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Author Topic: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt  (Read 2067 times)

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4est

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Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« on: June 10, 2024, 10:13:48 am »
+2

WDC #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt

Rising Sun is still a few months away, but we already know we'll be revisiting a mechanic not seen since Empires.

Here's this week's challenge:

Design a card or landscape that costs and/or interacts with Debt.

Other rules and suggestions:
  • Your submission must have a Debt symbol () somewhere on the card, either as a cost (such as Engineer, Overlord, or Triumph) or as an interaction within its text (such as Capital, Tax, or Mountain Pass).
  • Costs with both and are allowed (e.g. Fortune, Wedding).
  • Your submission may contain multiple cards (e.g. a split pile or a non-Supply pile), though for judging sake, let's try to keep things to no more than 2 total card-shaped-things per submission.
  • You may use any other official expansion mechanics.
  • Make sure your card has a compelling reason to cost (or interact with) Debt. Remember how Debt affects things like openings, buys, costs/cost reduction, gains (a la Workshop), etc.
  • As always with my contests: Don't make me squint. Eliminate unnecessary words and complexity where possible.

Judgment Details:
  • Entries and revisions must be submitted by 5:00 PM CT (11:00 PM UTC) on Sunday, June 16. I'll try to have results posted by Tuesday, June 18.
  • Entries will be judged on ingenuity, balance, simplicity, and appropriate use of the Debt mechanic.

Have fun! I'm excited to see your designs!



Entries:
Impoverished Village by JW
Central Bank by grep
Stock Exchange by faust
Mad Scientist by BryGuy
Gangster and Kingpin by HorazVitae
Expansive by grrgrrgrr
Industrialist by infangthief
Incomplete Cathedral by valb_7k
Labor and Slum by fika monster
Archduke by segura
Usurer by emtzalex
Tinkerer by LTaco
Royal Engineer by Udzu
Desperado by NoMoreFun
« Last Edit: June 17, 2024, 10:31:20 am by 4est »
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JW

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2024, 05:43:32 pm »
+5

Impoverished Village 

Action
+1 Card and +2 Actions
If you have less than 10 , you may take 3 for +2 Cards.
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grep

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2024, 09:07:09 am »
+4

__


Central Bank
D6 - Project
At start of your turn, take 1 Debt.
Your Victory cards are also Treasures, when you play them, +$1.


Clarification: for already playable Victory-(Action|Treasure) cards, it's extra $1. For example, Farm gives $3, and Nobles give +$1 in addition to +2 Actions or +3 Cards.

Upd: reduced price, text clarification
« Last Edit: June 12, 2024, 10:26:25 pm by grep »
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2024, 11:13:05 am »
+6


Quote
Stock Exchange - 5D
Project

At the start of your turn, if you have Debt, +2 Cards, +1 Action.
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BryGuy

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2024, 10:46:39 pm »
+1

:)                                                      :)
:)                                                      :)
Quote
Mad Scientist 4Debt P Action
+1 Card
+1 Villager

Choose two different:
discard a card for +1 Action;
or +1 Card and trash a Hand card;
or discard a Gold for +1 Buy and +P;
or discard a Treasure for +$1.
:)
The debt allows you to gain this card when your potion comes available even if you don't have enough coin as well. Debt with potion cost is something i plan to test now.
:)                                                      :)
« Last Edit: June 12, 2024, 08:22:21 am by BryGuy »
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HorazVitae

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2024, 05:51:06 am »
0



Gangster
Gain a Card costing up to $4. Then take Kingpin. If another player had it, take Debt until you have 1 more than him.
-
When you discard this, other than during Clean-up, play it, but the card may cost $1 more and is gained into your hand instead.
5@(Debt) Cost Night - Reaction

Kingpin
At the start of your turn, choose one:
Each other player gains a curse;
Discard a card to draw a card.
State

Its a non-terminal workshop that makes you the biggest fish in the game, if you are willing to be the one with the most debt, although someone might be taking over before you can use your power. You can protect it somewhat by buying more gangsters, because that increases the amount of debt others have to take but it might be a constant tug of war. If you have a gangster in your starting hand while you are the kingpin, so you can discard it for the benefit of your plans.

The only thing i am a tad unsure about is whether to price it at 5 or 6 debt. i tend to struggle with proper debt costing.

EDIT: Put it at 5D.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2024, 05:46:56 am by HorazVitae »
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grrgrrgrr

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2024, 04:49:15 pm »
+6



Quote
Expansive (Trait)
Expansive cards cost @3 more. When you play an Expansive card, +$1.


I was on the fence whether I should go for above or this, but I ultimately went with above.
Quote
Insured (Trait)
You can buy Insured cards by taking @ instead of paying $.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2024, 02:40:52 am »
0


Quote
Industrialist
4-debt Night

Choose two different options: +1 Coffers; +1 Villager; gain a Horse.
Take 3-debt, then gain a non-Victory card costing up to $1 per @1 you have.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2024, 03:51:46 am by infangthief »
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HorazVitae

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2024, 04:59:31 am »
0


Quote
Stock Exchange - 5D
Project

At the start of your turn, if you have Debt, +2 Cards, +1 Action.

correct me if i am wrong, but isn't this just a one-off that doesn't do much else than gimp you with needless debt in kingdoms where you don't have any other debt cost? Since you can't buy projects more than once.
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2024, 05:45:10 am »
+3


Quote
Stock Exchange - 5D
Project

At the start of your turn, if you have Debt, +2 Cards, +1 Action.

correct me if i am wrong, but isn't this just a one-off that doesn't do much else than gimp you with needless debt in kingdoms where you don't have any other debt cost? Since you can't buy projects more than once.
Yes, in many cases this will just work as a one-shot, and that's how it is costed: A bit more expensive than Expedition because the effect is a bit better.

However you can benefit for multiple turns if you don't pay off the Debt and instead use those turns to trash/remodel/gain cards and accept that you won't be buying things. Effectively, the project gives each consecutive turn a choice of "get this one-shot effect again" versus buying other stuff.
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HorazVitae

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2024, 05:52:31 am »
0

Hmm, maybe i am just bothered by the fact that it could just be a one-shot for one turn if you have no cards in the kingdom that want to do stuff that makes it worthwile to not buy any cards for more than one round. In those games it'd just be a -1coin token, +2actions and +1card for next turn for $4, once, which doesn't gel with the project archetype for me. Although to get the effect you envision, an event wouldn't suffice so i guess there is not really a different solution.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2024, 11:17:52 am »
+1


Quote
Incomplete Cathedral @5
At the start of your turn, trash a card from your hand. You may take @2 to gain a card costing up to $2 more than it.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2024, 12:17:35 pm »
+2


Quote
Incomplete Cathedral @5
At the start of your turn, trash a card from your hand. You may take @2 to gain a card costing up to $2 more than it.
How is an incomplete Cathedral better than a complete one? Also, Cathedral is a Project, so flavor-wise you're starting the process to build a cathedral, I suppose. Here, you start the process of... building an incomplete cathedral? Very confusing.

Cathedral is already a mandatory opening buy most of the time, and this will be even more so. The ability to turn all your Estates into useful $4s is just insane. It could cost 8D or more and still be worth it.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2024, 12:19:22 pm by faust »
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2024, 02:05:05 pm »
+2

It being incomplete adds the construction flavour present in many Remodelers. I guess it's bigger than a normal Cathedral, which is why it's better, and also why it remains incomplete (inspiration for the theme was the Sagrada Famailia [although now that I look it up it's not actually a Cathedral]).
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2024, 06:48:09 pm »
+1

My submission is Both an action card, and a Thematic non supply card (ala horse)

The normal action card:
Labour

Quote
Labour
$4, Action

+3 Cards
You may play a Slum from your hand. If you didn't, gain a Slum

The thematic non supply card:
Slum

Quote
Slum
$1, Action - Duration

+1 Action.
You may take 1 Debt to get +1 Action. If you did, at the start of your next turn, repeat this ability.
-
When you gain or trash this, play it.
(This is not in the Supply)
(This is not in the supply)

FAQ:
There are 6 Slum  cards per player. So 2 player theres 12, 3 player 18, etc.
If you gain a labour card during another players turn, you still have to play it. You may take a debt to ensure Actions at the start of your actual next turn.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2024, 03:40:29 pm by fika monster »
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2024, 02:18:17 am »
+3

Quote
Archduke 8D
+1 Card
+1 Action

Gain a Duchy
-----------------
When you gain this, put your hand onto your deck.
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emtzalex

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #16 on: June 14, 2024, 10:29:46 am »
+1

My Submission:




Quote
Usurer {4+} Action
Trash a Treasure from your hand (or reveal you can't). Choose one: +$2; or -{2} per $1 the trashed card costs.

Overpay: gain a card costing $1 per {2} you overpaid.

Usurer is a mandatory Treasure trasher that can function either as a terminal Silver or a trash-for-benefit card (provided you have enough Debt to remove from trashing a Treasure). Early on it's weaker than Moneylender, paying you $2 instead of $3. Later, it can trash more expensive cards, or (in rare cases) provide $ when you have no Treasures.

While the base cost is 4 Debt, there is also an overpay mechanic, allowing you to "borrow" to gain another card, but at the (usurious) rate of 2 Debt per $1 the card costs. Of course, you can (potentially) use the Usurer's ability to pay down the debt, but (depending on various factors around deck size, hitting shuffles, etc.) that may or may not happen soon enough.

More interesting (to me) is the Overpay's impact on the endgame (particularly, the Penultimate Province Rule). If you take the second-to-last Province (or Colony) in a game, rather than worrying your opponent might be able to buy the last one on the following turn, you know for a fact they will be able to (using Usurer's overpay function, and not having to worry about the massive debt they will incur). Thus, the PPR becomes a strict rule, along with other impacts on endgame strategy. I know a lot of people will hate this about the card, but I like effects that function as rule changes (like Shaman), and I think this is an interesting one. Plus, you can always not play with a card / put it on your banned list.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2024, 12:12:05 pm by emtzalex »
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Thanks to Shard of Honor for his Extended Version of the Dominion Card Image Generator, which I use to mock up my fan cards, and to Violet CLM, who made the original.

segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2024, 10:44:22 am »
0

Put me on the hater list. If you can convert an extra Buy into a Province and nobody will buy the sixth, the game will often and in a green slog. Does not sound like fun to me.
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2024, 12:00:19 pm »
0

My Submission:




Quote
Usurer {4+} Action - Night
Trash a Treasure from your hand (or reveal you can't). Choose one: +$2; or -{2} per $1 the trashed card costs.

Overpay: gain a card costing $1 per {2} you overpaid.
Your mockup has only the action type but the text version says Action - Night.
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emtzalex

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2024, 12:12:32 pm »
0

My Submission:




Quote
Usurer {4+} Action - Night
Trash a Treasure from your hand (or reveal you can't). Choose one: +$2; or -{2} per $1 the trashed card costs.

Overpay: gain a card costing $1 per {2} you overpaid.
Your mockup has only the action type but the text version says Action - Night.


Fixed. Thank you!
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #20 on: June 15, 2024, 06:22:32 pm »
+3



FAQ:
Cost reduction does not affect the debt cost of Victory cards.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #21 on: June 15, 2024, 07:50:47 pm »
+1

Can't you just get a few Tinkerers and then use them go gain all the Provinces? Which requires no other cards and wins the game more quickly than most engines?

Like-

Turn 1: buy Tinkerer
Turn 2: buy Tinkerer (you now have 1 debt)
Turn 3: buy Tinkerer (you now have ~2-4 debt)
Turn 4: buy Province (works if you drew 5+ coppers across Turns 3 and 4) (you now have 8 debt)
Turn 5+: play any Tinkerer you draw and don't pay off debt

Should get 4 Provinces in 7-9 turns
« Last Edit: June 15, 2024, 07:55:47 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #22 on: June 15, 2024, 08:47:08 pm »
+4

Can't you just get a few Tinkerers and then use them go gain all the Provinces? Which requires no other cards and wins the game more quickly than most engines?

Like-

Turn 1: buy Tinkerer
Turn 2: buy Tinkerer (you now have 1 debt)
Turn 3: buy Tinkerer (you now have ~2-4 debt)
Turn 4: buy Province (works if you drew 5+ coppers across Turns 3 and 4) (you now have 8 debt)
Turn 5+: play any Tinkerer you draw and don't pay off debt

Should get 4 Provinces in 7-9 turns

No, because Province costs Debt not Coins in tinkerer games.
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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2024, 11:33:12 pm »
0

24 hours
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2024, 05:16:50 am »
+7

__


Royal Engineer (1 Debt - Event)
Gain a card costing up to $5. Take 1 Debt per $1 it costs.

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #25 on: June 16, 2024, 03:40:56 pm »
0

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #26 on: June 16, 2024, 06:07:12 pm »
+1

Desperado
Action - $3
+2 Cards
While you have any <>, +2 Actions
At the start of your buy phase, you may return this to its pile for +$3. If you did, +<3> at end of turn.

Rules clarification: Unlike Capital, you can't pay off the end of turn debt with any excess $ you have.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2024, 04:23:24 pm by NoMoreFun »
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2024, 05:41:41 am »
+2

Desperado
Action - $3
+2 Cards
While you have any <>, +2 Actions
At the start of your buy phase, you may return this to its pile for +$3 and +<3>

The +$3 and +<3> cancel each other (you can't use the $ for buying as long as you have debt).
To make the $3 usable, the card should give out the debt later than the $, like Capital does, e.g. during clean-up.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2024, 07:01:10 am »
0

No, because Province costs Debt not Coins in tinkerer games.

well, yes, that's why it's possible. The fact that Provinces now cost <8> is what allows you to buy a Province on Turn 4, provided you can pay off the debt from Turn 3 by that point

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2024, 07:06:31 am »
+5

No, because Province costs Debt not Coins in tinkerer games.

well, yes, that's why it's possible. The fact that Provinces now cost <8> is what allows you to buy a Province on Turn 4, provided you can pay off the debt from Turn 3 by that point
Tinkerer gains cards that cost coins, not debt, so it can't gain any victory cards with its on-play ability.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2024, 07:41:36 am »
0

No, because Province costs Debt not Coins in tinkerer games.

well, yes, that's why it's possible. The fact that Provinces now cost <8> is what allows you to buy a Province on Turn 4, provided you can pay off the debt from Turn 3 by that point
Tinkerer gains cards that cost coins, not debt, so it can't gain any victory cards with its on-play ability.

ohh, yes, now I get the objection. You're correct of course.

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2024, 10:32:45 am »
+2

CONTEST CLOSED

Please check the OP to make sure I have your most updated submission.

I'll have commentary and results posted in the next day or two.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2024, 04:24:06 pm »
+2

Desperado
Action - $3
+2 Cards
While you have any <>, +2 Actions
At the start of your buy phase, you may return this to its pile for +$3 and +<3>

The +$3 and +<3> cancel each other (you can't use the $ for buying as long as you have debt).
To make the $3 usable, the card should give out the debt later than the $, like Capital does, e.g. during clean-up.

I fixed it, but for transparency this happened after the contest was closed.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2024, 04:46:21 pm »
+1

All good, I'll take these changes into account.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #34 on: June 19, 2024, 02:31:35 pm »
+5

Appreciate the patience, I'm about 2/3 of the way through the card write-ups and will get these posted tonight or tomorrow!
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #35 on: June 19, 2024, 10:28:57 pm »
+3

WDC #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt

Commentary & Results

Thanks everyone for your patience, and I appreciate all the submissions! Let's get to it, OPs are linked, shortlisted entries are bolded.



Impoverished Village by JW
A Village that lets you take Debt for extra cards. The price point for +2 Cards compares with Expedition, and the limit helps prevent spamming these to draw your deck on boards where you don't need to buy cards. An elegant entry and a use for Debt we haven't seen on an official card yet.

Central Bank by grep
A Debt Project that makes your VP cards Coppers at the cost of giving you 1%. Playing VP cards feels overly complicated when it could just be discard at the start of your Buy phase for $1 each. The bigger issue is the penalty which I think is way too steep. 1% per turn may not seem like much but it's basically like getting Cutpursed every turn, and unless you have more than one VP card to play, it doesn't make up for the every turn cost. In most games you trash your Estates, making this worthless, and by the endgame, adding a few extra Coppers to your deck hardly feels worth the trouble. 

Stock Exchange by faust
Another Project, sort of an Expedition+ that you can potentially trigger on multiple turns if you stay in Debt or go back into Debt. Without other ways to take Debt, this Project is eventually going to "run out" and getting more than one or possibly two turns out of it will be rare. With other Debt sources, this gets much more interesting, a mini game of sorts where you actively try to end turns in Debt. While I wish the latter was more the norm, I think the former, "one-shot" vibe will be more common. 

Mad Scientist by BryGuy
I like the idea of a Debt-Potion cost! It remedies one of the core downsides of Potion cards: not drawing your Potion with enough money in hand to buy the card you want (looking at you, Familiar). The issue here though is that Pawns, where you choose 2 from a set of 4 options, REALLY want those 4 options to be simple, easy to grok and remember. Mad Scientists options by themselves aren't complex, but layering on the standard effect you always get with some options having conditional things and some just giving the bonus, it makes it very hard to just glance at the card and know what it can actually do for you. The wording in some places is also a bit strange (trash a Hand card should be trash a card from your hand).

Gangster and Kingpin by HorazVitae
There's a lot going on with this one, trying to wrap my head around it. So it's a Night Workshop that can gain better cards to hand if you trigger its Reaction. I've always thought there's some interesting design space for Night Reactions where the effect gets more interesting during other phases. The Debt cost works here by preventing you from gaining other Gangsters. So far, so good. What I don't really get is Kingpin. Outside of potentially the early game, it's hard to envision a scenario where the start of turn effect of Kingpin ever really triggers (especially in multi-player). The Cursing means you can't ignore Gangster, and the chances of getting Kingpin and then not having another player play it feel really low, essentially making it's ability sort of a factor. The Debt thing also feels a little convoluted. I would recommend figuring out a different Artifact or honestly just dropping it altogether, the Debt cost Night-Reaction seems viable as is. 

Expansive by grrgrrgrr
I actually slightly prefer the other Trait you shared, turning the selected card into a Debt card is a super simple but compelling idea. Expansive is cool too, the card costs extra Debt and gains a Training sort of ability. Like all Traits, the utility is highly dependent on the selected card, but I like this idea a lot and it gives me Cursed vibes, where it makes the card stronger but at a cost. Good one!

Industrialist by infangthief
Another Night card, with a Pawn like choice of Coffers, Villagers, or Horses. The bottom grants choices already, so I think eliminating the choice at the top (and just going with a flat bonus) would be a bit cleaner. The Debt Workshop thing is weird; it's sort of like just buying a card during your Night phase (that you have to pay for later), but it gets better if you already have Debt or play in multiples. Playing the first one let's you pay $3 for a $3 but a second one gains a $6 for just $3 more. 

Incomplete Cathedral by valb_7k
Another Debt Project. So it's basically Cathedral, a mandatory trash every turn, except you can also Remodel stuff if you want. An easy autobuy on just about every board. A Debt Remodel is interesting design space to explore but this is simply too powerful. 

Labor and Slum by fika monster
A Smithy that comes with a pile of Taskmaster variants. You can chain them which is nice, though the mandatory gain is a bit rough, really making you think twice about going for Labours. You really don't want to flood your deck with Ruined Villages. The Debt option let's you get the +Actions next turn and keep the card out of your deck. Paying $1 every turn for an Action doesn't feel great? The flavor is okay, but I would consider making the gain optional and increasing the cost to $5. 

Archduke by segura
Cantrip Duchy gainer is something I've tried before and tested, and it's fun times--gaining Duchies nonterminally seems powerful, but it fattens your deck quicker than you realize. The Debt cost seems fair (I had priced a similar card without the on-gain at $6 which worked well). The on-gain is interesting, you Haunted Woods yourself which without virtual $, makes it challenging to pay off Debt this turn. I can't decide if I like this or not. It's a fine on-gain on its own and can create some interesting decisions, though I feel like it stomps on the core conceit of Debt--you get to pay for part of the card now and part of it later. Overall, I think it's a well designed card, though I wonder if a different ongain that interacts with the top effect (e.g. Marshland's on-gain) might work better.

Usurer by emtzalex
Overpay using Debt is a neat idea, sort of a twist on Stonemason where you don't need the cash up front, however not including a non-Victory card clause is terrifying. Consider removing Province gaining and then you can also likely keep to 1 Debt per $ on the overpay. Trashing anything other than Copper seems unlikely? Perhaps a simpler Moneylender variant would work here. 

Tinkerer by LTaco
A gain to hand Workshop that only works if you have Debt. Normally, you don't want to keep Debt across turns, but you're encouraged to do so here. The in games using this is the fascinating part and makes buying VP cards a way to help fuel your Tinkerers to gain other cards. My one concern is that buying out Debt Provinces gets too easy (having the last one basically be free is a problem), but it's something worth testing! It's a really creative idea and an interesting use of Debt that I've not seen before.

Royal Engineer by Udzu
An Event that basically let's you borrow to gain $5s, with an extra $1 in interest. Super simple and straightforward, though I would suggest adding a non-Victory clause. I worry a bit if 1% is too generous, perhaps 2% is a better base cost. Really solid entry though. 

Desperado by NoMoreFun
A Moat that becomes a Lost City if you have Debt. Like some of the other submissions that reward having Debt, this one will be really hard to activate without other Debt cards, since the only way to get Debt from this is to use it as a one-shot. Consider giving it a Debt cost to encourage keeping some Debt to activate after buying it. The one-shot is interesting, though losing the card and taking Debt seems like a pretty steep penalty. 



Honorable Mentions: Impoverished Village by JW, Expansive by grrgrrgrr, Archduke by segura

Runner Up: Royal Engineer by Uzdu

WINNER: Tinkerer by LTaco


Congrats to LTaco and thanks everyone for participating!
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #36 on: June 20, 2024, 03:20:54 am »
+5

Without virtual Coins? You play Treasure first and then buy a Debt-costed card (I could as well have used an on-buy trigger)! The point of it all is to make it harder to go for Archduke once you already have green in your deck.
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infangthief

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #37 on: June 20, 2024, 03:47:50 am »
+1

Nice judging 4est and thanks for the feedback.

Quote
The bottom grants choices already, so I think eliminating the choice at the top (and just going with a flat bonus) would be a bit cleaner.
Yes!
I wanted a bonus that helped with deck control (because once you've started playing Industrialists it's awful if you get a turn in which you don't draw them).
Then yesterday I realised that the uncomplicated deck control bonus is "You may trash a card from your hand". Not exactly a flat bonus, but often a no-brainer to clear out junk. It also helps you get rid of your other Industrialists once you judge it's time to come out of debt and start greening.

So, after the event:
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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #38 on: June 20, 2024, 07:29:57 am »
0

Without virtual Coins? You play Treasure first and then buy a Debt-costed card (I could as well have used an on-buy trigger)! The point of it all is to make it harder to go for Archduke once you already have green in your deck.

Whoops, yes you are correct! I was forgetting when the top decking would trigger. I guess what I'd add then is that my games testing a cantrip Duchy gainer, you rarely end up getting more than two anyway so the penalty may not really come up. Good design though and I stand by the rankings.
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LTaco

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #221: I Am Forever in Your Debt
« Reply #39 on: June 20, 2024, 06:27:31 pm »
0

Thank you for hosting this contest and for the the comments.
The new contest is now open.
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