Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[GendoIkari]

In preparation for the next poll.... if you have any ideas of events that a reaction could react to, that aren't already published on real cards, please either PM me or just reply here so that they can be discussed. The next poll will be what to react to, and it will include everything that official reactions react to, plus any that people suggest, unless those suggestions aren't practical.

[LastFootnote]

I am struggling to come up with any practical new triggers. Some are close enough to existing triggers that they shouldn't be a separate option (e.g. "when you trash a card" rather than "when one of your cards is trashed"). All the basic ones that haven't been used have big issues.

[Infthitbox]

"When you draw a card" -- potentially dangerous, but there's probably some space here
"when you shuffle" -- stash's trigger, only not a passive ability

[A Ladder]

Of all the reaction,s I like the ones that trigger on gaining the most.

"When an opponent gains a card". Reacting to what opponents do could be interesting.
"When you enter your buy phase". I was going to say "when you play a treasure" but that could be annoyingly common, so I went with when you typically could play a treasure (edge case Black Market and Storyteller) so the buy phase.

[yuma]

I was going to say "when you play a treasure" but that could be annoyingly common, so I went with when you typically could play a treasure (edge case Black Market and Storyteller) so the buy phase.

"When an opponent players a treasure card" or to make it less common, "when an opponent players a treasure card costing $4 or more."

[GeneralRamos]

Well, between typing and hitting enter, people already referenced what I could think of.
(1) "When another play plays a Treasure card." Not the best idea, but perhaps not terrible.
(2) "When another player gains a card." Facilitates Smuggler-like engagements.
(3) "When another player draws a card other than during Clean-up"

[werothegreat]

Ones that have been covered already:

-When another player plays an Attack
-When you gain a card
-When you would gain a card
-When you discard this
-When another player gains [a certain card]
-When one of your cards is trashed
-When you buy a Victory card

Possible new ones:

-When you play an Attack (could be an Attack-Reaction)
-When another player gains [a different certain card]
-When another player gains any other card
-When you buy a card
-When you return a card to the Supply
-When you pass a card
-When a Supply pile empties
-When you buy an Event
-When you set aside a card

Now there's also what you *do* with the Reaction.

-...reveal this from your hand
-...discard this from your hand
-...set this aside... return it to your hand [later]
-...trash this
-...play this

We could also have:

-...pass this to the left
-...return this to the Supply

[GendoIkari]

I am struggling to come up with any practical new triggers. Some are close enough to existing triggers that they shouldn't be a separate option (e.g. "when you trash a card" rather than "when one of your cards is trashed"). All the basic ones that haven't been used have big issues.

Was "when you draw" or "when you would draw" tried at some point? Seems like it could be fine, unless the issue is that it makes you draw 1 at a time for Smithy instead of all 3 at once.

Also, I wonder if MTG's "Miracle" mechanic could work... that is "when you draw this". I think that was done on a fan card at some point. Some people will say that the problem is you draw straight into your hand, and at that point how do you prove that the reaction is one you just now drew... but MTG did it anyway despite the exact same limitations.

[eHalcyon]

When you discard this other than from play

When you discard this from play

When you buy/gain/trash a specific card or type of card

When you would gain/trash a specific card or type of card

When an opponent buys/gains/trashes a specific card or type of card

When this card is revealed (by something else)

When any player (including you) plays an Attack card

[A Ladder]

-When another player gains [a different certain card]

Or this could even be "When another player gains [a type of card]". Action, Treasure, Victory being the most common.

[GendoIkari]

-When you return a card to the Supply
-When you pass a card
-When you buy an Event
-When you set aside a card

The Event one just flat-out can't work I don't think, considering that the card will often be used with no events. The other 3 could only work if the card itself let you do the relevant thing; because there's not enough other cards that would let you do them.

[A Ladder]

Also, I wonder if MTG's "Miracle" mechanic could work... that is "when you draw this". I think that was done on a fan card at some point. Some people will say that the problem is you draw straight into your hand, and at that point how do you prove that the reaction is one you just now drew... but MTG did it anyway despite the exact same limitations.

Playing with the "Miracle" Mechanic  in MTG was fine becuase you typically only drew one card at the start of your turn and shuffled your deck way less. Pretty easy to make sure you didn't mess up and/or to see if your opponent was playing legitimately.

 I can see this being problamatic with Dominion. However, once people get used to that, it won't be too hard to track.

[Erick648]

One question to ask about each of these triggers is, "Do we want to pause the game (or does the game already pause) every time this happens just to check whether someone wants to react?" For example, if there were a reaction that reacted to playing a Treasure, players would have to play their Treasures slowly, pausing after each one to check whether anyone wanted to react (in fact, I think Donald X has used such a trigger as an example of the principle I'm describing).  Ideally, the triggers should either be something that creates a natural pause in the game (like an Attack), or something the owner of the Reaction does (so he doesn't need to check whether anyone else wants to react).

[GeneralRamos]

Also, I wonder if MTG's "Miracle" mechanic could work... that is "when you draw this". I think that was done on a fan card at some point. Some people will say that the problem is you draw straight into your hand, and at that point how do you prove that the reaction is one you just now drew... but MTG did it anyway despite the exact same limitations.

My Concubine, posted in one of my threads, used the "when you draw this" mechanic. It does potentially run into cheating problems as you noted. For concubine, the "when you draw this" effect set them aside, which created accountability. So it can be done, with the right constraints. But of course, I didn't even bother to call it a reaction, though I suppose it could/should be.

One question to ask about each of these triggers is, "Do we want to pause the game (or does the game already pause) every time this happens just to check whether someone wants to react?" For example, if there were a reaction that reacted to playing a Treasure, players would have to play their Treasures slowly, pausing after each one to check whether anyone wanted to react

Yeah, that's why I didn't think it was a great idea, though it is an idea.

[scott_pilgrim]

When an opponent buys/gains/trashes a specific card or type of card

It would be cool to have a Remodel-type card that reacts to an opponent trashing a card and grabs it out of the trash.  I guess it might be frustrating in multi-player if multiple people want to get the same card out of the trash.

Reacting to other players buying a victory card to top-deck it could be cool too.

Anything where card type is relevant could also work with cost instead.  For example, "when you gain a card costing $3 or more..." or  "When you play a card costing $5 or more...".

Some other ideas (some are a little crazy):
"When you play your nth action this turn..." or "When you have n cards in play..."
"When you have n [actions/buys/coin/cards in hand]..."
"When you gain a copy of a card you have in play..."
"When you gain a [this]..."
"When you play a [this]..."
"When another player plays a [this]..."
"When another player gains a [this]..."
"When another player reveals a Reaction..." (or just any card; this could get weird though)
"At the start of your Clean-up phase..."
"When you would discard a card from play..."
"When you would end your turn..." (I don't know where that one is going, sounds dangerous)
"When you would end your action phase..." or "When you have no actions remaining..."
"When you would end your buy phase..." or "When you have no buys remaining..."
"When you trash a [this]..."
"At the start of your nth turn..." or "At the start of your turn, after you've taken n turns..."

[eHalcyon]

Yeah, when I wrote "type of card", I didn't just mean Victory, Attack, etc.  I just mean "card that meets some sort of requirement".

[faust]

I'm kind of interested in a card that facilitates self-triggering, so something like:

"When you reveal this..."
"When you set a card aside..."
"When you name this..."

with corresponding upper half.

[Gubump]

"Immediately after resolving [a specific or non-specific card],"
"When you draw this other than during your cleanup phase," <== I've made a fan card that has this, and it requires you to reveal it as you draw it, so once you put it into your hand and take your hand off of it, it's too late to reveal it. It also returns itself to the Supply.
"At the start of your turn, [possible condition],"
"At the start/end of your cleanup phase, [possible condition],"
"At the start/end of another player's cleanup phase, [possible condition],"
"When you buy/gain/trash a card costing up to/exactly/less than [some cost],"
"When you buy [a specific or non-specific card],"
"When you gain a copy of this,"
"At the start of your buy phase, [possible condition],"
"At the start of another player's buy phase, [possible condition],"
"When another player trashes a card,"
"When the player to your left/right [Does the following:
Gains/trashes/buys [a specific or non-specific card],
Plays an attack card,
[Any other of my suggested reactions or existing reactions],]"

And to those of you who are suggesting "when another player plays a Treasure card," that doesn't really work. Do you really want everybody to have to play their Treasures one-by-one, pausing between every single one, to check and see if any of the other players will use their reaction card?

[eHalcyon]

"At the start/end of your turn/specific phase" could be easily phrased as a regular Action or Treasure.  I don't see a need for Reaction typing there.

[mustang255]

You can also use a more conditional variation: "Whenever you gain a card during an opponent's turn" or such.

[Roadrunner7671]

Vote reaction!

[Accatitippi]

Some random ideas:
"When another player plays a card costing: More/less than this, exactly X...."
When another player plays a Reaction card...
Whenever you have 3 cards or less in your hand... (...during your turn?)
When you draw this during your clean up phase...

[Asper]

"At the start of your turn..."

No, seriously. A card that does something different when you start your turn with it in hand as compared to when you draw it later.

[Asper]

I see gubump allready posted "At the start of your turn". I think this is really nice, but works best on a card that doesn't draw, because that means you can't chain them with freshly drawn ones (which might seem weird to less experienced players). Also, i suggest having the reaction effect being similar to the normal one, just better. Immediately, a reaction effect is "nonterminal", so a version that's terminal usually seems like an idea to me. But without draw, what can you do?  How about terminal $2 vs nonterminal $3 for $3? Just an idea.

"At the start of your buy phase" is something i used before, but one has to be aware it basically makes the card a treasure by another name. I think it's the best way to implement the dreaded action-treasure without having the rules confusion.

Most of the others don't sound especially interesting to me. A card that reacts on another player playing a copy of it sounds nice, but you could just as well put the reveal on the play effect á la Tournament.

[GendoIkari]

I see this is going to be tricky... a bunch of possible ideas have been thrown out here. I'll need some criteria or feedback on ones that probably shouldn't be on the list. Also, I think the similar things will be grouped together... that is, there won't be a "when you gain a card on another player's turn". Instead, if we choose "when you gain a card", then we could later decide that it would be better balanced as "when you gain a card on another player's turn". Same with "when you gain" vs "when you would gain".

[scott_pilgrim]

Yeah, I think we're going to need several polls that start as general as possible and get increasingly specific.  Really what we need to be doing is figuring out how we can generalize all of these options.  Something like:

"When [someone] gains..."
"When [someone] draws..."
"When [someone] trashes..."
"When [someone] reveals..."
"When [someone] plays..."
"At the [start/end] of [game state]..." ([game state] could be things like your turn, another player's turn, your buy phase, etc.)
And maybe include a poll option for "other" to give some of the whackier options a chance.

Then decide who [someone] is and what has to be gained/drawn/trashed/etc. in later polls.

[liopoil]

I think first we should vote on whether the reaction should sometimes take place on your turns (tunnel, market square, watchtower), or always on an opponent's turns (most other reactions), or even only on your turns (I do not think there are any such reactions currently).

[eHalcyon]

"At the start of your turn..."

No, seriously. A card that does something different when you start your turn with it in hand as compared to when you draw it later.

I still don't think this requires a Reaction type.  "If this is the first action you play this turn..." accomplishes nearly the same thing.

[Gubump]

If there are an overwhelming amount of choices, you could have multiple polls with some of the suggestions on each and then pit the winners against each other.

[Asper]

"At the start of your turn..."

No, seriously. A card that does something different when you start your turn with it in hand as compared to when you draw it later.

I still don't think this requires a Reaction type.  "If this is the first action you play this turn..." accomplishes nearly the same thing.

It does, unless you play more than one, or it is intended to be useable twice per turn. But you are right, it's probably a little too similar.

[spiralstaircase]

You could have terminal that is self-countering, but it it is countered then you get +1 action to make up for it.  That would meet both the 'action-reaction' and the 'sometimes terminal' conditions.

Hedge witch
Action - Reaction - $4
Each other player gains a curse
---
When another player plays a Hedge Witch, you may reveal this card.  If you do, that card has no effect on you, and if it is the first time you've reacted to that card, that player gets +1 card, +1 action.

That kind of thing.

[Asper]

You could have terminal that is self-countering, but it it is countered then you get +1 action to make up for it.  That would meet both the 'action-reaction' and the 'sometimes terminal' conditions.

Hedge witch
Action - Reaction - $4
Each other player gains a curse
---
When another player plays a Hedge Witch, you may reveal this card.  If you do, that card has no effect on you, and if it is the first time you've reacted to that card, that player gets +1 card, +1 action.

That kind of thing.

Hedge Witch
Each other player may reveal a Hedge Witch from their hand. Those who don't gain a Curse. If everyone did, +1 Card, +1 Action.

[spiralstaircase]

Hedge Witch
Each other player may reveal a Hedge Witch from their hand. Those who don't gain a Curse. If everyone did, +1 Card, +1 Action.

Yeah, but that's not a reaction :-)

[eHalcyon]

Hedge Witch
Each other player may reveal a Hedge Witch from their hand. Those who don't gain a Curse. If everyone did, +1 Card, +1 Action.

Yeah, but that's not a reaction :-)

That's his point.  There's no need to do that as a reaction because it's simpler as a regular Action.