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Author Topic: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot  (Read 4711 times)

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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #50 on: November 26, 2022, 08:15:43 am »
+1

I'm a little late on this, but here's a 24 hour warning to get your submissions in.
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X-tra

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #51 on: November 26, 2022, 03:22:20 pm »
+2

I don't know if the victory point is worth it being trashed on the first play. I feel like the effect should be more or the cost less.
The main perk is not the , but the trashing clause itself. Sometimes, you want to hit , but do not wish to keep the Silver that got you there. Recycled Goods is just that: A Silver that does not linger in your deck. And it's mostly better than keeping a subpar stop card.

Recycled Goods can copy Duchess’s “In games using this” wording. It also doesn’t need the Reaction type because the contents of the trash are common knowledge.
True that it could use Duchess' wording, but that would add a 4th line of text, shrinking the font. I think the current version is a good compromise between readability and ease of understanding. The only reason why it's blue is to draw attention to the fact that it can be gained from the trash. Same as Patron; that card is uselessly coloured in blue, yet it still is since Donald X. figured that players could benefit from the extra tell.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2022, 09:00:07 pm by X-tra »
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Erick648

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #52 on: November 26, 2022, 08:23:09 pm »
+2


Quote
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$3 Action
+5 Cards
Discard 4 cards.
You may trash this to play it again.
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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #53 on: November 27, 2022, 12:56:12 pm »
+4

Contest closed. I'll update this soon with the list of entries I have. Hoping to have judging completed by tomorrow evening.
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exfret

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #54 on: November 27, 2022, 07:31:39 pm »
0

I don't know if the victory point is worth it being trashed on the first play. I feel like the effect should be more or the cost less.
The main perk is not the , but the trashing clause itself. Sometimes, you want to hit , but do not wish to keep the Silver that got you there. Recycled Goods is just that: A Silver that does not linger in your deck. And it's mostly better than keeping a subpar stop card.

Recycled Goods can copy Duchess’s “In games using this” wording. It also doesn’t need the Reaction type because the contents of the trash are common knowledge.
True that it could use Duchess' wording, but that would add a 4th line of text, shrinking the font. I think the current version is a good compromise between readability and ease of understanding. The only reason why it's blue is to draw attention to the fact that it can be gained from the trash. Same as Patron; that card is uselessly coloured in blue, yet it still is since Donald X. figured that players could benefit from the extra tell.

Yeah, but the trashing is forced. Spending $3 to hit $5 once maybe isn't great. Stop cards aren't great either, but I feel like this is extending that line of thinking too far. There is a point you want a silver, and that point lasts longer than once during the third/fourth turn.
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Gubump

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #55 on: November 27, 2022, 10:03:59 pm »
0

I don't know if the victory point is worth it being trashed on the first play. I feel like the effect should be more or the cost less.
The main perk is not the , but the trashing clause itself. Sometimes, you want to hit , but do not wish to keep the Silver that got you there. Recycled Goods is just that: A Silver that does not linger in your deck. And it's mostly better than keeping a subpar stop card.

Recycled Goods can copy Duchess’s “In games using this” wording. It also doesn’t need the Reaction type because the contents of the trash are common knowledge.
True that it could use Duchess' wording, but that would add a 4th line of text, shrinking the font. I think the current version is a good compromise between readability and ease of understanding. The only reason why it's blue is to draw attention to the fact that it can be gained from the trash. Same as Patron; that card is uselessly coloured in blue, yet it still is since Donald X. figured that players could benefit from the extra tell.

Yeah, but the trashing is forced. Spending $3 to hit $5 once maybe isn't great. Stop cards aren't great either, but I feel like this is extending that line of thinking too far. There is a point you want a silver, and that point lasts longer than once during the third/fourth turn.

He's playtested it a fair bit, including with me, and it hasn't seemed underpowered so far. Keep in mind that the non-one-shot version is not only a , but a that you have to go through 5+ other cards to get to (I say "5+" because those 5 cards can potentially return themselves to the pile). And the Reaction amps it up a decent amount as well.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2022, 11:30:54 pm by Gubump »
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spheremonk

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #56 on: November 27, 2022, 11:42:45 pm »
+1

I’ve been participating in this contest for longer than most, and so far, I’ve never been banned. Here’s my best attempt at a red card:

*$%# all of you. My submission got 1 respect and Gubump’s non-substantive language changes to my submission got 6 respect. That’s nonsense.

(I leave it as an exercise for the reader to determine whether I'm joking.)
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #57 on: November 28, 2022, 02:12:21 am »
0

I don't know if the victory point is worth it being trashed on the first play. I feel like the effect should be more or the cost less.
The main perk is not the , but the trashing clause itself. Sometimes, you want to hit , but do not wish to keep the Silver that got you there. Recycled Goods is just that: A Silver that does not linger in your deck. And it's mostly better than keeping a subpar stop card.

Recycled Goods can copy Duchess’s “In games using this” wording. It also doesn’t need the Reaction type because the contents of the trash are common knowledge.
True that it could use Duchess' wording, but that would add a 4th line of text, shrinking the font. I think the current version is a good compromise between readability and ease of understanding. The only reason why it's blue is to draw attention to the fact that it can be gained from the trash. Same as Patron; that card is uselessly coloured in blue, yet it still is since Donald X. figured that players could benefit from the extra tell.

Yeah, but the trashing is forced. Spending $3 to hit $5 once maybe isn't great. Stop cards aren't great either, but I feel like this is extending that line of thinking too far. There is a point you want a silver, and that point lasts longer than once during the third/fourth turn.

He's playtested it a fair bit, including with me, and it hasn't seemed underpowered so far. Keep in mind that the non-one-shot version is not only a , but a that you have to go through 5+ other cards to get to (I say "5+" because those 5 cards can potentially return themselves to the pile). And the Reaction amps it up a decent amount as well.
I don't think that this power argument holds up well in a world in which Collection exists.

But I don't think that such considerations really matter that much. I am not a fan of Recycled Goods but the card does something novel in two respects: being a one-shot Silver and being a support card for an alt-VP strategy. That is pretty sweet.
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exfret

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #58 on: November 28, 2022, 03:15:38 am »
+1

I don't know if the victory point is worth it being trashed on the first play. I feel like the effect should be more or the cost less.
The main perk is not the , but the trashing clause itself. Sometimes, you want to hit , but do not wish to keep the Silver that got you there. Recycled Goods is just that: A Silver that does not linger in your deck. And it's mostly better than keeping a subpar stop card.

Recycled Goods can copy Duchess’s “In games using this” wording. It also doesn’t need the Reaction type because the contents of the trash are common knowledge.
True that it could use Duchess' wording, but that would add a 4th line of text, shrinking the font. I think the current version is a good compromise between readability and ease of understanding. The only reason why it's blue is to draw attention to the fact that it can be gained from the trash. Same as Patron; that card is uselessly coloured in blue, yet it still is since Donald X. figured that players could benefit from the extra tell.

Yeah, but the trashing is forced. Spending $3 to hit $5 once maybe isn't great. Stop cards aren't great either, but I feel like this is extending that line of thinking too far. There is a point you want a silver, and that point lasts longer than once during the third/fourth turn.

He's playtested it a fair bit, including with me, and it hasn't seemed underpowered so far. Keep in mind that the non-one-shot version is not only a , but a that you have to go through 5+ other cards to get to (I say "5+" because those 5 cards can potentially return themselves to the pile). And the Reaction amps it up a decent amount as well.

The reaction doesn't amp the actual card up, it just makes it so you have it in your deck more often... It doesn't provide any more reason to buy it.

As for it being a "5+" without the one shot, that doesn't really change my opinion much. You can't play it multiple times, that's a huge drawback. Not to mention your original argument was that it's strength came from it leaving your deck. I feel like that indicates a card is weak in the first place (and silver is fairly priced, so that's probably not what this is about, but your argument falls through nonetheless).
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X-tra

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #59 on: November 28, 2022, 09:23:22 am »
0

Yeah, but the trashing is forced. Spending $3 to hit $5 once maybe isn't great. Stop cards aren't great either, but I feel like this is extending that line of thinking too far. There is a point you want a silver, and that point lasts longer than once during the third/fourth turn.
Spending a (pseudo) one-shot to hit is not only fair, it's totally great. Feast existed for a reason, and it wasn't cut because of its power level - rather, because it was a boring card. Recycled Goods remedies the boring factor by adding a neat alt- scoring mode combined with player interactivity and giving more mileage out of Estates and Duchies. Pretty nifty.

The reaction doesn't amp the actual card up, it just makes it so you have it in your deck more often... It doesn't provide any more reason to buy it.
The reaction does amp up the card, otherwise it wouldn’t exist. It mostly amps up the excitedness of the card over the power level, but it sure allows you to set up to get more benefit from Duchy dancing. Duchy dancing happens fairly often, and if you played a Recycled Goods prior to gaining your first Duchy, then, playing that re-gained Recycled Goods, you’ll score 5 for , which is one point short of a Province for the same cost. The advantage being that you didn’t carry a dead weight Silver in your deck prior to that.

As for it being a "5+" without the one shot, that doesn't really change my opinion much. You can't play it multiple times, that's a huge drawback. Not to mention your original argument was that it's strength came from it leaving your deck. I feel like that indicates a card is weak in the first place (and silver is fairly priced, so that's probably not what this is about, but your argument falls through nonetheless).
Your idea that a card leaving your deck on its own being weak is pure nonsense. This would mean that all one-shot cards are de facto weak, not to mention Horses. There is a fallacy here.

Moreover, in game in which Recycled Goods appear, Silver will also be present 100% of the time. For the same cost, it is up to the player to determine if they prefer keeping subpar lingering economy from Silver, or if they prefer to cull the Silver altogether from their deck to see their more powerful cost cards appear more often. This could be the case in a game with no trashing, or in single-gain boards where the extra 1 (or more?) could matter, etc... It’s Dominion. The goal is to assess what works in a game, and what doesn’t. That’s the beauty of it. There are games in which a player will prefer to grab a Silver, and games in which they will prefer to grab a Recycled Goods. Data shows that the latter happens more often though, if that says anything.
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #60 on: November 28, 2022, 10:08:03 am »
0

As for it being a "5+" without the one shot, that doesn't really change my opinion much. You can't play it multiple times, that's a huge drawback. Not to mention your original argument was that it's strength came from it leaving your deck. I feel like that indicates a card is weak in the first place (and silver is fairly priced, so that's probably not what this is about, but your argument falls through nonetheless).
Your idea that a card leaving your deck on its own being weak is pure nonsense. This would mean that all one-shot cards are de facto weak, not to mention Horses. There is a fallacy here.
I suggest you tone it down a bit. Building some weird strawman to claim that someone critiquing your card is talking "pure nonsense" is pretty rude.

Also, of course a card being a one-shot means it's weaker than if it wasn't a one-shot, unless you're going to argue that Horses are in fact better than Laboratories.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #61 on: November 28, 2022, 10:23:44 am »
+2

I suggest you tone it down a bit. Building some weird strawman to claim that someone critiquing your card is talking "pure nonsense" is pretty rude.

Also, of course a card being a one-shot means it's weaker than if it wasn't a one-shot, unless you're going to argue that Horses are in fact better than Laboratories.
Sorry about the misusage of the word "nonsense," that was indeed unnecessary. I guess it's the "your argument falls through nonetheless" that ticked me off somewhat. Though in my defense, I believe I have argued correctly and sanely for the rest of what I had to say.

I do not like that you're assuming that I'm dismissing the criticism altogether. I spent a good amount of time entertaining an healthy back-and-forth with exfret, and I wouldn't have done so if I believed that debating here was unnecessary. I'm defending my piece, it's only natural. I have been prone before to modify and cull stuff that did not work at all following valid criticism; I'm not stranded in an echo chamber, this I promise.

And finally, since we're on the topic of strawmen, I don't know why you're putting words into my mouth with the Horse analogy. I never argued that such cards were better than their non self-trash (or self-return) counterparts. If we return to the topic at hand, here, we are in a situation where being a one-shot can be better than it not being so. They keyword "can" means that it's up to the player to evaluate whether it is the case in a given game. I think that's fair, no?
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #62 on: November 28, 2022, 06:49:20 pm »
0

I think you may have misunderstood exfret's point. You originally claimed that the self-trashing is advantageous because you don't want the card in your deck (for long). exfret is suggesting that if you don't want a card in your deck, then it's probably a weak card. It's not that all one-shot cards are weak, but rather if a card being one-shot makes it stronger, then it must have been a very weak card to begin with. (This argument doesn't quite work literally because of the VP which stays with you forever, but I think it's a reasonable approximation.)
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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #63 on: November 29, 2022, 12:56:31 am »
+9

Hey everybody, I'm about 2/3 of the way through the judging (there were a lot of cards this week!) and will need a bit more time to finish. Appreciate your patience, and check back for final results tomorrow!
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #64 on: November 29, 2022, 10:12:17 pm »
+8

WDC #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot

Commentary & Results


Appreciate y'all's patience. Thanks everyone for the submissions, I know one-shots are very tricky to design and price, so nice work everybody.

OPs are linked, shortlisted entries are bolded, enjoy!



Schrödinger's Cat by Builder_Roberts
A Moat that can also be a one-shot double Lab. $4 seems a bit pricey when compared to things like Encampment or Experiment. Of course, the below line is the most interesting part of the card, and while it's cool and there are a few mind-bending interactions out there, I'm struggling to see if it's really worth the extra FAQ and complexity when you could just swap out "You may trash this for" with "You may return to the Supply for" and essentially have the exact same card. I think a return to Supply version for $3 would be balanced.

(Untitled) by fika monster
Too much text for my taste, this one-shot will thin a card from your hand and then gain a card from the trash costing less than the combined cost of (untitled) and the card you trashed. I'll ignore the set-up part for a second, this is very weak when trashing the cards you usually want to trash. Trashing a Copper lets you gain a $2, and trashing an Estate lets you gain a $4. You have to trash at least a $3 cost to gain a $5, at least Dismantle nets you the Gold when trashing Estate. I would recommend allowing gaining a card up to the same, or perhaps adjusting the price of the card. The set-up adds way too much unnecessary complexity, adding stuff to the trash, reducing the size of all the piles (which especially messes with split piles), and fiddling with the endgame conditions.

Excavate by Augie279
A Treasure Map that you only need one of. I like the Cornucopia vibes here of checking for uniques in play, and this rewards building up a deck that can maximize the Excavate trash when you're ready for it. It's a bit reminiscent of the event Commerce, though this is usually a bit easier to activate. The only thing I don't care for is the Debt price, which feels a little out of place--honestly, I think a price of $6 or possibly even $5 would work okay here, though the Debt works I suppose.

Ocean Wave by BryGuy
A one-shot terminal draw that puts any non-Treasures from the top 6 cards into your hand, and offers an overpay option to gain a second one. There are a few wording adjustments needed ("Put the Treasures back in any order" and the using the new overpay language). This can provide a pretty nice big draw on a single play, and getting two of them for $4 isn't a bad deal, but the biggest problem is that you need both trashing and village support to really make it worth it. In games where you're missing one or both of these, Ocean Wave simply won't be helpful.

Sieve by majiponi
A cheap payload generator, I like this one a lot. You basically spend $2 to gain a Silver and a Gold, with an extra coin the turn you play it at the cost of an extra Copper. A solid opener, especially on a 5-2, and it actually works okay mid-game as well once your deck can better handle the stop cards. Solid entry, and love the simplicity.

Stash House by emtzalex
A Warehouse that can trash itself to be a handsize increaser instead of decreaser. I like where this is going, but without seeing the rest of your turn, it will be hard to know when trashing your Warehouse will really be worth it (similar to the Mining Village problem). Typically, you get sifters to help gain deck control when trashing or draw are slow or restricted. The one-shot effect can give you a few extra cards once, which maybe those extra two cards make a difference, but the bonus doesn't really help you do anything to eliminate the need for a Warehouse. At the very least, it could be a decent opener if there's a strong $3 you want to make sure you play on the first shuffle like Steward or something, and it can get out of the way once you don't need the sifting anymore. 

Deer Stalk by Ethan
A $5 Smithy that you can trash for VP depending on how many Victory cards are in your hand. I like the idea, and it reminds me of Wild Hunt (with a hint of Investment sprinkled in), however I don't think it compares very favorably to Wild Hunt. Especially if Deer Stalk is your only draw, you likely won't pop these until the very end of the game (sort of like you do with Mining Village) and the VP dump can be quite sudden (vs. Investment where you don't mind trashing these midgame once they've served their thinning purpose). Wild Hunt doesn't require you to trash your Smithy, and the player interaction also forces VP to be gained throughout the game instead of only on the last turn. 

Hero's Demise by Sumrex
An Encampment variant that trashes itself if you have 3 or more unused Actions. You essentially cannot play two Hero's Demises in a row without losing one, and I like that this forces players to play things in a certain order and keep a good number of terminals around to ensure they don't have to play two of these in a row, or just mindlessly play these as your only source of draw. I think it plays differently enough from Encampment to exist and trashing vs. return to the Supply makes losing them feel much more painful. Nice one!

Prospecting Town by JW
A Village that you can exchange for Golds if you have multiple copies of them in play. I don't care for the current multiples wording, but I get why it's there. It's a pretty neat idea, and I like that you can convert your Villages into payload later. There's possibly a way to make it so players could decide on the Gold exchange mid-turn for gain-and-play stuff, but I think this works well as is, and also avoids the issue Mining Village often has where you decide at the end of your turn once you've seen everything. 

Pawnshop by weretheruler
I was hoping someone would submit Bomb :). Pawnshop is either a one-shot Masquerade (without the passing) or a Moat with a gain from trash effect (it's not a one-shot if you choose that one, correct?). I think this is okay, $4 feels a bit expensive when compared to Masquerade, but you can always get a second one to gain the first one back. The gain-from-trash should probably have either a cost or non-VP card restriction.

Travelling Book Merchant by lompeluiten
First, that is a very long card name! Try mocking it up, it's a pretty tight squeeze to fit on the card :) This card reminds me a bit of Raze where you can trash a card from your hand or itself and get some draw. The self-trash option is a double Lab which makes it a bit like playing two Horses, quite good of course. The other option feels really bad though--Trade Route has taught us all that terminal, single card trashing is way too slow in most games. Compared to Raze, which at least is always non-terminal, and can draw a card sometimes when you trash Estates, I think making this always non-terminal (or at least giving some other bonus for the non-one-shot option) would be worth it to make this more than just a double Horse.

Crusader by czzzz
A one-shot Duration with a next-turn double-lab + village effect, which is quite strong, and comes with a half-Bonfire on purchase, yeeha. The +1 Action may be a little hard to track since you trash it, but it's maybe not too big a deal. This feels balanced at $4 and it's definitely worth opening since it thins and can help spike $5 on the second shuffle. Midgame, these can help keep your engine kick off until they run out. Nice one!

Bricks by nagdon
A big Remodel one-shot that can turn Estates into $5 (or $6s) and Coppers into $4 (including more Bricks). The Altar comparison is apt. Return to the Supply instead of trashing helps keep this relevant into the end game which is nice. It's a bit slow early game since you have to keep regaining them, to keep your remodeling going, but it seems fine. I do wonder if adding +1 Action would make it feel a bit more exciting and allow for gain and play stuff, though piledriving loops may be a little too easy then.

Mask Salesman by kru5h
Bonus points for the Ocarina of Time reference :). Mask Salesman is a cheap, one-shot Command card that lets you play a $5 card. Not a bad opener, especially when there's $5s like Sentry or Count which you'd like to play on the second shuffle but didn't get the 5-2 (or better yet, when you do). And then this allows spare buys and Workshop variants to gain one-shot $5 plays which can be a solid play throughout the midgame as well. The one change to potentially explore would be to see if the pile runs too quickly, and you could try a return to the Supply one-shot instead. Really like this one.

Study by xyz123
A big Library that trashes itself if you've already got one in play. It's simple which I like, but as others have pointed out, draw to 8 is often a Hunting Grounds or better on the first play, which is already quite strong ($4 was definitely way too cheap). Playing with only one of these gets around the one-shot restriction entirely. Getting Draw to X cards to work in most engines requires other parts, namely +Actions, and disappearing money, and I suppose on the rare board that has all of these, you might put up with the one-shots to get a few good turns in, but I worry it will be too much of a drawback for players to really commit to multiples and basically just play with one of them.

Morgue by NoMoreFun
Morgue is a $3 Hunting Grounds that disappears if you don't discard an Action card at the start of your Buy phase. Really glad you made the switch to discard vs. just reveal, which makes it much harder to keep multiples since you need a leftover Action card for each one you play. Obviously, $3 for +4 cards is quite good for a terminal draw, and even if you lose them, $3 isn't too bad to rebuy or gain with Workshops. It's not bad in money decks either since you can just get a lot of them and have them discard extra copies. This one also reminds me of Encampment, but it's usually a little easier to keep around since you don't have to discard until the end of the turn (vs. Encampment which requires you to reveal after each play). I like it!

Adorn by anordinaryman
It's a Night Improve that can work on things other than Actions. You can use it as a poor man's Monastery, and eventually trash it into a $5, but it can also do more exciting things by upgrading your cheaper Action cards into stronger ones. I don't love the Copper junking--like I get why it's there, but it feels like a really steep penalty, and takes away a bit of the fun of using this as a Feast when you're finished with it.

Burnt Offering by Xen3k
The wording is a bit confusing here, but if I understand correctly, this is a one-shot that turns itself into a Gold, and then trashes your hand, remodels each of the uniques, and gains you an extra Copper for each one. Okay. So there's a lot going on here. Trashing hand can be usually really powerful (see Count), but it's something that gets harder and harder to do as the game goes on. Burnt Offering mitigates this a bit with the Remodel thing since you can still trash your hand and regain a card you didn't really want to trash, or get a better one. What I don't understand though is the Copper gaining. Unless I'm missing something here, it seems like this pretty much hoses any benefit that trashing your hand would get. Say you open Burnt Offering and draw it turn three with 3 Coppers and an Estate. You'll gain a Gold, thin 3 Coppers, gain an Estate, gain a Copper, thin an Estate, gain a $4, gain a Copper. So you really only net thinning one Copper here, which doesn't feel great. The mass remodel thing is different and cool, but I think the Copper junking is too much. You could make it trash itself into a Gold and a Copper if you wanted to keep an element of it, but gaining a Copper for each unique just seems too weak.

Gunpowder by SignError
A Woodcutter that offers an optional one-shot for either a Chapel effect or a Militia attack. The trashing option is very good, and makes this a strong opener similar to Chapel or Steward or Count, but you get some economy out of it too. It's hard to see the Militia option really coming into play, since once you've thinned out your cards, there's not much need to buy this for anything other than the +Buy, and the discard attack doesn't feel like enough of a bonus (since it offers no additional benefit to you) to lose your Woodcutter over. Perhaps there could be another option instead like gaining a card, a more powerful attack (like Pillage), or something else that helps you and not just hurts your opponent.

Pupil by Gubump
One-shot Apprentice. Not bad for Estate trashing early I guess, and the below line lets you always open with it. It's weak for Copper trashing, and especially in games with limited trashing, I don't foresee there being enough of these left to really generate big draws from trashing Golds, etc. I think the below-line is fine? I can't think of any instances in which it matters that the card can have different costs simultaneously--like Peddler, it basically just means you can always buy/gain it for $2, but otherwise it costs $5.

Venture Capitalist/Seed Money by spheremonk
There's three cards here, but I'll let it slide, I guess? Venture Capitalist comes with the Heirloom Seed Funding, which is similar to Stockpile. VC can trash a Silver (or a Seed Funding) to gain a Financing which is a powerful one-shot trasher that gains back any trashed Seed Fundings. VC suffers from Urchin syndrome where you have to line it up with a target, which will make it very swingy of who gets their Financing first. Additionally, I don't like that Venture Capitalist cannot trash other things--why not let it trash a card from your hand and then if it's a Treasure that costs $1 or more (or whatever threshold you want) then it can one-shot? The Seed Funding messes with the opening like Cursed Gold, but it's a more automatic decision which isn't as interesting. Anyway, I think the combination of ideas has some potential, but it could use some streamlining. 

Swordsmith by exfret
Another $5 Smithy that lets you trash it to make it non-terminal. There will be games where you save these up for a big mega-turn at the end, but I think in most situations, blowing up your Smithy for just an extra Action is too hard of a sell. The below line is neat though, I'm surprised I've never seen that as an on-gain effect, but it's a nice way to make good use of a dead-drawn Action card.

Recycled Goods by X-tra
I remember this one, I think from another contest that I judged actually haha. Recycled Goods is a one-shot Plunder and you can often get them for free when gaining Duchies and Estates. It's not a bad opener, as it's does the Silver thing of helping you hit $5 (plus throws in a free VP) and then nicely gets out of the way. As I said last time, I don't know how often you'll go out of your way to pick up early Estates and Duchies for free ones, but I do really like that this helps someone trying to catch up with Duchies by providing free Silvers and extra VP. 

Infrastructure by arowdok
Wow, so I guess it's a one-shot Project! Didn't think it would be possible, So basically, Infrastructure is a Royal Carriage that you can use whenever you want, and don't need to wait to get onto your Tavern Mat. 5 Debt feels expensive for a single extra play, so I would recommend playing with the pricing and bonus a little more. Definitely an idea that's worth exploring though.

Maid by LTaco
A cheap Liaison like to Bauble. Similar to Infrastructure this lets you trash it to replay an action. This one does require you to line it up with an Action you want to replay, and as a one-shot it will be tricky to know when the right time is to replay it. At least they are easy to gain, which helps mitigate the issue a little bit, at least until they run out. 

Trailblazer by Erick648
A sort of terminal Forum that can one-shot to play again. Obviously this wants +Actions, though the sheer volume of cycling means it's probably decent in a money deck too. The one-shot just about guarantees you find the right hand of cards you need since you get to pick the best 5 of 15 cards. I like the simplicity, though my one suggestion would be to playtest and see if draw 5 discard 4 is too centralizing. 4 and 3 might work better at the $3 price point.



Honorable Mentions: Excavate by Augie279, Hero's Demise by Sumrex, Prospecting Town by JW, Crusader by czzzz, Morgue by NoMoreFun, Trailblazer by Erick648

Runner Up: Sieve by majiponi

WINNER: Mask Salesman by kru5h



Congrats to kru5h and thanks everyone for participating!
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sumrex

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #65 on: November 30, 2022, 03:44:51 am »
+1

Damn, I really thought I got this one :/ well, next time I guess
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X-tra

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #66 on: November 30, 2022, 08:57:56 am »
+1

Haha, oops! Totally forgot I already submited Recycled Goods before! And that, coincidentally, you were the one who judged it. Sorry about that, I should've verified before posting! Needless to say, good judging.  ;)

On the case of Pupil though:

I can't think of any instances in which it matters that the card can have different costs simultaneously--like Peddler, it basically just means you can always buy/gain it for $2, but otherwise it costs $5.

An advantage of the fluctuating cost means that you can acquire it cheaply and Pupil a Pupil for +5 Cards in a pinch. I can see it happening sometimes.
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BryGuy

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #67 on: November 30, 2022, 10:05:16 am »
+1

WDC #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot

Ocean Wave by BryGuy
A one-shot terminal draw that puts any non-Treasures from the top 6 cards into your hand, and offers an overpay option to gain a second one. There are a few wording adjustments needed ("Put the Treasures back in any order" and the using the new overpay language). This can provide a pretty nice big draw on a single play, and getting two of them for $4 isn't a bad deal, but the biggest problem is that you need both trashing and village support to really make it worth it. In games where you're missing one or both of these, Ocean Wave simply won't be helpful.

First i'd like to say, this is some of the best judging i have seen in the three months i have been here. Thank you for taking the time to critique each card.
Second if you advise word economy to be both better and worse, i'll only make it better. I believe adding "in any order" is unnecessary. If you are not directed, then it does not matter. I am also no fan of blindly following tradition.
Thirdly thank you for the overpay word advise. All of my cards are now improved.
Again, thank you for the judging.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2022, 10:23:23 am by BryGuy »
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kru5h

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #68 on: November 30, 2022, 10:43:49 am »
+4

Wow, my first win! Thank you.

New contest will be up shortly.

BryGuy

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #69 on: November 30, 2022, 01:25:23 pm »
+1

Wow, my first win! Thank you.

New contest will be up shortly.
With all the good cards you make - this being your first win is surprising.

kru5h

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #169: I Am Not Throwing Away My [One-]Shot
« Reply #70 on: November 30, 2022, 08:47:44 pm »
+1

Wow, my first win! Thank you.

New contest will be up shortly.
With all the good cards you make - this being your first win is surprising.

Thank you.

I'm good at making cards within my own constraints, but I don't often make the best cards under other people's constraints.

Also, I've been making cards for 6 years. I'm bound to have a few good ones. Donald X. has made 6x the good cards I have in the same amount of time, though.
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