Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Teproc]

To go back to relevant topics: what is the narrative for scum!faust claiming here ? Why did he do that ?

It's literally the same play I made in M100 as scum and carried to a 4 consecutive day mislynch to win for scum.

It's the beauty of the claim. It works perfectly from a town or scum perspective  regardless of alignment I believe Faust is telling the truth.

I simply believe he's scum, not town. I'll detail the read further when I get home - but I've done so previously already.

It shouldn't have though. You should have lost at lylo. My problem here is that there was no urgency for faust to claim.

If you want to look at your play, faust claims makes sense in exactly the same way that yours does. In that it doesn't, it's a terrible play, and terrible plays are townie.

[Teproc]

I'm not actually interested in this discussion. Unless I missed skumpy saying he could confirm the roleblocking - and I'm pretty sure I didn't - there's no reason for a Doctor to claim.

[Teproc]

Now if you want to explain why faust is scum, great, I'm listening, but you won't convince me that the claim is scummy,find something else.

[Galzria]

So, Skumpy, Galzria, DatSwan are voting for me, Xx, RR, chairs, Andrew signaled they don't believe me... so everyone is willing to lynch me except maybe Teproc? Sound familiar?

Yes, but we know much more today then we did yesterday.

ALright.

faust's claim makes perfect sense to me. Skumpy thinks it's scummy for faust to have changed his reads a lot: it is most definitely not, scum is generally more confident and consistent than town.

Galz, surprisingly, seems to find his choice of target scummy, but you would never, never roleblock the scummiest player around if you were trying to block the kill, because that's not the player the scumteam chooses to do the kill. Skumpy is a perfectly viable choice: wouldn't have been mine but if you're having serious doubts about him, it's a great choice eespecially bhecause there's a very real chance it completely clears Skumpy at some point. This setup makes that a bit difficult, but it's possible. It does make Skumpy even townier than he was in any case.

Now, faust is an excellent player, and is very able to do this very credible claim as scum. In fact his frustration might be of the "But I did everything like town!me would have, why doesn't anyone see that ?" variety. Possible, but that's not the vibe I get, and mostly I think faust is town from the whole game.

Oh yeah, I'm done with being cagey with my reads. My lynch pool today is

Andrew
RR
DatSwan
chairs
XXR

With the bottom being the scummiest, roughly. I am pretty convinced Galz is town, as I don't remember him being the type to feign not reading the setup as scum. The Rolestopper thing in particular, but that might not have been rolled... I will say that if there is a Watcher, they should be very confident that Galz is town. This is not an incitation to claim, at all, to be clear, but something to keep in mind if a Watcher does flip at some point.

vote: XXR

I just find it very suspicious that me getting roleblocked leads to "Unfortunately, you're town". If I'm skum team, I'm not making night kills based on who might get tracked/watched, I'm making them based on who has a role that is least important to use tonight. There'd be a 1/3 chance I'm a flavor cop (if we believe faust), in which case, there's no way I' d commit the kill. And scum isn't trying to get a clean sweep, they're trying to win. If that means potentially throwing their scummiest player under the bus, then why not? Faust roleblockling Galzria does nothing, for instance, to convince me Galzria's more town. I don't need to be more cleared and it will absolutely never 'completely clear me'. And yes, I think it's very scummy to block me over DatSwan, based on faust's posts yesterday.


Since everybody's chimed in well enough to their faust reads, here's my theory.

First off, looking back at it, obviously I was roleblocked. If faust is town, then he's not lying. If he's scum, then that means mod 1 is on and mod 2 is off (otherwise, he wouldn't claim it), meaning there's no flavor cop, meaning scum wouldn't know anything about my role. That means if they falsely claim to roleblock me and I was a PR who challenged him, then I would instantly call him out. faust may walk the walk and talk the talk, but he's not winning a WIFOM against me. It could be that mod 3, 4, 5 are all off, but that's quite unlikely to be the case. But it's still important for me to tell everybody if I know if I was indeed roleblocked, he says. That's not true whatsoever.

So if faust is scum, that means scum knows there's a doctor. It's also a small point in favor of Teproc not dying yet, but the 1-shot commuter is probably a bigger factor even if I am correct. Scum wants to kill TWM (Teproc's a risk). As I said before, that doesn't seem odd to me - nobody except XX has seriously accused him, and maybe his reads are good enough that he's considered a threat.

Let's assume that Galzria and Datswan are not town PR's lying to hide their roles (it's a possibility, but I hope not). So let's make the scum team faust/Galzria/Datswan to give scum minimum information possible about town PR's. Now TWM's getting killed and scum knows there's a doctor in one of Andrew/Chairs/RR/XX/Skumpy. Of those 5, if they were a doctor, which of those 5 would be most likely to heal TWM? Correct. So I get roleblocked.

I'd guess that mod 3 is probably off based on this. Otherwise, Rolestopping TWM would've taken care of both possibilities of healing and watching him (also, no watcher information this game yet), though it's not crazy to both Rolestop TWM and roleblock me, especially if I was tracker.

Which I why I'd also guess that mod 4 is on. Otherwise, I don't see why faust would come out and admit to roleblocking me unless he knew there was a chance someone would catch him, and with me, Galzria, and TWM starting to throw suspicion his way, he's a good candidate for the tracker's target.

I'm not sure about mod 5. I'd lean slightly towards on just to a) deny faust a very believable claim and b) try to add some credibility to roleblockling me.


It's my theory against his "I decided you were scum because you didn't vote Jake and you OMGUS'ed even though literally everybody had been willing to vote for an innocent person, and now that you've been roleblocked once, I'm now absolutely convinced you're town".


Now onto a post about the Teproc-on-XX vote! Hold tight!

[Teproc]

Well, when I specifically asked skumpy to say something he didn't, so I took this as a more general "faust is probably a roleblocker of either alignment" thing. But Skumpy can clarify that now, please ?

[Teproc]

While I think of it: Skumpy, I assume from your reaction that you have nothing to says that infirms faust having roleblocked you ? That is, either you're a VT and have no idea either way or you're a PR who has no way of knowing whether or not your action went through. I'll take silence as a yes, but I just want to be sure you took this into consideration, since you're new.

And I will assume you're not asking me to claim. If you want me to claim, I can. Frankly, I don't see why this matters. If he's town, he's telling the truth. If he's scum, he knows mod 2 is off, so he claims it. There's a 75% chance scum has a roleblocker, and I very much think that if he's scum, he (or somebody) did in fact roleblock me as he said.

This is what I'm referring to.

[Skumpy]

You've detailed your reasoning and it included notions about who to roleblock which I think ar completely wrong.

I assume this is directed to me: If you were scum and you had a roleblocker, what would you do? Maybe I'm just looking too hard for a narrative against faust, but I think my logic is much more sound than 'I roleblocked you. OK, you're clean!' Give me a better strategy than roleblock-the-guy-most-likely-to-save-or-watch-TWM-who-also-hasn't-claimed-a-role.

To go back to relevant topics: what is the narrative for scum!faust claiming here ? Why did he do that ?

He claimed when I threatened him with information against him which I didn't expect him to believe. Maybe he thought I was watcher or tracker and saw night 1 that he was a PR, and thought it would raise more suspicion if he didn't claim yet. If someone said to me 'I know you're a PR', I would make them spill the beans first before I confirm it. I didn't see him indicate he was planning on claiming, but it'd be strange for him to criticize Galzria for doing it yesterday and then do it himself today.

I never said I knew for an absolute fact he blocked me, I said I'm pretty damn sure he blocked me because there's no reason for him to lie or to risk lying. Again, give me an explanation for why he would lie about roleblockling me as scum. There's a 87.5% chance we have either a watcher/tracker/UB-turned-Cop. Since I don't believe there's a flavor cop, I don't think he can risk claiming to block me without knowing my role. If he's wrong, he's dead meat.

PPE: A Lot

[Skumpy]

Yes, I mean I believe he is a roleblocker, and he is either Town mod 2 or Scum mod 1. I believed he was scum before, and claiming roleblocker has not influenced my belief, other than the fact that I was the target. I have said a lot against him this entire game, both before and after the claim.

[Teproc]

Galz: as a scum RB, would you have targeted skumpy ? I know I wouldn't have.

[Teproc]

No surprises there.

Vote: Faust

No surprises indeed. Unfortunately, you are town.

I don't see why faust would think you hav info there, he even refers to the fact that you suspctd him before.

[Skumpy]

No, this post.

No surprises there.

Vote: Faust

No surprises indeed. Unfortunately, you are town.

That's very kind of you to say. It doesn't really convince me about anything, but kind nonetheless. In the meantime, I would suggest claiming your role before I present more evidence against you.

So essentially, it's because faust's read on you changed dramatically ?

That and the other 2 things I said in the exact same post. I said yesterday I thought it was either him or Jake. I voted for him then, and nothing's changed my mind since.


I agree with Chairs .... I was not expecting faust to take my threat seriously and immediately claim, which is very odd to me.

I mentioned twice on day 2 that I had picked up on something nobody else had. This is what it was.

But even if there is, suppose I'm Precise Alarm Clock (Doctor, mod 1)

A) I'm the doctor (mod 1 is working). In which case, I claim doctor, and either IC myself or set up a WIFOM with 1 scum.

B) I'm the not-doctor (mod 1 is not working). In which case, I can claim "I ain't no doc, but I know nobody here ain't no doc neither!" Which again either IC's myself or sets up a WIFOM.

Wouldn't this just instantly clear like half the town? Am I missing something?

You are missing that if there is no player with the flavor name Precise Alarm Clock if the modification1 is no active. Instead, an additional Good Memories (VT) is added. So it is not possible for a single player to claim "not-Doctor", and it is possible for scum to fakelclaim since they know exactly what modifications are present.

Which is strange because the flavor name is Good Memory, not Good Memories, as faust incorrectly stated. If you were a VT and you saw in your QT 'Good Memory' in giant green letters, you're not going to forget it. Obviously, he could be a PR, but there were only 2.5 expected PRs for town, versus 3 for scum. The odds were against him, and I'm very sorry I didn't get a chance to point this out yesterday and maybe save Jake. Sadly, it does us no good today.

faust, who did you roleblock night 1?


PPE: For Teproc: I apologize, I apparently did not ask enough questions At least I'm not the only who didn't get it, I thought they were the same. Still does not in any shape or form justify faust roleblockling (that's autocorrected: I'm keeping it cause I like the term), and his response makes no sense whatsoever.

[Teproc]

I don't know how any of this indicates that scum could hav been worried you had a result on him ?

[Teproc]

scum!faust*

[Skumpy]

I said 'claim your role, I have evidence against you'. Which he instantly did. That's all the facts. The question is now, as you said before, "Why would he claim then and there?" Note he didn't claim in his first post like Galzria did on day 2. If you think he was going to claim early on just to clear me: first off, I don't care what you say, roleblocker is not the role that should be clearing people, especially with 3 scum alive. I didn't need or want clearing, I didn't get any votes day 2, and nobody suspected me except XX and apparently faust suddenly. I think he should have been more worried about keeping his own role hidden so he's not a target.

For the record, I suspect XX and faust are teamed together, and your lynch today could be correct, and if needed, I can switch to XX. I'm happy to unvote for now to keep options open, but my vote is hovering dangerously close to faust's head still.

[Galzria]

Faust "cleared" Skumpy on the following opinion:

"I know you didn't perform the kill, so I you're town."

First: That logic simply has no validity. The kill could've come from 3 locations. The fact that Skumpy didn't do it DOESN'T clear him or make him town.

Second: Skumpy is, regardless of alignment, almost certainly a PR. The likelihood that, as scum, he performed the kill is probably even less than 1/3 - PR's gonna PR, Goon's gonna Goon.

Third: Combining the two above - the likelihood that blocking Skumpy told Faust absolutely anything about Skumpy's alignment is next to nothing. Yet "Unfortunately, you are town."

[Teproc]

Your "evidence" post was not meant to i dicate night action evidence right ? I didnt thi k so and dont see why he would.

I gzt that you don't think targeting you made sense for a town RB but you are simply wrong on this. It made perfevt sesne, and if faust is scum that's why he claimed it.

Ppe: well i disageee with literally everything in this post.

[Galzria]

Your "evidence" post was not meant to i dicate night action evidence right ? I didnt thi k so and dont see why he would.

I gzt that you don't think targeting you made sense for a town RB but you are simply wrong on this. It made perfevt sesne, and if faust is scum that's why he claimed it.

Ppe: well i disageee with literally everything in this post.

I don't get how you disagree with it.  Skumpy is a PR. If scum he was the LEAST likely person to perform the kill.

[Skumpy]

I don't get how you disagree with it.  Skumpy is a PR. If scum he was the LEAST likely person to perform the kill.

Why am I a PR again?

[Teproc]

When faust claimed to have blocked skumpy, I wrote something in my QT something to the effect of "well tjat basically ckear skumpy". It doesnt matter if I'm wrong actually, its sufficient to prive thag tiwn can rhink tbat so move on from that freakinf point because it doesnt hold water for the uptenth freaking time.

[Teproc]

Hate phoneposting so much

[Skumpy]

When faust claimed to have blocked skumpy, I wrote something in my QT something to the effect of "well tjat basically ckear skumpy". It doesnt matter if I'm wrong actually, its sufficient to prive thag tiwn can rhink tbat so move on from that freakinf point because it doesnt hold water for the uptenth freaking time.

It's TWM's job to drink, not yours.

[Teproc]

Anyway I've bee  working under the assumption that skumpy was a VT from d1 and assumed sxum was too. I truly dont understand how youre plauing this game Galz.

[Galzria]

When faust claimed to have blocked skumpy, I wrote something in my QT something to the effect of "well tjat basically ckear skumpy". It doesnt matter if I'm wrong actually, its sufficient to prive thag tiwn can rhink tbat so move on from that freakinf point because it doesnt hold water for the uptenth freaking time.

It's a horribly invalid opinion though.

[Teproc]

IT DOESNT MATTER. TOWN IS WRONG ALL THE FREAKING TIME. you know that. Come on.

[Galzria]

Anyway I've bee  working under the assumption that skumpy was a VT from d1 and assumed sxum was too. I truly dont understand how youre plauing this game Galz.

Almost all of Skumpy's posts have indicated he's had some sort of information.