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Author Topic: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia GAME OVER, SCUM WINS  (Read 122865 times)

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Teproc

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1025 on: August 30, 2014, 12:09:56 pm »

I'm trying to understand the whole Andrew thing. Is it that if there is no Roleblocker then he must have been Rolestopped and is therefore scum?

Yep.

Keep in mind that these are the PRs faced by mafia : 3-Shot Cop, Watcher, Tracker, Roleblocker. What's the upside in rolestopping town ?

I can see a few, but none of these really apply :
- you could rolestopp an obvious COp target to prevent an IC, but how was Andrew an obvious cop target ? Most people had a town read on him at that point I believe.
- if you think you'll be tracked, targeting someone else than the NK can make you look like a PR. BUt that's not worth using a shot, and is probably faulty logic anyway.
- if you think Andrew will be watched, targeting him could make you look like a PR, but see above.
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1026 on: August 30, 2014, 12:33:51 pm »

Well I'm not sure what to say, no idea why I'd be rolestopped.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1027 on: August 30, 2014, 12:42:04 pm »

Yep.  Vote:Andrew
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1028 on: August 30, 2014, 12:42:50 pm »

Yep.  Vote:Andrew

Syntax.  Vote: Andrew
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1029 on: August 30, 2014, 12:56:41 pm »

Vote: Andrew
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Teproc

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1030 on: August 30, 2014, 12:58:21 pm »

That's L-1 by the way.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1031 on: August 30, 2014, 12:59:13 pm »

Or not. WW keeps voting twice, it's confusing !
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Hydrad

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1032 on: August 30, 2014, 01:00:10 pm »

Is there any point in delaying this lynch? I guess hearing andrews final words? But no point in waiting till the end of the day I'm assuming
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Teproc

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1033 on: August 30, 2014, 01:01:44 pm »

Well I'm not sure what to say, no idea why I'd be rolestopped.

This was after Jimmm posted, so I'm assuming ANdrew didn't have anything more to say, since Jimmm not being a doctor obviously means we lynch him. I mean if you want to wait for Andrew to post his final thoughts that's fine, but it's so unlikely that he's town that I wouldn't bother at this point.
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Hydrad

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1034 on: August 30, 2014, 01:46:56 pm »

Well Vote: Andrew

Thats Lynch in 1
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1035 on: August 30, 2014, 02:09:30 pm »

vote: Andrew
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1036 on: August 30, 2014, 02:11:32 pm »

THREAD LOCKED
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1037 on: August 30, 2014, 02:14:09 pm »

Flavor later.

AndrewisFTTW has been lynched. He was Kotake (Mafia ???)!

Night Four begins now and ends at 2 PM forum time, Monday September 1st.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1038 on: August 30, 2014, 02:15:53 pm »

FINAL VOTE COUNT:

AndrewisFTTW (5): Teproc, Witherweaver, Jimmmmm, Hydrad, AndrewisFTTW

Not voting (3): scott_pilgrim, chairs, EgorK

With 8 alive, it took 5 to lynch.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Night Four)
« Reply #1039 on: August 31, 2014, 07:25:53 pm »

A reminder to everyone to confirm and send in night actions before the start of Day Five.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1040 on: September 01, 2014, 04:02:19 pm »

The group slept in Kakariko village. When they awoke, they were horrified to find Sheik's lifeless body in her bed. Nervously, they finally pulled the wrapping from her face, and then let out it a collective gasp. "She was Princess Zelda all along!" they cried out. "No one could have guessed!"

With heavy hearts, they took up the Master Sword and headed for the Spirit Temple.

Witherweaver has been killed in the night! He was Sheik (Town 3-shot Cop)!
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Four)
« Reply #1041 on: September 01, 2014, 04:04:14 pm »

DAWN OF THE FIFTH DAY.

VOTE COUNT 5.0:


Not voting (6): Hydrad, scott_pilgrim, jimmmmm, chairs, EgorK, Teproc

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Day five ends at 10:00 pm, September 11

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Night Four)
« Reply #1042 on: September 01, 2014, 04:05:13 pm »

Seems about right. Now we need to reread Andrew, cross that with Archetype and see what that tells us. Really this should be the easy part.

EgorK, do you have a result you want to share ?
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1043 on: September 01, 2014, 05:18:15 pm »

Andrew reread. I'll comment on every interaction I can see (except interactions with me, although I'll probably make a note of them). I will include every vote though.

DAY 1

#47 : Happy that mail-mi is IC, RVS on S_P

#50 : Reminds Hydrad he's not in BM anymore when he votes for mail-mi

#54/59/63/69/72/100 : The whole thing with the Robz IC plan. To remind everyone : Hydrad voted mail-mi saying we should lynch him so that Robz cpuld inherit IC and could be Link. I supported that and said I liked the plan except it didn't work because UB doesn't inherit IC in this setup. Obviously this was all just a joke about Robz's avatar, but Andrew got confused at this and thought it was a real plan but he was missing something. This all could work with Hydrad being his partner : Andrew missed the point because he was worried that his partner Hydrad was going to get in trouble. Maybe. Probably just confirmation bias at work here, curious if anyone agrees on this particular point.

#104 : Votes WW for reading too much into Hydrad's play. Again, being overly protective of Hydrad ? This is getting a little too obvious though, scum might not want to defend their buddies so much so early.

#114 : "What's with the wagon on Hydrad ?" Hydrad had 4 votes at this point, very early into day 1.

#118 : When Hydrad says he's scared and would rather not die, Andrew suggest he could defend himself. More overt coaching !

#120 : "Huh ?" at Archetype for a single-line vote on Hydrad. So... this could be "huh, you're bussing, really ? Are you sure this is a good choice ?" It could also be "really, going for the easy lynch ?". Probably null.

#123 : Arch answers this is scum panicking, Andrew says he doubts newbie scum would raw so much attention to themselves. Yeah I'm really liking the Arch/Andrew/Hydrad scumteam here : Andrew might have told Hydrad to keep a low profile on day 1 because he wouldn't be lynched as a newbie, and freaked out when Hydrad started joking about lynching the ICs. Then Arch decides to bus whn the wagon is already high, hoping that everyone will get scared and never revisit Hydrad later in the game (there was a whole theory a few games ago about how early suspicion was great for scum). This solidifies Andrew in his protection of Hydrad since the other partner is bussing and scum tends to not want to do the same thing as their partners
.
#134 : As Hydrad reaches L-1 through ash, this is what Andrew posts

Yeahhh... what exactly was the point of that? We have more than a week to actually discuss things.

Maybe a little too relaxed for my theory ? Not sure about this post.

#156 : Reminds everyone that we haven't heard of S_P, Egork, Robz and not much from mail-mi, Arch and chairs. This leads into the semantics debate with ahs that gets a little heated and we don't really need to get into it since they've both flipped.

#180 : Says ash putting Hydrad at L-1 was a scum plan. Chainsaw defense, textbook (it's when you attack someone on your partner's  wagon to discredit the wagon).
He also says in this post that he's actually null on Hydrad. Distancing himself for chen Hydrad flips ?

#220 : Now thinks Hydrad is town "despite his weird defense post". Defends Hydrad by comparing him to ANdrew in WoT.
Says I'm scummy for being non-commital.
Disagrees with ash's point about Jimmm's posting style.

#223 : Response to me defending myself from #220, says it's wierd I'm not forming solid reads, asks what I think of Hydrad based on his defense post.

#226 : Agrees with me that Jimmmm is suspicious, disagrees with me about Hydrad.

#232 : There's a whole discussion between him and me (already present in #220,223 and #226) where he says I backed off of him because of my bias against him, which is me being noncommital. I say that wasn't the main reason, he says it reminds him of a similar argument with yuma in Stack the Deck (where yuma was scum)

#260 : In response to me voting for Jimmm by saying "has been scummy (see previous posts", asks which posts I'm referring to.

#281 : Votes for me for not answering his question in #260, not commiting to my reads, being sarcastic "and stuff". That was the fourth vote on me at that point.

#304 : Says his lynch of choice is ash because the L-1 thing seems like a scum strategy. Says he could also lynch me. After this point he's mostly taling about ash.

#317 : Votes ash.

#350 : Reiterates his willingness to lynch me but would prefer to lynch ash.

#381 : Agrees with a post by S_P about silverspawn in which S_P defends silverspawn.

#416/417 : Agrees with Egork arguing with me about ash being scum. Asks me if I have a reason to think ash is scum or if I just think the wagon on him is scummy. There's more trying to convince various people (me and WW mostly) to hammer ash. ANd then some arguing with ash himself.

#503/508 : IN response to me noting that my reads have been bad lately, says it's scummy because it seems like I'm trying to cover my bases if ash flips scum. Says I'm his #2 lynch.

#514 : After I respond to #503, says he has no idea what he was talking about.

#599 : Says Jimmmm is "somebody to look at if ash flips town", but doesn't want to lynch him today. Jimmmm has 4 votes on him at this point.

DAY TWO

#683 : First post, votes Jimmmm for being the scummiest on wagon, going back to lurk after starting the wagon, lacking content.
Still thinks Robz is town. Wonders why I'm voting for him considering I did a similar thing in Stack the Deck (similar to what Robz did by backing off of ash after he refused to claim)

#691 : Doesn't get why I'm convinced Jimmm is town.
Less sure about Egork but appears to be leaning town.

A lot of discussing Robz.

#715 : Explains the differences between bussing and a wagon to Hydrad.

#728 : Finds Jimmm's silverspawn-only reread scummy.

#739 : Reaffirming that Jimmm is scummy.

#774 : Finds WW's vote on Egork weird after he had been mostly suspeciting Robz and myself.

#785 : Says he doesn't know what to think about silverspawn (who has 5 votes at his point), tries to get people to vote Jimmm (who has 3 votes at this point).

#798 : Doesn't think silver is scum, no one is votins Jimm, so he votes Robz (second vote on Robz, silver being the major wagon at that point with 4 votes, Jimmm actually still had 3 votes).

#833 : Says he could lynch Robz of silver at this point. Robz has 4 votes, silver has 3, Jimmm and Egork have 2. This makes Jimmm look more suspicious to me : why is Andrew suddenly giving up on lynching him ?

#874 : After Robz is hammered : "Wow. That sucks. Not sure if we should know who targeted WW..."

DAY 3

#895 : votes Arch in his 3rd post of the day (first two were about needing to reread and being absent for a while). This is after silverspawn's claim, before Arch's claim.

#914 : Unvotes after Arch claims and Hydrad denies Arch's claim, says he needs to reread.

#928 : "No way Hydrad is lying here", votes Arch.

#956 : In explaining #928, says Hydrad is doing what he expects new town to do in this situation.

DAY 4

Nothing of substance actually, since he didn't post until we started uncovering the whole rolestopping thing.
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Teproc

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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1044 on: September 01, 2014, 05:20:54 pm »

SO basically, for me, this comes down to : would Andrew be this obviously protective of Hydrad if he were his scum partner ? I believe he could certainly be, and it seems completely logical to do so especially in the end, where Hydrad's counterclaim of Arch would clearly give him a chance of distinguishing himself from the pool of VTs.

This combined with the fact that rereading Arch also made me go with Hydrad as the most likely partner is enough for me. I will reread Hydrad though (not today) before I do anything.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1045 on: September 01, 2014, 05:26:09 pm »

Hydrad had either used ninja shot or not mafia

PPE: 2
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1046 on: September 01, 2014, 05:28:00 pm »

Well that changes things. A lot. How likely is it that scum still has their one-shot ninja on day 4 ? Probably very low...
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1047 on: September 01, 2014, 05:30:40 pm »

We know Andrew was rolestopped on night 2, which might imply he was doing the NK. We know Arch was doing the NK on N3, so if nHydrad is scum he wouldn't have used his shot here.

But knowing there's a Tracker and a Watcher in the setup, and especially since they shot the IC who had a decent chance of being Watched, they would have definitely used their ninja there. So yeah, I'm probably wrong about Hydrad.
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1048 on: September 01, 2014, 05:49:07 pm »

does this mean I get to be a IC and get killed tonight?
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Re: M48: Legend of Zelda Mafia (Day Five)
« Reply #1049 on: September 01, 2014, 05:54:15 pm »

does this mean I get to be a IC and get killed tonight?

That would be great, I wouldn't have to be paranoid about you because everything except for Egork's tracking makes me think you're scum. Egork is about 150 times more likely to die than you though, so that won't happen.

Better yet, we could end the game today ! I'm thinking Jimmm as the ain candidate, but it's so hard to form a read on chairs. BOth Arch and Andrew have virtually no interactions with him, but that's just a byproduct of his lurking... They also don't have a lot of interactions with S_P, which I think looks good for S_P.
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