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Author Topic: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (GAME OVER, Maquis win!)  (Read 323428 times)

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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #75 on: February 23, 2019, 08:55:30 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.
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Awaclus

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #76 on: February 23, 2019, 08:59:43 am »

I need to find a quote from the last game to put as my sig.

I am going to go ahead and vote: Awaclus because I was right last game, dammit, and no one believed me!

Well you're wrong this time.
How ironic coming from you.

How is that ironic coming from me?
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #77 on: February 23, 2019, 09:02:07 am »

I need to find a quote from the last game to put as my sig.

I am going to go ahead and vote: Awaclus because I was right last game, dammit, and no one believed me!

Well you're wrong this time.
How ironic coming from you.

How is that ironic coming from me?
I remember you for a long time always opening with a silverspawn vote because he was scum in Futuramafia. Now Glooble does the same to you.
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MiX

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #78 on: February 23, 2019, 09:06:49 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.

I think everyone should claim to be (or not to be) hated at L-2. I don't see the advantage of outing a non-cop instantly.
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Glooble

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #79 on: February 23, 2019, 09:12:18 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.

I think everyone should claim to be (or not to be) hated at L-2. I don't see the advantage of outing a non-cop instantly.

Why would you out a cop instantly?
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #80 on: February 23, 2019, 09:14:01 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.

I think everyone should claim to be (or not to be) hated at L-2. I don't see the advantage of outing a non-cop instantly.
The advantage is that we guarantee that no Cop wastes their shot on a useless target.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #81 on: February 23, 2019, 09:14:52 am »

For the same reason we probably want an instant IC reveal.
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MiX

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #82 on: February 23, 2019, 09:27:09 am »

For the same reason we probably want an instant IC reveal.

To get him killed instantly? But then I guess cops don't drop dead, huh...

Essencially, we get more results from cops, but cops die sooner...not sure if that's a good tradeoff.

I'll need to think about this...
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Glooble

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #83 on: February 23, 2019, 09:30:47 am »

For the same reason we probably want an instant IC reveal.

To get him killed instantly? But then I guess cops don't drop dead, huh...

Essencially, we get more results from cops, but cops die sooner...not sure if that's a good tradeoff.

I'll need to think about this...

Keep in mind we only have a 1-shot doctor, who might be scum, and maybe a 1-shot bus driver (who also might be scum.) Thatís not a lot of protective roles to protect anyone who might claim.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #84 on: February 23, 2019, 09:34:36 am »

For the same reason we probably want an instant IC reveal.

To get him killed instantly? But then I guess cops don't drop dead, huh...

Essencially, we get more results from cops, but cops die sooner...not sure if that's a good tradeoff.

I'll need to think about this...

Keep in mind we only have a 1-shot doctor, who might be scum, and maybe a 1-shot bus driver (who also might be scum.) Thatís not a lot of protective roles to protect anyone who might claim.
Hence my being less sure about the IC thing. We don't need to discuss that; they can just decide on their own. But Gul Dukat does not need to be protected, so that is definitely a good claim.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #85 on: February 23, 2019, 09:38:38 am »

Okay

Gul Dukat - hated godfather, non alignment indicative
Jake Sisko - Triggerable IC

Pros of Gul claiming are cops donít waste target.
Cons of Gul claiming are if town he is probably left alive for scum to kill in lylo.
18 people (17 targets) with 4 cops means each cop has a 5.88% chance of hitting him.
Iím not sure the pro is actually worth the con day one based on the small changes of him getting hit. Overall I think itís a low pro and a low con so we are not making a mistake either way. Maybe If Gul think there is any chance they are going to be an investigations target at the end of the day they should claim.

Pros of Jake claiming are we get an IC day on and cops donít waste an investigative target, also Jake becomes go to night kill and protects cops.
Cons of Jake claiming are simply he fact that the longer we wait the more helpful an IC can be.
I think this obtains max cost/benefit at on Day 2. There is a chance a cop has a result in day 2 creating a decision for scum to make. We will have a lynch and information for Jake to help us work through.

So I think Gull claim if they are potentially a target and Jake claim tomorrow.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

shraeye

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #86 on: February 23, 2019, 09:39:16 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.

I think everyone should claim to be (or not to be) hated at L-2. I don't see the advantage of outing a non-cop instantly.
The advantage is that we guarantee that no Cop wastes their shot on a useless target.
Why is Gul Dukat a useless target?  He's not the IC.
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Glooble

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #87 on: February 23, 2019, 09:40:48 am »

For the same reason we probably want an instant IC reveal.

To get him killed instantly? But then I guess cops don't drop dead, huh...

Essencially, we get more results from cops, but cops die sooner...not sure if that's a good tradeoff.

I'll need to think about this...

Keep in mind we only have a 1-shot doctor, who might be scum, and maybe a 1-shot bus driver (who also might be scum.) Thatís not a lot of protective roles to protect anyone who might claim.
Hence my being less sure about the IC thing. We don't need to discuss that; they can just decide on their own. But Gul Dukat does not need to be protected, so that is definitely a good claim.

True. Letís also keep in mind the possibility of a scum double-voter when putting someone to L-2, though the fact that they have to announce the double vote publicly probably keeps scum from using that power early in the game.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

He/ Him

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Glooble

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #88 on: February 23, 2019, 09:41:41 am »

I think Gul Dukat should claim.

I think everyone should claim to be (or not to be) hated at L-2. I don't see the advantage of outing a non-cop instantly.
The advantage is that we guarantee that no Cop wastes their shot on a useless target.
Why is Gul Dukat a useless target?  He's not the IC.

Heís a useless target because heís a Godfather. Heíll investigate as station-aligned no matter what.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

He/ Him

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shraeye

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #89 on: February 23, 2019, 09:46:24 am »

Oooh, missed the part after the parenthesis in the rules; focused too much on hated.  Sooo, yeah....guess that's not my role....#wifom

But I fully agree that each town should decide for themselves the best time to claim.  There isn't much point in discussing these things too hard.  RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #90 on: February 23, 2019, 09:48:42 am »

But I fully agree that each town should decide for themselves the best time to claim.  There isn't much point in discussing these things too hard.  RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.
RVS is bullshit.

Also sure town roles can decide this for themselves. But how do we know that Gul is town? Scum needs to be forced to make that claim.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #91 on: February 23, 2019, 09:53:19 am »

But I fully agree that each town should decide for themselves the best time to claim.  There isn't much point in discussing these things too hard.  RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.
RVS is bullshit.

Also sure town roles can decide this for themselves. But how do we know that Gul is town? Scum needs to be forced to make that claim.

Do we care is scum!gull claims or not? A claimed Gull is not going to be treated any different than all other players alignment wise. Thus claiming Gull at L-anything shouldnít change our want to lynch them at all. The only town pro we get for any alignment Gull claiming is so they donít get copped. And the only town con is if Gull is town scum will not want to kill them to be able to abuse them in mylo. In fact scum can kinda force town to lynch Gull eventually or risk losing in the event Gull is town.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

shraeye

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #92 on: February 23, 2019, 09:55:35 am »

But I fully agree that each town should decide for themselves the best time to claim.  There isn't much point in discussing these things too hard.  RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.
RVS is bullshit.

Also sure town roles can decide this for themselves. But how do we know that Gul is town? Scum needs to be forced to make that claim.
Yeah, I agree on RVS. 

I don't see how getting Gul to claim is particularly damning if it's scum.   Like, obviously getting scum to claim any role would be good because A) they can't counterclaim in the future and B) we'd know who scum is.

So yeah, town should decide when to claim for themselves.  Scum, you all need to claim right now.  #winning
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Glooble

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #93 on: February 23, 2019, 09:57:41 am »

RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.

Love the joke, disagree with the premise. Itís all about encouraging conversation so we have something to analyze later when we have more information. Plus every so often scum trips up, which is more likely with more talking.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

He/ Him

Check out my podcast: www.stppodcast.com

mcmcsalot

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #94 on: February 23, 2019, 09:58:43 am »

Oh I missed the town benefit of scum!gull claiming by locking them into a gull claim. That may tip the scales in favor of gull claiming.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

shraeye

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #95 on: February 23, 2019, 10:00:50 am »

RVS is random voting stage, not really verbose strategizing.

Love the joke, disagree with the premise. Itís all about encouraging conversation so we have something to analyze later when we have more information. Plus every so often scum trips up, which is more likely with more talking.

I really just said that for the joke, plus a soft emphasis on "let's stop making shraeye accidently claim not-X".

I'm all for talking.  And the hashtags.  #important
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shraeye

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #96 on: February 23, 2019, 10:01:45 am »

Oh I missed the town benefit of scum!gull claiming by locking them into a gull claim. That may tip the scales in favor of gull claiming.
Are you serious?!  My "it's not worth it" post makes you think it's worth it.  #backfire #facepalm

Disregard mcmcs, he's not right.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #97 on: February 23, 2019, 10:11:41 am »

Oh I missed the town benefit of scum!gull claiming by locking them into a gull claim. That may tip the scales in favor of gull claiming.
Are you serious?!  My "it's not worth it" post makes you think it's worth it.  #backfire #facepalm

Disregard mcmcs, he's not right.

I said maybe, the pro of potentially locking scum into a claim as well as the pro of not wasting a cop shot on Gull, as well as the pro of not accidentally clearing an unclaimed scum!gull who lies. Might outweigh the con of forcing us to think about lynching gull later in the game due to the numbers.

Iím not convinced either way but there are more pros than I initially thought.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #98 on: February 23, 2019, 10:14:31 am »

Also important to note that all cops arenít guaranteed to be town so the chances that a town!cop hits gull is pretty low.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #99 on: February 23, 2019, 10:19:03 am »

Also important to note that all cops arenít guaranteed to be town so the chances that a town!cop hits gull is pretty low.
Yeah but it doesn't really matter for us whether a town Cop hits scum or a scum Cop hits other scum.
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