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[Dylan32]

Vote: Dylan this is L-1

Reasons:

1. Spaces claim analysis does seem to give Sudgy towncred, Sudgy's claim doesn't make perfect sense under the assumption that remaining scum is Strongman/RB
2. Original reason for Sudgy > Dylan was that a Sudgy lynch looked likelier to push through, and Galz was on it. Now it seems reasonably likely that either lynch could be pushed through and as I already stated I prefer Dylan.

You ignore that right below that, Space points out that my claim wasn't safe either, so I should get the same towncred sudgy does by that logic.

substantially less by the order

Why? More claims have happened by the time I claimed, and yet I still chose to claim one that wasn't safe? Why would lying scum me do that?

[O]

Vote: Dylan this is L-1

Reasons:

1. Spaces claim analysis does seem to give Sudgy towncred, Sudgy's claim doesn't make perfect sense under the assumption that remaining scum is Strongman/RB
2. Original reason for Sudgy > Dylan was that a Sudgy lynch looked likelier to push through, and Galz was on it. Now it seems reasonably likely that either lynch could be pushed through and as I already stated I prefer Dylan.

You ignore that right below that, Space points out that my claim wasn't safe either, so I should get the same towncred sudgy does by that logic.

substantially less by the order

Why? More claims have happened by the time I claimed, and yet I still chose to claim one that wasn't safe? Why would lying scum me do that?

Whos after you?

Awaclus -- I guess
Me -- I heavily hinted I was VT all of day 1
LaLight, Ashersky, Iguana -- hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
e - I guess
Roadrunner - I guess

[SpaceAnemone]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive? Who has time for that? Luckily the other things I really have to do this afternoon are listening to a bunch of choir repertoire (which stacks nicely with sitting around on the internet anyway), a load of house-cleaning, and going for a run... so the pressure for f.ds procrastination is really strong :-P

First, though, let me get one other thing out of my system. What's the chance of Awaclus not being a true IC? Has anyone else out there worried about it enough to have gone and reviewed all the discussion of possibilities for bus-driving and other role-based interactions now that we've had so many flips and know whose words we should have trusted? I hope this is just my paranoia thinking out loud, or my poor memory forgetting that it's already been covered properly in a discussion I haven't re-read recently enough, but I'd appreciate it if one or two other people would report back on that front -- I feel like it's a less demanding task to delegate than a full re-read, at least! Any takers? :-)

[Awaclus]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive?

No, you just have to vote for O.

[SpaceAnemone]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive?

No, you just have to vote for O.

I'm re-reading him now on the grounds that if we don't lynch him, we don't get our IC back in the game. Which was what led me to wonder how definitely you're our IC...

[Awaclus]

IIRC faust made that consideration while he was still alive and concluded that it was not impossible but practically extremely unlikely that I was scum.

[Dylan32]

I think the only way he isn't IC is if e happpened to bus drive him and a townie the one night twm hid behind him.

[Dylan32]

Phone posting. Pardon spelling

[Dylan32]

Vote: Dylan this is L-1

Reasons:

1. Spaces claim analysis does seem to give Sudgy towncred, Sudgy's claim doesn't make perfect sense under the assumption that remaining scum is Strongman/RB
2. Original reason for Sudgy > Dylan was that a Sudgy lynch looked likelier to push through, and Galz was on it. Now it seems reasonably likely that either lynch could be pushed through and as I already stated I prefer Dylan.

You ignore that right below that, Space points out that my claim wasn't safe either, so I should get the same towncred sudgy does by that logic.

substantially less by the order

Why? More claims have happened by the time I claimed, and yet I still chose to claim one that wasn't safe? Why would lying scum me do that?

Whos after you?

Awaclus -- I guess
Me -- I heavily hinted I was VT all of day 1
LaLight, Ashersky, Iguana -- hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
e - I guess
Roadrunner - I guess

e verified he was above me and got slot 13 at the end of the e vs rr thing. So my claim wasn't safe until long after the Mara claim was actually over.

[Dylan32]

Mass* claim

[O]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive? Who has time for that? Luckily the other things I really have to do this afternoon are listening to a bunch of choir repertoire (which stacks nicely with sitting around on the internet anyway), a load of house-cleaning, and going for a run... so the pressure for f.ds procrastination is really strong :-P

First, though, let me get one other thing out of my system. What's the chance of Awaclus not being a true IC? Has anyone else out there worried about it enough to have gone and reviewed all the discussion of possibilities for bus-driving and other role-based interactions now that we've had so many flips and know whose words we should have trusted? I hope this is just my paranoia thinking out loud, or my poor memory forgetting that it's already been covered properly in a discussion I haven't re-read recently enough, but I'd appreciate it if one or two other people would report back on that front -- I feel like it's a less demanding task to delegate than a full re-read, at least! Any takers? :-)

We have

1. No claimed protective townroles outside of Galzria, who is town if Awaclus is scum
2. No real way to doctor/protect a hider in the first place, since action priority etc. I don't believe doctor/JKing Awaclus does anything for TWM either.

So... One shot commuter? In the same slot as Restless Sheeper? (and if Awaclus is scum, we have Galzria and Jake confirmed town getting 2/3 of the rando slots. Did someone else confirm the third random slot?)

TLDR not seeing it. 

[Dylan32]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive? Who has time for that? Luckily the other things I really have to do this afternoon are listening to a bunch of choir repertoire (which stacks nicely with sitting around on the internet anyway), a load of house-cleaning, and going for a run... so the pressure for f.ds procrastination is really strong :-P

First, though, let me get one other thing out of my system. What's the chance of Awaclus not being a true IC? Has anyone else out there worried about it enough to have gone and reviewed all the discussion of possibilities for bus-driving and other role-based interactions now that we've had so many flips and know whose words we should have trusted? I hope this is just my paranoia thinking out loud, or my poor memory forgetting that it's already been covered properly in a discussion I haven't re-read recently enough, but I'd appreciate it if one or two other people would report back on that front -- I feel like it's a less demanding task to delegate than a full re-read, at least! Any takers? :-)

We have

1. No claimed protective townroles outside of Galzria, who is town if Awaclus is scum
2. No real way to doctor/protect a hider in the first place, since action priority etc. I don't believe doctor/JKing Awaclus does anything for TWM either.

So... One shot commuter? In the same slot as Restless Sheeper? (and if Awaclus is scum, we have Galzria and Jake confirmed town getting 2/3 of the rando slots. Did someone else confirm the third random slot?)

TLDR not seeing it.

Did you even read my post? E rr and I all claimed going for the 3rd random slot. e got it and flipped bus driver.

[Dylan32]

And why would we need a protective role for the hider anyway? He could hide behind any town and live.

[sudgy]

Now that I'm rereading his claim, that last part just seems like he was trying to hard to explain it. Like UB isn't one of the roles where anyone would say "Why would you go for that?" so why make a point of rationalizing it?  And for the info about no one claiming slot 3, that's in the claim summary posts by faust, so try to find one of those. I think there is one roughly page 125ish, but I don't have time to go back and dig anymore right now.

I've never heard any discussion of UB and have no idea how good or bad it is.  I still don't know.

Vote: Dylan this is L-1

Reasons:

1. Spaces claim analysis does seem to give Sudgy towncred, Sudgy's claim doesn't make perfect sense under the assumption that remaining scum is Strongman/RB
2. Original reason for Sudgy > Dylan was that a Sudgy lynch looked likelier to push through, and Galz was on it. Now it seems reasonably likely that either lynch could be pushed through and as I already stated I prefer Dylan.

You ignore that right below that, Space points out that my claim wasn't safe either, so I should get the same towncred sudgy does by that logic.

Why doesn't his claim make sense? He claimed targeting a role in a slot that already had a role confirmed from it. Note that sudgy didn't claim the slot he targeted. Only the role. He didn't claim slot until later, which left him the flexibility to change it later if need be.

PPE 1

How in the world can you go for a role but not go for its slot?  You can't try for a random slot hoping that the role is in there.

I'm somewhat around until deadline now.  I have some family stuff today and I have to sleep tonight, but there's nothing else really.

I'm liking Dylan more now because he seems to be flailing.

[O]

Urgh, am I really going to have to do full re-reads of everyone left alive? Who has time for that? Luckily the other things I really have to do this afternoon are listening to a bunch of choir repertoire (which stacks nicely with sitting around on the internet anyway), a load of house-cleaning, and going for a run... so the pressure for f.ds procrastination is really strong :-P

First, though, let me get one other thing out of my system. What's the chance of Awaclus not being a true IC? Has anyone else out there worried about it enough to have gone and reviewed all the discussion of possibilities for bus-driving and other role-based interactions now that we've had so many flips and know whose words we should have trusted? I hope this is just my paranoia thinking out loud, or my poor memory forgetting that it's already been covered properly in a discussion I haven't re-read recently enough, but I'd appreciate it if one or two other people would report back on that front -- I feel like it's a less demanding task to delegate than a full re-read, at least! Any takers? :-)

We have

1. No claimed protective townroles outside of Galzria, who is town if Awaclus is scum
2. No real way to doctor/protect a hider in the first place, since action priority etc. I don't believe doctor/JKing Awaclus does anything for TWM either.

So... One shot commuter? In the same slot as Restless Sheeper? (and if Awaclus is scum, we have Galzria and Jake confirmed town getting 2/3 of the rando slots. Did someone else confirm the third random slot?)

TLDR not seeing it.

Did you even read my post? E rr and I all claimed going for the 3rd random slot. e got it and flipped bus driver.

Right, so we have no real confirmation that the remaining scum couldn't have the third random slot instead of SK!e. Either way it's unlikely.

And we choose to believe that town!TWM is truthful when he says he hid behind Awaclus. So i was checking for ways that town!TWM could hide behind scum!Awaclus and still love.

[SpaceAnemone]

Right, so we have no real confirmation that the remaining scum couldn't have the third random slot instead of SK!e. Either way it's unlikely.

And we choose to believe that town!TWM is truthful when he says he hid behind Awaclus. So i was checking for ways that town!TWM could hide behind scum!Awaclus and still love.

If you're thinking like that, doesn't it imply scum!Galz anyway? We know e can't have gotten his bus-driving from slot 6 because of the masons, which Jimmmmm said he got from that slot. So it has to have been one of the random ones. Jake claimed to have picked up Tracker from slot 12, so if e didn't get his bus-driving from 13, then it has to have come from 11, which is the slot Galz claims.

I'm pretty certain that town!TWM thinks he hid behind Awaclus on N1. And looking back through Robz's rules clarifications, his words at #2592 kind of imply that the situation hadn't come up already in the game so far, though I realise that's more info than he'd probably like us to be taking from that post. Anyway, I think I'm comfortable leaving Awaclus as IC for another day, unless anyone else has come up with anything?

[SpaceAnemone]

I'm still quite torn. I thought I'd drop some useful stuff in-thread while I deliberate. Re-reading is hard and long :-(

Voting history for Dylan
Day 1: Jake (#292), TWM (#436), JR (#883)
Day 2: Space (#1765), sudgy (#2054), Andrew (#2303), Not Voting (#2305), sudgy (#2359), Cuzz (#2422)
Day 3: sudgy (#2915)
Day 4: No votes
Day 5: iguana (#3747)
Day 6: sudgy (#3793), LL (#3996)
Day 7: sudgy (#4050), Not Voting (#4057), Galz (#4064), sudgy (#4102)


Voting history for sudgy
Day 1: TWM (#508), JR (#979), TWM (#1055), JR (#1186)
Day 2: TWM (#1584), Not Voting (#1950), Andrew (#2287), Cuzz (#2405)
Day 3: ash (#2795), e (#3244)
Day 4: ash (#3441)
Day 5: Space (#3765)
Day 6: faust (#3877)
Day 7: Dylan (#4069)


Voting history for RR
Day 1: mcmc (#1298)
Day 2: Andrew (#2478), Not Voting (#2486), Andrew (#2522), Not Voting (#2528)
Day 3: iguana (#2637), Jimmmmm (#2894), Not Voting (#2939), e (#3005)
Day 4: No votes
Day 5: iguana (#3740)
Day 6: faust (#3921), Not Voting (#3969), LL (#3985)
Day 7: O (#4059), Dylan (#4107)


Voting history for O
Day 1: Not Voting (#260), RR (#358), Awaclus (#678), LL (#1221), Not Voting (#1256), Awaclus (#1345)
Day 2: faust (#1539), Space (#1600), faust (#1931), ash (#2151), Andrew (#2286), faust (#2445), Andrew (#2477), Not Voting (#2567)
Day 3: faust (#2664), Not Voting (#2668), ash (#2721)
Day 4: ash (#3412), Not Voting (#3473)
Day 5: Space (#3612), faust (#3684), Space (#3691)
Day 6: Space (#3861), faust (#3966), LL (#4020)
Day 7: sudgy (#4099), Dylan (#4117)


Voting history for Galz
Day 1: JR (#571), Not Voting (#1140), LL (#1207)
Day 2: Dylan (#1755), Andrew (#2557), Not Voting (#2568)
Day 3: ash (#2794), Not Voting (#3085), e (#3119)
Day 4: Not Voting (#3555)
Day 5: No votes
Day 6: sudgy (#3783)
Day 7: sudgy (#4091)


Voting history for Space
Day 1: LL (#144), mcmc (#974), JR (#1382)
Day 2: Cuzz (#2432)
Day 3: e (#3315)
Day 4: iguana (#3475), ash (#3549)
Day 5: iguana (#3617)
Day 6: LL (#3860)
Day 7: No votes


Voting history for Awaclus
Day 1: e (#461), O (#698)
Day 2: O (#1545)
Day 3: No votes
Day 4: No votes
Day 5: O (#3682), iguana (#3768)
Day 6: sudgy (#3870)
Day 7: O (#4065)

[Robz888]

Vote Count 7.6

O (1): Awaclus
Dylan32 (3): sudgy, RoadRunner7671, O
sudgy (2): Galzria, Dylan32

Not Voting (1): SpaceAnemone

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch. Day 7 ends Monday, July 3, At 2:00 PM Forum Time.

[SpaceAnemone]

Here's another way of looking at the votes. I wanted to see whether any of the bussing scums had voted for any of our remaining players in a bussy sort of way. Sadly they don't seem to be making life so easy for me, but I thought I'd post a summary anyway. Actually, I'll post the whole thing inside a code box; if you want to read it, past the content into a post and then preview it to get a coloured-up version :-)

The weirdest thing I've spotted is that the only people LL didn't vote for are: gkrieg, Calamitas, Eevee, PPS, Iguana, Cuzz, Jake (and himself). Everyone else got a vote from LL at some stage in the game. It's like he went round purposefully trying to make sure he'd planted a vote on everyone to confuse wagon-gazing!

As for the rest:

• Galz gets a number of early-game votes from scum. I think that's mostly indicative of him having been an active early-game player, though.
   
• Faust gets a couple of later scum votes. I'm leaving the already-dead players in the code box below this because I figure it's helpful to have a known-town baseline for comparison.
   
• LL got zero known-mafia votes for the whole game, which is kind of interesting. Awaclus's vote-receiving pattern isn't very interesting at all.
   
• I have the same number of scum votes as Galz, but mostly from LL, who knows I read him reasonably well, and iguana because of TWM's hiding.
   
• The fact that LL is the only known scum on the e wagon is still a bit troubling, because I expect scum to want rid of the SK. Unless maybe RR is one of their own and they didn't want to risk having us go after him if e flipped town? That's something I hadn't considered. RR was on the e wagon himself, but he'd have had less choice in the matter.
   
• Dylan has more days of receiving no votes than anyone other than Awaclus. The only scum vote he has is a single push from LL.
   
• RR also has a single LL vote. The faust vote at #3885 stands out a little for some reason. I want to follow up on stuff RR said to bring that on.
   
• Iguana wasn't bussed by any known scum, but with Dylan and RR on his lynch wagon, a bus is still possible.
   
• O's votes don't particularly stand out either. He also got a D6 boop from LL.
   
• sudgy looks a lot like the others, but with an added Dylan tunnel, and more interest from other people D6.
   

Code: [Select]

[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]JR[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#332), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#513), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#571), [color=purple]e[/color] (#876), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#883), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#886), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#902), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#979), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#991), [color=limegreen]gkrieg[/color] (#1015), [color=red]LL[/color] (#1155), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#1168), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#1186), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#1319), [color=black]Space[/color] (#1382), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#1396), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#1400)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]Galz[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=red]ash[/color] (#157), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#160), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#297), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#1253), [color=limegreen]JR[/color] (#1296), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#1386)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=red]iguana[/color] (#1773)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#2678), [color=red]LL[/color] (#2692)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA][color=black]Dylan[/color] (#4064)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]gkrieg[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#220), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#241), [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#1035)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]TWM[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]JR[/color] (#337), [color=red]ash[/color] (#343), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#370), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#436), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#508), [color=purple]e[/color] (#706), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#713), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#1055)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=black]sudgy[/color] (#1584)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2655)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=red]Calamitas[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]faust[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#1539), [color=black]O[/color] (#1931), [color=black]O[/color] (#2445)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#2664)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=red]ash[/color] (#3409)[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#3684)[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=black]sudgy[/color] (#3877), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3919), [color=black]RR[/color] (#3921), [color=black]O[/color] (#3966)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=red]LL[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=black]Space[/color] (#144), [color=purple]e[/color] (#171), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#239), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#272), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#1207), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#1211), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#1219), [color=black]O[/color] (#1221)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#3405)[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3819), [color=black]Space[/color] (#3860), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3930), [color=black]RR[/color] (#3985), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#3996), [color=black]O[/color] (#4020)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#678), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#692), [color=red]LL[/color] (#884), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#1343), [color=black]O[/color] (#1345), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#1390)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]Space[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#142)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#1583), [color=black]O[/color] (#1600), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#1650), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#1765), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#2419)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=red]iguana[/color] (#3434)[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#3612), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#3620), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3646), [color=black]O[/color] (#3691), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#3765)[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#3861)[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=purple]e[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#186), [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#461)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2385)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2620), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2853), [color=black]RR[/color] (#3005), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#3014), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3023), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3116), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#3118), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#3119), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#3244), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#3272), [color=purple]e[/color] (#3276), [color=limegreen]Jimmmmm[/color] (#3307), [color=black]Space[/color] (#3315), [color=limegreen]Jimmmmm[/color] (#3319), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3321), [color=purple]e[/color] (#3322), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#3323)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]PPS[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]JR[/color] (#146), [color=limegreen]gkrieg[/color] (#206), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#235)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]Dylan[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=black]Galz[/color] (#1755), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#2265), [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#2295)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#3864)[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA][color=black]sudgy[/color] (#4069), [color=black]RR[/color] (#4107), [color=black]O[/color] (#4117)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]RR[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#358), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#362), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#1070)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#2015)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#3066), [color=purple]e[/color] (#3231)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3885)[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=red]iguana[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#641)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#2501)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=purple]e[/color] (#2624), [color=black]RR[/color] (#2637)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=black]Space[/color] (#3475)[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3606), [color=black]Space[/color] (#3617), [color=black]RR[/color] (#3740), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#3747), [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#3768), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#3773)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Jimmmmm[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#1534)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#2887), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#2890), [color=red]LL[/color] (#2892), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#2893), [color=black]RR[/color] (#2894)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]O[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#182), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#187), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#196), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#640), [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#698)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#1545)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#3682)[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#3820)[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA][color=black]RR[/color] (#4059), [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#4065)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#808), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#849), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#1019)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#1555), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#1557), [color=purple]e[/color] (#1636), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#1956), [color=red]LL[/color] (#2090), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#2125), [color=black]O[/color] (#2286), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#2287), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#2299), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#2303), [color=black]O[/color] (#2477), [color=black]RR[/color] (#2478), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#2482), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#2483), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#2484), [color=black]RR[/color] (#2522), [color=limegreen]Jimmmmm[/color] (#2537), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#2547), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#2557), [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color] (#2558)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#245)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#1507), [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#1554), [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#1575), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#2405), [color=limegreen]PPS[/color] (#2406), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#2422), [color=limegreen]Andrew[/color] (#2427), [color=black]Space[/color] (#2432), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#2446), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#2454)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=red]ash[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#231), [color=red]LL[/color] (#243), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#429)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#2151), [color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#2187)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=black]O[/color] (#2721), [color=purple]e[/color] (#2770), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#2794), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#2795), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#3233), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3256), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#3266), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#3269), [color=purple]e[/color] (#3271), [color=purple]e[/color] (#3277), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3295)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3374), [color=red]LL[/color] (#3397), [color=black]O[/color] (#3412), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3426), [color=black]sudgy[/color] (#3441), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#3445), [color=black]Space[/color] (#3549), [color=red]iguana[/color] (#3569), [color=red]ash[/color] (#3591)[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]Jake[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=black]Dylan[/color] (#292)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=limegreen]mcmc[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Cuzz[/color] (#163), [color=purple]e[/color] (#173), [color=red]LL[/color] (#174), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#316), [color=limegreen]gkrieg[/color] (#489), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#644), [color=red]LL[/color] (#731), [color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#741), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#782), [color=black]Space[/color] (#974), [color=red]LL[/color] (#976), [color=black]RR[/color] (#1298)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]Jake[/color] (#1514), [color=limegreen]Jimmmmm[/color] (#1520)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]


[b]Vote-receiving history for [color=black]sudgy[/color][/b]
Day 1: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#548), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#570), [color=limegreen]Eevee[/color] (#1120)[/color]
Day 2: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#1703), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#2054), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2241), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#2359)[/color]
Day 3: [color=#AAA][color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#2911), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#2915), [color=limegreen]TWM[/color] (#2932)[/color]
Day 4: [color=#AAA][color=red]LL[/color] (#3390)[/color]
Day 5: [color=#AAA]No votes[/color]
Day 6: [color=#AAA][color=black]Galz[/color] (#3783), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#3793), [color=limegreen]faust[/color] (#3797), [color=limegreen]Awaclus[/color] (#3870)[/color]
Day 7: [color=#AAA][color=black]Dylan[/color] (#4050), [color=black]Galz[/color] (#4091), [color=black]O[/color] (#4099), [color=black]Dylan[/color] (#4102)[/color]


[SpaceAnemone]

Here's the RR post that prompted that faust vote I wanted to look at.

I have a secret weapon to confirm myself as town if need be, but that makes me a high NK target so I'd prefer not to.

RR, it got brushed off as a joke earlier, with LL's help. However, I'd like you to return to it now and explain what you were thinking about at the time. If you have a way to make yourself look more townie about now, I'd be very interested in hearing about it.

I note that your play here is not a million miles away from your lurky/absent play in RMM43, which you just won as part of the scum faction with faust and Haddock, and which we can now talk about.

The thing that mostly cleared you so far in M100 is that you had the head-to-head with e over the claiming exercise, but e could absolutely have guessed a scum slot rather than a town slot. I think that it's likely you actually had the draft place and role slot you claimed, rather than that you're a secret strongman, but you're also smart enough to have decided to wifom us by not taking Galz out last night and you had an extra incentive to get rid of faust because the two of you have just been scum buddies together.

Other factors in favour of RR being scum:

• It puts another scum on the e wagon, and I feel like that wagon is missing a scum at the moment. (The other on-wagon people without known faction are Galz and sudgy).
   
• Along with Galz and Dylan, RR could be the off-wagon scum at the ash lynch. That feels right. Again, Galz also fits the profile.
   
• He was on the iguana wagon, but faust did rather push him into it. He was actually pushing to lynch both me and iguana on consecutive days.
   
• His jump onto the faust wagon at #3921 involved agreeing in a maybe-scummy manner with LL, who said that sudgy had a surprisingly good faust case. The interaction just doesn't sit well with me.
  

That's maybe more gut and wagon-gazing than real logic, but if anyone else has stuff to add, please go ahead!

[SpaceAnemone]

In terms of my other re-reads, I went through a lot of O posts, and other than the fact that I find the pro-fun attitude stuff to be at odds with his desire to push for information and discussion on PRs from very early in the game, I don't think he's all that likely to be our scum, because there's good townie play in there too.

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O re-read. 382 game posts so far.

He comes straight into the game pretty much broadcasting what to expect of his playstyle, so at least he's consistent. I spent the early game not really having much of a picture in my head of him relative to the other oldies I don't know. I do note that this is the sort of playstyle that winds me up really easily, so that's likely to colour my re-read. I'll try and compensate for that afterwards.

#169 Already not in favour of a mass claim for fun-related reasons.

#270 He's made a malformed vote on LL, but with a decent argument behind it around thinking LL would have the top spot and that town would have picked IC over vig.

#278 Makes a softclaim about not rolling a low draft number, not being vig/immune etc.

#584 This is interesting because he's doing exactly the kind of info-fishing I pushed for later on with the massclaim, but kind of claiming that it's nothing to do with a massclaim. Probably an issue of semantics more than anything else. It fits with being a VT who wants something more evidence-based to go on, though I guess it could also fit with being scum and wanting extra info that could be used later in whatever he sees a massclaim going like.

#604/#605 I actually agree totally with what O was doing, but I think D1 wasn't the right time to get others to agree with it. I just don't quite get the whole "pro-fun" and "pro-entertainment" thing that goes along with it, since that side of things (with his fake-claiming and stuff) goes in exactly the opposite direction to amassing the kind of info he's pushing for in these posts.

#612 Says he won MVIII by bussing hard. If scum, he's bussed LL for a bit of D1, ash for a very short while D2, ash with conviction all through D3, ash for the start of D4 but not for the actual lynch, and LL just for the hammer D6. That might be considered a decent amount of bussing.

#613 First sarcastic fake-claim.

#1256 Sudden unvote and total about-turn on LL.

#1341 His stuff around here makes a lot of sense (JR defence towards the end of D1).

#1424 This feels like it would be too much of a good performance as scum, because I feel like scum will almost certainly have discussed the HH and mechanisms surrounding the role.

#1474 "Is there where I mention that i was the hammer hero all along?" just when he was looking so townie. Okay, so this kind of "pro-fun" misinformation is just his style I guess. Tough to ignore how much it rubs me up the wrong way, but I'll work on that...

Wow. D1 is so long and painful. I'm not a D1 player [i]at all[/i]. On to D2...

#1539 This is one of those things to work on ignoring. But at the same time, maybe it's just too brazen to be scummy?

#1827 Having voted LL during the peak of LL's wagon D1, he's now sheeping LL onto me in D2.

#1918 This metagaming advice seems to be pro-town.

#2143 "I do really think the largest whiners are the most likely to be scum, since they're the most sure that TWM/MCMC are town... so that'd be Ashersky, Faust, and Galzria I guess." -- any updates on this thought process re Galz now, O?

#2464 Arguing a lot against people townreading Galz.

... then I re-read D3 and much of D4 in full yesterday and nothing jumped out at me.

I'm not feeling the O-must-be-scum vibe. If he [i]is[/i] scum, he's really good at hiding it, but the whole "pro-fun" thing is also probably quite good for hiding behind compared to a more purely logic-based playstyle, so it's hard for me to feel very sure.

(I read up to around his 240th post)

[SpaceAnemone]

My Dylan re-read was also not totally useful, possibly because of confirmation bias. He's a good scum and I know it. He's aware of his scum meta, and appears to have taken steps to distance himself from it. I certainly don't mind him as a default lynch, as he's the leading wagon at the moment, but I'd like to know I've explored other options too!

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#312 Anti-massclaim for D1. But doesn't overall rule it out.

#436-#442 Throws shade on TWM for changing his mind on O and votes him (in the opposite order).

#532 Defending ash. Though maybe too much to risk on a partner?

#872 "Bussing D1 or D2 is particularly strong for scum." -- another pro-bussing candidate! If this is scum!Dylan, he was not on a single correct wagon D1, D2 [i]or[/i] D3, and then he didn't vote at all D4. He did get in on iguana at last in D5, and LL on D6, but by those points scum was really needing the townpoints, and he'd started a specific tally of people being on good lynches.

#1065 Posted to say he's really far behind.

#1765 Back from big VLA; hasn't posted anything since his "I'm behind" post at #1065. Plonks a vote on me without much useful description, but lurky early-game me is an easy target.

#1870 Pushing in the same direction as ash.

#2056 scumreading Eevee for being too right? Then Eevee was an NK. Of course, if sudgy really is the scum it woud be great wifom for a frame job, but there are more interesting people out there to frame this early in the game, I think.

#2243 Points out how good he is at being scum. Also, nicely puts LL into the scummy category, iguana into the nullish cetegory, and ash into the "lean town" category.

#2303 Careless L-2 against the HH plan?

#2319 Points out how different he is to his superb scum meta, in a post to Andrew, who was his scumbuddy in another recent game. This is really quite wifomy!

#2644 "Also, something about people saying "I wouldn't do that as scum" still just irks me, even though it is kind of an inevitable argument." -- isn't that kind of what all Dylan's "here's how my scum meta goes" posts are effectively trying to do? :-P

#2915 This is the post where Dylan feels the need to hint cryptically to us about the thing that would lead him "to strongly believe that someone specific is lying". I still don't quite see why town!Dylan needs to do that, but scum!Dylan experimenting with some slightly more ash-like scum-play could certianly find it interesting to try out.

Meh.. I'm well into re-reading Dylan's D3 now, and I still can't shake the gut feeling that he's scum.

This re-read mostly brought to you by confirmation bias :-)

[Roadrunner7671]

Oh yeah, that thing about me getting towncred was absolutely not a joke, but I don't think I want to share it until tomorrow.

[O]

Oh yeah, that thing about me getting towncred was absolutely not a joke, but I don't think I want to share it until tomorrow.

I've heard roadrunner gets default lynched a lot while he's town...

That's being said, if it's not extremely substantial evidence, I vote we A. press him to share today and B. If he insists on not sharing today, default lynch him tomorrow if his towncred seems BS.

[Roadrunner7671]

Vote: O for reasons not related to his last post.