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[GendoIkari]

Ok, so we've decided we'll be making an Action card. But do we want just a pure action? Or other stuff as well?

I included Looter since Looter that's not an attack is a thing. But if you want a Looter-Attack, you want to choose the last option, "more than 1 secondary type". If that last option wins, then the next poll will be between the various multi-type combinations.

Like Wizards did, if the votes end up pretty close so that no choice has a very big percentage of the votes, then I'll have a run-off vote of the top 2 options.

Leaving this one up for a whole week because I'll be out of town at bgg.con next week. I've allowed people to change their votes too, because why not.

Also, if you really hope for a certain thing, feel free to "campaign" for it in the replies and try to convince others why your choice is best!

[scott_pilgrim]

I was wanting to do a victory card at first, but now I think I've decided on Reserve.  I think the best types are Reserve, Duration, or Reaction, because those will give us more distinct effects to work with.  More distinct effects is better than one bigger, coherent effect, because I don't think we're going to be able to do a good original idea for a single, bigger effect (we might come up with it, but it will be hard to execute it).

[Asper]

I'm glad to see that action won and that "Just action" is an option. Personally, i'm hoping for it to become a straightforward friendly interaction card. A simple attack would be okay, too.

Of the cases scott_pilgrim named, i think Reserves have the most design space left, and still allow for relatively simple, clear-cut original ideas.

[Gubump]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

[GendoIkari]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

[faust]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I guess it's also possible that when you call it, it will do something for multiple turns.

[Asper]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I guess it's also possible that when you call it, it will do something for multiple turns.

Or for the rest of the game, with a very hard to trigger calling condition.

[LastFootnote]

I guess it's also possible that when you call it, it will do something for multiple turns.

I think this would be the way to go if you made an Action–Reserve–Duration. Not sure what effect would be appropriate, though.

[werothegreat]

I guess it's also possible that when you call it, it will do something for multiple turns.

I think this would be the way to go if you made an Action–Reserve–Duration. Not sure what effect would be appropriate, though.

Portable Lighthouse
- Action-Reserve-Duration

+1 Action
Put this on your Tavern mat.
----------------------------------------
When another player plays an Attack, you may call this, to be unaffected by that Attack.  At the start of your next turn, +.

[Awaclus]

I guess it's also possible that when you call it, it will do something for multiple turns.

I think this would be the way to go if you made an Action–Reserve–Duration. Not sure what effect would be appropriate, though.

Portable Lighthouse
- Action-Reserve-Duration

+1 Action
Put this on your Tavern mat.
----------------------------------------
When another player plays an Attack, you may call this, to be unaffected by that Attack.  At the start of your next turn, +.

[popsofctown]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I thought the philosophy of this thing was such that you totally should put it as a poll option and let yourself get overruled if everyone wants reserve duration.  Is it GendoIkari makes the card or f.ds makes the card?

[eHalcyon]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I thought the philosophy of this thing was such that you totally should put it as a poll option and let yourself get overruled if everyone wants reserve duration.  Is it GendoIkari makes the card or f.ds makes the card?

Well, it would be impractical to put every possible combination in the poll, and it's always possible for bad stuff to get voted in if it's flashy enough, especially when the masses are involved.  Though in this case, it seems like it's feasible at least, and the people participating in this forum are a bit more refined than "the masses".

[Davio]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

[werothegreat]

I picked Reserve because I could use a bit more tan before winter

*wink*

[LastFootnote]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

I'm not sure what you're saying here. Could you elaborate?

[Roadrunner7671]

I voted for looter cause looters arw awesome. F.DS can make CultistV2, guys!

[GendoIkari]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I thought the philosophy of this thing was such that you totally should put it as a poll option and let yourself get overruled if everyone wants reserve duration.  Is it GendoIkari makes the card or f.ds makes the card?

Well it wasn't a question of personal preference, but of rules clarity. Since people have pointed out how a Reaction-Duration could work, it sounds fine to be an option, even if it isn't the option I'd pick. But like the reason I didn't "allow" action-treasure isn't because I personally don't like action-treasure. It's because Donald hasn't ever made an action-treasure, and food good reasons around rules confusions.

[popsofctown]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I thought the philosophy of this thing was such that you totally should put it as a poll option and let yourself get overruled if everyone wants reserve duration.  Is it GendoIkari makes the card or f.ds makes the card?

Well it wasn't a question of personal preference, but of rules clarity. Since people have pointed out how a Reaction-Duration could work, it sounds fine to be an option, even if it isn't the option I'd pick. But like the reason I didn't "allow" action-treasure isn't because I personally don't like action-treasure. It's because Donald hasn't ever made an action-treasure, and food good reasons around rules confusions.

Everyone else is aware of the rules issues though.  Duration Reserve is nowhere near as confusing as action treasure. 

[GendoIkari]

I want it to be a Duration - Reserve, because I think that that would be very interesting.

Assuming you're serious, I don't think it's even clear how that would work. I mean, I guess you could have a normal effect when you play it, and then a next-turn effect of putting it on your Tavern. But that wouldn't be all that different from putting it on your Tavern right away. I'm pretty sure this won't be listed as an option should "more than 1 extra type" be chosen. Unless someone can explain to me an example of how it would work.

I thought the philosophy of this thing was such that you totally should put it as a poll option and let yourself get overruled if everyone wants reserve duration.  Is it GendoIkari makes the card or f.ds makes the card?

Well it wasn't a question of personal preference, but of rules clarity. Since people have pointed out how a Reaction-Duration could work, it sounds fine to be an option, even if it isn't the option I'd pick. But like the reason I didn't "allow" action-treasure isn't because I personally don't like action-treasure. It's because Donald hasn't ever made an action-treasure, and food good reasons around rules confusions.

Everyone else is aware of the rules issues though.  Duration Reserve is nowhere near as confusing as action treasure.

Yeah, I guess in my head I was thinking "Put this on your tavern mat. At the start of your next turn, do stuff. Whenever something happens, you can call this to do other stuff." The biggest issue being that the start of your next turn stuff would happen without the card being in play. Which of course can currently happen with edge case Procession stuff, but not normally. Anyway, it will be on the list!

[liopoil]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

Yeah, everyone vote for reactions. The coolest cards in Dominion are reactions.

[GendoIkari]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

Yeah, everyone vote for reactions. The coolest cards in Dominion are reactions.

When we go to choose mechanics, I'll be sure to include "draw up to x".

[eHalcyon]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

Yeah, everyone vote for reactions. The coolest cards in Dominion are reactions.

When we go to choose mechanics, I'll be sure to include "draw up to x".

There are so many possibilities, I think you need to do open submissions (for general descriptions).

[scott_pilgrim]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

Yeah, everyone vote for reactions. The coolest cards in Dominion are reactions.

When we go to choose mechanics, I'll be sure to include "draw up to x".

There are so many possibilities, I think you need to do open submissions (for general descriptions).

This is why I think a phrase-by-phrase approach is best.  If we try to do it CAP-style, there's so little to the process that it's basically just like doing a card design contest, with no restrictions or anything.  Everyone submits a concept, we vote on that, and then the execution is too straightforward to be interesting.

I think instead we shouldn't pre-determine a goal that we try to achieve, and we all just vote for what we think is the best option at every step out of a list of grammatically and functionally coherent options.  This way may end up being a disaster, but I think if we do open submissions then it's not much different from just having everyone submit an entire card and voting on the best one.

[eHalcyon]

I voted for Reaction, because I think there's more cool stuff we can do with it.

The obvious drawback with Reactions is that having a reaction part weakens the action part.
If you put a big emphasis on the reaction, the action part will end up pretty meh. The other way around the reaction part will be pretty meh.
It's hard to balance these right.

So you have to go for uniqueness.

Yeah, everyone vote for reactions. The coolest cards in Dominion are reactions.

When we go to choose mechanics, I'll be sure to include "draw up to x".

There are so many possibilities, I think you need to do open submissions (for general descriptions).

This is why I think a phrase-by-phrase approach is best.  If we try to do it CAP-style, there's so little to the process that it's basically just like doing a card design contest, with no restrictions or anything.  Everyone submits a concept, we vote on that, and then the execution is too straightforward to be interesting.

I think instead we shouldn't pre-determine a goal that we try to achieve, and we all just vote for what we think is the best option at every step out of a list of grammatically and functionally coherent options.  This way may end up being a disaster, but I think if we do open submissions then it's not much different from just having everyone submit an entire card and voting on the best one.

Well the thing would be making it very general in the early stages. 

Or do the phrases thing, but still have it by submission (because even with phrases there are still too many possibilities).

[GendoIkari]

Yeah I'm still working out the details, but a part of it will be open submission. But before that part, there will be parts to narrow down the general working or concept.