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[Galzria]

I’m not scum, I’m VT, and exiling me ends the game.

[faust]

Well, eh. If we exile the fake Doctor and scum!Space doesn't fakeclaim here then tomorrow it's 1v1. A lot can happen there. I doubt the game looks like as much of a lock from a scum!Space perspective. Didds is the most likely partner for Space and it looks like she's gonna be the exile if we decide to exile a Doctor.

And I don't buy town!Space being confused, like, at all. There is no way in the world town!Space wouldn't have weighed he possible outcomes of a claim like that. And I find it hard to see a way in which they would arrive at the conclusion that it's a good thing to do.

It's 1 v 1 but neither of those people would be space...

I don't follow... scenario is: 1-shot BP claim. No counterclaim, so they are IC. The remaining Doctor is IC. You are IC. Only 2 people remain, one of them being Space. What are you suggesting?

Let's say we exile the correct scum today, actual Doctor dies. Tomorrow, it's me, you, space, Galz. We are picking between you and Galz, because I think space is town. That's what I meant by "a 1 v 1 that doesn't include space"

Okay but if you bring up a point unrelated to what I was saying, it would be less confusing if you didn't quote what I said.

[WestCoastDidds]

Hi friends---

Just catching up...what a morning!  I don't see any reason to disbelieve these claims on face.  I am a bit confused by why they have come out now, which is neither here nor there, but it seems to point to scum Galz more clearly than the Galz/chairs interactions I was evaluating before. 

vote: Galzy

[Swowl]

Vote Count 5.5:

WCD (2): chairs, Galz
Galzria (2): Robz, WCD
chairs: (1): Space
Not Voting (1): faust

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Day 5 starts now and ends October 29th at 7:40pm Forum Time. That is in just over 24 hours!!

[chairs]

Faust apparently counts as six votes 

[Galzria]

N3: Galz -- he was terribly awol, and I know my frustration with his lack of interaction with the game was showing in-thread. However, an absent scum can still be puppeted by present scumbuddies in the scum QT, so it seemed worth a shot, and it seemed like the only possible way to get alignment-indicative content from him.

Cool - so faust is IC now as well! (Ok, to me anyway)

N3: If you Tracked me and got no result, either I'm town (hint hint), or the only possible way this happens AND the kill goes through a Doctor is if there exists a Strongman - because in this scum!Galzria scenario, either the Doctor was RB'd (in which case you would've seen me RB the Doctor OR perform the kill on EFHW), or YOU were RB'd, in which case the kill on EFHW must have been Strongman.

And with faust being IC (to me now), that means the scum team is either:

{WCD, Space}, {Chairs, Space}, reaaaaaaaaaaly unlikely {WCD, Chairs}.

[Swowl]

Faust apparently counts as six votes 

Thank you. Fixed.

[Robz888]

Why is faust an IC for Galz? If he's an IC for Galz he's just an IC, because Galz and faust can't both be scum.

[Galzria]

Why is faust an IC for Galz? If he's an IC for Galz he's just an IC, because Galz and faust can't both be scum.

Slightly facetious, but generally true.

If I'm scum, then it's clearly {Galzria, Chairs} or {Galzria, WCD}. faust is town in both scenarios.

My point was that Space tracked me on the night EFHW died, and got no result. Eevee was dead at this point, so there were only two scum remaining. Scum PR's that could potentially be in play are:

2 shot Rolestopper
1-shot Strongman

In order for Space to get a No-Result on me if I'm scum, is if THEY were Rolestopped, and a Strong-man killed EFHW through the Doctor. If I'm scum and the Doctor was Rolestopped, then Space would've seen me either: Rolestop the Doctor, OR Kill EFHW. As the only viable scenario for my being scum requires there to be a Strongman, this confirms faust's claim (which yes, is confirmed anyway in a world where I'm scum)

Note that the only viable scenario for my being scum is NOT the one Space put forward:

The existence of my role does mean that scum has a two-shot role-stopper, which is how they presumably killed EFHW N3: role-stopping her to prevent the doctor shot from taking, and then using a regular NK to get the job done. That means there is one rolestopper shot unaccounted for, i.e. my target could have been rolestopped on at most one night. I haven't actually confirmed with Swowl whether his interpretation of the "twice at night" means both shots could have been used on different targets on N3, or whether it needs to be different night. For scum to end up no-killing last night, I suspect it means that both rolestopper shots have now been used.

Note that from N3 when scum pulled out the stops to take EFHW down, there's no point in them using their godfatherer shot, so that makes the expected number of scum targets per night lower. When I tracked faust in N2, the godfatherer could still have been expected to be using shots, whereas when I tracked Galz N3, if he is the godfatherer (which I think is likely, with Chairs being the Siamese Cat) then there was no point in him targeting, since the godfatherer shot only protected them from EFHW's role and she was guaranteed to be out of the game.

-----

The truth is, I've been waiting for a Bullet Proof claim. It's what makes the most sense for EFHW's death. Why? Because if there is NOT a Strong-Man, then the only way for EFHW to have been killed is for the Doctor to have been Role Stopped. If this was the case, then there is NO REASON for there to have been no-kill last night. Scum would've killed the Doctor. The only logical reason EFHW died is that there is a Strongman.

Faust should be IC to pretty much everybody because his existence is the only reasonable explanation for us to be exactly where we're at right now.

[chairs]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

[Robz888]

..... yeah faust is IC.

[Robz888]

Space's claim is very extra. Why am I considering space town again?

[Galzria]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bill by the horns.

[chairs]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bill by the horns.

lol

[Galzria]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bull by the horns.

EBWOP

[Robz888]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bill by the horns.

Why aren't you voting for Space, then? Space is confirmed scum to you.

[Robz888]

There's been a lot of not voting for confirmed scum!

[Robz888]

I still want to exile Galz.

[Galzria]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bill by the horns.

Why aren't you voting for Space, then? Space is confirmed scum to you.

Because it COULD be {WCD, Chairs}, even if it’s unlikely.

Also, because there’s no likely {Chairs, Space} narrative, but {WCD, Space} is very clear.

[Robz888]

So then you're claiming that scum is two of {chairs, Didds, Space}? That's a bold move, Cotton.

Yeah, that’s me. Taking the bill by the horns.

Why aren't you voting for Space, then? Space is confirmed scum to you.

Because it COULD be {WCD, Chairs}, even if it’s unlikely.

Also, because there’s no likely {Chairs, Space} narrative, but {WCD, Space} is very clear.

I think chairs/space is more likely than didds/chairs...

[Robz888]

It's not Didds/chairs! That play is too crazy for them!

[Robz888]

Can we kill Galz now?

[Galzria]

Can we kill Galz now?

If you want to lose, sure.

[faust]

Why is faust an IC for Galz? If he's an IC for Galz he's just an IC, because Galz and faust can't both be scum.

Slightly facetious, but generally true.

If I'm scum, then it's clearly {Galzria, Chairs} or {Galzria, WCD}. faust is town in both scenarios.

My point was that Space tracked me on the night EFHW died, and got no result. Eevee was dead at this point, so there were only two scum remaining. Scum PR's that could potentially be in play are:

2 shot Rolestopper
1-shot Strongman

In order for Space to get a No-Result on me if I'm scum, is if THEY were Rolestopped, and a Strong-man killed EFHW through the Doctor. If I'm scum and the Doctor was Rolestopped, then Space would've seen me either: Rolestop the Doctor, OR Kill EFHW. As the only viable scenario for my being scum requires there to be a Strongman, this confirms faust's claim (which yes, is confirmed anyway in a world where I'm scum)

Note that the only viable scenario for my being scum is NOT the one Space put forward:

The existence of my role does mean that scum has a two-shot role-stopper, which is how they presumably killed EFHW N3: role-stopping her to prevent the doctor shot from taking, and then using a regular NK to get the job done. That means there is one rolestopper shot unaccounted for, i.e. my target could have been rolestopped on at most one night. I haven't actually confirmed with Swowl whether his interpretation of the "twice at night" means both shots could have been used on different targets on N3, or whether it needs to be different night. For scum to end up no-killing last night, I suspect it means that both rolestopper shots have now been used.

Note that from N3 when scum pulled out the stops to take EFHW down, there's no point in them using their godfatherer shot, so that makes the expected number of scum targets per night lower. When I tracked faust in N2, the godfatherer could still have been expected to be using shots, whereas when I tracked Galz N3, if he is the godfatherer (which I think is likely, with Chairs being the Siamese Cat) then there was no point in him targeting, since the godfatherer shot only protected them from EFHW's role and she was guaranteed to be out of the game.

-----

The truth is, I've been waiting for a Bullet Proof claim. It's what makes the most sense for EFHW's death. Why? Because if there is NOT a Strong-Man, then the only way for EFHW to have been killed is for the Doctor to have been Role Stopped. If this was the case, then there is NO REASON for there to have been no-kill last night. Scum would've killed the Doctor. The only logical reason EFHW died is that there is a Strongman.

Faust should be IC to pretty much everybody because his existence is the only reasonable explanation for us to be exactly where we're at right now.

Not that I don't like being an IC... but a Rolestopper is not a Roleblocker.

[faust]

Space's claim is very extra. Why am I considering space town again?

It's a good question.