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[gkrieg13]

I thought if Calamitas was bulletproof it wouldn't matter and he was kinda scummy so I went for it.

[SpaceAnemone]

Calamitas was evil?? I was really sure he was townie!! :-(

I'd assumed that the reason people took him off the table yesterday was that he was probably Iguana's backup, since otherwise town seemed too prone to be swingy, given the weakness of all the claimed town roles.

If I also trust your theory that both sums are newbies, then I guess a vote: diedre is in order.

PS: hi from some very antisocial phone posting in the middle of my cousin's wedding ceilidh :-P

[gkrieg13]

I mean we probably want to no lynch today and have LYLO tomorrow.

[gkrieg13]

Just based off of interactions SA just has to be the last scum

[mail-mi]

I mean we probably want to no lynch today and have LYLO tomorrow.

I'm not actually sure, since it's probably just you who will be killed, and I'm 99% sure you're not scum. If you are, gg

I'm with you on SA though I need to reread them both to figure out which one I am for sure.

[SpaceAnemone]

I mean we probably want to no lynch today and have LYLO tomorrow.

I don't quite follow why that's better than lynching scum today, since we don't have any claimed night-time investigatory PRs left. It won't exactly narrow down the pool, since presumably I'm not going to be the townie who gets picked off in the night.

However, if Mail-mi's PR is also non-consecutive, rather than one-shot (is claiming one-shot and being more-than-one-shot a common thing?), maybe that can be used to prove it's not me! If you lynch me then I think we all die, and scum wins :-( However, if you can target my (non-existent) night action onto deidre, nothing will happen, and someone other than diedre will die, which I think proves I'm town, under the assumption we only have one scum remaining.

Honestly, I've been entirely honest and straight with you guys all game.. I just come out sounding scummy, and apparently I also have sucky reads sometimes. Also while you're already thinking I'm sounding terribly scummy, is now a good time to say I'm barely going to be online in the next 24 hours? I'll phone-post from my 6 hours of trains tomorrow afternoon if I can, but on the journey up here yesterday, I could barely even get enough signal for an sms.

[mail-mi]

Unfortunately, my redirect was only 1-shot.

[diedre91]

Gkrieg and iguana seemed really friends at this game. Now that iguana is dead and he was town, I am assuming gkrieg is also town.

I am between mail-mi and SA.
But since SA already started voting on me, he seems scummier.
Who votes that fast when there are only four players left?! Scum.

[gkrieg13]

Well we want to be able to choose between two people instead of theee people. I mean right now I'm pretty sure mail-mi is town but it would still be nice to see him dead and flipped then having to reread him and figure out he is 100%town(which I'm pretty sure of anyway. Plus people might still have tricks up their sleeves!

vote: no lynch

[diedre91]

Well we want to be able to choose between two people instead of theee people. I mean right now I'm pretty sure mail-mi is town but it would still be nice to see him dead and flipped then having to reread him and figure out he is 100%town(which I'm pretty sure of anyway. Plus people might still have tricks up their sleeves!

vote: no lynch

But if we does not lynch anyone, night will come and we will lose another town, right?

[diedre91]

we "does" is the best... we "do"

[gkrieg13]

Well we want to be able to choose between two people instead of theee people. I mean right now I'm pretty sure mail-mi is town but it would still be nice to see him dead and flipped then having to reread him and figure out he is 100%town(which I'm pretty sure of anyway. Plus people might still have tricks up their sleeves!

vote: no lynch

But if we does not lynch anyone, night will come and we will lose another town, right?

Yes but there is only one scum left. If you are town, you have to choose who that one scum is out of three people. If we lose a townie, you now only have to choose out of two people which increases your chances of hitting scum. There is also less rereading to do, if you plan on doing that before placing your vote. 

[Haddock]

Flavour finally being written!  Also note the change to the deadline, which should be 18th September (8-day Days), not the 20th.

[mail-mi]

Well we want to be able to choose between two people instead of theee people. I mean right now I'm pretty sure mail-mi is town but it would still be nice to see him dead and flipped then having to reread him and figure out he is 100%town(which I'm pretty sure of anyway. Plus people might still have tricks up their sleeves!

vote: no lynch

It's not a good idea, I don't think, because in what scenario does scum not just kill you?

[SpaceAnemone]

I am between mail-mi and SA.
But since SA already started voting on me, he seems scummier.
Who votes that fast when there are only four players left?! Scum.

Who votes for you at this stage? Someone who's going to be offline for a while/phone-posting, and who trusts at least one of the other players here not to be careless. After all, we need 3/4 for a lynch now, so my vote being on you makes zero difference, other than signaling that I suspect you much more strongly than Mail-mi.

[gkrieg13]

Well we want to be able to choose between two people instead of theee people. I mean right now I'm pretty sure mail-mi is town but it would still be nice to see him dead and flipped then having to reread him and figure out he is 100%town(which I'm pretty sure of anyway. Plus people might still have tricks up their sleeves!

vote: no lynch

It's not a good idea, I don't think, because in what scenario does scum not just kill you?

Why is that a bad thing?  At least it gives you guys the opportunity to know 100% that I'm not scum.  I would even give my reads before we no-lynched if that is what you want.

[gkrieg13]

Also setup-wise, from those who have already died we have

VT
VT
VT
Macho Tracker
IC
Delayed Doctor
?? non-consecutive vig
?? 1- shot redirector
??VT
??VT

vs.

2-shot double voting traitor
goon
???

[gkrieg13]

Calamitas played a great scum game BTW.

Finally got some time off,  vacation can get quite busy

My current reads/thoughts:

Rather scummy:
 - Chairs: Weird comments about double voting; assumption about traitor that is not confirmed for town but for mafia

Seprix was a traitor - which means even his partners didn't know he existed.

Slightly scummy ones:
 - Diedre: Pretty much non-existent
 - Silver : Mainly the statement of iguana who doesn't seem scummy but not particular scummy either, have to wait for his eleboration
 - mail-mi: Opening the case for teamlyle

Rather towny:
 - Gkrieg: Very active, long and helpful posts. No signs pointing towards mafia by now

On iguana and rr I have pretty much a null-read, leaning more towards town in the case of ii and absolute null in the case of rr. But even the town of ii is more a feeling and I cannot give concret evidence.

Conviniently leaves SA off his list.

Then keeps saying SA is townie, whereas he goes after mail-mi quite a bit.  Mail-mi is getting more IC in my eyes now actually.

I also feel like his messing up by calling SA he over and over again is forced.

And then just the way that he was so reluctant to jump on the SA wagon but then so willing to lynch RR.

vote: SA

[mail-mi]

I will reread when I get home.

[Haddock]

Vote Count 4.1

Sometimes, you have to roll a hard six.

SA (1): gkrieg (L-2)
diedre (1): SA (L-2)


Not Voting (4): diedre91, mail-mi

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

Deadline: 2pm, 18 September.

[SpaceAnemone]

I also feel like his messing up by calling SA he over and over again is forced.

Gkrieg, this is just out of line. I have already said that I find the pronouns issue personally offensive, and you're implying that I might have been encouraging it for the sake of looking like a non-scum-partner? It's absolutely not okay for anyone to encourage others to act in a discriminatory or insensitive way about a minority just to win a game, and that's pretty much what your suggestion there amounts to.

I let one or two instances of misgendering on the part of non-native English speakers slide because their language usage backgrounds might be a little different... see the fact that I haven't even complained about deidre's post at #882 yet. I just don't have the time/mental energy to keep correcting people and to fight what feels like a losing battle for town at the same time without letting one thing derail the other. If I'd had a scum QT with Calamitas, you can bet I'd have sorted out the pronouns issue with him the moment it arose.

[mail-mi]

I also feel like his messing up by calling SA he over and over again is forced.

Gkrieg, this is just out of line. I have already said that I find the pronouns issue personally offensive, and you're implying that I might have been encouraging it for the sake of looking like a non-scum-partner? It's absolutely not okay for anyone to encourage others to act in a discriminatory or insensitive way about a minority just to win a game, and that's pretty much what your suggestion there amounts to.

I let one or two instances of misgendering on the part of non-native English speakers slide because their language usage backgrounds might be a little different... see the fact that I haven't even complained about deidre's post at #882 yet. I just don't have the time/mental energy to keep correcting people and to fight what feels like a losing battle for town at the same time without letting one thing derail the other. If I'd had a scum QT with Calamitas, you can bet I'd have sorted out the pronouns issue with him the moment it arose.

SA, he means this only in game, and again, no personal offence is meant.

Also, the fact that you only replied to this part of his post, instead of including anything else, makes me think you're scummier.

off to reread.

[mail-mi]

first I'm doing diedre.

I think I have to explain my vote... I entered on teamlyle wagon because he put his vote on me. I just fired back.

He admits to blatant OMGUSing...without any prodding from anyone to explain his vote. This somehow makes him seem townier and scummier: scum feels the need to explain votes, but they would at least try to come up with a better reason than OMGUS. So slightly slightly townie.

Calamitas is a townread in Day 2. Don't know what to think of that yet.

Diedre's complaint post in 406: I think it reads more townie than scummy.

dinner's ready. will do the rest later if i can.

[SpaceAnemone]

I also feel like his messing up by calling SA he over and over again is forced.

Gkrieg, this is just out of line. I have already said that I find the pronouns issue personally offensive, and you're implying that I might have been encouraging it for the sake of looking like a non-scum-partner? It's absolutely not okay for anyone to encourage others to act in a discriminatory or insensitive way about a minority just to win a game, and that's pretty much what your suggestion there amounts to.

I let one or two instances of misgendering on the part of non-native English speakers slide because their language usage backgrounds might be a little different... see the fact that I haven't even complained about deidre's post at #882 yet. I just don't have the time/mental energy to keep correcting people and to fight what feels like a losing battle for town at the same time without letting one thing derail the other. If I'd had a scum QT with Calamitas, you can bet I'd have sorted out the pronouns issue with him the moment it arose.

SA, he means this only in game, and again, no personal offence is meant.

I understand fine that it's probably not what he meant, and I don't need you to explain his meaning to me, thank you. What gkrieg actually suggests is that I might have been deliberately encouraging (or at best, allowing) Calamitas behave in a socially unacceptable manner in order to win potential town points for myself. And I'm saying that's unethical play, which goes beyond the game. Would you want to hang out on a forum that allowed casual racism to be used in the same way?

Also, the fact that you only replied to this part of his post, instead of including anything else, makes me think you're scummier.

I already said that trying to argue both at once is tiring! And I did in fact also point out in there that if Calamitas had been in a scum QT with me I'd have had a better communication channel in which to get to know him and stop him from making quite such a spectacular pronoun-fail. He'd regard me as more of a person if we'd had that connection, but we didn't. That's pretty much the best case I have for not being scumbuddies with him, because VT is a useless role and I don't have any other information.

Even when I was pointing out what I thought were the main reasons I read Calamitas as town, I acknowledged that the main one I quoted (the misgendering of EFHW) didn't hold if diedre was his scum partner, and it looks like that's true. Given that Calamitas actually was scum after all, this has become the one piece of evidence I have that it's diedre and not you, tenuous though it is, since I guess it's possible to pick a target using only a username. I imagine you and Calamitas would have discussed things, though, and neither of you seems to have been particularly hesitant with the use of pronouns..

[mail-mi]

I'm back!

I also feel like his messing up by calling SA he over and over again is forced.

Gkrieg, this is just out of line. I have already said that I find the pronouns issue personally offensive, and you're implying that I might have been encouraging it for the sake of looking like a non-scum-partner? It's absolutely not okay for anyone to encourage others to act in a discriminatory or insensitive way about a minority just to win a game, and that's pretty much what your suggestion there amounts to.

I let one or two instances of misgendering on the part of non-native English speakers slide because their language usage backgrounds might be a little different... see the fact that I haven't even complained about deidre's post at #882 yet. I just don't have the time/mental energy to keep correcting people and to fight what feels like a losing battle for town at the same time without letting one thing derail the other. If I'd had a scum QT with Calamitas, you can bet I'd have sorted out the pronouns issue with him the moment it arose.

SA, he means this only in game, and again, no personal offence is meant.

I understand fine that it's probably not what he meant, and I don't need you to explain his meaning to me, thank you. What gkrieg actually suggests is that I might have been deliberately encouraging (or at best, allowing) Calamitas behave in a socially unacceptable manner in order to win potential town points for myself. And I'm saying that's unethical play, which goes beyond the game. Would you want to hang out on a forum that allowed casual racism to be used in the same way?

Ah, i see your point.

Also, the fact that you only replied to this part of his post, instead of including anything else, makes me think you're scummier.

I already said that trying to argue both at once is tiring! And I did in fact also point out in there that if Calamitas had been in a scum QT with me I'd have had a better communication channel in which to get to know him and stop him from making quite such a spectacular pronoun-fail. He'd regard me as more of a person if we'd had that connection, but we didn't. That's pretty much the best case I have for not being scumbuddies with him, because VT is a useless role and I don't have any other information.

Even when I was pointing out what I thought were the main reasons I read Calamitas as town, I acknowledged that the main one I quoted (the misgendering of EFHW) didn't hold if diedre was his scum partner, and it looks like that's true. Given that Calamitas actually was scum after all, this has become the one piece of evidence I have that it's diedre and not you, tenuous though it is, since I guess it's possible to pick a target using only a username. I imagine you and Calamitas would have discussed things, though, and neither of you seems to have been particularly hesitant with the use of pronouns..

uh where? i didn't see that in your post.

Also, SA, if I get what you're implying here, I (and I would assume Calamitas) do regard you as a person. I just forget, because we're on an internet forum about a board game. The male to female ratio is like 16 to 1 I think, and "he" is just my default pronoun. So, again, I have never intended any personal offense, and I sincerely apologize.

will finish diedre reread soonish.