Dominion > Rules Questions

Sauna and Innovation

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Jeebus:
So I'm hearing from Ingix that Champion is now changed back to being "first" instead of "after"? So are Sauna and Merchant changed too? I think it would be best if Champion, Sauna and Merchant all worked the same way, either "first" or "after", since it's not defined in any rulebook so having different rulings for these cards would be weird and confusing.

Jeebus:
The conclusion is that Champion happens "first" (and will apparently say that in new printings), while Sauna and Merchant still happen after.

I was wrong in my possible interpretation above regarding Champion (before the new ruling) not triggering on its own playing. All "after" abilities (like Citadel) trigger after the played card is resolved, not before. So Champion needs to be "first" in order to not give you an extra Action when you play it.

scolapasta:

--- Quote from: Jeebus on March 10, 2020, 04:58:41 pm ---The conclusion is that Champion happens "first" (and will apparently say that in new printings), while Sauna and Merchant still happen after.

I was wrong in my possible interpretation above regarding Champion (before the new ruling) not triggering on its own playing. All "after" abilities (like Citadel) trigger after the played card is resolved, not before. So Champion needs to be "first" in order to not give you an extra Action when you play it.

--- End quote ---

I posted this elsewhere, but Champion could still be after if you remove the first +1 Action (Maybe with an extra helping parenthesis):

"For the rest of the game, when another player plays an Attack card, it doesn't affect you, and when you play an Action (including this), +1 Action."

Jeebus:

--- Quote from: scolapasta on March 10, 2020, 05:09:53 pm ---I posted this elsewhere, but Champion could still be after if you remove the first +1 Action (Maybe with an extra helping parenthesis):

"For the rest of the game, when another player plays an Attack card, it doesn't affect you, and when you play an Action (including this), +1 Action."

--- End quote ---

You're right of course. But I doubt Donald wants to do that, since it's more of a change than adding "first" to it. And the card as printed can more easily be said to happen first (in line with old versions of Moat and other Reactions, which happened first but didn't say "first"), than it can be said to happen after but not give the first +1 Action.

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