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[scott_pilgrim]

These were everyone's guesses:

Dylan32: H8
pacovf: B1
sudgy: B3
LaLight: G6
faust: "Row 8, column 4" (I thought this was slightly ambiguous but there was no way of interpreting it that got a hit)
Calamitas: C2

[scott_pilgrim]

(Also, at least one player has asked me not to re-score.)

[gkrieg13]

haha nice googling gkrieg

Yay for googling!

[liopoil]

ah, crud. i just thought of a quick-and-dirty probably has at least one way to do it between the four tiles solution


every tile corresponds to a number 0-63; guesser picks (sum of all heads)%64

yeah, this has about a 50-50 chance of getting the red square and almost certainly gets something good. Axxle came up with essentially this pretty quickly.

[scott_pilgrim]

I also want to apologize for the "power creep" in the scoring.  It was unintentional that the third game had such a big point difference among players compared to the first and second.  I'm trying to keep things as even as possible but I don't think I'm doing a very good job of it (and that game in particular was scary because scoring depended on how many teams came up with the solution; I'm relieved it wasn't something like all but one team got it right, that would have been horrible for the last team).

[schadd]

ah, crud. i just thought of a quick-and-dirty probably has at least one way to do it between the four tiles solution


every tile corresponds to a number 0-63; guesser picks (sum of all heads)%64

yeah, this has about a 50-50 chance of getting the red square and almost certainly gets something good. Axxle came up with essentially this pretty quickly.

well lah-dee-dah

[LaLight]

I kind of want to know what square LaLight guessed too.

Although it was only a 25%, I'm curious.

I chose the only different tile in 12th square, because i thought you picked this one to hint because of that.

[UmbrageOfSnow]

I kind of want to know what square LaLight guessed too.

Although it was only a 25%, I'm curious.

I chose the only different tile in 12th square, because i thought you picked this one to hint because of that.

Your guess was fine, no problems with it.  We didn't have a great chance of getting it right to begin with.  I just wanted to know.

I was going to say know how close we were, but you were pretty obviously going to get within a very short radius of it.   I don't know, not being diagonal is closer!

[2.71828.....]

Wait, can you say what each group guessed? I guessed B1, which was a blue tile, shouldn't 2.7 and I get 3 points?

Yeah, this is why I wanted people to be as clear as possible.  You said B1 and you also said "starting from the bottom left, the second tile from the bottom".  Reading that now I realize I should have asked for clarification, but I thought you meant "second tile on the bottom" (moving left to right), which is where B1 was.

I apologize for this, it doesn't feel right to not give you the points, but it feels even more unfair to the other players to take points away from them because of that.  If it's unanimous I'll re-score as if you submitted the move you intended to (I don't expect it to be unanimous though).  If anyone PM's me (I'll keep it anonymous) asking me not to re-score then I'll leave the scoring as is.

Yeah, I understand, don't worry. Sorry, e

Its ok.  I realized after the fact that I had messed up standard chess notation in our qt, but didn't bother to go back and fix it.  That being said, I disagree with scott's decision here not to re-score due to the fact that it is abundantly clear in our qt that we had a different naming scheme that we agreed upon.  While you may not have mentioned our naming scheme in your PM to scott with your choice, I still think that looking back at what happened we should be awarded the points.  Regardless, I understand the situation that scott is in as the moderator and I will respect whatever decision he ultimately makes.

[2.71828.....]

Yeah, this is why I wanted people to be as clear as possible.  You said B1 and you also said "starting from the bottom left, the second tile from the bottom".  Reading that now I realize I should have asked for clarification, but I thought you meant "second tile on the bottom" (moving left to right), which is where B1 was.

Actually, looking at this again, we really should get the points.  "Second tile from the bottom" is completely different than "second tile on the bottom."  Writing my last reply I hadn't really noticed that pacovf had explained the tile he chose.  Elaborating as he did, plus the clear discussion in our qt, I really don't get why it is difficult to change the scoring.

[faust]

I don't feel that great about playing "games" that are solvable here. I mean it's really just a math problem at that point. Not that math problems aren't fun, but there is a thread for such things.

This is assuming scott knew beforehand that the game was solvable.

[Dylan32]

I searched google and saw that a solution existed, but didn't share it with my partner because I thought using such info was against the spirit of the game.  If there was a group that used a solution from an external site, I am slightly disappointed.

[GendoIkari]

I don't feel that great about playing "games" that are solvable here. I mean it's really just a math problem at that point. Not that math problems aren't fun, but there is a thread for such things.

This is assuming scott knew beforehand that the game was solvable.

So at what point did you realize that we made our plan based on a 9x9 grid instead of 8x8? 

I figured you would just adapt it by going from 4-0 instead of 5-1, but the board we got just didn't allow our idea to pan out; no matter what I did a black square was going to be the strongest.

[pacovf]

I searched google and saw that a solution existed, but didn't share it with my partner because I thought using such info was against the spirit of the game.  If there was a group that used a solution from an external site, I am slightly disappointed.

I didn't ask Google for a solution because it seemed against the spirit of the game, but to be fair it wasn't specified in the rules. Next time, a clause to such effect could be added. Or just avoid solvable games, as faust said.

[gkrieg13]

Sorry guys, I didn't realize that googling things would be against the spirit of the game.  I had actually seen this problem before, so I had actually messed around with the site that had the answer before because it was an interesting problem.

[scott_pilgrim]

I agree with others that "solvable" games are not ideal.  I ran this particular one because I thought it would be hard enough that it would feel very rewarding for any teams who actually figured it out, and because I didn't realize how easy it would be to find the answer by googling it, and also because it wasn't just a binary "could you solve it or not", though to be fair it might have been closer to that than it should have been.

In general, most games will not be just "team math problems" like that one was.  Some games like guess f of the average (particularly the first round) may be solvable, but will hopefully still have a "human" component to them that makes players think about whether it's really best to play at the "solution".  I think it will be somewhat common for me to do multi-round games that are sort of formatted like guess f of the average, where the first round has a somewhat widely known solution, but the later rounds are a bit trickier.

That being said, if a lot of players give the same kind of feedback for what sorts of games they would like to play, I will try to take it into account when possible.  At some point down the road I may post a poll to see what kinds of games are most popular.

[scott_pilgrim]

Yeah, this is why I wanted people to be as clear as possible.  You said B1 and you also said "starting from the bottom left, the second tile from the bottom".  Reading that now I realize I should have asked for clarification, but I thought you meant "second tile on the bottom" (moving left to right), which is where B1 was.

Actually, looking at this again, we really should get the points.  "Second tile from the bottom" is completely different than "second tile on the bottom."  Writing my last reply I hadn't really noticed that pacovf had explained the tile he chose.  Elaborating as he did, plus the clear discussion in our qt, I really don't get why it is difficult to change the scoring.

I understand your frustration and I agree that reading it now it's clear what pacovf meant, but I read it as "from the bottom, the second tile", where it's ambiguous whether the second tile means moving left to right or bottom to top.  I understand that this is not the most natural way to interpret it, but I just automatically made sense of it in a way that would be consistent with B1 (I was just checking that the two things he gave me were not contradictory).  Since I specifically stated that I would use the chess notation as a default way of communicating the locations with players, I think that should be the default.

I think it's like letting your opponent take back misclicks in Dominion online.  They accidentally make a move that's good for you, and you're not really under any obligation to let them take it back, but if you're feeling extra generous you have that option.  One or more players have requested that I don't re-score, which is the analog to not granting an undo request.  In general, I think the mod should always err on the side of being too "machine-like", as that's most likely to feel fair to the most players in the long-run, and in this case that means going with the literal chess notation reference that pacovf sent me.

[scott_pilgrim]

THREAD LOCKED

Rules for the next game coming shortly.  (If you want to continue discussing something from above, you can PM me.)

[scott_pilgrim]

4. Don't Be an Idiot      

Rules      

THERE IS TO BE NO COMMUNICATION AFTER RULES ARE POSTED.      
This game will be played in three rounds, with slight rule variations in the second and third rounds.      
Each player PM's the mod with a choice: Option A, or Option B.      
If ALL players choose option A, everyone scores a points ("a" being a variable, not an indefinite article).  If ANYONE chooses option B, each player who chose option B scores b points, while everyone who chose A scores 0 points.      
The values of a and b vary each round, according to the table below:   
   
Round   a   b
1       6   5
2       5   6
3       4   20

In Round 2, if EVERYONE chooses option B, no one will score any points.      
In Round 3, if MORE THAN ONE player chooses option B, no one will get any points.
      
Note: At the end of each round, I will reveal who chose which option.      

[scott_pilgrim]

Deadline for the first round will be 8:00pm tomorrow (Friday) but deadlines for this game will be soft in the sense that I will probably just issue a prod and delay the end of the round until I get a response, unless you go inactive for an unreasonably long time.  (But it's best for everyone if you just submit on time!)

Also, if I get submissions from everyone early I will post results early, unless at least one player requests that I don't.

[scott_pilgrim]

Sorry for the delay...Round 1 results:

Calamitas   A
UmbrageOfSnow   A
gkrieg13   B
sudgy   B
Axxle   B
liopoil   B
2.71828…   B
Dylan32   A
faust   A
ghostofmars   A
schadd   A
GendoIkari   B
LaLight   A

[scott_pilgrim]

Round 2 deadline will be 11:30am tomorrow (Sunday).

[scott_pilgrim]

Round 2 results:

Calamitas   B
UmbrageOfSnow   B
gkrieg13   B
sudgy   B
Axxle   B
liopoil   B
2.71828…   B
Dylan32   B
faust   B
ghostofmars   B
schadd   A
GendoIkari   B
LaLight   B

[scott_pilgrim]

Round 3 deadline will be 11:30am tomorrow (Monday).

[scott_pilgrim]

Thread Unlocked

Round 3 Results:

Calamitas   A
UmbrageOfSnow   (no submission)
gkrieg13   A
sudgy   A
Axxle   B
liopoil   B
2.71828…   B
Dylan32   A
faust   A
ghostofmars   A
schadd   A
GendoIkari   A
LaLight   A