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Author Topic: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion  (Read 88694 times)

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markusin

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #75 on: November 03, 2014, 12:15:17 am »
0

Or change it to "When you gain an Action, you may put it on your Reserves mat."
Whoops. Uh, that's what it was supposed to be. Only action cards go on the reserves mat.
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ThaddeusB

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #76 on: November 03, 2014, 09:03:02 pm »
0

Looking at the existing basic card types, I see one combination that hasn't been tried yet: Duration-Attack.  What would a Duration-Attack look like?  The first idea that comes to my mind is a cost increaser - an anti-Bridge for your opponents if you will.  That or something like "silver produces one less" or maybe even "when you play an action, discard a card".

In terms of unexplored areas, Guilds added "flexible coins".  The next logical step is "flexible cards" - one time use cards you obtain through whatever means that don't go into your deck but are set aside to be used at your choice.  I definitely think there will be non-supply cards based on the announced set size, so something like a special card or cards that give you these flexible cards is plausible.  Or maybe cards that get aside on buy to be used whenever, but after the first use go into the deck as normal.

Presumably there will be at least one alt VP card.  No ideas there, but I wouldn't mind seeing another vanilla VP-Action card.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #77 on: November 03, 2014, 09:16:11 pm »
0

It's highly, highly unlikely for Durations to appear outside of Seaside.  We can hope though.

Duration-Attacks have been discussed before, but I am too lazy to search for an old thread.  The anti-Bridge has been discussed before as well. 

A duration cost-increaser has a couple of design problems.  The first is that its interaction with cost reducers can be confusing for many people.  The second is that it can cause some broken scenarios where multiple players are playing it every turn and nobody is able to buy anything at all because all the costs are increased too much.

Duration attacks in general can be confusing in their interaction with Moat.  You play the attack, I reveal Moat.  Am I now defended against your "while in play" attack?  If it's a card that attacks now and on the new turn, does my initial Moat protect me on my next turn?  Can I reveal a Moat on the next turn to block that latter attack?

These problems don't preclude cards like that from being made, but it does make them unlikely to me.
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popsofctown

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #78 on: November 03, 2014, 10:05:12 pm »
+1

Is it April? Didn't we already have our last expansion
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Hydrad

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #79 on: November 03, 2014, 10:15:21 pm »
0

Is it April? Didn't we already have our last expansion

Have I got a surprise for you!
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blueblimp

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #80 on: November 03, 2014, 10:29:23 pm »
+1

The first idea that comes to my mind is a cost increaser - an anti-Bridge for your opponents if you will.
The original Cutpurse was exactly this: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=117.0.
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Kirian

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #81 on: November 03, 2014, 11:26:22 pm »
+7

Is it April? Didn't we already have our last expansion

Also, bad news, Isotropic is going down.
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #82 on: November 03, 2014, 11:39:17 pm »
0

Is it April? Didn't we already have our last expansion

Also, bad news, Isotropic is going down.

I remember that April Fool's joke except that it actually wasn't a joke.
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Awaclus

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #83 on: November 03, 2014, 11:49:21 pm »
0

Is it April? Didn't we already have our last expansion
No. No.
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market squire

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #84 on: November 04, 2014, 11:22:16 am »
0

Looking at the existing basic card types, I see one combination that hasn't been tried yet: Duration-Attack.  What would a Duration-Attack look like?  The first idea that comes to my mind is a cost increaser - an anti-Bridge for your opponents if you will.  That or something like "silver produces one less" or maybe even "when you play an action, discard a card".

In terms of unexplored areas, Guilds added "flexible coins".  The next logical step is "flexible cards" - one time use cards you obtain through whatever means that don't go into your deck but are set aside to be used at your choice.  I definitely think there will be non-supply cards based on the announced set size, so something like a special card or cards that give you these flexible cards is plausible.  Or maybe cards that get aside on buy to be used whenever, but after the first use go into the deck as normal.

Presumably there will be at least one alt VP card.  No ideas there, but I wouldn't mind seeing another vanilla VP-Action card.

The Duration Attack thing is very unlikely, although I'm currently thinking of fixing this concept, which is hard, but maybe possible. As I don't consider this a speculation, it will be in the Fan Card section soon. :)

But the more likely sounds your other guess to me. Timing flexibility. Cards that give you the decision when to trigger (besides when you play it).
I asked Donald about such effects here. It was about a Dark Ages Outtake that was like "+1 Action, set this aside --- when you play an Action while this is set aside you may put this into play and play the Action again." It seems really promising - but it needed a mat.
Instead of using a mat, there could be neutral "trigger cards" that you put on a card to indicate how often you can still trigger its effect. In this example, instead of using a mat and putting the card back into play, you'd remove the trigger card to indicate that the effect has been used (and that the Action will be cleaned up).

EDIT: Just found a necropolitan Thread with exactly the same idea (only without ancillary cards).
« Last Edit: November 04, 2014, 12:05:13 pm by market squire »
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werothegreat

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #85 on: November 04, 2014, 12:39:55 pm »
+1

The way to do a Duration Attack is to only have it attack when played.  That way you avoid the nonsense LastFootnote was speculating about.  For example, I made a fan card called Coastal Raiders that had a Militia discard effect when played, and +$3 on your next turn.

However, every Reaction (and Lighthouse) that deals with Attacks specifically says "When another player *plays* an Attack."  So theoretically a Duration Attack that attacks both turns would be possible and logically feasible, but it would be an immense bummer to have to sit through an attack twice because you didn't have your Moat when it was first played, so that's a reason against them.

As for "while in play" Duration Attacks, now that would just be silly.
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #86 on: November 04, 2014, 02:10:21 pm »
0

I think Duration attacks could work if only the instance they are put into play counts as attacking. I mean, on the second turn, the card is already in play, so you aren't playing it again. Yah, it weakens lighthouse and Moat, but as long as the attack isn't too oppressive, this really shouldn't be an issue.
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AJD

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #87 on: November 04, 2014, 10:17:06 pm »
+6

I think Duration attacks could work if only the instance they are put into play counts as attacking. I mean, on the second turn, the card is already in play, so you aren't playing it again. Yah, it weakens lighthouse and Moat, but as long as the attack isn't too oppressive, this really shouldn't be an issue.

It doesn't weaken Lighthouse and Moat; it just makes them really confusing.
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ThaddeusB

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #88 on: November 07, 2014, 12:56:50 pm »
+1

Thanks for the thoughts on "duration attacks". I agree that their interaction with reactions could be confusing. That mostly means more rule book text, but probably does weaken the chances of something like that ever happening. In regards to the cost increaser specifically, it could be fixed to prevent broken situations... but the fact Cutpurse started that way and changed on publisher request pretty much completely rules the idea out.

However, there might be other ways to get opponent hand effects without being an attack exactly - kind of like Smugglers, you could get some benefit from opponent turns with in an play card ("while this is in play, gain a coin token when an opponent buys a card") or messes with people in a "neutral" way and thus isn't considered an attack ("while this is on play, whenever one would draw a card, gain an action instead; whenever one would gain an action, draw a card instead").  A reaction-attack (which could be responded to by another reaction to block the attack) might be another way to make the idea work ("when a player gains a card you may discard this. If you do, they gain a curse.)

There could also be "altering effects" on your own hand only ("when this is in play, +1$ for each action card played.  I doubt any of these specific cars will happen, bit I would not at all be surprised to see some sort of new "lingering effect" mechanism introduced - either through "use later" cards or cards with effects that aren't completely resolved immediately or some other way I haven't imagined. While durations and con tokens do this to some degree, I feel there is a lot of room left in that space.

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Eran of Arcadia

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #89 on: November 07, 2014, 08:46:39 pm »
0

("while this is on play, whenever one would draw a card, gain an action instead; whenever one would gain an action, draw a card instead").

I think if you worded it exactly like that, you could argue that it causes an infinite loop.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #90 on: December 09, 2014, 05:59:41 pm »
+1

Donald has revealed a new card!

Persuasive Procurer - Action, $5
+$2
In your buy phase this turn, the other players reveal their hands, and you can buy cards from them.
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Donald X.

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #91 on: December 09, 2014, 06:17:16 pm »
+35

Donald has revealed a new card!

Persuasive Procurer - Action, $5
+$2
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Band of Nitwits: Action, $5
Play this as if it were any joke card Donald X. has posted in the forums costing less than it that you choose. This is that card until it leaves play or becomes too confusing.
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Kirian

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #92 on: December 09, 2014, 06:18:19 pm »
+2

Donald has revealed a new card!

Persuasive Procurer - Action, $5
+$2
In your buy phase this turn, the other players reveal their hands, and you can buy cards from them.
Band of Nitwits: Action, $5
Play this as if it were any joke card Donald X. has posted in the forums costing less than it that you choose. This is that card until it leaves play or becomes too confusing.


Post of the year.
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Archetype

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #93 on: December 09, 2014, 06:23:25 pm »
+7

I think what's in the set is up in the air at this point.

How's that for some groundless speculation.
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jsh357

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #94 on: December 09, 2014, 06:26:37 pm »
+1

As if DXV would be crazy enough to have a hot air balloon card or something.  Madness, right?
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eHalcyon

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #95 on: December 09, 2014, 06:36:41 pm »
+3

I think what's in the set is up in the air at this point.

How's that for some groundless speculation.

OK, here is some more groundless speculation about the upcoming set.  Some potential card names:

Chasm
Empyrean
Flying Machine
Bottomless Pit
Erosion
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LastFootnote

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #96 on: December 09, 2014, 07:06:26 pm »
+6

Groundless Speculation — Action, $5
Name a card. Wait for the next Dominion expansion to be released. If it contains a card by that name, gain a Province.
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #97 on: December 09, 2014, 07:13:18 pm »
+2

Groundless Speculation — Action, $5
Name a card. Wait for the next Dominion expansion to be released. If it contains a card by that name, gain a Province.

Something tells me that you would gain a lot of provinces...and at an acceptable speed for goko :P
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Archetype

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #98 on: December 09, 2014, 08:13:30 pm »
+1

I think what's in the set is up in the air at this point.

How's that for some groundless speculation.

OK, here is some more groundless speculation about the upcoming set.  Some potential card names:

Chasm
Empyrean
Flying Machine
Bottomless Pit
Erosion
Darn. I wondered if someone had made that joke already.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Groundless speculation about the 2015 expansion
« Reply #99 on: December 09, 2014, 10:54:06 pm »
0

Donald has revealed a new card!

Persuasive Procurer - Action, $5
+$2
In your buy phase this turn, the other players reveal their hands, and you can buy cards from them.
Band of Nitwits: Action, $5
Play this as if it were any joke card Donald X. has posted in the forums costing less than it that you choose. This is that card until it leaves play or becomes too confusing.


Post of the year.

But what about Stache?  :'(
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