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[gkrieg13]

I don't think TA makes this up; at least not the part about Ruin.  It's a little too... creative for a fake claim.  Also, what would be the point?

I agree with this.  That's why I'm apprehensive about lynching him so quickly.  He could fake claim that if he were ruin himself.

[Seprix]

So he's probably the 3rd party? 3rd party can still apparently kill, so...?

[gkrieg13]

So he's probably the 3rd party? 3rd party can still apparently kill, so...?

I'm just not sure that he would fake claim that.  Why out that there is a 3rd party at all?

[Witherweaver]

I think that would be, like, the worst third-party claim in the history of Mafia.  Pretty much guarantees no out in the end game.

If Ruin-aligned was a separate faction... maybe it could be 2 vs 2 scum teams.  Then I'm still not sure on the motivation.

[Ichimaru Gin]

Flavor-wise. I feel like Ruin makes more sense as a single scum with no partners.

[gkrieg13]

@TA  You had scum reads on mail-mi on day 2.  How do you feel about him now?

[Hydrad]

Flavor-wise. I feel like Ruin makes more sense as a single scum with no partners.

that could be interesting. maybe a team of 3 and a team of 1? can there be unbalanced multiball scum things?

actually i guess thats just a traitor...

[gkrieg13]

Also who should TA target tonight if we don't lynch him?

[gkrieg13]

Also who should TA target tonight if we don't lynch him?

It's between hockey and mail-mi.

[Witherweaver]

Mail-Mi.  Hardest player to read.

[hockeysemlan]

Actually looking back at the days and Hockey is just trying to push wagons every day.  He seems the least towny of the VTs to me.  He might be the 3rd party, he also says he isn't whiteknighting EFHW, but just says that she is his top town read.  This sounds scummy to me. 

vote: hockeysemlan

PPE:  I believe he already said it doesn't

Focus on better targets. I'm not the guy, today. And hum, how can I both be sheepy and "pushing wagons" at the same time? I was stuck e until he was caught, then I made a case against Ghacob and now I'm torned between Hydrad and TA. I don't see how that's scummy behaviour.

Townreading EFHW the way I did is scummy though, I admit that..

PPE: great. Better to target me in some way than lynching me right now..

[gkrieg13]

Actually looking back at the days and Hockey is just trying to push wagons every day.  He seems the least towny of the VTs to me.  He might be the 3rd party, he also says he isn't whiteknighting EFHW, but just says that she is his top town read.  This sounds scummy to me. 

vote: hockeysemlan

PPE:  I believe he already said it doesn't

Focus on better targets. I'm not the guy, today. And hum, how can I both be sheepy and "pushing wagons" at the same time? I was stuck e until he was caught, then I made a case against Ghacob and now I'm torned between Hydrad and TA. I don't see how that's scummy behaviour.

Townreading EFHW the way I did is scummy though, I admit that..

PPE: great. Better to target me in some way than lynching me right now..

I guess I kind of meant that you were pushing wagons by sheeping.  That is what I was going for.

[hockeysemlan]

I guess I kind of meant that you were pushing wagons by sheeping.  That is what I was going for.

Alright. Still, I created the case on Ghacob and I voted e 3 days in a row. That's not sheepy behaviour in my book. It started today, in that case.

[gkrieg13]

Mail-Mi.  Hardest player to read.

I definitely agree with this.  He hasn't been pushed that much this game.

[mail-mi]

Although WW voted for EFHW on day 2, never explained it, and then asked me questions trying to take focus off of EFHW.
It might be weak, but I'm trying to find something. 

Hydrad could be the double voter!  We need a vote count to confirm though.  If he is, TA is lynched.

PPE: anything else from you mail-mi?

Not really, unfortunately.

so just sheeping?

Yeah, pretty much. I agree with your observations.

[Witherweaver]

Okay, so,

TA first vote is against UoS (#475).  Switches to e here:

Yeah, I agree that a lot of it was "noise". Definitely catch up a few pages at a time I had a hard time following the cases/reasoning (and a lot of it still isn't clear).

Really I'm fine lynching gkrieg/Seprix not because of the cases on them, but the opinions I got from my own re-read. I don't have a good thread on what the "case" is, who's been on wagon/who hasn't been, but I just know that these are players who I found scummy things on when I re-read. And for D1 here I think that's enough honestly. I don't have enough of a read on anyone to avoid wagons based on who's on/off. I'm sure I'll be able to get a lot more focus later on.

I disagree with you on XP, also.

I still think you're scummy, but 2.7's reaction has definitely been scummy than your reaction, so Vote: 2.7.

I think no one else was voting for e.  Later on in the day, switches to Seprix:

Not sure how long I'll be around tomorrow and I want my vote somewhere useful. vote: seprix

Here e had 3 votes (including TA), Seprix had 5.  Switches back to e here:

I am just terrible at quotes today:

Cynicism mode:  50/50 means you've talked too much or been the subject of too much attention so he feels bad having no read on you.

Heh, that's probably true. Which is weird, cuz I don't think there's anything wrong with having null reads right now.

Seprix is flailing. I have no idea what kind of flailing though. He's scummy to me but I have more trouble putting my finger on his scumminess compared to e's scumminess. my head says e, my gut says seprix (but both say uos) i don't know which one i should trust more.

vote: 2.7

After XP had moved to e, and I think one more had joined the Seprix wagon.  Jump off of e felt like partner bussing, but the jumping back on does not.  e becomes the dominant lynch, alternatives are XP and Seprix.  TA argues against XP and still considers Seprix.  This:

My take on viable lynches:

E=Seprix > Hockey >>> XP

I'm out for dinner, will be back probably 1-2 hours before deadline. I'll be here though.

gives him a potential "out" of the e wagon if Seprix becomes viable.  But here e has 6 votes, Seprix, XP, and Hockey all had 3. 

He doesn't come back again until after the lynch.

Day 2, fairly early on comes back to e:

vote: e

interested to hear more about egork though.

mail-mi's townread on e seems very constructed to me.

Switches to Mail-Mi later; e isn't really a viable lynch Day 2.  Votes Ichi Day 3, and then back to e:

I'd lynch E still

Vote: E

At this point Seprix was an alternate wagon, I think it was 3-3, putting e in the lead.  Then Seprix, then Hockey and e is hammered at L-1.

PPEs.

[Witherweaver]

I don't think this is partner behavior.  Especially Day 3.  Why lynch e then?

[Seprix]

unvote

I'm open to ideas after WW said things.

[ashersky]

Vote Count 5.8:

WW (1): chairs
TwistedArcher (2): Hydrad, hockey
hockey (2): gkrieg13, mail-mi

Not Voting (4): IG, TA, ww, seprix

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Day 5 ends on August 8 at 2:00 a.m.

[Twistedarcher]

@TA  You had scum reads on mail-mi on day 2.  How do you feel about him now?

Still think he's scummy. I just thought the way he was sheeping and getting on wagons was phony and ingenuous, and I still think that. Honestly though I don't have a lot to go on here, he's done nothing to stick out since then. He keeps using the "I'm busy" excuse as a reason he's not scum, but it's a null reason not an anti-scum reason.

[Twistedarcher]

I'd be fine lynching Hockey, especially so if he's the alternative to me getting lynched.

[gkrieg13]

The vote count means Hydrad isn't the double voter. I'm fine with Hydrad, hockey, or mail mi at this point. One of them has to be scum/3rd party. Plus if we lynch out of mail mi and hockey, TA can target the other one and if they don't die, we can lynch TA.

[gkrieg13]

Actually I think this is a good idea. We lynch mail-mi and TA investigates hockey. Then we have checked everyone alive for ruin. If TA doesn't die in the night, he is ruin and we lynch him tomorrow.

[Seprix]

Actually I think this is a good idea. We lynch mail-mi and TA investigates hockey. Then we have checked everyone alive for ruin. If TA doesn't die in the night, he is ruin and we lynch him tomorrow.

Great plan. vote: Hockey

[Witherweaver]

Hockey:

First sheeps the Chair wagon early and then  on Seprix, who I think is the leading wagon at this point:

can mess with us

what does that even mean

Five votes, man, that's around just provoking aka "mess with someone"- but ah, shouldn't care, made my case with you I think. Scumread me as much as you like, but you can't lynch me alone- despice how many times you vote, y'know.

PPE: gk speaking sense. I like it. Vote: Seprix

Ok. Your not alone anymore. Good luck with it.

A couple posts later a pretty hedgey stance on e:

This last series of posts makes me feel townier on Seprix. I don't feel really good about this wagon. Can we lynch e instead? That would be great. I thought it was common knowledge by now that everyone should sheep me D1

I'm staying. Rereading e gives me a null/slight townie feeling, I could read him scummy but that would be based on meta and I don't like that very much. He is not a bad lynch, but I regard seprix scummier at this point.

Gets on the e wagon:

Ugh.. Everything is so random..

The good thing with an e-lynch at this point is the fact that Faust pushes it so hard that if he's wrong he might be a good candidate for D2. I don't understand why you would tunnel someone this much as town, (though I understand that it is a quite naive statement. Good towns do anything, I guess) at least not D1.

There some good points against e, though, and I wouldn't mind to test if Faust is right, after alll. Seprix is the obvious choice today and we can always take him tomorrow. In my mind, both e and seprix can be scum.   

Vote: e

From Seprix 6 to e 5, which flips the wagon to e's favor, earning some town points I think.  Stays on e through the rest of day 1.

Day 2, votes e again:

I'm Back!

Fell behind due to computer-problems and whatnot.. strange lynch yesterday, need to catch up on that more thouroughly later.. but briefly reading it: nice save scumteam.

vote: e

Basically stays there all day.  On Day 3 goes for Ghacob:

Aw, man..

This wasn't good at all. Both the choice of Egork as the "lurkerlynch" and the loss of UoS.. Can't really complain since I haven't been as active as I maybe need to be.. we need to get a grip on this game today..   

vote: Ghacob

Then Seprix:

SS is lurking so hard right now. Like seriously. He's been online all day and has only posted once. He hasn't been doing ANY scum hunting which he usually does as town. Actually, I really like an SS lynch today.

Vote: SS

He has been scumhunting? He pushed me quite hard to test my reaction, and cleared me after a while, SS is seriously my towniest read right now- lurking or not.

Your try to scumpaint SS is bad and you should feel bal.

vote: Seprix

Back to e, which actually was the hammer due to some kind of doublevote.  (How do we know e wasn't just hated?)

E-lynch is happening, Yey!

Vote: e

And was pretty vocal about a townread on EFHW.  Well, not that likely a partner here.  The L-1/hammer could have been bus for cred (e looked to be already the decided lynch by that point), but the switching late on Day 1 and staying on him is less likely.

PPE