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Author Topic: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Perfect Mafia Victory!)  (Read 297048 times)

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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #250 on: January 27, 2019, 05:39:55 am »

Given that the pool size is definitely not three new players, the odds are even lower.
What does this mean?
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #251 on: January 27, 2019, 05:46:17 am »

Here's an interesting wagon:

Quote
MiX (5): Debatepro, arishipshape, shraeye, faust, Uncleeurope

Question to the crowd: How do you expect scum to react to this wagon?
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #252 on: January 27, 2019, 05:48:20 am »

There's a lot of discussion but I'm not sure anyone is scummy. No good cases so far.

I am, however, pretty sure that Debatepro is town, and arishipshape probably too. That's something.
"I have no scumreads but I'm going to townread some newbies."
- every scum ever.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #253 on: January 27, 2019, 05:52:55 am »

faust was sheeping shraeye's vote untill now...feels like the best time to abandon it, now that shraeye's reasoning is being questioned, but jumping to raerae makes him very scummy.

Not sure scum!faust would do such a blatant dodge, nevertheless, vote: faust, Dylan's STILL not here and my vote won't change it, will it.
I voted you to get some reactions going. I think it worked. You have a style that goes against the meta here and makes it easy to paint you as scummy, I wanted to see what would happen if scum thought they might get a lynch through on you.

Then raerae was being scummy and seemed like a better place for my vote. Note that raerae's scummy behaviour was in part triggered by the wagon on you, so my vote did its job.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #254 on: January 27, 2019, 05:55:24 am »

raerae sounds like classic town!raerae, though I think I remember her being able to do that regardless of alignment.

I got a fleeting scum vibe re: MiX. Sitting on it for now. Not worth jumping on the wagon.

vote: Dylan for pressure.
Can you specify how raerae sounds like classic town!raerae? I think I never got to be in a game with her so far, or maybe one short one only.

Also, how good are pressure votes if you announce that they are for pressure?
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #255 on: January 27, 2019, 05:58:33 am »

Tell me Faust, why should I not vote: faust?
Because I am town.
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silverspawn

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #256 on: January 27, 2019, 06:00:05 am »

There's a lot of discussion but I'm not sure anyone is scummy. No good cases so far.

I am, however, pretty sure that Debatepro is town, and arishipshape probably too. That's something.
"I have no scumreads but I'm going to townread some newbies."
- every scum ever.

do you disagree with the reads?

faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #257 on: January 27, 2019, 06:03:04 am »

This is directed at faust. ----- Are you just doing a bit with the quotes or do you have a role restriction regarding what you can post?  If I am correct you would not be able to answer with a "yes or no"... so how about this for now:
This is so convoluted that it is a bit scummy. I would think that scum finds my behaviour more puzzling; they know I'm not doing it because I'm scum, so they try to make some sense of it otherwise.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #258 on: January 27, 2019, 06:04:04 am »

Thus, in short: the scumteam is raerae, silver, DatSwan, and the prize more the most townie townzor who ever towned goes to Eddie.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #259 on: January 27, 2019, 06:05:39 am »

There's a lot of discussion but I'm not sure anyone is scummy. No good cases so far.

I am, however, pretty sure that Debatepro is town, and arishipshape probably too. That's something.
"I have no scumreads but I'm going to townread some newbies."
- every scum ever.

do you disagree with the reads?
Not particularly? I mean ari is pretty null at this point. Debatepro has a kind of typical newb!town paranoia about their posts.
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MiX

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #260 on: January 27, 2019, 06:56:42 am »

Dammit faust, you said what I was about to say, now I'll sound scummy for sheeping you...

The flavour claim is pretty bad, just look at the setup:

If they ask at night in the scum QT or at any time during the day in their private QT, scum players may ask me to create the PM I'd have sent them if they had some hypothetical role.  If they exactly name a role a town member has, I promise they will recieve the same rules text as that town role.  If they exactly name a flavor name and role name, I'll just give them your PM outright (with player name removed). I'll err on the side of giving scum more information over allowing them to be outed by flavor.  This may provide scum with additional information if they are clever and you do a lot of claiming or soft claiming.  You have been warned. Flavor claiming will only help scum.

Do you think flavour claiming won't favour scum? Or that the benefits of flavour claiming (for scum) aren't enough for you to flavour claim anyway?

The post that will essencially say what faust said is In Progress, I'll post it when I'm more avaiable, just wanted to get this out of the way for now.
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #261 on: January 27, 2019, 07:01:51 am »

faust was sheeping shraeye's vote untill now...feels like the best time to abandon it, now that shraeye's reasoning is being questioned, but jumping to raerae makes him very scummy.

Not sure scum!faust would do such a blatant dodge, nevertheless, vote: faust, Dylan's STILL not here and my vote won't change it, will it.
I voted you to get some reactions going. I think it worked. You have a style that goes against the meta here and makes it easy to paint you as scummy, I wanted to see what would happen if scum thought they might get a lynch through on you.

Then raerae was being scummy and seemed like a better place for my vote. Note that raerae's scummy behaviour was in part triggered by the wagon on you, so my vote did its job.

This is a bit of a cop-out, because it doesn't answer what you think about MiX.

faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #262 on: January 27, 2019, 08:06:22 am »

faust was sheeping shraeye's vote untill now...feels like the best time to abandon it, now that shraeye's reasoning is being questioned, but jumping to raerae makes him very scummy.

Not sure scum!faust would do such a blatant dodge, nevertheless, vote: faust, Dylan's STILL not here and my vote won't change it, will it.
I voted you to get some reactions going. I think it worked. You have a style that goes against the meta here and makes it easy to paint you as scummy, I wanted to see what would happen if scum thought they might get a lynch through on you.

Then raerae was being scummy and seemed like a better place for my vote. Note that raerae's scummy behaviour was in part triggered by the wagon on you, so my vote did its job.

This is a bit of a cop-out, because it doesn't answer what you think about MiX.
If I had additional thoughts to share about MiX, I would have.
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EFHW

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #263 on: January 27, 2019, 08:19:36 am »

@shraeye: So you picked out three people and not others to signal your reason for voting MiX?

@MiX: what did you think you had realized by looking closer?
Oh, and there ARE meaningful cases on me: Debatepro's, ari's and even shraeye's if you look closer, so it's not "for no reason".
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #264 on: January 27, 2019, 08:21:07 am »

[quote ]
If I had additional thoughts to share about MiX, I would have.
[/quote]
Where is this one from?
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silverspawn

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #265 on: January 27, 2019, 08:22:58 am »

Ok, so I think MiX is perfectly towny and the wagon is questionable. But I'll need to look at who's onn it to decide whether it makes them scummy. It's definitely one of the things to analyze this game.

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #266 on: January 27, 2019, 08:28:54 am »

I reread the game so far and I find that I agree with what has been said about MiX being scummy.

Developed some town reads, which is always helpful.

Holding off voting since it's so early, but once we have a rough consensus the day starts to feel over regardless.

PPE: silver
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #267 on: January 27, 2019, 08:31:17 am »

Wait, somehow I missed a whole bunch of new posts. Catching up.
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #268 on: January 27, 2019, 08:37:35 am »

Welp, Faust is back, and there is a lot to analyze, and I don’t really have time to analyze it as it is Sunday. I’ll do some large posts about my thoughts later today or tomorrow. For now, unvote
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EFHW

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #269 on: January 27, 2019, 08:41:38 am »

Ok, consensus is not so near after all.
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #270 on: January 27, 2019, 08:47:57 am »

raerae sounds like classic town!raerae, though I think I remember her being able to do that regardless of alignment.

I got a fleeting scum vibe re: MiX. Sitting on it for now. Not worth jumping on the wagon.

vote: Dylan for pressure.
Can you specify how raerae sounds like classic town!raerae? I think I never got to be in a game with her so far, or maybe one short one only.

Also, how good are pressure votes if you announce that they are for pressure?
Her style is to energetically question anything that is a bit off.

unvote

There wasn't any other reason to vote for him.

To answer your other question, the vote on ari was a policy vote.
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #271 on: January 27, 2019, 08:56:06 am »

The only problem I see with the flavor claim is that now scum can avoid that one name. If they guess his role, they could also get faust's PM. I don't advocate anyone else flavor claiming, though. Later I want to double check if they get safeclaims. On phone rn.
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #272 on: January 27, 2019, 09:06:10 am »

The only problem I see with the flavor claim is that now scum can avoid that one name. If they guess his role, they could also get faust's PM. I don't advocate anyone else flavor claiming, though. Later I want to double check if they get safeclaims. On phone rn.

Short phone post: scum flavour was picked randomly, everyone could be town
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #273 on: January 27, 2019, 09:49:02 am »

I reread the game so far and I find that I agree with what has been said about MiX being scummy.

Developed some town reads, which is always helpful.

Holding off voting since it's so early, but once we have a rough consensus the day starts to feel over regardless.

PPE: silver

This seems weird to me, already eager to end the day and move on? Calm down and enjoy the show. And I realize this was corrected by you not reading all the posts, but still, this mentality seems dangerous to me.

Plus the entirety of your posts have been very scarce with you only coming in to agree with a consensus, say you have town reads without any risk involved in the claim (because it was left as the quite simplistic: "Yo, I have town reads, fools." Like, what is the purpose of saying this to us other than to be like "I'm playing the game too, guys!"), then backed down from the consensus once it wasn't a consensus. (Well, maybe not backed down, but still.)

And since my current vote isn't generating any discussion I may as well Vote: AFEW

(Vote: EFHW <-Just in case)
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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #274 on: January 27, 2019, 12:43:22 pm »

I'm not sure if shraeye's case is towny or not...some things are dead on while others are clearly misinterpreting what I've said:

So here is why my vote went onto MiX.  Two reasons, both small.

First; calling out some people but not others. 
I completely missed Uncleeurope...odd, maybe it's because I've actually seen him play.

I like wagons too, just not the current ones, those guys are my top townreads!

...I STILL want something from shraeye, his wife already talked, why can't he?

At this point Dylan had not posted.  The fact that he wants input from others so emphatically (but not from all) is incongruous.

I wasn't on dylan but I was on shraeye, so I wanted him to talk, so I could move my vote elsewhere...in retrospect, I should've asked both, given that I simply swapped to dylan...but at the moment that was my reasoning.

Second; he is very worried about votes on him while claiming not to be

To be honest, I disregard the first vote on me, especially one right from the start of the game.

Here he scumreads someone for voting on him.  Devil-may-care + OMGUS = more incongruous.

Oh, thank you LaLight, was that for me? Regardless, FoS: LaLight, seems opportunist, maybe it's just the OMGUS talking, but still.

Note how I said the FIRST vote, not all; everyone should be worried about their votes, if everyone thinks I'm scummy, I need to fight back somehow.

LaLight's vote for me came unexplained and it felt like an attempt at joining a wagon for virtually no reason...seemed like the kind of low effort posts scum would do, but on the other hand it felt TOO scummy to be made by scum...so I just said "FoS" and went on my way. Then LaLight said that he "loved" ari, and that explained the vote more (sheeping my townread is acceptable), so I backed off.



Now my reactions to your vote...at first I was thinking you would explain the vote sooner, so I asked for said explanation. Then, seeing that faust voted for me without saying anything new, I came to the (at the time) only logical conclusion: the purpose of your vote was for pressure. You had a reason behind the vote, whatever it was, but the motive was clear, so I backed off: if you don't want to say what it is, who am I to push it?

Now, knowing the meaning, I approached it as a normal case, the case being whatever the initial reason was, which for me meant a minor slip (like me buddying or maybe just the way I worded things, I didn't know what, but I knew that town!shraeye and scum!shraeye would have some backing to that vote), so I mentioned it when stating cases on me; didn't want to leave out any information, that would just be scummy for no reason, more info is good.

Then raerae said there's no reason: well, there's just no way shraeye would do that play without a reason, so I told her to look closer; by doing so, she would come to the same conclusion that I did: the motive was pressure (note how I said the "meaningfulness" exists if you look closer, not the reason; after all, you could only guess at it, and raerae already stated she did not want to).

Then, after raerae continued to push me on why I thought shraeye's case existed in the first place, I said what I'm saying now: I did something that he thought was scummy and he voted me based on those reasons; at that point, some time had passed and shraeye hadn't said what the scummy thing was, so I asked for it: whatever it was must've been good enough to vote, but was it enough to maintain it? I was also on the process of destroying my early wagon, and that vote was part of it.



And there you have it, that is all I have to say about shraeye's case, as for shraeye himself...I feel like too many people are finding me scummy for this case to be scummy, there was some effort so I'll consider it null for now.

PPE all the way since faust's awakening, including my posts.
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