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Author Topic: Codename Select  (Read 16236 times)

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EFHW

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #200 on: March 01, 2022, 08:16:22 am »

A similar thing happened with the turn 9 challenge.

My clue 8 ("Blow") was intended to select WHALE, reject PUMPKIN (I thought those were EFHW's two "Edible" words) and propose BUBBLE and KICK.
Then on turn 9, Swowl guessed BUBBLE, so I had to rethink and try to see things from Swowl's perspective.

To be honest I was totally at sea with the "Sightseer" clue. Like I was sure "Sightseer" + "Flame" had to be OLYMPUS, but EFHW guessed POINT which is why I challenged the "Flame" clue. Maybe I need to go and do more sightseeing.
You k now how there are points along a scenic route where you look at the vista?
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EFHW

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #201 on: March 01, 2022, 08:18:32 am »

A similar thing happened with the turn 9 challenge.

My clue 8 ("Blow") was intended to select WHALE, reject PUMPKIN (I thought those were EFHW's two "Edible" words) and propose BUBBLE and KICK.
Then on turn 9, Swowl guessed BUBBLE, so I had to rethink and try to see things from Swowl's perspective.

To be honest I was totally at sea with the "Sightseer" clue. Like I was sure "Sightseer" + "Flame" had to be OLYMPUS, but EFHW guessed POINT which is why I challenged the "Flame" clue. Maybe I need to go and do more sightseeing.
You k now how there are points along a scenic route where you look at the vista?
Point was a stretch for flame, but I thought of flaming point, like boiling or freezing. Was point hinted at by flame?
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #202 on: March 01, 2022, 08:20:12 am »

Flame was meant to be for Ash and Olympus, originally. But I changed my "intent" to match EFHW's guess.

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EFHW

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #203 on: March 01, 2022, 08:21:28 am »

I also thought bench for sightseer.

I saw ash and Olympus, but what was the third word?
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #204 on: March 01, 2022, 08:21:40 am »

Did anyone else get screwed up by thinking about glass blowers? I think I was connecting blow with jeweler and flame and then once I got thinking about glass blowers I was still thinking about them and it made me connect jeweler with sightseer (because they're like a big tourist thing in Venice). It's like I forgot to clear my internal cache of word associations.
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #205 on: March 01, 2022, 08:22:16 am »

Probably Jeweler (see above)
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EFHW

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #206 on: March 01, 2022, 08:29:53 am »

Here's what was behind my turns. Turn 7, edible selected sugar, rejected jeweler, and clued whale and pumpkin. Turn 11 sports selected Olympus, rejected ash, and clued bowl and kick.
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #207 on: March 01, 2022, 08:35:39 am »

Here's what was behind my turns. Turn 7, edible selected sugar, rejected jeweler, and clued whale and pumpkin. Turn 11 sports selected Olympus, rejected ash, and clued bowl and kick.
Cool. I was right about Whale and Pumpkin then.
I thought the "grains" word you were rejecting was Bench (like the grain of the wood).
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #208 on: March 01, 2022, 08:36:02 am »

I think it would be less messy (but also slower) if we required a 24-hour challenge period after each clue and disallowed retroactive challenges.

The whole mind game where you have to decide whether to say what you really clued in a challenge or make it line up with the guess seems like really bad game design to me, especially when you consider what it looks like to max points. It gives the cluer the power (assuming they can coordinate with the other challengee) to screw over their guesser even if their guesser guessed completely right, simply because the guesser is ahead on points.

I think the spirit of the game, as well as simplicity, would be better served if someone simply posted their guess and clue and then there were 24 hours for challenges, in which someone could challenge the clue. Then after that time expired the clue would be assumed to be consistent and anyone could make a guess. Or something. Do you all hear what I mean?
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #209 on: March 01, 2022, 08:49:01 am »

I think it would be less messy (but also slower) if we required a 24-hour challenge period after each clue and disallowed retroactive challenges.

The whole mind game where you have to decide whether to say what you really clued in a challenge or make it line up with the guess seems like really bad game design to me, especially when you consider what it looks like to max points. It gives the cluer the power (assuming they can coordinate with the other challengee) to screw over their guesser even if their guesser guessed completely right, simply because the guesser is ahead on points.

I think the spirit of the game, as well as simplicity, would be better served if someone simply posted their guess and clue and then there were 24 hours for challenges, in which someone could challenge the clue. Then after that time expired the clue would be assumed to be consistent and anyone could make a guess. Or something. Do you all hear what I mean?

Ok, yes, possibly.

But can the guesser be held to account at all then, or can they just guess any random grid-word they like?

Quote
It gives the cluer the power (assuming they can coordinate with the other challengee) to screw over their guesser even if their guesser guessed completely right, simply because the guesser is ahead on points.
Hmm, I suppose that is possible. I mean, I'm assuming there is no external coordination going on, so on the face of it how can they come up with some other word that they're going to agree on?
But I suppose it is possible that the standard "correct play" would be for challengees to swap their selected/rejected words over, and that would be bad.
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #210 on: March 01, 2022, 08:50:39 am »

Maybe people could choose to challenge either guesses or clues? And if you challenge a guess, the guess has to line up with the cluer's intent.
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #211 on: March 01, 2022, 08:53:05 am »

You could also just make an unenforceable good faith rule that people should express their original intent when responding to a challenge. You could even make it enforceable by requiring everyone to post their intentions, encrypted, when they post a clue and then provide the key in the event of a challenge. Then we're definitely sacrificing user friendliness though. Though the game isn't exactly approachable right now.
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #212 on: March 01, 2022, 08:53:26 am »

Maybe people could choose to challenge either guesses or clues? And if you challenge a guess, the guess has to line up with the cluer's intent.
But then the cluer can just say that their intent was something different, if they want the guesser to lose points.
Or that their intent happens to match the guess, if they want the challenger to lose points.
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jotheonah

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #213 on: March 01, 2022, 08:54:41 am »

Maybe people could choose to challenge either guesses or clues? And if you challenge a guess, the guess has to line up with the cluer's intent.
But then the cluer can just say that their intent was something different, if they want the guesser to lose points.
Or that their intent happens to match the guess, if they want the challenger to lose points.

True, that's worse.
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #214 on: March 01, 2022, 08:55:31 am »

You could also just make an unenforceable good faith rule that people should express their original intent when responding to a challenge. You could even make it enforceable by requiring everyone to post their intentions, encrypted, when they post a clue and then provide the key in the event of a challenge. Then we're definitely sacrificing user friendliness though. Though the game isn't exactly approachable right now.
Yes. A good-faith rule might help. But still there's the problem of a clue just being (unintentionally) weak. If my clue isn't very good and someone guesses it "wrong" - is that the guessers fault or is it my fault?
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #215 on: March 01, 2022, 09:34:28 am »

Maybe you could just have 24-hours for challenges, after which the player just announces what their selected word was. Would still need to be good-faith required I think.

Or even just have a mod who just challenges every clue and doesn't gain or lose points. You give a clue then you PM the mod with that your clue means. Everything is simple then.
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #216 on: March 02, 2022, 04:16:24 am »

Turn 4:
Guess: UNIVERSITY
Clue: DOMINION

Turn 5:
Guess: Blacksmith
Clue: Flour


That "Dominion" clue was 2 weeks ahead of its time.
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infangthief

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #217 on: March 04, 2022, 10:35:00 am »

So... as it stands this game seems too complicated. And also not very balanced - some turns are easy and some are hard.

Would you be up for trying a simpler co-operative version?

3 (or more) players, fixed turn order, no challenges, no scoring. Then at the end we post our interpretations and see how closely it matches up. Maybe we can come up with a team score based on the closeness of interpretations at the end.

That should exercise the main principle of the game, but without the complexity and competitiveness that comes from challenges.
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Swowl

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #218 on: March 04, 2022, 11:22:05 pm »

interesting...
so scoring would happen in sort of a non-chronological order and more based on pure correctness of interpretation.

I would be down to test run that to try to better the game.
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EFHW

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Re: Codename Select
« Reply #219 on: March 05, 2022, 07:50:27 am »

I'm in
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