Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10 ... 56  All

Author Topic: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Game Over! Town Wins!  (Read 130576 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

pingpongsam

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1760
  • Shuffle iT Username: pingpongsam
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #175 on: May 05, 2021, 09:49:51 pm »

Ash2: Disagree. I may agree later. As it is I keep checking m PM to even see what timeline I am on. I am fully following regardless. Also, this mechanic is unique enough to draw me out of retirement.

Ash5: I don’t think we talk about that today. I think it is an important piece of the puzzle. The original intent clearly was to have interaction between timelines. With random assignments that is sure to still exist to some degree. At some point I expect we have sufficient information to bring our QTs to bear and divulging who has who right now seems like a poor play for Town.
Logged
You are the brashest scum player on f.ds.

WestCoastDidds

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
  • Shuffle iT Username: WestCoastDidds
  • Didds, ya'll
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #176 on: May 05, 2021, 11:07:01 pm »

I’m definitely feeling the not-my-timeline lethargy, although it hasn’t inhibited me from reading so maybe having some folks with birds eye views will help.

I don’t quite understand what Faust’s plan gets us. More people italic voting, and then a point where the people in the active timeline are forced to vote that way even if it’s against their own judgement as a loyalty test. That feels like it would feel really icky to the people being forced to vote that way, although it does provide an incentive for the non-actives to participate. I’m not sure that is a net gain, but I’m sure there is much I don’t understand.

I am also unsure what the shared qt is for right now. :/
Logged
classic Diddsian meddling
I never got to read what Didds said, but whatever she's saying, she's right.

scolapasta

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 578
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #177 on: May 05, 2021, 11:18:18 pm »

I’m definitely feeling the not-my-timeline lethargy, although it hasn’t inhibited me from reading so maybe having some folks with birds eye views will help.

I don’t quite understand what Faust’s plan gets us. More people italic voting, and then a point where the people in the active timeline are forced to vote that way even if it’s against their own judgement as a loyalty test. That feels like it would feel really icky to the people being forced to vote that way, although it does provide an incentive for the non-actives to participate. I’m not sure that is a net gain, but I’m sure there is much I don’t understand.

I am also unsure what the shared qt is for right now. :/

Ditto. As a forward, I'll follow along, sure, but I don't expect to be posting much.

I do have to say, I do feel a kindred spirit with my other forwards. But of course when I will be able to vote, it's just on them, so meh.
Logged
Feel free to join us at scolapasta's cards for discussion on any of my custom cards.

ashersky

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2343
  • 2013/2014/2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #178 on: May 06, 2021, 12:51:59 am »

Some further thoughts on "the plan":

--it requires all players of the active timeline to agree to exile whomever is selected in italics.  That seems...difficult at best.  Easy enough to say you will, then adamantly refuse when the italicized exile is a strong town read or mafia partner.

--it only works on Day 1.  After the exile, there's a fairly clear breakdown of players by timeline, and then it's all moot.  Someone could just track bolded votes.

--mafia can definitely control this to their advantage.  At worst, they get all the information they need for night actions.  Imagine some powers only working on members of a certain timeline, or active timeline.

--that said, I don't necessarily think that means the plan came from mafia, as it was probably easier to just get people to claim.

--the italicized votes idea is strictly to hide timelines until the end of the day.  If players don't care or don't want to hide their timeline, though, no reason to force it.  As we've seen.  This could just have easily been done with popsquizes and weights.  So that makes the plan seem like more of a plan than it actually is, which could be a credgrab.

Other thoughts:

--what if timelines are randomly assigned and all mafia are in one timeline.  That makes the other timeline even more useless.

--has everyone posted yet?
Logged
f.ds Mafia Board Moderator

2013, 2014, 2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
2015 f.ds Representative, World Forum Mafia Championships
2013, 2014 Mafia Player of the Year (Tie)

11x MVP: M30, M83, ZM16, M25, M38, M61, M76, RMM5, RMM41, RMM46, M51

faust

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3377
  • Shuffle iT Username: faust
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #179 on: May 06, 2021, 01:03:15 am »

We're all so stuck on whether this plan is good or not, we're actually not getting anywhere useful. Good job faust. Your plan is working.
Fuck you too.
Logged
You say the ocean's rising, like I give a shit
You say the whole world's ending, honey it already did

Swowl

  • Pawn
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
  • Shuffle iT Username: Swowl
  • Snow.Owl.Duh.
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #180 on: May 06, 2021, 01:56:52 am »

We have all taken the civility pledge. Please abide by it.
Logged
Jesus how did i fuck that up
real good. That’s how
Town:  14 wins, 14 losses (1 MVP)
Skum: 7 wins, 7 losses (1 MVP)
3-Party: 4 wins, 1 loss

ashersky

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2343
  • 2013/2014/2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Sign Ups Open!
« Reply #181 on: May 06, 2021, 02:49:52 am »


TIMELINE MECHANICS
1.   All players in this game will be evenly divided into 2 “Timelines” – Forward and Reverse.
2.   Every Day and Night Phase will belong to a specific Timeline – Either Forward or Reverse.
    a.   During the Day, all players alive may post as usual in the game thread. However, only the players on the Active Timeline will be allowed to vote or use PRs.
    b.   Additionally, players will only be allowed to vote for players on the Active Timeline.
    c.   During the Night, only players on the Active Timeline will be allowed to take actions.
    d.   Night actions can target any player, regardless of which Timeline they belong to.
3.   Active Timelines will begin at the Start of Day and end at the conclusion of the following Night.

TIMELINE QT MECHANICS:
3.   When either player from the same QT dies, it will be closed for the remainder of the game.

A few tidbits of public information to discuss, because setup discussion is always...something.

I think #2 and #3 sort of define the same thing -- the "active period" of a timeline is always a day+night cycle.  An active timeline can't start at the beginning of the night, for example.  Seems that night actions could affect what timeline is active for the next cycle.

#2a CLEARLY hints at day powers.  I mean, use PRs is written there after "during the day."  There's a separate rule for actions at night at 2d.  So yeah, day powers.

For the QT #3, closed after a death always feels suspect to me.  Like, why not let the living player share thoughts or gloat?  Because the dead player might come back, perhaps...

So those are thoughts.  We can discuss them if you want.  Or not.
Logged
f.ds Mafia Board Moderator

2013, 2014, 2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
2015 f.ds Representative, World Forum Mafia Championships
2013, 2014 Mafia Player of the Year (Tie)

11x MVP: M30, M83, ZM16, M25, M38, M61, M76, RMM5, RMM41, RMM46, M51

pingpongsam

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1760
  • Shuffle iT Username: pingpongsam
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #182 on: May 06, 2021, 06:45:36 am »

I saw the day power potential as well. Complete WIFOM. Either possibility exists.

Closed QTs are for mod sanity is the simplest explanation but reincarnation is not out of the question.
Logged
You are the brashest scum player on f.ds.

WestCoastDidds

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
  • Shuffle iT Username: WestCoastDidds
  • Didds, ya'll
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #183 on: May 06, 2021, 08:10:53 am »

@Ahersky, I think we haven’t seen chairs here.

And hupercube just did a drive by, be back. I believe everyone else has posted.
Logged
classic Diddsian meddling
I never got to read what Didds said, but whatever she's saying, she's right.

MiX

  • Navigator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 77
  • Shuffle iT Username: MiX
  • It's me.
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #184 on: May 06, 2021, 08:28:52 am »

Okay let's get out of mechanical discussion.

Everyone who is reverse timeline, either vote in bold or vote in italic. You're playing this day, act like it. Everyone else, I'd suggest you vote in italic anyway, even if you don't intend to care about your vote, it would provide cover to people that don't want to claim.

For gkrieg: yeah, it can help scum to only have a few people say their timeline, but this only affects D1, so I think it helps town more overall.

Ash, I disagree with almost everything you're saying, Swowl putting down possibilities doesn't mean they have to be in the game IMO, this doesn't matter because we disagree on everything, but still.

We need to put down a deadline for the italic votes. I vote for a full IRL day before the actual deadline, so 3:25 pm 5/10. It's very likely no decision would have been made, and I don't think we should make it plurality, but if there is a majority of players that want to exile someone, I think we should do that.

Vote: faust, if there's any game where it can be correct to exile faust D1, it's this one, he's basically doing what scum!faust does, which is create chaos through order. Also Space isn't around to say if what he's doing is logical or not, so I need to keep a closer eye on him. Not to mention I can't pressure anyone else realistically, people that have claimed reverse timeline are basically stating they don't care about pressure, and the people that haven't claimed don't need to react to votes at all.

I'd love to see more votes from everyone, or we're not going to do much today.
Logged

mathdude

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 216
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #185 on: May 06, 2021, 08:29:23 am »

There have been a number of people agreeing with faust's strategy but very few italic votes and no recent italic vote count. There has also been mention of seeing an early deadline to get these votes in but no follow-up. And we're losing time.

There have also been some people who disagree, yet have not proven their Timeline by means of a vote. So that's not helpful either.

Even though I don't think it's helpful, FWIW, I wil...
FoS: faust
I mean...
vote: faust
Request vote count.


Also, request vote count.
Proud request: chairs.


PPE1 - thank you MiX!
Logged
he/him

mathdude

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 216
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #186 on: May 06, 2021, 08:31:59 am »

EBWOP
That was supposed to say
prod request: chairs.
Logged
he/him

hypercube

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 139
  • Shuffle iT Username: xyrix
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #187 on: May 06, 2021, 08:32:07 am »

OK I'm getting caught up here, first off to those I haven't played with before hello!, and I use he/him pronouns just fyi.

Since it seems trivial to determine what timelines people are on I'll go ahead and just say that I'm on the reverse timeline. For now I'm operating under the assumption that at some point the timelines will merge or at least people will get swapped between them since that seems like the most likely way to deal with the potential lategame weirdness.

In regards to the italic voting plan, I'm in favour of binding the choice of exile to the wishes of the overall majority. The voting should only be allowed for people in the active timeline though - it seems obvious to me that trying to pass off exiles to some unknown future day is a bad idea and it's strange to me that faust didn't make this explicit when bringing it up (possibly because he seems to want no-exile D1?).

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.

Re ash's #4. This is an interesting point. Maybe there's a third party who can target both timelines.

Why would this change anything?

Logged
I have sigs off.

MiX

  • Navigator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 77
  • Shuffle iT Username: MiX
  • It's me.
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #188 on: May 06, 2021, 08:33:41 am »

Italic vote count 1.1

MiX (1): faust
faust (2): MiX, math

Not Voting (13): EFHW, WCD, scolapasta, chairs, hypercube, Joth, Galzria, Ashersky, Glooble, PPS, Awaclus, gkrieg, Dylan

With 16 alive, it takes 9 to exile. The italic day 1 ends at 3:25 pm, May 10th
Logged

hypercube

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 139
  • Shuffle iT Username: xyrix
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #189 on: May 06, 2021, 08:59:13 am »

It's occurred to me that timelines merging matches the narrative structure of the movie, so that's a minor point suggesting that that will happen at some point.

EFHW, Dylan, ashersky all have said that the advantage of the italic voting plan is in concealing people's timelines - these are first of all not really possible to conceal as has been pointed out already, and also there seems to be obvious advantages to letting everyone vote. I'm not sure if not picking up on that is scummy or towny though.
Logged
I have sigs off.

pingpongsam

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1760
  • Shuffle iT Username: pingpongsam
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #190 on: May 06, 2021, 09:44:24 am »

Okay let's get out of mechanical discussion.

Everyone who is reverse timeline, either vote in bold or vote in italic. You're playing this day, act like it. Everyone else, I'd suggest you vote in italic anyway, even if you don't intend to care about your vote, it would provide cover to people that don't want to claim.

For gkrieg: yeah, it can help scum to only have a few people say their timeline, but this only affects D1, so I think it helps town more overall.

Ash, I disagree with almost everything you're saying, Swowl putting down possibilities doesn't mean they have to be in the game IMO, this doesn't matter because we disagree on everything, but still.

We need to put down a deadline for the italic votes. I vote for a full IRL day before the actual deadline, so 3:25 pm 5/10. It's very likely no decision would have been made, and I don't think we should make it plurality, but if there is a majority of players that want to exile someone, I think we should do that.

Vote: faust, if there's any game where it can be correct to exile faust D1, it's this one, he's basically doing what scum!faust does, which is create chaos through order. Also Space isn't around to say if what he's doing is logical or not, so I need to keep a closer eye on him. Not to mention I can't pressure anyone else realistically, people that have claimed reverse timeline are basically stating they don't care about pressure, and the people that haven't claimed don't need to react to votes at all.

I'd love to see more votes from everyone, or we're not going to do much today.

Great energy, I am digging this.

Vote: MiX
Logged
You are the brashest scum player on f.ds.

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11809
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #191 on: May 06, 2021, 10:30:58 am »

Vote: MiX
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

faust

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3377
  • Shuffle iT Username: faust
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #192 on: May 06, 2021, 11:10:28 am »

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.
Every investigative role has a QT, i.e. they can share their results without having to claim.
Logged
You say the ocean's rising, like I give a shit
You say the whole world's ending, honey it already did

mathdude

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 216
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #193 on: May 06, 2021, 11:53:53 am »

(Lots of thoughts)

Great energy, I am digging this.

Vote: MiX

FoS: pps and Awaclus
Logged
he/him

hypercube

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 139
  • Shuffle iT Username: xyrix
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #194 on: May 06, 2021, 12:03:20 pm »

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.
Every investigative role has a QT, i.e. they can share their results without having to claim.

Ah, I see, thanks.
Logged
I have sigs off.

Glooble

  • Bishop
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 113
    • View Profile
    • Solutions to Problems
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #195 on: May 06, 2021, 12:06:05 pm »

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.
Every investigative role has a QT, i.e. they can share their results without having to claim.

Except they have no idea if their QT-mate is town, so they may not want to reveal to that person that they have an investigative role.
Logged

I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

He/ Him

Check out my podcast: www.stppodcast.com

mathdude

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 216
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #196 on: May 06, 2021, 12:16:31 pm »

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.
Every investigative role has a QT, i.e. they can share their results without having to claim.

Except they have no idea if their QT-mate is town, so they may not want to reveal to that person that they have an investigative role.

Exactly this. But I can see why faust wants investigative roles to share with their partners... or helps out him and his team if one of them can get info from town.
Logged
he/him

EFHW

  • Spy
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 81
  • Shuffle iT Username: EFHW
  • EFHW="ee-foo". Really, how else would you say it?
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #197 on: May 06, 2021, 12:38:16 pm »

Re ash's #4. This is an interesting point. Maybe there's a third party who can target both timelines.

Why would this change anything?

If only mafia are left from one timeline, then they can't be exiled by players on the other timeline. If there is one large team, then town is at a big disadvantage. If there are two teams, then there could be two winners. Or, there could be someone able to vote or kill players from either timeline so that no one gets to be immortal due to the timeline restrictions.
Logged

EFHW

  • Spy
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 81
  • Shuffle iT Username: EFHW
  • EFHW="ee-foo". Really, how else would you say it?
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #198 on: May 06, 2021, 12:41:10 pm »

It's occurred to me that timelines merging matches the narrative structure of the movie, so that's a minor point suggesting that that will happen at some point.

EFHW, Dylan, ashersky all have said that the advantage of the italic voting plan is in concealing people's timelines - these are first of all not really possible to conceal as has been pointed out already, and also there seems to be obvious advantages to letting everyone vote. I'm not sure if not picking up on that is scummy or towny though.
No, you have that backwards. The advantage of concealing timelines is that the italics plan could preserve some agency for the forward timeline folks. There are probably too many known timelines at this point for it to work, though.
Logged

EFHW

  • Spy
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 81
  • Shuffle iT Username: EFHW
  • EFHW="ee-foo". Really, how else would you say it?
    • View Profile
Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #199 on: May 06, 2021, 12:43:47 pm »

vote: joth. Feels very much like his last scum game.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10 ... 56  All
 

Page created in 0.059 seconds with 19 queries.