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[ashersky]

ash, give me some kind of confirmation you're reading me.

I am reading your posts.

[LaLight]

there is a reason why i haven't read any flavor

[ashersky]

FYI - I did not take any actions so my only Hated counter is my (silly) rules infraction.

[ashersky]

there is a reason why i haven't read any flavor

Too busy?

[LaLight]

ash, flavor doesn't matter in case of who is and isn't a cylon, or that would've been too easy. you read human-aligned in qt? you're human aligned. test showed you're cylon? you're probably one.

that happened, let's exile scum now. WCD or MiX, pick one

I agree in the sense that just because a flavor character is/isn’t a Cylon on the show, they have to/can’t be here.  My point is that cylons are bad, regardless of who the flavor character is.  If this was HP mafia and Harry Potter was a Cylon, he’d be the evil version of Harry.

being a Cylon and being a Cylon-aligned is very different. Slytherin doesn't mean evil

[LaLight]

there is a reason why i haven't read any flavor

Too busy?

no. i think reading too much into it gives unneeded biases. i treat this game as mafia.

[LaLight]

test might be 0.01% correct for all we know and relying on it to exile is dumb

[ashersky]

Look, I've been trying to figure this game out since I got my QT.  I want to win, and continue winning, as I am sure everyone else does.  Research is part of that, given how integral the flavor appears to be, knowledge not being required notwithstanding.

So, I am a military non-cylon battleship mechanic who seems to be a pretty good guy, to a fault maybe.  But I'm actually a civilian, so that's confusing.  The rest makes sense, though, as my power matches my flavor, etc. etc.

I raise it D1 and see what info folks can offer.  Nothing of use, unfortunately.  I'm still confused.  Then Awaclus has this whole thing where he confirms alignment changes are a thing in this game.  Yes, he could just be lying mafia, but I don't read him that way, and if he is, he's doing very well at it.

So now I think, hey, alignment is fluid.  Maybe my confusion is based on incorrect assumptions I'm making from the get-go.  But still, no real breakthroughs on my end.

Then we get the cylon checker.  So I do that, and BAM, seems I could very well be Cylon.  And hey, that actually ALSO matches the mismatches in my role.  Military flavor but civilian in game.  So maybe human in flavor but cylon in game.

If those represent a pattern, the next flash of light is going to be my alignment, because that's all that's left.

I might be a secret Cylon-aligned player.  Solution: exile me.
I might be a Cylon that can be recruited/turned by Mafia, thereby presenting them with numbers and powers.  Solution: exile me.
I might be a Human with a erroneous result.  No impact on my alignment for anyone else.  Solution: maybe ignore it, unless you don't town read me anyway.
I might be a Cylon that is human-aligned.  Least likely, to me, but including all options.  Solution: ignore it.

These seem like the possible outcomes.  Two clearly require my exile, one is up in the air based on your reads, and one says to leave me alive.  That's like 2.5 in favor of exile.

My win con, as far as I know, is posted in the rules post.  I think I am very likely a threat to the human population per the win con.  I want to win, so we need to remove me.

If my win con could actually be different, I assume a few things:

--my win con is permanent once I die in game (so if I am exiled as town, I keep the town win con)
--at some point, some thing could trigger my win con to be revealed/changed/etc.

So, exiling me today I think would also allow me to stay town for the rest of the game.  So that's another reason/request from me for this.

[MiX]

As of right now, I have no reason to believe ash is in a different situation than all human-aligned players. We don't know if we're Cylons, and alignment changes have kinda been confirmed to exist by Awaclus. So all the points ash is making apply to everyone.

I might be a secret Cylon-aligned player.  Solution: exile me.
I might be a Cylon that can be recruited/turned by Mafia, thereby presenting them with numbers and powers.  Solution: exile me.
I might be a Human with a erroneous result.  No impact on my alignment for anyone else.  Solution: maybe ignore it, unless you don't town read me anyway.
I might be a Cylon that is human-aligned.  Least likely, to me, but including all options.  Solution: ignore it.

I might be scum. Solution: exile me.
I might be town. Solution: don't exile me.
I might be neither. Solution: probably exile me.

That's 1.5 in favor of exiling me. That says nothing about town actually wanting to exile me.

Honestly, you shouldn't think about the cylon result on yourself, since the results aren't guaranteed, anyone could've gotten that result, based on what we know now. That is not enough grounds to exile everyone.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Fyi your character is (spoiler alert) a cylon in the show but in terms of their "allegiance" would definitely be called human-aligned (from what I remember)

[Awaclus]

I raise it D1 and see what info folks can offer.  Nothing of use, unfortunately.  I'm still confused.  Then Awaclus has this whole thing where he confirms alignment changes are a thing in this game.  Yes, he could just be lying mafia, but I don't read him that way, and if he is, he's doing very well at it.

What I have confirmed is that I was explicitly told of a voluntary choice to change my alignment. I have not confirmed that we have a lying mod and involuntary alignment changes, and because this is not a bastard game, it seems fairly safe to assume we have neither of those.

[LaLight]

I raise it D1 and see what info folks can offer.  Nothing of use, unfortunately.  I'm still confused.  Then Awaclus has this whole thing where he confirms alignment changes are a thing in this game.  Yes, he could just be lying mafia, but I don't read him that way, and if he is, he's doing very well at it.

What I have confirmed is that I was explicitly told of a voluntary choice to change my alignment. I have not confirmed that we have a lying mod and involuntary alignment changes, and because this is not a bastard game, it seems fairly safe to assume we have neither of those.

this is actually an amazing point. i don't think alignment can change if you weren't informed from the beginning, or given a choice in a non-bastard game

[Awaclus]

Actually let's see if we can get a mod confirmation for that.

Can the game contain involuntary alignment changes?

Can the game contain alignment changes where the player is not informed of their alignment changing?

Can the game contain mod-provided information that is false, without it being explicitly mentioned that it could be false?

[Jack Rudd]

Further confirmation that LaLight is Helo, whatever in-game thing that might mean. (Thematically, this would represent his determination to keep Athena alive.)

[faust]

Can the game contain involuntary alignment changes?

Can the game contain alignment changes where the player is not informed of their alignment changing?

Can the game contain mod-provided information that is false, without it being explicitly mentioned that it could be false?

Yes. No. No.

[Awaclus]

Cool, so that's settled then. Can we go back to playing the game now?


Also,

Well, technically it’d be a modkill.

that's an awful idea, don't do it. Punishments can get arbitrarily harsh, and especially if you're breaking the rules intentionally to abuse the punishment system for an in-game advantage, I wouldn't completely rule out the possibility of a punishment like your entire alignment getting disqualified from the game.

[Swowl]

OK catching up.

My flavor is Galen Tyrol. 

Oh, also, my qt says human-aligned, but given Awaclus’s claim of alignment changes in the game, I don’t think we can trust that information.
(I realize that the mod-confirmed cylon result on myself could be a mod lie per the power explanation.  Without knowing the odds of that, even if we assume only 50/50, that’s a 50% chance I am actually mafia, even if I don’t know it.  That’s just way too high a percentage to ignore.)

In the show Galen is accused of being a Cylon in the first season. All the testing machine says is "Results are not guaranteed to be accurate."
Just saying, it could be based on flavor... not on chance. Like it was pre-decided if you checked yourself it would come back false-positive.

[Swowl]

I guess I’m also hopeful that being exiled will reveal whatever my true alignment is so I know who to cheer for in the speccy.

This is really only like super valuable if you are a cylon and you flip red. I guess there is something to be said if you are a cylon and green, but a mafia flip is what we need to sort shit out I think here the best.

[Swowl]

Can the game contain involuntary alignment changes?

Can the game contain alignment changes where the player is not informed of their alignment changing?

Can the game contain mod-provided information that is false, without it being explicitly mentioned that it could be false?

Yes. No. No.

Awaclus - Obv you fall into voluntary instead of non-voluntary bc you got the choice. But just confirming I have this correct... you did or did not do something to activate that decision?
Also, can you confirm that you specifically were informed pre-game that you could switch alignments?

[Swowl]

Fyi your character is (spoiler alert) a cylon in the show but in terms of their "allegiance" would definitely be called human-aligned (from what I remember)

wait, is this accurate? I don't remember him being a cylon.

[Swowl]

that happened, let's exile scum now. WCD or MiX, pick one

fairly small and un-related pool of players. why they up on your radar?

[Jack Rudd]

Fyi your character is (spoiler alert) a cylon in the show but in terms of their "allegiance" would definitely be called human-aligned (from what I remember)

wait, is this accurate? I don't remember him being a cylon.

He's one of the Final Five; his being a cylon is revealed at the end of Season 3.

[Awaclus]

Awaclus - Obv you fall into voluntary instead of non-voluntary bc you got the choice. But just confirming I have this correct... you did or did not do something to activate that decision?
Also, can you confirm that you specifically were informed pre-game that you could switch alignments?

I did not do anything to activate the decision, I only submitted a response to it. I was not informed pre-game that I could switch alignments, I was informed in the middle of day 1 after the thread was temporarily locked.

Also, I just realized that the mechanic that did my thing yesterday could match the description of "the game can contain involuntary alignment changes" because it actually had a 24-hour deadline for submitting a response, and it defaulted to having my alignment changed if I failed to submit one. I suppose in principle, if I had missed the deadline by accident, then the game would have contained an involuntary alignment change. In the light of that, I guess it was a pretty pointless question to ask faust, but at least the other questions served their purpose.

[EFHW]

ash, did the wiki not say that your character was a cylon? We've been pretty clear from the start that cylon/human identity does not necessarily correspond to cylon/human alignment. The civilian/military thing is odd, but maybe faust deviated from canon for modding reasons. Or he made a mistake.

[Swowl]

Awaclus - Obv you fall into voluntary instead of non-voluntary bc you got the choice. But just confirming I have this correct... you did or did not do something to activate that decision?
Also, can you confirm that you specifically were informed pre-game that you could switch alignments?

I did not do anything to activate the decision, I only submitted a response to it. I was not informed pre-game that I could switch alignments, I was informed in the middle of day 1 after the thread was temporarily locked.

Also, I just realized that the mechanic that did my thing yesterday could match the description of "the game can contain involuntary alignment changes" because it actually had a 24-hour deadline for submitting a response, and it defaulted to having my alignment changed if I failed to submit one. I suppose in principle, if I had missed the deadline by accident, then the game would have contained an involuntary alignment change. In the light of that, I guess it was a pretty pointless question to ask faust, but at least the other questions served their purpose.

OK I can actually parse that. I think it is fair to say that your choice was "voluntary". There has to be a deadline right? You were given a choice, that is voluntary... I don't think it is fair to call it not so if it goes random if you pass DL given.

It is just weird for me to have a character that can undergo an alignment change but not be informed of it start of game. You would know this though... I was/am thinking it is possible that you picked option 2 and just gave all the info correctly, yet lied about the choice. But given that the cylon-checker-thing also may have a mechanic that gives % chances, and that is mod confirmed... I suppose I am inclined to believe you.