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Author Topic: The Greatest Card  (Read 11595 times)

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Orange

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The Greatest Card
« on: October 20, 2016, 10:55:31 pm »
+1

Something I've been thinking about...which individual card is the most powerful?  To be clear, I'm not trying to infringe on Qvist's outstanding effort to rank.  I'm talking any card in the game.  Off the top of my head, here are the candidates:

Champion
Dominate
Donate
Followers
Fortune
King's Court
Madman
Prince
Princess
Teacher

Am I missing anything else?  Anything that has no business on the list above?  (I'm looking at you, Princess.)

If there is interest in this topic, maybe we'll do a nomination round, vote for the top 8 or 16, then do a little head-to-head playoff.
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gkrieg13

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2016, 11:00:31 pm »
+20

If there is interest in this topic, maybe we'll do a nomination round, vote for the top 8 or 16, then do a little head-to-head playoff.


Wait, like a bracket?
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J Reggie

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2016, 11:02:30 pm »
0

If there is interest in this topic, maybe we'll do a nomination round, vote for the top 8 or 16, then do a little head-to-head playoff.


Wait, like a bracket?

What else?

Limetime

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2016, 11:20:53 pm »
+1

Followers does not belong in that list. I can see an argument for madman not being there. (Madman goes away) prince doesn't really belong there either.
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J Reggie

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2016, 11:27:19 pm »
0

Yeah, I'd change this list to something like:

Champion
Chapel
Cultist
Dominate
Donate
Fortune
King's Court
Mercenary
Possession
Teacher

Beta

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2016, 11:32:16 pm »
+4

Scout?

Or was that the card so powerful they had to wipe it from existence?
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LostPhoenix

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2016, 11:47:56 pm »
+2

I'm surprised Goons has not been mentioned.
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Chris is me

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2016, 12:33:12 am »
+1

If the evaluation of the cards includes the opportunity cost of gaining them and not just their effects, Champion shouldn't even be on the list.

Anyhow, the answer is probably Donate.
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RTT

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2016, 02:15:01 am »
0

no love for chapel. I guess Donate is just miles better.

Also Including Dominate is like including Province or Colony. Of course if cost isnt a factor those are the cards you want the most of in a game :P
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 02:17:09 am by RTT »
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schadd

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2016, 02:27:08 am »
+1

king's court
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2016, 04:39:34 am »
+1

I don't think the idea is to vote for the strongest card relative to its cost, but the card that just has the strongest effect.
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Davio

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2016, 04:58:12 am »
+1

Hmm, strongest for me would be: If you could start with 7 Coppers, 3 E/S and this card, which would you prefer?
I'm only counting up to Adventures, since I don't have any experience with Empires.

Champion is pretty darn strong, since you won't have to worry about terminal collision or being attacked ever again, so whatever you're trying to do, it will be way faster.
You won't have to spend any time buying Villages to create a smooth draw engine, just buy only drawers. Since you can always play any drawer, trashing is a bit less of an issue, you don't have to work as hard to get Village+drawer in the same hand.
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AdrianHealey

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2016, 05:41:57 am »
0

Hmm, strongest for me would be: If you could start with 7 Coppers, 3 E/S and this card, which would you prefer?
I'm only counting up to Adventures, since I don't have any experience with Empires.

Champion is pretty darn strong, since you won't have to worry about terminal collision or being attacked ever again, so whatever you're trying to do, it will be way faster.
You won't have to spend any time buying Villages to create a smooth draw engine, just buy only drawers. Since you can always play any drawer, trashing is a bit less of an issue, you don't have to work as hard to get Village+drawer in the same hand.

I was thinking the exact same thing. A board with only terminals? Engine away anyway!
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2016, 06:26:43 am »
0

Dominate has no business being on there. The card itself is not powerful. It just changes the way you play/build. Also, Prince doesn't belong there.

Goons is missing as is Cultist. Also, where did Ambassador and Chapel go?

Without that said, I feel very confident saying Donate is the strongest Dominion card in the game.

As far as a single card that warps the game(usually for the worst), I would have to go with Cultist.
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2016, 06:34:00 am »
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If I have a chamion to start and the opponent a goons, pretty sure I'll win.
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2016, 08:08:04 am »
0

I'd vote for Donate, then Goons.

I think cost is a fundamental part of a card. Champion doesn't just pop into your deck, and Donate for 8 coins would only be marginally better than Forge.
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Orange

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2016, 08:36:12 am »
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aku_chi

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2016, 08:44:02 am »
+1

... Donate for 8 coins would only be marginally better than Forge.

I disagree.  There are plenty of boards where the limiter for Forge isn't how early you can get it, but how long it takes to draw your junk with Forge and/or the opportunity cost of using Forge instead of some other action.  A Donate that cost $8 wouldn't have those issues, though it would have others.
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2016, 08:45:10 am »
+2

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2016, 09:04:51 am »
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Rebuild for sure!!!

RTT

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2016, 09:34:41 am »
+5

The Greatest Card can only be Great Hall
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faust

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2016, 09:50:32 am »
+7

The Greatest Card can only be    Moat   
FTFY
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faust

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2016, 09:52:13 am »
0

Without that said, I feel very confident saying Donate is the strongest Dominion card in the game.

I'm very confident that this is not the case.
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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2016, 09:54:38 am »
0

... Donate for 8 coins would only be marginally better than Forge.

I disagree.  There are plenty of boards where the limiter for Forge isn't how early you can get it, but how long it takes to draw your junk with Forge and/or the opportunity cost of using Forge instead of some other action.  A Donate that cost $8 wouldn't have those issues, though it would have others.
Both are very valid points, and I agree on both accounts, but they do not really address what I was saying, which is, Donate is so great also because there's no cost barrier before you can get it.
Maybe I should have compared Donate and Chapel instead. With debt, there's no contest, while with a coin price on Donate Chapel would have a fighting chance.
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Chris is me

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Re: The Greatest Card
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2016, 10:27:22 am »
0

Without that said, I feel very confident saying Donate is the strongest Dominion card in the game.

I'm very confident that this is not the case.

I think it really depends on how you view greatness.

The thing with Donate is it is almost exclusively used a single time in a game, so it doesn't have as much of an apparent effect as KC, Goons, Cultist, etc.

But in terms of how much the game changes with its presence, how much it reduces luck and leads to the higher skilled better playing player winning the game, it's hard to beat.
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