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[catsclaw]

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201112/15/game-20111215-063524-87e70ce5.html

I didn't notice him buy the Province, which is why I ended the game when I did.  His strategy was to use Treasuries and try and hit a Tournament (which I hated because the Nobles will cycle the Treasuries, and all the Curses mean it'll take forever to buy a Province).  Mine was to get a lot of Caravans hoping to cycle through the Sea Hag faster, and buy Nobles.  Obviously, it didn't work.  Should I have just stuck to money?

[Geronimoo]

The Sea Hag combined with no trashing forces this game into a big money affair. Buy Silvers until you get to 1 Gold, then start greening (empty Nobles first, get Provinces if you can and then empty the Duchies for a 3-pile ending). Don't bother with the card drawers here.

[ackack]

I'm not sure I'd say his strategy was to "use Treasuries" since it looks like he had 2 - it seems like more of a Tournament deck. I actually think this is a spot where Treasury will be quite strong - pick them up when you can, don't buy any green until fairly late, and then use your moneyed up deck to actually run at Provinces. added: Picking up a Tournament on an early 4 isn't a bad idea either - if your opponent isn't really going for Provinces, it's likely to stay useful.

added: also, if you are going to try to green rush, then Transmute is probably legitimately useful here after a few turns, especially if you have a deck full of Caravans.

[DG]

I was going to post something along the lines of "a few strategies might work here, as long as you put together a coherent plan based on your early draws". However Geronimoo got in first so I thought I'd put together a script for a drawing deck using transmute. The simulator shows it slightly ahead of the raw hag+treasure+green strategy so I'm guessing the balance will go with decisions in play and managing the 3-pile ending. The transmute deck might also have more options coming from the tournament, which I haven't included in my script.

Code: [Select]

<player name="transmute" author="DG" description="The drawing of the caravans make the trasmute viable">
 <type name="UserCreated"/>
 <type name="Province"/>
 <type name="Bot"/>
 <type name="TwoPlayer"/>
   <buy name="Province">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Gold"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Duchy">
      <condition>
         <left type="gainsNeededToEndGame"/>
         <operator type="smallerOrEqualThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="4.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Nobles">
      <condition>
         <left type="gainsNeededToEndGame"/>
         <operator type="smallerOrEqualThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="3.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Estate">
      <condition>
         <left type="gainsNeededToEndGame"/>
         <operator type="smallerOrEqualThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Transmute">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Transmute"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Treasury">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Treasury"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Gold"/>
   <buy name="Sea_Hag">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Sea_Hag"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Curse"/>
         <operator type="greaterOrEqualThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="3.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Potion">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Potion"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Transmute"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Caravan"/>
   <buy name="Transmute">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Transmute"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Silver"/>
   <buy name="Transmute"/>
</player>

[mischiefmaker]

My thought was Sea Hag-BM as well. Caravan, Treasury, and Tournament are going to be much lower value than usual since there's a lot more junk in your deck for them to draw into -- a Treasury that draws into a Curse is less valuable than a Silver. Also, Tournament is less valuable than normal since by the time you can actually buy a Province, much less line it up with a Tournament, the prizes won't be that valuable.

In general, I tend to dislike trying to cycle Sea Hags using cantrips -- not effective enough, and the cantrips lose value over time as your deck adds Curses.

[HiveMindEmulator]

a Treasury that draws into a Curse is less valuable than a Silver

Not really true, as the treasury can still go back on top of your deck to be used next turn.

[ackack]

a Treasury that draws into a Curse is less valuable than a Silver

Not really true, as the treasury can still go back on top of your deck to be used next turn.

Yeah, that's the key point here. 3 or 4 Treasuries should give you a few turns of building Golds and getting a consistently strong deck that I think should compete well against somebody rushing for Duchies/Nobles.

[Geronimoo]

akack's Treasury strategy does indeed beat the 3-pilers. You should probably build up to 3-4 Golds using Treasuries and then start greening.

[werothegreat]

You let him get all the Tournaments.  That's just asking for Followers to spank you.

[mischiefmaker]

Followers seems significantly weakened with Sea Hag on board, especially if both players open Sea Hag.

[werothegreat]

Followers seems significantly weakened with Sea Hag on board, especially if both players open Sea Hag.

It would still be the only discarding attack on the board.  And Bag of Gold would be great to have, because the Golds might help relieve the mush created by all the Curses.  And then you can Transmute them into Duchies.  Either way, you really should never let your opponent get all the Tournaments.

[Geronimoo]

It will take a lot of effort to reach $8 for Provinces after the cursing so your deck will have expanded and it will be very hard to align the Tournaments with the Provinces. On top of that the Followers will not deal out Curses and people will have plenty crap to discard. Bag of Gold will be useful but it all just seems too much work for very little gain.