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[WestCoastDidds]

It should however be generally understood that a refusal to cooperate with town is ... well, bad, and doing so out of spite or some kind of vague fear is anti-town. Didds has basically refused to engage with me all game.

Huh? How have I refused to engage with you? I thought we had an interesting exchange about PINL.

I am not refusing to cooperate with town at all.  A full claim of my role would not be beneficial for us, and as far as the qt those folks should get to say who they are.  I don't see that outing them as 7 dwarves helps town, although I could be convinced otherwise.

You refused to answer my initial question, and refused further calls to claiming. You also haven't meaningfully addressed my question of why you thought there was scum on your wagon.

Your initial question felt like fishing to me, and I said as much. It felt like you were targeting me in a way that plays on my known problem of saying too much too soon.

The further calls to claiming have not been universal. It feels like you and Fang want to know, and other people are like "don't do it".  I think Fang is especially scummy in those requests. I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us, but as I've said, I can be convinced. It seems like scum, knowing there is a 7D neighborhood can't effectively claim one of those anyway. Additionally, since our names seem to have some tie to our roles it might not be beneficial for town to know.

I thought there was scum on my wagon because it built quickly and it wasn't made of anything.  It began with pubby's QED, and then was followed by votes without reason. And then Jimmmm's inexplicable "bad logic, vote WCD" post. In my experience, when a wagon gets to 5, there is scum on it. And since I know I am town, I am even more sure of that.  As you and others have pointed out, I obviously cannot be certain of the fact, but I can be sure of my feelings which is what I meant when I said 100%. I 100% feel like there is scum there.

[WestCoastDidds]

The scola/Joth meet up needs to happen sooner rather than later.  You all actually live close to one another.
But yes, I am available for any and all f.ds Live events, as evidenced by my travels with Space! 

[Awaclus]

The further calls to claiming have not been universal. It feels like you and Fang want to know, and other people are like "don't do it".  I think Fang is especially scummy in those requests. I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us, but as I've said, I can be convinced. It seems like scum, knowing there is a 7D neighborhood can't effectively claim one of those anyway. Additionally, since our names seem to have some tie to our roles it might not be beneficial for town to know.

It is likely that scum has someone in the neighborhood, in which case they already know and it's just town that doesn't.

[WestCoastDidds]

The further calls to claiming have not been universal. It feels like you and Fang want to know, and other people are like "don't do it".  I think Fang is especially scummy in those requests. I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us, but as I've said, I can be convinced. It seems like scum, knowing there is a 7D neighborhood can't effectively claim one of those anyway. Additionally, since our names seem to have some tie to our roles it might not be beneficial for town to know.

It is likely that scum has someone in the neighborhood, in which case they already know and it's just town that doesn't.

Which is a reason to tell you who is i the neighborhood, but faust wants to know which dwarf names...

[faust]

The further calls to claiming have not been universal. It feels like you and Fang want to know, and other people are like "don't do it".  I think Fang is especially scummy in those requests. I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us, but as I've said, I can be convinced. It seems like scum, knowing there is a 7D neighborhood can't effectively claim one of those anyway. Additionally, since our names seem to have some tie to our roles it might not be beneficial for town to know.

It is likely that scum has someone in the neighborhood, in which case they already know and it's just town that doesn't.

Which is a reason to tell you who is i the neighborhood, but faust wants to know which dwarf names...

I am not following your argument.

[scolapasta]

The further calls to claiming have not been universal. It feels like you and Fang want to know, and other people are like "don't do it".  I think Fang is especially scummy in those requests. I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us, but as I've said, I can be convinced. It seems like scum, knowing there is a 7D neighborhood can't effectively claim one of those anyway. Additionally, since our names seem to have some tie to our roles it might not be beneficial for town to know.

It is likely that scum has someone in the neighborhood, in which case they already know and it's just town that doesn't.

Which is a reason to tell you who is i the neighborhood, but faust wants to know which dwarf names...

If we knew for certain scum with in the neighborhood, then revealing both would make sense. If we don't know, then I'm not sure which, if either it makes sense.

Especially being a bastard game - means that alignment might not have been doled at randomly.

[WestCoastDidds]

Awaclus wants to know what people are in the neighborhood.

faust wants to know the names of the dwarves in the neighborhood.

I am way more comfortable sharing the people than their drawf names.

[infangthief]

If MiX were playing, he'd be annoyed that I shared my name, but also know it made me town

That your name made you town, or sharing your name made you town?

[faust]

drawf names.

HA!

[mathdude]

@Jimmmmm, were you following along anyway and then decided to post because you read mathdude's prod request?

Nope. If I'm not posting it means I'm not following along.

Happy with a WCD lynch. Unvote

Admitting to not following along (since there have been some very extensive times without Jimmmm posts).  That's something scum can do when the wagon is in the wrong spot.  That's not helping town by not being around.

Okay pubby's probably a better exile than Didds. PINL. Vote: pubby

Deadline's in the morning for me. I normally sleep in past then, so I should be around for it if the Day's still going.

Why is pubby a better exile?  A "reason" like this is just as helpful as not giving a reason at all.

Jimmmmm is not participating much.  He isn't offering anything useful even when he does show up.  I think he's quite possibly scum.  And even if he is town, he's not helping us and not giving us anything to help town-read him later.

Vote: Jimmmmm

Jimmmmm has still not been prodded. He's just too fast for me. Keep trying though, we'll get him some time.

Can you please clarify prodding rules for us (with PINL)?  EFHW posted between prod request and vote count, yet was still prodded.  Jimmmmm posted between prod request (both times), and that seems to be the reason he hasn't been prodded.  I'm confused.

I'm serious, definitely not playing and already modkilled even if he were: MiX

I still don't fully believe it!

The setup will be mostly closed, but will probably disclose some things. PINL (Promise I'm Not Lying) rules will apply -- if and only if I write "PINL" before or after messaging, you know you can trust it.

I don't believe there has been any PINL on any vote count, and definitely not on any post about MiX being part of the game (or not) or about their being modkilled.  So I'm not sure what to trust at this point.

[Awaclus]

Awaclus wants to know what people are in the neighborhood.

faust wants to know the names of the dwarves in the neighborhood.

I am way more comfortable sharing the people than their drawf names.

I might have communicated unclearly, but I agree with faust. Having a better idea what kinds of roles are present in the game helps both town and scum, because it means everyone can plan their actions better. Currently, it is more likely than not that scum already has that information and town doesn't, which is why it's beneficial to reveal it.

Having a better idea who has those roles, as far as I can tell, is only a negligible benefit to town, whereas it is a considerable benefit to scum. Even though most likely revealing it would just negligibly benefit town because scum already knows, the benefit to town doesn't seem important enough to justify taking the risk.

[faust]

Why is pubby a better exile?  A "reason" like this is just as helpful as not giving a reason at all.

Jimmmmm is not participating much.  He isn't offering anything useful even when he does show up.  I think he's quite possibly scum.  And even if he is town, he's not helping us and not giving us anything to help town-read him later.

Vote: Jimmmmm

Why do you question a pubby exile, who has done even less than Jimmmmm, and then proceed to call for a lurker exile of Jimmmmmm?

[WestCoastDidds]

drawf names.

HA!

Right?

[pubby]

Partially why I voted Didds is because of a comment she made very early and very unprompted:

I am the most obvious dwarf, or maybe second most obvious dwarf had I been thinking about it more.

It didn't seem beneficial or logical for a town member to unnecessarily hint at their role. It seemed like something scum would do to convince others they're one of the good guys. And then she goes and says:

I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us

Then why did she share initially?

So I'm still pleased with my vote on Didds, but I'll post shortly with some more thoughts.

[WestCoastDidds]

Awaclus wants to know what people are in the neighborhood.

faust wants to know the names of the dwarves in the neighborhood.

I am way more comfortable sharing the people than their drawf names.

I might have communicated unclearly, but I agree with faust. Having a better idea what kinds of roles are present in the game helps both town and scum, because it means everyone can plan their actions better. Currently, it is more likely than not that scum already has that information and town doesn't, which is why it's beneficial to reveal it.

Having a better idea who has those roles, as far as I can tell, is only a negligible benefit to town, whereas it is a considerable benefit to scum. Even though most likely revealing it would just negligibly benefit town because scum already knows, the benefit to town doesn't seem important enough to justify taking the risk.

Ah, I see.  Yes, I was confused.

Scola, as someone who says maybe don't tell.... what do you think? Reveal which dwarves are in the game?

[WestCoastDidds]

No, it wasn't unprompted. It was a response.  Here is the full quote

Still waiting on infangthief and EFHW to chime in, but considering some of us know each other pretty well, maybe we could discuss what characters we think others picked.

Like I know pubby, so I might have a theory or two about who he picked.

Ohhhhhh...... I like it!

Most of the gamer dudes are going to have picked obscure dwarves I’ve never heard of. My not gamer friendlies will have chosen Disney dwarves or other popular culture ones like LoTR and whatnot.

I am the most obvious dwarf, or maybe second most obvious dwarf had I been thinking about it more.

[WestCoastDidds]

I am not sure how sharing the seven dwarf names helps us

Then why did she share initially?

Share my name? Because I don't think we should exile protective folks.

[Awaclus]

I'm still pleased with my vote on pubby.

[jotheonah]

IIRC, I prodded EFHW before she posted, I just didn't mention the prod until after she had posted. With Jimmmmm, he always gets a post in before I get a chance to prod him. It doesn't matter, prods don't suddenly have hidden mechanical depths, PINL. Although, great idea for future bastard games.

[infangthief]

Pubby is definitely an option.

But not as good an option as Diddzria.

vote: Galzria

@Awaclus did Didds do anything that you found towny?
@Jimmmmm same question.
@Didds, same question.

Ummm... I think it is towny of me to try not to get exiled, not overshare information about who the 7 dwarves are, and to keep back the parts of my role that would not be beneficial for scum to know.

I also think it is towny of me to advocate that we not exile the people who are showing up

If MiX were playing, he'd be annoyed that I shared my name, but also know it made me town

Thank you for answering, I appreciate it.

[WestCoastDidds]

No, it wasn't unprompted. It was a response.  Here is the full quote

Still waiting on infangthief and EFHW to chime in, but considering some of us know each other pretty well, maybe we could discuss what characters we think others picked.

Like I know pubby, so I might have a theory or two about who he picked.

Ohhhhhh...... I like it!

Most of the gamer dudes are going to have picked obscure dwarves I’ve never heard of. My not gamer friendlies will have chosen Disney dwarves or other popular culture ones like LoTR and whatnot.

I am the most obvious dwarf, or maybe second most obvious dwarf had I been thinking about it more.

In debate we call that clipping cards
Vote: pubby

[WestCoastDidds]

If MiX were playing, he'd be annoyed that I shared my name, but also know it made me town

That your name made you town, or sharing your name made you town?

The sharing made me town. I have a particular problem with saying too much too soon. It drives MiX crazy, and I am sure helps scum. It's also why I was so wary of faust fishing for information specifically from me.

[scolapasta]

IIRC, I prodded EFHW before she posted, I just didn't mention the prod until after she had posted. With Jimmmmm, he always gets a post in before I get a chance to prod him. It doesn't matter, prods don't suddenly have hidden mechanical depths, PINL. Although, great idea for future bastard games.

Our first PINL. Yay!

[pubby]

No, it wasn't unprompted. It was a response.  Here is the full quote

You were not asked to hint at yourself. For what reason would you post that?

[scolapasta]

Awaclus wants to know what people are in the neighborhood.

faust wants to know the names of the dwarves in the neighborhood.

I am way more comfortable sharing the people than their drawf names.

I might have communicated unclearly, but I agree with faust. Having a better idea what kinds of roles are present in the game helps both town and scum, because it means everyone can plan their actions better. Currently, it is more likely than not that scum already has that information and town doesn't, which is why it's beneficial to reveal it.

Having a better idea who has those roles, as far as I can tell, is only a negligible benefit to town, whereas it is a considerable benefit to scum. Even though most likely revealing it would just negligibly benefit town because scum already knows, the benefit to town doesn't seem important enough to justify taking the risk.

Ah, I see.  Yes, I was confused.

Scola, as someone who says maybe don't tell.... what do you think? Reveal which dwarves are in the game?

I generally want to have info because it helps me try to "solve' the game. I do think being a bastard game, makes solving harder, as there will be things that aren't clear  or just wrong.

Did we establish it's more likely than not though that scum already knows? Again bastard game throws everything into chaos.

You said it's open day, so I think I'd poll my fellow dwarfs and see what they think?

I'm also fine with your not revealing, at least for the day.