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Author Topic: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 5)  (Read 192677 times)

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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Signups)
« Reply #500 on: September 17, 2021, 09:41:38 am »

Let's just look at the wagons:

iguanaiguana (1):
EFHW (2): WestCoastDidds, MiX
Jimmmmm (4): jotheonah, faust, mathdude, EFHW
faust (2): Jimmmmm
mathdude (3): 2.71828....., iguanaiguana, gkrieg13
MiX (1): LaLight

Not Voting (1): Swowl

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to exile. Day 1 ends September 18, 2021, 03:00:00 pm

So there's 4 viable wagons: EFHW, Jimmmmm, math and MiX. Out of these, EFHW is the only one that can be scum. There, I said it. I'll just reread all of them anyway.

The people under the radar have either been on VLA or are actually townie (or both, see: Didds) so we can let them slide for today. faust is town so let's not do that, besides it's never correct to exile them D1. And I kinda agree with e that joth should get a D1 pass, but it's mostly because I can't see scum!joth flipping today.
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Jimmmmm

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Signups)
« Reply #501 on: September 17, 2021, 09:43:50 am »

I can't see scum!joth flipping today.

Do you mean this if joth is scum you can't see him being exiled Today?
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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Signups)
« Reply #502 on: September 17, 2021, 09:44:11 am »

I can't see scum!joth flipping today.

Do you mean this if joth is scum you can't see him being exiled Today?

Yes.
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Jimmmmm

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Signups)
« Reply #503 on: September 17, 2021, 09:44:33 am »

I can't see scum!joth flipping today.

Do you mean that if joth is scum you can't see him being exiled Today?

EBWOP
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #504 on: September 17, 2021, 09:44:45 am »

Jimmmm, can you go read EFHW and see what you think? I need some fresh eyes and you have time on your hands.

MiX, how are you feeling about Joth?
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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #505 on: September 17, 2021, 09:46:00 am »

Jimmmm, can you go read EFHW and see what you think? I need some fresh eyes and you have time on your hands.

MiX, how are you feeling about Joth?

Null IIRC, but honestly I forgot.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #506 on: September 17, 2021, 09:46:43 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.
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Jimmmmm

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #507 on: September 17, 2021, 09:47:30 am »

Jimmmm, can you go read EFHW and see what you think? I need some fresh eyes and you have time on your hands.

I kind of did, at least regarding the defensiveness case. I'm make sure to look at her tomorrow. (As always, annoying that it's bedtime just as activity is picking up.)
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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #508 on: September 17, 2021, 09:49:48 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.

In fact, Vote: faust. Scum or anti-Town, you don't get a free pass just because you want one.
@Jimmmmm, at what point did you start feeling angry at faust?

@faust, same question re: Jimmmmm.

I'm scumreading the hell out of this post: it serves no purpose and simply extends a discussion that isn't productive. It sounds like the perfect post for scum!EFHW to do if both faust and Jimmmmm are town (which I think they are).

And I'm also sheeping you.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #509 on: September 17, 2021, 09:50:13 am »

Who else were the current wagons? Oh, math. HmmmÖ. I havenít carefully considered Math.

The case there was he was all meta and not moving the game forward?

Iím not sure that is worse than the other under the radars who are not moving the game forward. Is it worse to be trying to engage than just not around?
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jotheonah

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #510 on: September 17, 2021, 09:54:18 am »

vote:  EFHW
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #511 on: September 17, 2021, 09:56:48 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.

In fact, Vote: faust. Scum or anti-Town, you don't get a free pass just because you want one.
@Jimmmmm, at what point did you start feeling angry at faust?

@faust, same question re: Jimmmmm.

I'm scumreading the hell out of this post: it serves no purpose and simply extends a discussion that isn't productive. It sounds like the perfect post for scum!EFHW to do if both faust and Jimmmmm are town (which I think they are).

And I'm also sheeping you.

I think if the criteria is not moving the game forward (what faust said math was doing), she meets it. If the criteria is not scumhunting, I think she meets that, too. She has asked very few questions and some of them kept us spinning, like the way is faust mad at Jimís no vice versa questions. Iguana indicated in regard to the defensiveness line, that she ha been playing defense meaning that she is only responding to people and not advancing things on her own. So, while there is nothing scummy, I donít see anything towny.

BUT, as she point out, I have a hard time letting her start with a blank slate, largely because when she is scum, I am town or 3p, alive at the end, and then she wins. So, Iíve got a chip on my shoulder.

I donít want to be pubby! Convinced of my own rightness even when itís wrong and not helpful as a result. So, if someone really thinks sheís town, tell me why.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #512 on: September 17, 2021, 09:59:10 am »

A million typos. Sorry! On my phone at the doctors office.

faust, besides MiX, who is on your scummy list?
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #513 on: September 17, 2021, 10:00:54 am »

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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #514 on: September 17, 2021, 10:12:32 am »

vote:  EFHW

Oh, this is a scumslip from joth.

I wonder if scum!joth's still this obvious...
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faust

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #515 on: September 17, 2021, 10:25:00 am »

faust, besides MiX, who is on your scummy list?
Why do you want to know?
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EFHW

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #516 on: September 17, 2021, 11:16:23 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.

In fact, Vote: faust. Scum or anti-Town, you don't get a free pass just because you want one.
@Jimmmmm, at what point did you start feeling angry at faust?

@faust, same question re: Jimmmmm.

I'm scumreading the hell out of this post: it serves no purpose and simply extends a discussion that isn't productive. It sounds like the perfect post for scum!EFHW to do if both faust and Jimmmmm are town (which I think they are).

And I'm also sheeping you.

But you're wrong. Imagine you are trying to figure out if two arguers are being genuine in their postings of high emotion. It helps a lot to know what set them off. faust got mad when Jimmmmm unfairly accused him of going down a rabbit hole. Ok. Jimmmmm said he wasn't really angry, he was "leaning into the argument." I think that's scummy.

Jimmmmm could do all of this recently towny stuff as scum with his eyes closed and one hand tied behind his back.
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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #517 on: September 17, 2021, 11:18:38 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.

In fact, Vote: faust. Scum or anti-Town, you don't get a free pass just because you want one.
@Jimmmmm, at what point did you start feeling angry at faust?

@faust, same question re: Jimmmmm.

I'm scumreading the hell out of this post: it serves no purpose and simply extends a discussion that isn't productive. It sounds like the perfect post for scum!EFHW to do if both faust and Jimmmmm are town (which I think they are).

And I'm also sheeping you.

Couldn't you had read that before? Was the question really necessary?

But you're wrong. Imagine you are trying to figure out if two arguers are being genuine in their postings of high emotion. It helps a lot to know what set them off. faust got mad when Jimmmmm unfairly accused him of going down a rabbit hole. Ok. Jimmmmm said he wasn't really angry, he was "leaning into the argument." I think that's scummy.

Jimmmmm could do all of this recently towny stuff as scum with his eyes closed and one hand tied behind his back.
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MiX

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #518 on: September 17, 2021, 11:19:27 am »

Sorry, got PPEd thereÖ.

MiXÖ. Whatís your sense on EFHW? I really donít want to be stubborn, but I donít think jimmm or faust are scum. And Iím just not sure about Joth.

In fact, Vote: faust. Scum or anti-Town, you don't get a free pass just because you want one.
@Jimmmmm, at what point did you start feeling angry at faust?

@faust, same question re: Jimmmmm.

I'm scumreading the hell out of this post: it serves no purpose and simply extends a discussion that isn't productive. It sounds like the perfect post for scum!EFHW to do if both faust and Jimmmmm are town (which I think they are).

And I'm also sheeping you.

But you're wrong. Imagine you are trying to figure out if two arguers are being genuine in their postings of high emotion. It helps a lot to know what set them off. faust got mad when Jimmmmm unfairly accused him of going down a rabbit hole. Ok. Jimmmmm said he wasn't really angry, he was "leaning into the argument." I think that's scummy.

Jimmmmm could do all of this recently towny stuff as scum with his eyes closed and one hand tied behind his back.

Couldn't you had read that before? Was the question really necessary?

EBWOP
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iguanaiguana

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #519 on: September 17, 2021, 12:44:27 pm »


I feel like I should clarify some of this.

The joth vote was a tiny scum ping which was big enough to warrant a first vote. You could call it semi-RVS.

#158 was really less about scumhunting and more about trying to engage with the game and not knowing how to. The main thing I want out of a Day 1 is to keep up and be engaged in discussions. "[player] is [alignmenty] for [reasons]" is far more helpful to that end than simply "[player] is [alignment]". It's also worth noting that I was not talking about voting without reason, rather making statements with some degree of apparent certainty.

The vote on EFHW was a "reward" for WCD giving reasons for a read. I did not consider the state of wagons at the time.

PPE

I'm gonna back us up a million years and point this post out. I thought it was townie. I basically was trying to articulate a town read on Jim and he rejected my townread as a misreading of his posts. If you are scum, I think you take the free town points when you are under pressure.

At the time, I was going to share this as a reason to think that Jim was town. Then, e pointed out if Jim is the towniest, we should look on wagon for scum and went for Mathdude. That's why I ended up there. Then Jim did a million things, and some of them were scummy as hell TBH and recently he's been hella towny again and I'm starting to lose track.

But the fact remains that this was a townie post and it was produced not before any pressure was on him but at least before tons and tons of people were starting to say he was the best exile and so I think it has more weight to it than posts he was making specifically knowing that he was fighting for his life.
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Point iguana. Not that points really matter with a result, but still.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.

EFHW

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #520 on: September 17, 2021, 12:52:15 pm »

Couldn't you had read that before? Was the question really necessary?

I didn't know either thing before I asked. I'm sorry there were more argument posts, but there weren't THAT many, and I know I gained some insight from it. What do you see as the problem?
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iguanaiguana

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #521 on: September 17, 2021, 12:59:07 pm »

As for Math himself, that is a tough one to read.

Last game Math was town, and I didn't share this but I read almost everything Math said as scum. I also noticed in the speccy at the end, where MiX and Galz had solved most of the game, they continually thought Math was the last scum with EFHW/faust instead of Dylan up onto the innocent result on him. And I remember also that outside of Dwarves mafia and Oz mafia he has been exiled D1 a lot, correctly and incorrectly, or something like that.

But there was one post last game that really made me think Math was town and so I just ignored the other scummy stuff. I'm gonna quote the relevant part:

So this is mostly to say I'm starting to become aware of my biases in trying to read people.

So here it is not just what he said but the way he said it that is just so townie a new player couldn't make that stuff up. "I'm starting to become aware." He's right there in the thread... realizing that he OMGUS voted me for no good reason and starting to become aware of his biases. Well... scum isn't starting to become aware of anything... they already know most things. So based on that one sentence I had a townread on Math.

This game... there is not that one sentence. There's actually a similar sentence.

-snip
 I believe I have fallen victim to this many times. When I start finding someone scummy, I often find it very hard to look at them objectively again. I just find more things that I think are scummy. And it gets worse if I start digging in and posting reasons for my scum read on them.
-snip

But this time, Math is talking about it as a hypothetical. Last game he was "starting to become aware" of his biases in the present tense. This game he's talking about it as a hypothetical... something he's seen many times but its not happening now.

Okay... so I'm realizing now as I type this all out that I've become incredibly fixated on a single sentence from a previous game that I used as my be-all-end-all to read a player who to be honest I sometimes find confounding and even aggravating.

But... as a whole... I think the argument still stands that Math is scummy because there is a lack of any kind of town-slip type post like he had in Oz. 

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Point iguana. Not that points really matter with a result, but still.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.

iguanaiguana

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #522 on: September 17, 2021, 01:00:42 pm »

Couldn't you had read that before? Was the question really necessary?

I didn't know either thing before I asked. I'm sorry there were more argument posts, but there weren't THAT many, and I know I gained some insight from it. What do you see as the problem?

Lol, every night when I go to bed while being extremely busy IRL, I wake up to find 3-4 more pages of mafia I have to read to be caught up, and 80% of it is faust vs. Jim. There are THAT many IMO
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Point iguana. Not that points really matter with a result, but still.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.

WestCoastDidds

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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #523 on: September 17, 2021, 01:08:45 pm »

faust, besides MiX, who is on your scummy list?
Why do you want to know?

Because I have you in my leaning town category, and Iíd like to be able to either move you up or down. I think MiX is town, so that increases your scum likelihood. But itís MiX, so itís hard to know. I think Jimmmm is town, but I think you do, too, now. Do we agree on anyone else?
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Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #524 on: September 17, 2021, 01:29:33 pm »

So EFHW. EFHW started out scummy and then there were some posts that made me question it. This one is important I think.

I might go back to Jimmmmm. I am feeling uncomfortable ever since joth got involved.

This is exactly the opposite of what I'm trying to accomplish.

Of course. Your arguments are not very strong though, because Jimmmmm is an experienced player and OMGUS and policy voting are newbie reactions. This makes me concerned that you are scum trying to misexile him.

I'm talking at cross-purposes with myself here, however. I actually do think Jimmmmm is scummy  -- because I think I see careful maneuvering that an experienced player who hasn't played for a bit might try. Pick a fight, be righteous about how town should play, buddy someone who voted you (me), and seem to move on with a level head.

vote: Jimmmmm

"I think I see careful maneuvering." To me, this about face on Jim of going from "Let's not restrict ourselves to faust and Jim" and then back to Jim again but for what look like very authentic reasons is a townie looking post. It was also one of the better arguments that Jim could be scum. So when I was reading along it was here that I was thinking, maybe Jim is actually doing this big scum show.

That being said, now I am thinking Jim is town again... so I am back to EFHW is tunneling and pushing an exile I don't feel good about. Last game I thought I had her as scum... and then she convinced me with a pretty nice case on pubby (who I thought was scum but he was town). So I know she can make a strong argument for a townie being scum as scum.

I also agree with MiX that her posts kind of egging on faust and Jim could be a scum thing. She has the town defense of really wanting to know, which she just now articulated, but as scum I think fanning those flames could be a legitimate tactic in order to distract. I also thought her most recent post saying that she didn't extend the discussion that much was kind of disingenous. Besides... the result has nothing to do really with the attempt.

So... bleh... I'm kind of all over the place with EFHW right now.
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Point iguana. Not that points really matter with a result, but still.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.
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