on second. unvote

[mcmcsalot]

Ugh, I had to scroll through three or four times to find Robz's vote. I thought there was just Awaclus. Jumping on third is different from jumping on second. unvote

How does your position on the wagon affect you liking the vote or not?

[mcmcsalot]

vote: EFHW

[WestCoastDidds]

Oh I see shraeye is catching up but is about to get to the part where everyone agrees that I wasn’t actually being scummy and in fact the people accusing me of such are really the scummy ones.

Yes, and I was ready to vote for people over it, but I don't think really anyone is accusing you. It looks like EFHW is taking heat over it, but...I don't think EFHW is actually accusing you of being scummy?

Galz said it best, I could see how it would be called scummy but it doesn't really amount to a tell, because it's the one post every knew was going to be made eventually.

You're town, so that's good to learn

That was kind of the problem with the EFHW vote for Cuzz.

[EFHW]

Ugh, I had to scroll through three or four times to find Robz's vote. I thought there was just Awaclus. Jumping on third is different from jumping on second. unvote

How does your position on the wagon affect you liking the vote or not?

Because it communicated something different than I intended.

[mcmcsalot]

vote: Cuzz

what was this intended to communicate other than "I find cuzz scummy" and how does being the third vote of seven needed to exile communicate something different?

[shraeye]

vote: Cuzz

what was this intended to communicate other than "I find cuzz scummy" and how does being the third vote of seven needed to exile communicate something different?

Hey, I wanted to ask these questions!  So...waiting on answers

[LaLight]

I'd like to note that if I could vote EFHW one more time, I would right about now

[jotheonah]

Shraeye, where you at?? Also, there is no nearly enough Joth-ity up in this joint.

Agreed. What does joth think about all this?

Just catching up now. I got sick this weekend and I’m still sick but now I’m well enough to catch up on mafia.

[jotheonah]

I was all set to vote Cuzz but then EFHW unvoted. They both seem scummy to me, so they’re probably both town. But that kind of thinking gets you nowhere fast.

vote: Cuzz

[EFHW]

vote: Cuzz

what was this intended to communicate other than "I find cuzz scummy" and how does being the third vote of seven needed to exile communicate something different?

It's day 1. Votes shift around a lot. I looked at the votes, and missed Robz's, so I expressed my misgivings with a vote. My intention wasn't to exile him then and there. Your statement that you found his question towny isn't much different. To increase a wagon to 3 is a much more forceful comment, and that explains why I got the reaction I did. Since I didn't mean to make such a forceful comment, I unvoted.

[Cuzz]

Vote: joth

[Cuzz]

Not remotely engaging with the actual content of anything anyone has said but still trying to seem like he might have an opinion about it.

[Cuzz]

Even a naked vote would have been less scummy than joth’s post.

[Cuzz]

I was planning on voting efhw before seeing joth’s post so I’d vote both of them if I could. You can consider my vote on efhw in spirit also for now.

[mcmcsalot]

vote: Cuzz

what was this intended to communicate other than "I find cuzz scummy" and how does being the third vote of seven needed to exile communicate something different?

It's day 1. Votes shift around a lot. I looked at the votes, and missed Robz's, so I expressed my misgivings with a vote. My intention wasn't to exile him then and there. Your statement that you found his question towny isn't much different. To increase a wagon to 3 is a much more forceful comment, and that explains why I got the reaction I did. Since I didn't mean to make such a forceful comment, I unvoted.

Efhw do you think wagons in general are good or bad?

[jotheonah]

Yes I finally rolled scum and celebrated by checking out from the game for three days then signing on and joining the leading wagon with very little explanation. That seems like me.

(It does not. I am a high-effort scum player.)

[Cuzz]

Yes I finally rolled scum and celebrated by checking out from the game for three days then signing on and joining the leading wagon with very little explanation. That seems like me.

(It does not. I am a high-effort scum player.)

I don’t think this is the slam dunk defense you intended it to be.

[EFHW]

vote: Cuzz

what was this intended to communicate other than "I find cuzz scummy" and how does being the third vote of seven needed to exile communicate something different?

It's day 1. Votes shift around a lot. I looked at the votes, and missed Robz's, so I expressed my misgivings with a vote. My intention wasn't to exile him then and there. Your statement that you found his question towny isn't much different. To increase a wagon to 3 is a much more forceful comment, and that explains why I got the reaction I did. Since I didn't mean to make such a forceful comment, I unvoted.

Efhw do you think wagons in general are good or bad?

I sometimes use votes to express myself when there is no danger of exile. My vote was not of the "everyone vote Cuzz" variety. Wagons are necessary to achieve consensus, but having one this early in the game is counterproductive. It discourages looking at everyone carefully. Voting later on a wagon signals that you are prepared to exile the person. That was not my goal, so I checked to see if there was already a wagon. I thought there was only one vote, but I was wrong, so everyone reacted like I had indeed meant to condemn him, but I didn't.

Three votes isn't the end of the world, though. There were also feelings about my not elaborating on why I was worried town could be hurt by the line of questioning. I remember games where there was extensive discussion of mass claiming in day 1. I don't think we ever did it, but every time town players ended up inadvertently saying information that would have been better kept to themselves. "Let's speculate" questions have had the same effect and that's why I objected and felt suspicious of the questioner. I haven't changed my mind on that, though I am also keeping his relative inexperience with playing mafia in mind.

[Robz888]

Lots of unreasonable confidence regarding who is scum being expressed right now.