Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 2 3 ... 17 [All]

Author Topic: New Promo at Origins...  (Read 141397 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
New Promo at Origins...
« on: June 12, 2014, 01:45:02 pm »
+23

« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 02:30:58 pm by pinkymadigan »
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2014, 01:47:39 pm »
+1

Prince card:
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1186675/new-dominion-origins-promo

Pretty powerful, pretty expensive.

I was thinking, "King's Court it to get three actions!" but I realized it said "If you do"...  I guess the best you could do now is play three Highways and use it on King's Court.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2014, 01:52:07 pm »
+2

Then I thought of playing four Highways and playing it on itself, but then I realized the first one would lose track of the second once it got set aside.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2014, 01:53:34 pm »
0

Then I thought of playing four Highways and playing it on itself, but then I realized the first one would lose track of the second once it got set aside.

That's probably the answer to what I'm kicking around in the BGG thread. For a minute I thought double-Prince shenanigans might be allowed.
Logged

jsh357

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2577
  • Shuffle iT Username: jsh357
  • Respect: +4341
    • View Profile
    • JSH Gaming: Original games
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2014, 01:55:08 pm »
0

Glad to see it finally came out; it's a really cool and powerful card, but not without risk.  Someone reply here when it's possible to order a copy!
Logged
Join the Dominion community Discord channel! Chat in text and voice; enter dumb tournaments; spy on top players!

https://discord.gg/2rDpJ4N

Watno

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2745
  • Shuffle iT Username: Watno
  • Respect: +2984
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2014, 01:56:34 pm »
0

4 Highways into Princing a Prince
Logged

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7140
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2014, 01:56:51 pm »
0

A princed Prince does nothing because you'll fail to trigger the "If you do" clause in "You may set this aside. If you do, set aside an Action card" at the beginning of each turn. I don't think the princes lose track of each other, they're identical twins after all.

Princing a Mercenary or Followers would be pretty sweet.
Logged

yed

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 620
  • Shuffle iT Username: yed
  • Respect: +571
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2014, 01:58:19 pm »
+1

Glad to see it finally came out; it's a really cool and powerful card, but not without risk.  Someone reply here when it's possible to order a copy!
You won't get it for free after the playtesting?
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2014, 01:59:31 pm »
0

Also, someone on the BGG thread said that you get the Prince back, but you don't.  It stays set aside.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7140
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2014, 02:02:00 pm »
+18

There's also the obvious Prince-Princess combo to make you Prince more expensive actions each turn.
Logged

petrie911

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 147
  • Respect: +109
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2014, 02:05:42 pm »
+8

Kind of reminds me of how tournament's payoff works. You buy an $8 card and get it to collide with a $4 card for a huge benefit.
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2014, 02:08:00 pm »
0

Kind of reminds me of how tournament's payoff works. You buy an $8 card and get it to collide with a $4 card for a huge benefit.

Or, better yet, pair it with Tournament...
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

jsh357

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2577
  • Shuffle iT Username: jsh357
  • Respect: +4341
    • View Profile
    • JSH Gaming: Original games
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2014, 02:11:57 pm »
0

Glad to see it finally came out; it's a really cool and powerful card, but not without risk.  Someone reply here when it's possible to order a copy!
You won't get it for free after the playtesting?

I didn't playtest it.  Don't see why I would get it for free anyway.
Logged
Join the Dominion community Discord channel! Chat in text and voice; enter dumb tournaments; spy on top players!

https://discord.gg/2rDpJ4N

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2014, 02:18:53 pm »
+10

Princing a Mercenary or Followers would be pretty sweet.

In our second playtest game, my housemate got a Prince of Spies, then that helped him get a Prince of Mercenaries. It was so brutal and awesome.

In the third game, I got a Prince of the Black Market, allowing me to buy Sea Hag. Then I got a Prince of Sea Hags.

Prince is awesome.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2014, 02:20:08 pm »
+9

for easier access:
 

jsh357

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2577
  • Shuffle iT Username: jsh357
  • Respect: +4341
    • View Profile
    • JSH Gaming: Original games
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2014, 02:25:54 pm »
0

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"
Logged
Join the Dominion community Discord channel! Chat in text and voice; enter dumb tournaments; spy on top players!

https://discord.gg/2rDpJ4N

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2014, 02:28:14 pm »
+25

It conforms to the principle that $8 cards begin with the letter P.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2014, 02:29:06 pm »
+3

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"

I don't expect soon, because implementing this correctly will require them to let you choose the order of start-of-turn effects. You want your Prince of Watchtowers to go off before your Wharf, but you want your Prince of Remodeling to go off afterward.
Logged

Titandrake

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2211
  • Respect: +2859
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2014, 02:30:01 pm »
0

Even Prince on a cantrip is like starting your turn by playing a level 2 City. It is an $8 card, to be fair.

I suppose it does need to compete with Province. In terminal draw-BM, it probably isn't worth it, but its existence makes terminal draw-BM weaker.
Logged
I have a blog! It's called Sorta Insightful. Check it out?

2.71828.....

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • Shuffle iT Username: irrationalE
  • Respect: +1322
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2014, 02:30:26 pm »
0

Really interesting card.  Obviously princing a throne room, spy, scheme (that would be really nice) or other such card is going to be amazing.  I would be careful about princing a masquerade or ambassador though
Logged
Man. I had four strips of bacon yesterday. Was one automatically undercooked, one automatically overcooked? No, let's put a stop to that right here, all four strips were excellent.

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2014, 02:31:20 pm »
+2

Princing a Smithy is amazing...
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2014, 02:33:19 pm »
+14

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"

I don't expect soon, because implementing this correctly will require them to let you choose the order of start-of-turn effects. You want your Prince of Watchtowers to go off before your Wharf, but you want your Prince of Remodeling to go off afterward.

Nah, they'll just go ahead and implement it incorrectly.
Logged

2.71828.....

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • Shuffle iT Username: irrationalE
  • Respect: +1322
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2014, 02:34:28 pm »
0

Just so I am straight on the mechanics of the card:  The card you choose to set aside will be played at the start of your turn every turn, but you may decide not to set it aside (for whatever reason) and then that card just gets shuffled back into your deck.  The prince itself is forever out of play
Logged
Man. I had four strips of bacon yesterday. Was one automatically undercooked, one automatically overcooked? No, let's put a stop to that right here, all four strips were excellent.

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2014, 02:36:15 pm »
+3

Just so I am straight on the mechanics of the card:  The card you choose to set aside will be played at the start of your turn every turn, but you may decide not to set it aside (for whatever reason) and then that card just gets shuffled back into your deck.  The prince itself is forever out of play
I don't think technically you are allowed to not set it aside intentionally, but if it gets rid of itself (Hermit), you could not set it aside whether you wanted to or not, and the Prince would still be out of play, yes (by my reading, I'm sure someone will confirm or deny).
Logged

2.71828.....

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • Shuffle iT Username: irrationalE
  • Respect: +1322
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2014, 02:36:33 pm »
0

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"

I don't expect soon, because implementing this correctly will require them to let you choose the order of start-of-turn effects. You want your Prince of Watchtowers to go off before your Wharf, but you want your Prince of Remodeling to go off afterward.

Nah, they'll just go ahead and implement it incorrectly.

Is the anything in the rules about resolving start-of-turn effects?  I mean, the duration cards that we have really do not need any special rule, but this seems like it needs something in the rules to clarify when exactly it should happen.  Or if you get your choice of when it happens
Logged
Man. I had four strips of bacon yesterday. Was one automatically undercooked, one automatically overcooked? No, let's put a stop to that right here, all four strips were excellent.

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #25 on: June 12, 2014, 02:40:53 pm »
+4

Is the anything in the rules about resolving start-of-turn effects?  I mean, the duration cards that we have really do not need any special rule, but this seems like it needs something in the rules to clarify when exactly it should happen.  Or if you get your choice of when it happens

Quote from: Seaside Rules
If multiple cards resolve at the same time on your turn (for example, Duration cards that do something “at the start of your next turn”), you choose what order to resolve them. A card that affects multiple players during your turn still resolves in player order, affecting you first if it affects all players and then proceeding clockwise.

The order of start-of-turn effects never matters when using just Seaside cards, but with Prince it does. You can resolve your Prince effects before, after, or between your Duration effects. And if you have multiple Prince effects, you can resolve some Durations between them.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 02:42:25 pm by LastFootnote »
Logged

theory

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3603
  • Respect: +6125
    • View Profile
    • Dominion Strategy
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #26 on: June 12, 2014, 02:48:18 pm »
+5

My head hurts parsing how this card will work ...
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #27 on: June 12, 2014, 02:50:37 pm »
+2

My head hurts parsing how this card will work ...

Mechanically it's pretty easy. Set it aside with a card, then play that card at the start of each turn. It doesn't work on Durations or one-shots.

IRL it's easiest to put the Princed card on top of the Prince and leave them in your play area so that you remember to do it each turn.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2014, 02:51:46 pm »
0

It conforms to the principle that $8 cards begin with the letter P.
I guess I have to start calling them "Plääni" and "Pkulkukauppias" then...
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #29 on: June 12, 2014, 02:52:03 pm »
+6

Really interesting card.  Obviously princing a throne room, spy, scheme (that would be really nice) or other such card is going to be amazing.  I would be careful about princing a masquerade or ambassador though
Even a Throne Room could be bad.

"Oh dang, I drew 4 Colonies and an Ambassador..."
Logged

Titandrake

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2211
  • Respect: +2859
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2014, 02:55:16 pm »
+5

What happens if you Prince an Island? You don't discard the Island from play, but every turn you do set the Island aside.
Logged
I have a blog! It's called Sorta Insightful. Check it out?

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #31 on: June 12, 2014, 02:57:16 pm »
+1

What happens if you Prince an Island? You don't discard the Island from play, but every turn you do set the Island aside.

…Huh. Good call. Obviously the intent is that you stop playing it if you fail to set it aside with Prince. Still, good catch.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #32 on: June 12, 2014, 02:58:33 pm »
+4

it seems best to target cards that are strong but unreliable, since reliability is always a non-issue, smithy seems perfect. also, cards that like a 5-card hand much more than a 4 card hand, like coppersmith, or storeroom.

and dont forget the prince->beggar->gardens rush :P

pinkymadigan

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 172
  • Respect: +185
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #33 on: June 12, 2014, 03:01:38 pm »
0

and dont forget the prince->beggar->gardens rush :P

Love it.
Logged

2.71828.....

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • Shuffle iT Username: irrationalE
  • Respect: +1322
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #34 on: June 12, 2014, 03:02:45 pm »
+3

and dont forget the prince->beggar->gardens rush :P

Love it.

but getting to 8 to buy prince?  Not going to happen
Logged
Man. I had four strips of bacon yesterday. Was one automatically undercooked, one automatically overcooked? No, let's put a stop to that right here, all four strips were excellent.

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #35 on: June 12, 2014, 03:04:18 pm »
+3

and dont forget the prince->beggar->gardens rush :P

Love it.

but getting to 8 to buy prince?  Not going to happen

Hah, you underestimate Beggar. In fact, I'd love to have a Prince of Beggars even without Gardens. With an extra $3 to spend every turn, you can pretty reliably get to $8 with just a few Silvers in your deck.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #36 on: June 12, 2014, 03:08:05 pm »
+15

The five Princes of the Bureaucrat pin.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #37 on: June 12, 2014, 03:09:22 pm »
+3

Prince + Counting House!  It needs a bit of price reduction to get moving, but finally a real Counting House combo :)
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #38 on: June 12, 2014, 03:13:49 pm »
0

The five Princes of the Bureaucrat pin.
A Prince of Crossroads counters this pretty well.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #39 on: June 12, 2014, 03:14:39 pm »
+12

I recognize this card from the Outtakes. A variant of this is in the "Orphans" section of the outtakes:


Prince - $6 - Action
Set aside this and an action card from your hand costing up to $5. Play it at the start of each of your turns.


Quote from Donald X. himself:
"Prince was cool but really could only exist as a unique card like a prize; otherwise people would always be Princing Princes."

You proved yourself wrong, and I thank you for it. Really awesome card. Practically a 1-card expansion given how intense it is.

It's interesting to compare the price of the 2 variants, and how the older version let you set aside a $5.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #40 on: June 12, 2014, 03:17:15 pm »
+1

scheme (that would be really nice)
Oh, that would be really nice indeed. Scheme is probably the best target for Prince.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #41 on: June 12, 2014, 03:19:28 pm »
0

Beware, the Prince of the Advisor.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #42 on: June 12, 2014, 03:21:14 pm »
+1

Prince of Scavengers, the closest thing to Lucky Chancellor in a real game.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #43 on: June 12, 2014, 03:25:05 pm »
+1

Oh man, Prince of Warehouses is pretty sweet.
Logged

Dsell

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • He/Him
  • Respect: +933
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #44 on: June 12, 2014, 03:27:35 pm »
0

Prince of Scavengers, the closest thing to Lucky Chancellor in a real game.

Just think of how much this will help two-card combos! Prince of Scavengers/Chancellors loves Stash as well as the Prince of Counting Houses (which incidentally sounds like a terribly boring job).
Logged
"Quiet you, you'll lynch Dsell when I'm good and ready" - Insomniac


Winner of Forum Survivor Season 2!

pst

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 584
  • Respect: +907
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #45 on: June 12, 2014, 03:31:45 pm »
+52

I recognize this card from the Outtakes. A variant of this is in the "Orphans" section of the outtakes:


Prince - $6 - Action
Set aside this and an action card from your hand costing up to $5. Play it at the start of each of your turns.

Let's call that version "the card formerly known as Prince".
Logged

Axxle

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1664
  • Most Valuable Serial Killer
  • Respect: +1966
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #46 on: June 12, 2014, 03:31:51 pm »
+2

Prince of Herbalists would probably be a cool dark horse in Colony games.
Logged
We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

pacovf

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3501
  • Multiediting poster
  • Respect: +3841
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #47 on: June 12, 2014, 03:33:59 pm »
0

After three highways, prince of king's court.  8)

Let's call that version "the card formerly known as Prince".

Haha, nice.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 03:37:40 pm by pacovf »
Logged
pacovf has a neopets account.  It has 999 hours logged.  All his neopets are named "Jessica".  I guess that must be his ex.

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #48 on: June 12, 2014, 03:39:15 pm »
0

I think this is the Prince of the golden decks. Prince/Goons Golden Deck sounds especially awesome.

Prince/Princess sounds extremely awesome.
Logged

2.71828.....

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1290
  • Shuffle iT Username: irrationalE
  • Respect: +1322
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #49 on: June 12, 2014, 03:40:03 pm »
0

Prince of Herbalists would probably be a cool dark horse in Colony games.

prince of herbalist is actually super amazing.  province/colony every turn once you have your golds/silvers/plats (or whatever you need to get to 8 or 11) in play
Logged
Man. I had four strips of bacon yesterday. Was one automatically undercooked, one automatically overcooked? No, let's put a stop to that right here, all four strips were excellent.

azadin

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 31
  • Respect: +28
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #50 on: June 12, 2014, 03:41:52 pm »
0

After three highways, prince of king's court.  8)

So mechanics question. Does the cost of the card you set aside have to be 4 the first time you play Prince, or does its cost have to be 4 or less at the end of each turn from then on out? The wording seems to imply that it only has to cost 4 when you initially play Prince and set the card aside with it. This seems crazy strong.

Also, if you Prince the King's Court, and play a duration card with it, would the King's Court get set back on the Prince, or would it go with the duration card, thereby losing it's Prince status afterward?
Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #51 on: June 12, 2014, 03:43:27 pm »
0

Also, if you Prince the King's Court, and play a duration card with it, would the King's Court get set back on the Prince, or would it go with the duration card, thereby losing it's Prince status afterward?

The latter.
Logged

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7140
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #52 on: June 12, 2014, 03:43:42 pm »
+9

Goko should make this card cost 4 for like the first week it's released, just so that we can all get our craziness fix.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #53 on: June 12, 2014, 03:45:15 pm »
0

So mechanics question. Does the cost of the card you set aside have to be 4 the first time you play Prince, or does its cost have to be 4 or less at the end of each turn from then on out? The wording seems to imply that it only has to cost 4 when you initially play Prince and set the card aside with it. This seems crazy strong.

It just has to be $4 or less when you set it aside with Prince initially.

Also, if you Prince the King's Court, and play a duration card with it, would the King's Court get set back on the Prince, or would it go with the duration card, thereby losing it's Prince status afterward?

Ooh, I've never had this happen. I think it doesn't get discarded, so you don't get to keep playing it. Better not use your precious Prince of the King's Court to play a Duration.
Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #54 on: June 12, 2014, 03:45:39 pm »
0

Goko should make this card cost 4 for like the first week it's released, just so that we can all get our craziness fix.
h
Actually, Prince on Prince does not work, because each play on the inner Prince will either do nothing or set it aside and thus forever lose the outer Prince effect.
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #55 on: June 12, 2014, 03:46:29 pm »
+1

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=1204.msg387920#msg387920

You could easily set up horrible pins with this card and Possession.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #56 on: June 12, 2014, 03:47:05 pm »
0

Goko should make this card cost 4 for like the first week it's released, just so that we can all get our craziness fix.

Oh man, it's plenty crazy at $8. I mean, I haven't played it against elite players, so maybe I won't have time to set Prince up in more online games. But using Prince on pretty much anything is awesome, so that helps you get some use out of it before the game ends.
Logged

pacovf

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3501
  • Multiediting poster
  • Respect: +3841
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #57 on: June 12, 2014, 03:49:23 pm »
+2

Goko should make this card cost 4 for like the first week it's released, just so that we can all get our craziness fix.

Imagine if princing a prince worked. I don't think anyone would complain ever again about duration cards.

"I princed a prince two turns ago, and at the beginning of the previous turn I played the prince to prince a prince. So this turn I play prince twice to prince a smithy and a militia, and next turn I will start my turn by drawing three cards, making you discard down to three, and then princing a bridge and another smithy before my real turn even begins. Now, is this smithy here one I played with prince, or one I played during my turn?"

-> Needs more "yo dawg".
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 03:50:36 pm by pacovf »
Logged
pacovf has a neopets account.  It has 999 hours logged.  All his neopets are named "Jessica".  I guess that must be his ex.

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #58 on: June 12, 2014, 03:49:52 pm »
+22

Lord Bottington is going to love his Prince of Rats.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

Axxle

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1664
  • Most Valuable Serial Killer
  • Respect: +1966
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #59 on: June 12, 2014, 03:50:02 pm »
0

Prince of Herbalists would probably be a cool dark horse in Colony games.

prince of herbalist is actually super amazing.  province/colony every turn once you have your golds/silvers/plats (or whatever you need to get to 8 or 11) in play
It'd also allow you to Double Province a lot easier than you normally would, and you'd probably be doing some of that if you're setting up a Prince thing while the other person is pounding Colonies.
Logged
We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #60 on: June 12, 2014, 03:53:10 pm »
+11

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

pst

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 584
  • Respect: +907
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #61 on: June 12, 2014, 03:54:06 pm »
0

Just thinking about using Prince with almost any action card is interesting. (Where are the Prince of Scout jokes, by the way?) But when I think of having two (or more) Princes with actions to play in the order you want then my mind really boggles. Suppose you have Princes of Bridge and Workshop/Armory when competing for the Minion split or something similar. Or a Beggar Prince with Prince of Coppersmith for extra $6 each turn.

Maybe it's too hard to set up even one Prince, so two Princes will take too much time? (DOTB.)
Logged

theblankman

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
  • Respect: +383
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #62 on: June 12, 2014, 04:00:26 pm »
0

A princed Prince does nothing because you'll fail to trigger the "If you do" clause in "You may set this aside. If you do, set aside an Action card" at the beginning of each turn. I don't think the princes lose track of each other, they're identical twins after all.
I'm not sure why you think this... the Princed Prince is already set aside, so "set this aside" just means put it where it already is.  Clause trivially triggered.  Unless there are specifically two different "aside" places, one for Princes and one for targets of Prince.  Then the Princed Prince would, on some turn after he's played, "move" from the aside-space for Prince targets to the aside-space for Princes, and you'd get to put another action on that Prince.  So it either goes crazy, or it lets you put a target on the second Prince, once, on some later turn.  But I don't see how it would do nothing at all. 
Logged
it's a shame that full-random is the de facto standard

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #63 on: June 12, 2014, 04:00:40 pm »
0

(Where are the Prince of Scout jokes, by the way?)
Scout isn't actually bad when it doesn't cost a card in your hand and gives you an extra action.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #64 on: June 12, 2014, 04:03:30 pm »
+1

(Where are the Prince of Scout jokes, by the way?)
Scout isn't actually bad when it doesn't cost a card in your hand and gives you an extra action.

True, but the opportunity cost of not having Princed something else can be quite high.
Logged

theblankman

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
  • Respect: +383
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #65 on: June 12, 2014, 04:03:54 pm »
0

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
You also don't discard the Hermit from play because it's set aside with Prince, and stays there.  So you never trigger the effect, "When you discard this from play... gain a Madman."  Sorry. 
Logged
it's a shame that full-random is the de facto standard

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #66 on: June 12, 2014, 04:07:45 pm »
+3

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
You also don't discard the Hermit from play because it's set aside with Prince, and stays there.  So you never trigger the effect, "When you discard this from play... gain a Madman."  Sorry.
No, you do discard it from play. That triggers two effects: Prince's and Hermit's, and you get to decide the order. If you choose wrong, you'll lose the Hermit, but if you don't, you get to keep it.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

theblankman

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
  • Respect: +383
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #67 on: June 12, 2014, 04:13:12 pm »
+1

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
You also don't discard the Hermit from play because it's set aside with Prince, and stays there.  So you never trigger the effect, "When you discard this from play... gain a Madman."  Sorry.
No, you do discard it from play. That triggers two effects: Prince's and Hermit's, and you get to decide the order. If you choose wrong, you'll lose the Hermit, but if you don't, you get to keep it.
Right, don't have the exact words of Prince down yet... and Hermit doesn't even have an "if you do" to guard the gain-Madman effect, just "trash this and gain a Madman."  Although one might argue that even if you pick the Prince effect first, it's possible for the Hermit to trash himself from set-aside-land.  A card can't exactly lose track of itself, can it? 
Logged
it's a shame that full-random is the de facto standard

theblankman

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
  • Respect: +383
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #68 on: June 12, 2014, 04:15:53 pm »
0

And of course we can hypothetically strategize about the card before we even play it... anyone think that, given the chance, you might want to Swindle your opponent's Prince into a Province? :) 
Logged
it's a shame that full-random is the de facto standard

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #69 on: June 12, 2014, 04:18:05 pm »
+6

And of course we can hypothetically strategize about the card before we even play it... anyone think that, given the chance, you might want to Swindle your opponent's Prince into a Province? :)
If my opponent has wanted a Prince instead of a Province, the odds are that I want him to have a Province instead of a Prince.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #70 on: June 12, 2014, 04:18:48 pm »
+9

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
You also don't discard the Hermit from play because it's set aside with Prince, and stays there.  So you never trigger the effect, "When you discard this from play... gain a Madman."  Sorry.
No, you do discard it from play. That triggers two effects: Prince's and Hermit's, and you get to decide the order. If you choose wrong, you'll lose the Hermit, but if you don't, you get to keep it.

To expand on this a bit more (this post will be worth $3 more than Awaclus'), this is what happens:

1. You discard Hermit from play (without buying anything).  This triggers Prince and Hermit.
2. You decide which to do first.  If you choose Prince (which is all I'll worry about here):
3. You set the Hermit aside, being able to play it again next turn.
4. You try to trash the Hermit, but can't because it has lost track of itself.  You still gain the Madman.

PPE: Yes, a card can lose track of itself.  Most cases of losing track are a card losing track of itself (TR-Mining Village for instance).
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #71 on: June 12, 2014, 04:29:06 pm »
+3

If my opponent has wanted a Prince instead of a Province, the odds are that I want him to have a Province instead of a Prince.

Well. If you give him a Prince, he will still play it a shuffle later. A whole shuffle can make a big difference and make another Prince preferable. Also, there are tons of tactical considerations regarding parity of the Provinces and how the game status is at the moment.
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #72 on: June 12, 2014, 04:36:32 pm »
0

The real question is, what use does Prince have in puzzles like emptying the supply in 3 turns? none :(

My first thought was "Prince of death cart oh my gosh" but it doesn't work :(

Prince of scavenger + Prince of scheme = start every turn with an empty deck, 2 actions, 2 coins, 4 cards, 1 card schemed from last turn, and 1 card of your choice in your deck.

Prince of steward for trashing each turn - but only if you want it. Prince of sea hag though...

But actually I'm going to guess that this card is actually below average in terms of how often you get one.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #73 on: June 12, 2014, 04:44:47 pm »
0

I think the main use of Prince is when you are already pretty thin and (almost) guaranteed to connect it with the correct Action, so trashing won't necessarily be the best target.

EDIT: Cool, I'm a Margrave now.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 04:46:13 pm by Awaclus »
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #74 on: June 12, 2014, 04:45:32 pm »
+1

Prince of Sea Hag is just going to discard your opponent's top card every turn. The curses will almost be empty before you can even get a Prince. You may even play Sea Hag instead of Princing it just to give out the last curse.
Logged

blueblimp

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2849
  • Respect: +1560
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #75 on: June 12, 2014, 04:59:09 pm »
+4

Interesting that this card has an accountability hole. If you set it aside but don't have any <=$4 action card in your hand, you aren't required to show your hand to your opponents. Of course, this is unlikely to ever happen.

But actually I'm going to guess that this card is actually below average in terms of how often you get one.
With any engine strategy where you wouldn't already buy a Province with your first $8, which is most of them, it seems like a clearly good buy. I don't think you'll often need more than one.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 05:00:42 pm by blueblimp »
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #76 on: June 12, 2014, 05:01:15 pm »
+2

And of course we can hypothetically strategize about the card before we even play it... anyone think that, given the chance, you might want to Swindle your opponent's Prince into a Province? :)
If my opponent has wanted a Prince instead of a Province, the odds are that I want him to have a Province instead of a Prince.

Depends how long ago he bought it.
Logged

Axxle

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1664
  • Most Valuable Serial Killer
  • Respect: +1966
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #77 on: June 12, 2014, 05:04:00 pm »
+12

Why is everyone avoiding the real question here. How many posts do we need to make in order to be ranked a Prince?
Logged
We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

pst

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 584
  • Respect: +907
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #78 on: June 12, 2014, 05:05:09 pm »
+1

Prince of Sea Hag is just going to discard your opponent's top card every turn. The curses will almost be empty before you can even get a Prince. You may even play Sea Hag instead of Princing it just to give out the last curse.

Really fun and if you find it as the only curser in the black market deck, though, when you have a big deck  so playing it ten times normally would take forever.
Logged

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #79 on: June 12, 2014, 05:05:46 pm »
0

Goko should make this card cost 4 for like the first week it's released, just so that we can all get our craziness fix.

Oh man, it's plenty crazy at $8. I mean, I haven't played it against elite players, so maybe I won't have time to set Prince up in more online games. But using Prince on pretty much anything is awesome, so that helps you get some use out of it before the game ends.

Rats.  Remake.  Most forced trashers, really.  Tactician.

A princed Prince does nothing because you'll fail to trigger the "If you do" clause in "You may set this aside. If you do, set aside an Action card" at the beginning of each turn. I don't think the princes lose track of each other, they're identical twins after all.
I'm not sure why you think this... the Princed Prince is already set aside, so "set this aside" just means put it where it already is.  Clause trivially triggered.  Unless there are specifically two different "aside" places, one for Princes and one for targets of Prince.  Then the Princed Prince would, on some turn after he's played, "move" from the aside-space for Prince targets to the aside-space for Princes, and you'd get to put another action on that Prince.  So it either goes crazy, or it lets you put a target on the second Prince, once, on some later turn.  But I don't see how it would do nothing at all.

SCSN is absolutely correct.  "Set this aside" means moving the card from "not set aside" space to "set aside" space.  If it was already set aside previously, it can't be moved and therefore it can't be set aside again.  This is the same principle that prevents you from triggering Mining Village's +$2 multiple times with TR/KC.

Prince a Hermit for unlimited Madmen (you don't trash the Hermit)
You also don't discard the Hermit from play because it's set aside with Prince, and stays there.  So you never trigger the effect, "When you discard this from play... gain a Madman."  Sorry.
No, you do discard it from play. That triggers two effects: Prince's and Hermit's, and you get to decide the order. If you choose wrong, you'll lose the Hermit, but if you don't, you get to keep it.
Right, don't have the exact words of Prince down yet... and Hermit doesn't even have an "if you do" to guard the gain-Madman effect, just "trash this and gain a Madman."  Although one might argue that even if you pick the Prince effect first, it's possible for the Hermit to trash himself from set-aside-land.  A card can't exactly lose track of itself, can it?

sudgy already explained it well, but Prince-Hermit should work for the same reason that Scheme-Hermit works.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 05:07:14 pm by eHalcyon »
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #80 on: June 12, 2014, 05:07:39 pm »
0

Why isn't Prince a Duration card? (Just so the whole Seaside rulebook doesn't have to be included with it, I guess.)

Using Prince on a Duration card fails, right?

And now I'm super-confused about what using Prince on Prince would do.

Some wiki-editing is in order, but I don't have time to do it right now.
Logged

JacquesTheBard

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 246
  • Respect: +249
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #81 on: June 12, 2014, 05:11:21 pm »
0

With really flexible cards like Steward or Count Prince is truly obscene. Steward especially, given how useful trashing is at the beginning and draw at the end.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #82 on: June 12, 2014, 05:12:29 pm »
0

With really flexible cards like Steward or Count Prince is truly obscene. Steward especially, given how useful trashing is at the beginning and draw at the end.
Scheme especially, I would say.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #83 on: June 12, 2014, 05:14:21 pm »
0

Why isn't Prince a Duration card? (Just so the whole Seaside rulebook doesn't have to be included with it, I guess.)

Using Prince on a Duration card fails, right?

And now I'm super-confused about what using Prince on Prince would do.

Some wiki-editing is in order, but I don't have time to do it right now.

Prince as a Duration card -- you're probably right.  It would also be confusing for this to be the one Duration card that doesn't last just for the next turn.

Prince on a duration -- yes, it would fail on the turn that the duration card doesn't get discarded.  I think that means it might succeed for one turn with Outpost on an Outpost turn... I'm not sure.

Prince on Prince -- you set aside P1, then choose to set aside P2.  At the start of your next turn, you play P2 and set it aside.   Then you choose an action card from your hand to set aside.  At the end of that turn, you do not discard P2 and thus fail to set it aside again.  Therefore P1's effect is lost and P2 does not get played on any subsequent turn.  The action set aside for P2 will be played though.


With really flexible cards like Steward or Count Prince is truly obscene. Steward especially, given how useful trashing is at the beginning and draw at the end.

I think Prince-Steward would be great, but the trashing wouldn't matter much in this case.  By the time you get Prince, you'll usually have trashed down significantly with Steward already.  It could be helpful in junk-heavy games though.  But the choice between a free Wharf or Merchant Ship would already be very handy.


New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 05:16:49 pm by eHalcyon »
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #84 on: June 12, 2014, 05:16:18 pm »
+16

New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
They get disqualified for cheating, since Possession costs a Potion.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #85 on: June 12, 2014, 05:16:30 pm »
+1

Why isn't Prince a Duration card? (Just so the whole Seaside rulebook doesn't have to be included with it, I guess.)

Using Prince on a Duration card fails, right?

And now I'm super-confused about what using Prince on Prince would do.

Some wiki-editing is in order, but I don't have time to do it right now.

Prince as a Duration card -- you're probably right.  It would also be confusing for this to be the one Duration card that doesn't last just for the next turn.

Prince on a duration -- yes, it would fail on the turn that the duration card doesn't get discarded.  I think that means it might succeed for one turn with Outpost on an Outpost turn... I'm not sure.

Prince on Prince -- you set aside P1, then choose to set aside P2.  At the start of your next turn, you play P2 and set it aside.   Then you choose an action card from your hand to set aside.  At the end of that turn, you do not discard P2 and thus fail to set it aside again.  Therefore P1's effect is lost and P2 does not get played on any subsequent turn.  The action set aside for P2 will be played though.



New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?

You can never play Prince on potion cost cards, thank goodness.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #86 on: June 12, 2014, 05:17:15 pm »
0

New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
They get disqualified for cheating, since Possession costs a Potion.

Whooops.  Good call. :P
Logged

amalloy

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 453
  • Respect: +620
    • View Profile
    • Twitch stream
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #87 on: June 12, 2014, 05:19:34 pm »
+7

New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
They get disqualified for cheating, since Possession costs a Potion.

Next promo card: Hi-Potion. +1 card, +1 action; while this is in play, all cards cost one potion less, but not less than zero.
Logged

qmech

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1918
  • Shuffle iT Username: qmech
  • What year is it?
  • Respect: +2320
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #88 on: June 12, 2014, 05:25:52 pm »
+1

New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
They get disqualified for cheating, since Possession costs a Potion.

Next promo card: Hi-Potion. +1 card, +1 action; while this is in play, all cards cost one potion less, but not less than zero.

Hi-Potion: You may discard a card. If you do, you may trash up to 4 Curses.
Logged

pst

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 584
  • Respect: +907
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #89 on: June 12, 2014, 05:26:15 pm »
0

Why isn't Prince a Duration card? (Just so the whole Seaside rulebook doesn't have to be included with it, I guess.)

Also then it would be discarded when the princed card can't be set aside again, so you could reuse the Prince, which might be too good.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #90 on: June 12, 2014, 05:35:05 pm »
0

Hi-Potion: You may discard a card. If you do, you may trash up to 4 Curses.
I don't get it.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

Axxle

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1664
  • Most Valuable Serial Killer
  • Respect: +1966
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #91 on: June 12, 2014, 05:37:52 pm »
+2

Hi-Potion: You may discard a card. If you do, you may trash up to 4 Curses.
I don't get it.
Bottled Fairy $10P Action-Duration: When you buy this put it in play, do not shuffle it into your deck at the end of the game. If you would lose the game, trash this and instead replay the game.
Logged
We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

amalloy

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 453
  • Respect: +620
    • View Profile
    • Twitch stream
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #92 on: June 12, 2014, 05:40:59 pm »
0

Hi-Potion: You may discard a card. If you do, you may trash up to 4 Curses.
I don't get it.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Hi-Potion heals you, and trashing curses is kinda like healing? It seems like quite a stretch to me as well.
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #93 on: June 12, 2014, 05:46:43 pm »
+17

New question -- what happens when multiple players have Prince-Possession going?
They get disqualified for cheating, since Possession costs a Potion.

Next promo card: Hi-Potion. +1 card, +1 action; while this is in play, all cards cost one potion less, but not less than zero.

Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

yed

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 620
  • Shuffle iT Username: yed
  • Respect: +571
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #94 on: June 12, 2014, 05:50:00 pm »
0

Glad to see it finally came out; it's a really cool and powerful card, but not without risk.  Someone reply here when it's possible to order a copy!
You won't get it for free after the playtesting?

I didn't playtest it.  Don't see why I would get it for free anyway.
Oh it was LastFootnote, somehow I thought it was you.
Logged

Tables

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2817
  • Build more Bridges in the King's Court!
  • Respect: +3350
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #95 on: June 12, 2014, 05:50:15 pm »
+4

Maybe I missed it, but I'm surprised nobody else commented on the set icon. It's confusion (I think)! It fits perfectly!
Logged
...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #96 on: June 12, 2014, 05:54:00 pm »
+1

Prince on Prince -- you set aside P1, then choose to set aside P2.  At the start of your next turn, you play P2 and set it aside.   Then you choose an action card from your hand to set aside.  At the end of that turn, you do not discard P2 and thus fail to set it aside again.  Therefore P1's effect is lost and P2 does not get played on any subsequent turn.

Prince says "stop playing it if you fail to set it aside on a turn you play it". But you do set aside P2 on the second turn ("you play P2 and set it aside").

...I guess that doesn't matter, though, because it doesn't say "if you don't set it aside". It says "if you fail to set it aside", and you do "fail to set it aside" (in addition to successfully setting it aside earlier in the turn). Okay.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #97 on: June 12, 2014, 06:08:24 pm »
+23

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"
Having no inside information whatsoever, at this point my first guess is never. As always I have to concede to the possibility that they've been rewriting the entire program from scratch and then everyone had to take maternity leave.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #98 on: June 12, 2014, 06:13:32 pm »
+2

What happens if you Prince an Island? You don't discard the Island from play, but every turn you do set the Island aside.
You stop playing the Island if Prince itself failed to set it aside. It almost looks like "with Prince" would have fit on the card but oh well. Prince cannot find the card on your Island mat and in some obscure way the rules cover this.

Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #99 on: June 12, 2014, 06:16:02 pm »
0

I recognize this card from the Outtakes. A variant of this is in the "Orphans" section of the outtakes:


Prince - $6 - Action
Set aside this and an action card from your hand costing up to $5. Play it at the start of each of your turns.


Quote from Donald X. himself:
"Prince was cool but really could only exist as a unique card like a prize; otherwise people would always be Princing Princes."

You proved yourself wrong, and I thank you for it. Really awesome card. Practically a 1-card expansion given how intense it is.

It's interesting to compare the price of the 2 variants, and how the older version let you set aside a $5.
At the start of playtesting it looked like that with the understanding that I would fix the duration etc. problems somehow. It turns out that playing the same card every turn is powerful.

In the outtakes article I was just repeating what I had thought back when, but obv. there were wordy and confusing ways around the problems.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #100 on: June 12, 2014, 06:19:01 pm »
+32

So mechanics question. Does the cost of the card you set aside have to be 4 the first time you play Prince, or does its cost have to be 4 or less at the end of each turn from then on out? The wording seems to imply that it only has to cost 4 when you initially play Prince and set the card aside with it. This seems crazy strong.

Also, if you Prince the King's Court, and play a duration card with it, would the King's Court get set back on the Prince, or would it go with the duration card, thereby losing it's Prince status afterward?
It only has to cost $4 when you play Prince, and a Prince'd Throne will lose its magic if you use it on a duration card.

Prince FAQ

Prince has you play the same cheap action every turn for the rest of the game. The turn you play Prince, you set it aside with an Action from your hand costing $4 or less; then every turn after that you play the Action at the start of the turn, and then set it aside again when you discard it from play. If you don't discard the Action then you stop playing it with Prince; Prince at that point is just set aside doing nothing for the rest of the game. That won't normally happen but will happen for example if the Action is a Feast or Mining Village and you trashed it, or if it's a duration card and so it stayed in play, or if it's a Madman and was returned to its pile, or if it's an Island and was set aside, or if it's a card you put back on your deck with Scheme. In practice you will probably not choose to set aside Prince with a card that won't work well with it, and so will play the Action you set aside every turn from that point on. The set aside Action technically goes back and forth from being in play to being set aside each turn, but in practice it's easier to leave it sitting on the Prince and just announce resolving it each turn.

Prince has to be set aside to do anything; using Throne Room on Prince won't let you set aside two cards. The Action card you set aside has to cost $4 at the time you play Prince, but can normally cost more; for example you could play a Highway, then use Prince on a Laboratory. You do not play the set aside Action the turn you first set it aside with Prince. Playing the card each turn doesn't use up your normal Action play, and is mandatory; setting aside the Action when you discard it from play is also mandatory, you only fail to do it if the card isn't in play at that point. At the end of the game, Prince and the set aside card are returned to your deck before scoring. When you have multiple effects to resolve at the start of the turn - such as multiple Princes and certain duration cards from Seaside - resolve them in any order, and that order may vary from turn to turn; choose one to resolve, resolve it, then move on to another one, until they are all resolved. Cards which cost $0* such as Mercenary and the Cornucopia Prizes can be set aside with a Prince, as can cards from Guilds that cost $2+ or $3+ or $4+. Cards with a Potion in the cost cannot be set aside with Prince. Prince plays its Action on extra turns from Outpost and Possession. The Action card that Prince plays is in play after it's played each turn, so it will count for things like Peddler; Prince however remains set aside.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #101 on: June 12, 2014, 06:23:43 pm »
+1

Interesting that this card has an accountability hole. If you set it aside but don't have any <=$4 action card in your hand, you aren't required to show your hand to your opponents. Of course, this is unlikely to ever happen.
Yeah, after realizing that I'd missed accountability on some early cards and swearing to do better, I've ended up not always including it, because of the confusion or extra text. Graverobber also intentionally didn't include the accountability.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #102 on: June 12, 2014, 06:30:20 pm »
+1

Why isn't Prince a Duration card? (Just so the whole Seaside rulebook doesn't have to be included with it, I guess.)

Using Prince on a Duration card fails, right?

And now I'm super-confused about what using Prince on Prince would do.

Some wiki-editing is in order, but I don't have time to do it right now.
At some point in there Prince tried to be a duration card, on the grounds that it kept doing stuff. It doesn't fit what duration cards actually mean at all though; really the entirety of duration cards is, you leave them in play until they're done. Prince isn't in play. (I'm pretty sure I also tried a version that was in play.)

You can use Prince on a duration card and there are edge-cases where it could be the play. It's not very effective though, you will play the duration card on your next turn and then Prince will lose it forever. But I mean, maybe you really wanted to save that duration card for next turn.

Prince on Prince is not very useful.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #103 on: June 12, 2014, 06:33:48 pm »
+2

Maybe I missed it, but I'm surprised nobody else commented on the set icon. It's confusion (I think)! It fits perfectly!
I do not know what the icon is intended to mean.

Also, Highway, Prince on Tactician; on my opponent's turn I discard my hand to Torturers; play Tactician, fail to discard anything, discard it from play, set it aside again.
Logged

elahrairah13

  • Spy
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 81
  • Respect: +73
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #104 on: June 12, 2014, 06:53:36 pm »
0

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"
Having no inside information whatsoever, at this point my first guess is never. As always I have to concede to the possibility that they've been rewriting the entire program from scratch and then everyone had to take maternity leave.

I kind of love you.
(note: not in a stalker way)
Logged

elahrairah13

  • Spy
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 81
  • Respect: +73
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #105 on: June 12, 2014, 06:55:11 pm »
+3

My objection to "Princing a Prince" not being useful is that it would lead to more in-game singing of:
and we should have more of that, when you think about it
Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #106 on: June 12, 2014, 07:33:14 pm »
+1

Interesting that this card has an accountability hole. If you set it aside but don't have any <=$4 action card in your hand, you aren't required to show your hand to your opponents. Of course, this is unlikely to ever happen.

Forced playing of Prince with Golem, Herald or TR-TR-draw may make it happen. It is unlikely, but not unlikely enough that it will NEVER happen. However, I guess you can choose not to set aside Prince if you are forced to play it, so an edge case would be to want the Prince out of your deck. I guess if you anticipante this being the next-to-last of your turns and you need the Action now, it can happen. Golem into Prince and draw, play Prince first, set it aside, play draw, continue to play action claiming you just drew them.
Logged

ashersky

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2343
  • 2013/2014/2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
  • Respect: +1520
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #107 on: June 12, 2014, 08:53:33 pm »
0

In addition to the $8 price point, NOT getting to play your action on the turn you set it aside is a small penalty as well.

Not a huge thing, but something to consider, especially if it is a vital attack, etc.
Logged
f.ds Mafia Board Moderator

2013, 2014, 2015 Mafia Mod of the Year
2015 f.ds Representative, World Forum Mafia Championships
2013, 2014 Mafia Player of the Year (Tie)

11x MVP: M30, M83, ZM16, M25, M38, M61, M76, RMM5, RMM41, RMM46, M51

jamfamsam

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 721
  • Shuffle iT Username: jamfamsam
  • Respect: +1214
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #108 on: June 12, 2014, 11:14:25 pm »
+2

So, if you play the Prince and set it aside but don't have an appropriate card to set aside with it, is the Prince essentially lost to use? I'm thinking of this in context of the rare occasion I Possess my opponent and a Prince happens to be in his hand.
Logged
"There is no extra charge for awesomeness..."

Nevermind

  • Bishop
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 121
  • Respect: +77
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #109 on: June 12, 2014, 11:19:56 pm »
+2

Finally, the wait is over! My fingernails can start regrowing.
Logged

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #110 on: June 13, 2014, 12:20:12 am »
+1

So, if you play the Prince and set it aside but don't have an appropriate card to set aside with it, is the Prince essentially lost to use? I'm thinking of this in context of the rare occasion I Possess my opponent and a Prince happens to be in his hand.

Yes, it's lost for the rest of the game.
Logged

Beyond Awesome

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2941
  • Shuffle iT Username: Beyond Awesome
  • Respect: +2467
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #111 on: June 13, 2014, 12:45:35 am »
0

So, is there anyone who is at Origins that would not mind picking me up one of those Prince cards?
Logged

enfynet

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1692
  • Respect: +1162
    • View Profile
    • JD's Custom Clubs
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #112 on: June 13, 2014, 12:46:38 am »
0

Finally, the wait is over! My fingernails can start regrowing.
You already have it? Because I'm going to be checking the BGG store daily until I can order it. So no fingernails for me yet...
Logged
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious."

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #113 on: June 13, 2014, 12:55:03 am »
+2

You can use Prince on a duration card and there are edge-cases where it could be the play. It's not very effective though, you will play the duration card on your next turn and then Prince will lose it forever. But I mean, maybe you really wanted to save that duration card for next turn.

When you say "Prince will lose it forever", do you mean it'll be cleaned up and go back into your discard pile like normal (and thus stop being played by Prince that way), or do you mean it'll end up set aside and out of your deck forever (but still not being played by Prince)? The wording of Prince seems to suggest the latter—it tells you to set aside the Princed card when you discard it from play. So your Princed Caravan gets set aside when discarded from play, but since it wasn't discarded on the same turn you played it, it doesn't get played again and remains in set-aside-land forever.
Logged

jomini

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1061
  • Respect: +770
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #114 on: June 13, 2014, 01:55:40 am »
0

So my fun initial thoughts with Prince:
1. Prince pins have a lot of wild and crazy options. The simplest thing as that we have a new no-attack pin option - Prince x5/Masq x5; I could completely see setting that up if the other guy goes for a megaturn and gets 50%+1 of the VP points and then has his deck die e.g. he goes Hermit/Coppersmith/+buy and kills his deck buying 7 colonies or if he goes for a slow slog (e.g. Horse Traders/Silk Road) with a lot of staying power.
2. Now there is something besides Peddler to trash a Kc into. How often will it be the right move to Procession a Kc into a Prince and then play a freebie action every turn?
3. Prince/Sir Martin. So I can play a Knight every turn up until it hits one of yours. New winner for most annoying Black Market draw - when your opponent gets the one Prince-able Knight?
4. A combo which I think may be surprisingly strong fairly often would be Prince/Horse traders or /Storeroom or /Secret chamber. With any limit draw card: Menage, Minion, Watchtower, Jack, and Lib that let's you sift even with no village and get some nice coin for your efforts, as a bonus Ht gives you the +buy to make a big Lib turn make up for the lost province buy. Storeroom is an insane amount of sifting - you get to look through up to 10 cards for the ones needed to kick off your big turn and you can toss dross for cash with a +buy, with any sort of limited draw you can effectively start +3$/+1 buy and likely with nice stacks of cards.



Logged

assemble_me

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1407
  • Shuffle iT Username: assemble me
  • Dominion stream/yt junkie
  • Respect: +808
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #115 on: June 13, 2014, 03:47:48 am »
0

I would really like to know if/when Prince is going to be released in other languages...
Logged
Join the f.ds Dominion league | My Twitch channel

... and none of his posts shall remain unedited

brokoli

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1119
  • Respect: +787
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #116 on: June 13, 2014, 04:03:23 am »
0

Wow, this looks awesome.
What I really like is the combo potential, especially to build golden decks or decks that buy province every turn at least.
- Prince of trusty steed could be a fun way to rush on feodums
- Prince of Tfb is sick if you find a way to have a Fortress (or rats) in hand every turn
- Prince of Storeroom in a deck full of tunnels (after copper trashing) is an easy way to reach $8 every turn or even more (and spend the rest of the money on more tunnels).
- Native village golden deck seems to work easily with Prince. Just prince a courtyard and topdeck your province each turn before playing native village. Then you have a folden deck of 8 cards.
- Prince of Saboteur or Outpost (princed with the help of a cost reducer) : these cards hurts in the deck, playing them from the "set aside" make them much better.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #117 on: June 13, 2014, 04:07:37 am »
0

Wow, this looks awesome.
What I really like is the combo potential, especially to build golden decks or decks that buy province every turn at least.
- Prince of trusty steed could be a fun way to rush on feodums
- Prince of Tfb is sick if you find a way to have a Fortress (or rats) in hand every turn
- Prince of Storeroom in a deck full of tunnels (after copper trashing) is an easy way to reach $8 every turn or even more (and spend the rest of the money on more tunnels).
- Native village golden deck seems to work easily with Prince. Just prince a courtyard and topdeck your province each turn before playing native village. Then you have a folden deck of 8 cards.
- Prince of Saboteur or Outpost (princed with the help of a cost reducer) : these cards hurts in the deck, playing them from the "set aside" make them much better.
Prince of Outpost isn't very good though.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

qmech

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1918
  • Shuffle iT Username: qmech
  • What year is it?
  • Respect: +2320
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #118 on: June 13, 2014, 04:32:36 am »
0

Hi-Potion: You may discard a card. If you do, you may trash up to 4 Curses.
I don't get it.

I fluffed the reference, which was a bit of a stretch anyway.  Sorry. 

Your regularly scheduled Prince discussion will resume shortly.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #119 on: June 13, 2014, 06:39:24 am »
0

Imaging Princing a Council Room and having "sort of" a Tactician hand every turn!!!

You don't even have to play any more Tacticians to keep it rolling.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7140
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #120 on: June 13, 2014, 07:25:27 am »
0

You can use Prince on a duration card and there are edge-cases where it could be the play. It's not very effective though, you will play the duration card on your next turn and then Prince will lose it forever. But I mean, maybe you really wanted to save that duration card for next turn.

When you say "Prince will lose it forever", do you mean it'll be cleaned up and go back into your discard pile like normal (and thus stop being played by Prince that way), or do you mean it'll end up set aside and out of your deck forever (but still not being played by Prince)? The wording of Prince seems to suggest the latter—it tells you to set aside the Princed card when you discard it from play. So your Princed Caravan gets set aside when discarded from play, but since it wasn't discarded on the same turn you played it, it doesn't get played again and remains in set-aside-land forever.

It goes to the discard. What happens if you prince a Caravan is this:

Turn N: Prince-Caravan, both the Caravan and Prince are set aside.

Turn N+1: The set aside Caravan is played at the beginning of your turn. Because it's a duration, it won't be discarded from play at the end of this turn, hence Prince can't set it aside and by the parenthetical clause on the card will stop playing it, thus "losing it forever".

Turn N+2: You draw a card from the Caravan that's now totally disconnected from Prince, at the end of your turn it goes to the discard as usual.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #121 on: June 13, 2014, 07:41:42 am »
0

So this could be a fun Golden deck:

1. Prince an Envoy so you start every turn with 9 cards
2. KC-Scheme, Vault lets you draw 5 extra cards and you can discard 11 (9 - 3 + 5) cards to get a Colony
3. Put back KC, Scheme and Vault, rinse, repeat
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #122 on: June 13, 2014, 07:51:24 am »
0

So this could be a fun Golden deck:

1. Prince an Envoy so you start every turn with 9 cards
2. KC-Scheme, Vault lets you draw 5 extra cards and you can discard 11 (9 - 3 + 5) cards to get a Colony
3. Put back KC, Scheme and Vault, rinse, repeat
Or just Prince a Scheme and return the Envoy every turn.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #123 on: June 13, 2014, 08:02:50 am »
0

But if you Prince the Scheme you only get to pick one card to return every time (Envoy), so you're not guaranteed to draw Vault.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #124 on: June 13, 2014, 08:08:49 am »
0

But if you Prince the Scheme you only get to pick one card to return every time (Envoy), so you're not guaranteed to draw Vault.
I meant another Scheme. There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #125 on: June 13, 2014, 08:12:57 am »
+1

There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.

Minion.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #126 on: June 13, 2014, 08:14:33 am »
0

Well, obviously there are reasons, a card in your hand is vulnerable to attacks (Pillage, Minion); a set aside card is not.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #127 on: June 13, 2014, 08:35:30 am »
+2

You can use Prince on a duration card and there are edge-cases where it could be the play. It's not very effective though, you will play the duration card on your next turn and then Prince will lose it forever. But I mean, maybe you really wanted to save that duration card for next turn.

When you say "Prince will lose it forever", do you mean it'll be cleaned up and go back into your discard pile like normal (and thus stop being played by Prince that way), or do you mean it'll end up set aside and out of your deck forever (but still not being played by Prince)? The wording of Prince seems to suggest the latter—it tells you to set aside the Princed card when you discard it from play. So your Princed Caravan gets set aside when discarded from play, but since it wasn't discarded on the same turn you played it, it doesn't get played again and remains in set-aside-land forever.

It goes to the discard. What happens if you prince a Caravan is this:

Turn N: Prince-Caravan, both the Caravan and Prince are set aside.

Turn N+1: The set aside Caravan is played at the beginning of your turn. Because it's a duration, it won't be discarded from play at the end of this turn, hence Prince can't set it aside and by the parenthetical clause on the card will stop playing it, thus "losing it forever".

Turn N+2: You draw a card from the Caravan that's now totally disconnected from Prince, at the end of your turn it goes to the discard as usual.

Actually, the parenthesis says to stop playing it, not to stop setting it aside, and the setting aside (when played by Prince) is not conditional on being played, so I think Caravan should be set aside and lost forever too after being discarded at the end of turn N+2.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #128 on: June 13, 2014, 08:37:03 am »
0

Quote
There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.
why is sheme so great? 6cards, 2 actions and you can always topdeck one action card doesn't necessarily sound better than 8 cards 1 action

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7140
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #129 on: June 13, 2014, 08:55:08 am »
+3

Barring discard attacks and trash for benefit or multi-Prince shenanigans, princing a Scheme is strictly better than princing a Smithy because you can always at least Scheme the Smithy and play it as your first action each turn, which is functionally equivalent to princing a Smithy, but you can also choose to play something else first (say, Fishing Village - Watchtower) or scheme another card this turn. Hence a princed Scheme gives you greater flexibility.

There are enough cases where you want to prince the Smithy anyway, though. E.g. if you've princed another card that you sometimes want to play after the Smithy, the already mentioned discard attacks and maybe some specific TfB spots.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #130 on: June 13, 2014, 09:12:52 am »
0

Barring discard attacks and trash for benefit or multi-Prince shenanigans, princing a Scheme is strictly better than princing a Smithy because you can always at least Scheme the Smithy and play it as your first action each turn, which is functionally equivalent to princing a Smithy, but you can also choose to play something else first (say, Fishing Village - Watchtower) or scheme another card this turn.
oh yea, that's true. sheme it is.

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #131 on: June 13, 2014, 09:44:30 am »
+3

There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.

Minion.

Also, you may have a hand of Prince-Scheme-X, where X is the card that you really want to Prince.  If you Prince your Scheme, you may need to wait many turns before cycling back to X.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Emeric

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 275
  • Shuffle iT Username: Emeric
  • Respect: +212
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #132 on: June 13, 2014, 10:11:03 am »
0

There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.

Minion.

Also, you may have a hand of Prince-Scheme-X, where X is the card that you really want to Prince.  If you Prince your Scheme, you may need to wait many turns before cycling back to X.
No, you may have a hand of Prince-Scheme and have just to wait to hit your good card.
Logged

pacovf

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3501
  • Multiediting poster
  • Respect: +3841
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #133 on: June 13, 2014, 11:41:47 am »
0

But if you Prince the Scheme you only get to pick one card to return every time (Envoy), so you're not guaranteed to draw Vault.
I meant another Scheme. There is no reason to Prince anything other than a Scheme whenever Scheme is on the board.

Minion

EDIT: of course, there was another page.
Logged
pacovf has a neopets account.  It has 999 hours logged.  All his neopets are named "Jessica".  I guess that must be his ex.

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #134 on: June 13, 2014, 11:49:05 am »
+6

LastFootnote: how long into playtesting did the "Prince of X" phrasing come about? Because that's seriously the best.
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #135 on: June 13, 2014, 11:50:34 am »
0

LastFootnote: how long into playtesting did the "Prince of X" phrasing come about? Because that's seriously the best.

When Donald was first emailing me about it, he mentioned "Prince of Pearl Divers". I immediately realized it was the best phrasing ever. I'm glad it's caught on here! :D
Logged

matste

  • Scout
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 40
  • Respect: +67
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #136 on: June 13, 2014, 12:11:49 pm »
0

Guess the other question is '[when] will Goko get this?"
Having no inside information whatsoever, at this point my first guess is never. As always I have to concede to the possibility that they've been rewriting the entire program from scratch and then everyone had to take maternity leave.
Wouldn't they need to ask for some kind of licence before using the Prince?
Logged

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #137 on: June 13, 2014, 12:40:58 pm »
0

When Donald was first emailing me about it, he mentioned "Prince of Pearl Divers". I immediately realized it was the best phrasing ever. I'm glad it's caught on here! :D

I'm trying to decide what the funniest "Prince of X" is. Too bad you can't have a Prince of Harems...
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #138 on: June 13, 2014, 12:42:44 pm »
+6

I'm trying to decide what the funniest "Prince of X" is.



("Prince of Noble Brigands" doesn't have quite the same ring to it)
Logged

Robz888

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2644
  • Shuffle iT Username: Robz888
  • Respect: +3392
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #139 on: June 13, 2014, 12:54:58 pm »
+8

Beggar Prince.

Logged
I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Watno

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2745
  • Shuffle iT Username: Watno
  • Respect: +2984
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #140 on: June 13, 2014, 12:55:51 pm »
0

Prince Jack of All Trades?
Logged

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #141 on: June 13, 2014, 01:01:07 pm »
+2

Also I've been thinking of what the best cards for Prince and for a second was like "Ooo, Prince of Barons!" then realized the problem with that.
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

Beyond Awesome

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2941
  • Shuffle iT Username: Beyond Awesome
  • Respect: +2467
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #142 on: June 13, 2014, 01:07:18 pm »
0

Prince of Scouts  ;D
Logged

Moneymodel

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 128
  • Respect: +131
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #143 on: June 13, 2014, 01:13:29 pm »
0

Y'know, the Prince and the Peddler is very close to the Prince and the Pauper.
Logged

Beyond Awesome

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2941
  • Shuffle iT Username: Beyond Awesome
  • Respect: +2467
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #144 on: June 13, 2014, 01:21:44 pm »
+3

You know, it is interesting that this card if it were made for an expansion it could only really go into Prosperity, but it doesn't really fit that set because it hardly has any action cards that are $4 or less.
Logged

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #145 on: June 13, 2014, 01:39:00 pm »
0

You know, it is interesting that this card if it were made for an expansion it could only really go into Prosperity, but it doesn't really fit that set because it hardly has any action cards that are $4 or less.
But among them are Monument and Bishop. Bishop seems like a good target for Prince by the time you get the Prince.
Logged

Captain Stupendous

  • Alchemist
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 36
  • Respect: +18
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #146 on: June 13, 2014, 01:46:09 pm »
+5

I'm trying to decide what the funniest "Prince of X" is. Too bad you can't have a Prince of Harems...

Prince of Princesses
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7868
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #147 on: June 13, 2014, 01:56:25 pm »
0

From the FAQ:

Quote
The set aside Action technically goes back and forth from being in play to being set aside each turn, but in practice it's easier to leave it sitting on the Prince and just announce resolving it each turn.

Interesting thing of note when you're playing in real life, the Action you set aside modifies Peddler's cost every turn (except the turn you set it aside), but Prince never does.  So I guess something to be careful about.

(I think.)
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7868
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #148 on: June 13, 2014, 01:58:40 pm »
0

"Prince of Schemes" sounds pretty cool, too.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #149 on: June 13, 2014, 02:12:21 pm »
+2

When Donald was first emailing me about it, he mentioned "Prince of Pearl Divers". I immediately realized it was the best phrasing ever. I'm glad it's caught on here! :D

I'm trying to decide what the funniest "Prince of X" is. Too bad you can't have a Prince of Harems...

Prince of Rats?

Prince Jack of All Trades?

I think I've been calling this Prince of all Trades.
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7868
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #150 on: June 13, 2014, 02:19:49 pm »
0

Oh, snap.

Jon Snow: Prince of Stewards.

Because R+L = J implies Jon is a prince, and he's a steward.

Edit: Okay it implies he's a king, but he used to be a prince.
Logged

terminalCopper

  • Explorer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 331
  • Respect: +759
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #151 on: June 13, 2014, 02:21:41 pm »
+7

(Where are the Prince of Scout jokes, by the way?)
Scout isn't actually bad when it doesn't cost a card in your hand and gives you an extra action.
Yeah, Scout becomes a village with a bonus, and a village with a bonus usually costs 4$. In other terms, all you have to do to turn Scout into a correctly priced card is combining it with a card costing 8$.
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #152 on: June 13, 2014, 02:27:21 pm »
+2

(Where are the Prince of Scout jokes, by the way?)
Scout isn't actually bad when it doesn't cost a card in your hand and gives you an extra action.
Yeah, Scout becomes a village with a bonus, and a village with a bonus usually costs 4$. In other terms, all you have to do to turn Scout into a correctly priced card is combining it with a card costing 8$.
to be fair you don't usually get to play your 4 cost village you bought every single turn.
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #153 on: June 13, 2014, 02:37:45 pm »
0

How often should you pass on playing your Prince?  It's effectively a one shot, so do you play it with that spent Witch in your hand to at least get the extra draw, or did you hold on to it hoping for a better pairing next shuffle?
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #154 on: June 13, 2014, 02:42:52 pm »
+3

If there are ever councilroom-style achievements again there should be one for playing Prince with a Ruined Village (or Ruins in general)
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #155 on: June 13, 2014, 02:42:59 pm »
0

I think you usually play it on the witch. The witch may have been hurting your deck, and the difference in quality between +3 cards, + 1 action each turn and whatever you would have played it on several turns later isn't big enough to counteract the benefit you'll get in those turns. However, witch costs 5, so unless you have a cost reducer in play...
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #156 on: June 13, 2014, 02:43:52 pm »
0

How often should you pass on playing your Prince?  It's effectively a one shot, so do you play it with that spent Witch in your hand to at least get the extra draw, or did you hold on to it hoping for a better pairing next shuffle?

In this example, it can do only cards costing up to four, so there's that. But in general, I would assume that when you buy a prince, you have at least generally some idea of what card(s) you want to use it on--no sense using it on something like a pawn when you have a smithy in your deck. And much of it, I'm sure, is based off of how much of the game is left.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 02:45:16 pm by silvern »
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #157 on: June 13, 2014, 02:45:52 pm »
+2

If there are ever councilroom-style achievements again there should be one for playing Prince with a Ruined Village (or Ruins in general)
"Ruin repairer"

seriously though:

prince on ruined village = village
prince on ruined market = market square
prince on ruined library = laboratory which is sort of like library?
prince on abandoned mine = peddler, which is sort of what mine does - give you a peddler in addition to a coin.
prince on survivors = uhh.... well there isn't any unruined survivors in the first place.
Logged

brokoli

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1119
  • Respect: +787
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #158 on: June 13, 2014, 03:01:38 pm »
0

I like Prince of Jesters.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #159 on: June 13, 2014, 03:06:45 pm »
0

The card does seem kind of swingy (is that the right word?), given that even if both players go for it, it will be much much better for anyone who activates it even just a few turns ahead. No more so than some other cards, I suppose though.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #160 on: June 13, 2014, 03:12:49 pm »
0

The card does seem kind of swingy (is that the right word?), given that even if both players go for it, it will be much much better for anyone who activates it even just a few turns ahead. No more so than some other cards, I suppose though.
The comparison to Tournament is pretty good.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #161 on: June 13, 2014, 03:16:07 pm »
0

The card does seem kind of swingy (is that the right word?), given that even if both players go for it, it will be much much better for anyone who activates it even just a few turns ahead. No more so than some other cards, I suppose though.
The comparison to Tournament is pretty good.

Quite similar, given that both hinge upon getting an 8$ card and then linking it with a 4$ card. But I anticipate that with Prince, the effect will be far, far more exaggerated.
Logged

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #162 on: June 13, 2014, 03:18:10 pm »
0

When Donald was first emailing me about it, he mentioned "Prince of Pearl Divers". I immediately realized it was the best phrasing ever. I'm glad it's caught on here! :D

I'm trying to decide what the funniest "Prince of X" is. Too bad you can't have a Prince of Harems...

The Shanty Town Prince?

or maybe Prince of Misfits (which would be spectacular, actually.)
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #163 on: June 13, 2014, 03:22:12 pm »
0

The card does seem kind of swingy (is that the right word?), given that even if both players go for it, it will be much much better for anyone who activates it even just a few turns ahead. No more so than some other cards, I suppose though.
The comparison to Tournament is pretty good.

Quite similar, given that both hinge upon getting an 8$ card and then linking it with a 4$ card. But I anticipate that with Prince, the effect will be far, far more exaggerated.
Depends on the kingdom, probably. Sometimes, being the only player to get the Princess or the Followers can be extremely good.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #164 on: June 13, 2014, 03:22:39 pm »
0

The card does seem kind of swingy (is that the right word?), given that even if both players go for it, it will be much much better for anyone who activates it even just a few turns ahead. No more so than some other cards, I suppose though.
The comparison to Tournament is pretty good.

Quite similar, given that both hinge upon getting an 8$ card and then linking it with a 4$ card. But I anticipate that with Prince, the effect will be far, far more exaggerated.
the thing is, with tournament, the 8 cost gives you 6 points too. Prince is easier to connect with another action though.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #165 on: June 13, 2014, 03:24:24 pm »
0

Prince is easier to connect with another action though.
At least if any Action is fine. If you need a Prince of a specific card, then isn't it equally easy, am I missing something here or was that just not the point?
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #166 on: June 13, 2014, 03:34:32 pm »
+1

If you have a Prince of Band of Misfits, do you get to keep changing the card or does it lock in like for Throne Room?
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #167 on: June 13, 2014, 03:35:00 pm »
+3

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #168 on: June 13, 2014, 03:50:39 pm »
0

Maybe this has already been asked, but if you have Durations and this, do you get to choose the order of resolving them?
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #169 on: June 13, 2014, 03:51:27 pm »
0

Maybe this has already been asked, but if you have Durations and this, do you get to choose the order of resolving them?
Yes and yes.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #170 on: June 13, 2014, 03:53:15 pm »
0

Maybe this has already been asked, but if you have Durations and this, do you get to choose the order of resolving them?
Yes and yes.
Well, 4 pages is obviously way too much for me to keep track of.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #171 on: June 13, 2014, 04:21:08 pm »
0

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn

That doesn't help for Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast).
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #172 on: June 13, 2014, 04:25:50 pm »
0

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn

That doesn't help for Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast).

i dont think throned cards enter play several times

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #173 on: June 13, 2014, 04:46:59 pm »
0

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn

That doesn't help for Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast).

i dont think throned cards enter play several times

They don't; but with Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast), the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, but you don't get to redesignate it as something else the second time you play it. So with Prince–Band of Misfits, the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, and I don't know whether you can redesignate it as something else the second time you play it.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #174 on: June 13, 2014, 05:20:33 pm »
0

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn

That doesn't help for Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast).

i dont think throned cards enter play several times

They don't; but with Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast), the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, but you don't get to redesignate it as something else the second time you play it. So with Prince–Band of Misfits, the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, and I don't know whether you can redesignate it as something else the second time you play it.

but BoM doesn't enter play a second time even if it imitates feast, it's in the trash after the first time, and only a phantom copy gets played the second time

azadin

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 31
  • Respect: +28
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #175 on: June 13, 2014, 05:20:50 pm »
0

If you have a Prince of Band of Misfits, do you get to keep changing the card or does it lock in like for Throne Room?

Doesn't Band of Misfits say it becomes the other card until it leaves play? And playing the card is when it becomes another card? I think setting it aside qualifies as leaving play, and playing it the next turn as a Band of Misfits lets you choose a card again.
Logged

Schneau

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1174
  • Shuffle iT Username: Schneau
  • Respect: +1461
    • View Profile
    • Rainwave
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #176 on: June 13, 2014, 05:23:16 pm »
+4

I was curious how many Kingdom cards Prince does work with, considering there are quite a few it either flat out doesn't really help (Durations), can't work on (Potion-cost), or require cost reducers (cards costing more than $4). Here are my numbers, which might be slightly off:

Durations (8 cards)
Potion-cost cards (10 cards)
One-Shots (Embargo, Island, Feast, Treasure Map, Pillage, Prince)
Non-Actions (23 cards)
Cards costing greater than $4 - requires cost reducer (83 cards, including 19 from above categories)

Total Kingdom Cards you can Prince: 206 - 111 = 95 cards you can normally Prince (46% of Kingdom cards)

There are also some non-Kingdom cards you can Prince:
Necropolis
Ruins (5 cards)
Mercenary (Madman doesn't work)
Prizes (4 cards)

Total: 10 cards

Even though I'm excited to try out Prince, I am slightly disappointed how many cards it just doesn't work with. And this doesn't even include some cards that would almost always be bad cards to Prince (many forced trashers and Ambassador).
« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 06:05:16 pm by Schneau »
Logged

theory

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3603
  • Respect: +6125
    • View Profile
    • Dominion Strategy
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #177 on: June 13, 2014, 05:26:29 pm »
+2

omg ... Possess someone and then appoint a Prince of Ambassadors or a Prince of Lookouts ...

Also this might be the only way to Band of Misfits a $4 card, right?
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #178 on: June 13, 2014, 05:32:00 pm »
0

omg ... Possess someone and then appoint a Prince of Ambassadors or a Prince of Lookouts ...

Also this might be the only way to Band of Misfits a $4 card, right?
remake is the best one - TWO cards...

you can always BoM a $4 card...
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #179 on: June 13, 2014, 05:36:54 pm »
0

remake is the best one - TWO cards...
Plus you gain something cool whenever you Possess him.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #180 on: June 13, 2014, 05:55:29 pm »
0

Shelters (5 cards)

You mean Ruins.
Logged

Schneau

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1174
  • Shuffle iT Username: Schneau
  • Respect: +1461
    • View Profile
    • Rainwave
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #181 on: June 13, 2014, 06:05:26 pm »
0

Logged

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8172
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9631
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #182 on: June 13, 2014, 06:15:30 pm »
0

So what happens to an abandoned Prince?  Like, say, you Prince a Feast - does he stay set aside for the rest of the game?
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #183 on: June 13, 2014, 06:17:50 pm »
0

In addition to the $8 price point, NOT getting to play your action on the turn you set it aside is a small penalty as well.

Not a huge thing, but something to consider, especially if it is a vital attack, etc.

And a penalty of the possibility of drawing it without any $4 or less actions.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #184 on: June 13, 2014, 06:44:57 pm »
+2

You can use Prince on a duration card and there are edge-cases where it could be the play. It's not very effective though, you will play the duration card on your next turn and then Prince will lose it forever. But I mean, maybe you really wanted to save that duration card for next turn.

When you say "Prince will lose it forever", do you mean it'll be cleaned up and go back into your discard pile like normal (and thus stop being played by Prince that way), or do you mean it'll end up set aside and out of your deck forever (but still not being played by Prince)? The wording of Prince seems to suggest the latter—it tells you to set aside the Princed card when you discard it from play. So your Princed Caravan gets set aside when discarded from play, but since it wasn't discarded on the same turn you played it, it doesn't get played again and remains in set-aside-land forever.

It goes to the discard. What happens if you prince a Caravan is this:

Turn N: Prince-Caravan, both the Caravan and Prince are set aside.

Turn N+1: The set aside Caravan is played at the beginning of your turn. Because it's a duration, it won't be discarded from play at the end of this turn, hence Prince can't set it aside and by the parenthetical clause on the card will stop playing it, thus "losing it forever".

Turn N+2: You draw a card from the Caravan that's now totally disconnected from Prince, at the end of your turn it goes to the discard as usual.

Actually, the parenthesis says to stop playing it, not to stop setting it aside, and the setting aside (when played by Prince) is not conditional on being played, so I think Caravan should be set aside and lost forever too after being discarded at the end of turn N+2.
SCSN has it right. If Prince fails to set the card aside that turn, Prince is done doing things to the card. I see that this is not clear on the card - it could say "when you discard it from play that turn." The parenthetical is trying to get that in.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #185 on: June 13, 2014, 06:45:46 pm »
+4

If you have a Prince of Band of Misfits, do you get to keep changing the card or does it lock in like for Throne Room?

Doesn't Band of Misfits say it becomes the other card until it leaves play? And playing the card is when it becomes another card? I think setting it aside qualifies as leaving play, and playing it the next turn as a Band of Misfits lets you choose a card again.
Correct, you can pick a new card for Band of Misfits each time.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #186 on: June 13, 2014, 06:47:00 pm »
+2

omg ... Possess someone and then appoint a Prince of Ambassadors or a Prince of Lookouts ...
I have seen an intentional Prince of Ambassadors; I think he won, too. Things were that bad.
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #187 on: June 13, 2014, 06:48:30 pm »
+17

So what happens to an abandoned Prince?  Like, say, you Prince a Feast - does he stay set aside for the rest of the game?

Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #188 on: June 13, 2014, 06:58:50 pm »
0

it leaves play each turn, so you can change it each turn

That doesn't help for Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast).

i dont think throned cards enter play several times

They don't; but with Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast), the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, but you don't get to redesignate it as something else the second time you play it. So with Prince–Band of Misfits, the Band of Misfits leaves play and gets played again, and I don't know whether you can redesignate it as something else the second time you play it.

but BoM doesn't enter play a second time even if it imitates feast, it's in the trash after the first time, and only a phantom copy gets played the second time

So? I don't see why it matters whether or not something gets moved to the play area for resolving the instructions on these cards.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #189 on: June 13, 2014, 07:03:24 pm »
0

(Anyhow, I see Donald X has answered the question at the root of this. Though I still don't really understand why Throne Room and Prince work differently in this respect.)
Logged

amalloy

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 453
  • Respect: +620
    • View Profile
    • Twitch stream
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #190 on: June 13, 2014, 07:15:40 pm »
+2

(Anyhow, I see Donald X has answered the question at the root of this. Though I still don't really understand why Throne Room and Prince work differently in this respect.)

With Prince, the BoM is entering play, leaving play, and entering play again, as part of resolving Prince multiple times. When BoM enters play the second time, its text instructs you to pick a card for it to imitate.

With Throne Room, the BoM enters play, leaves play, and then is played again, but does not enter play again; this happens as part of resolving the Throne Room exactly once, and the card that it throned was Feast; whether that card is still Feast now that it's in the trash does not impact what happens when you play Feast a second time.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #191 on: June 13, 2014, 07:20:13 pm »
+2

(Anyhow, I see Donald X has answered the question at the root of this. Though I still don't really understand why Throne Room and Prince work differently in this respect.)

With Prince, the BoM is entering play, leaving play, and entering play again, as part of resolving Prince multiple times. When BoM enters play the second time, its text instructs you to pick a card for it to imitate.

With Throne Room, the BoM enters play, leaves play, and then is played again, but does not enter play again;

But, as I say above, Band of Misfits tells you what happens when you "play this", not when it "enters play".
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #192 on: June 13, 2014, 09:00:45 pm »
0

(Anyhow, I see Donald X has answered the question at the root of this. Though I still don't really understand why Throne Room and Prince work differently in this respect.)

With Prince, the BoM is entering play, leaving play, and entering play again, as part of resolving Prince multiple times. When BoM enters play the second time, its text instructs you to pick a card for it to imitate.

With Throne Room, the BoM enters play, leaves play, and then is played again, but does not enter play again;

But, as I say above, Band of Misfits tells you what happens when you "play this", not when it "enters play".
Band of Misfits reverts to being a Band of Misfits when it leaves play, which happens when you set it aside (the set aside area is not "in play").
Logged

dominator 123

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 164
  • Shuffle iT Username: dominator 123
  • Notice the space
  • Respect: +369
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #193 on: June 13, 2014, 09:20:17 pm »
0

What happens if you have 3 Princed Conspirators? Is any of them activated?
Logged
"Strictly Better" compares only effects and not cost, change my mind

amalloy

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 453
  • Respect: +620
    • View Profile
    • Twitch stream
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #194 on: June 13, 2014, 09:47:28 pm »
0

What happens if you have 3 Princed Conspirators? Is any of them activated?

The last one is. The Princes are not themselves played this turn, but the cards they play for you are.
Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #195 on: June 13, 2014, 09:54:29 pm »
0

SCSN has it right. If Prince fails to set the card aside that turn, Prince is done doing things to the card. I see that this is not clear on the card - it could say "when you discard it from play that turn." The parenthetical is trying to get that in.

Sorry for nitpicking, but is this a ruling or you are claiming the actual text on the card implies this? If its the latter, I still don't see it. And Ironworks/Trader has made a nitpicker out of me.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #196 on: June 13, 2014, 09:56:39 pm »
0

SCSN has it right. If Prince fails to set the card aside that turn, Prince is done doing things to the card. I see that this is not clear on the card - it could say "when you discard it from play that turn." The parenthetical is trying to get that in.

Sorry for nitpicking, but is this a ruling or you are claiming the actual text on the card implies this? If its the latter, I still don't see it. And Ironworks/Trader has made a nitpicker out of me.
I see that this is not clear on the card.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #197 on: June 13, 2014, 10:02:35 pm »
0


This is actually pretty good, given that it would be set out with the other ruins/a looter.
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #198 on: June 13, 2014, 10:19:22 pm »
0


This is actually pretty good, given that it would be set out with the other ruins/a looter.

True, this would actually be way overpowered in a Looters game.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

c4master

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 167
  • Respect: +56
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #199 on: June 14, 2014, 07:27:47 am »
+9

Has anyone ever met "Prince Hamlet"? ;)

Yeah, and I wondered why it took so long to point out "Prince of Monuments". And noone even mentioned the "Prince of Cellars". :(

Did you ever know about Harald, the "Herald prince"?

The "Prince of Bridges" seems to be really cool, too, since you can then gain 5-costs.
Logged

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8172
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9631
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #200 on: June 14, 2014, 09:27:55 am »
+1

If I have a Princed Bridge and a Princed Band of Misfits, and I play the Bridge first, is the Band of Misfits also reduced in cost, or can he now emulate "$5" cards?
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #201 on: June 14, 2014, 09:30:45 am »
0

Presumably it is also reduced in cost--Bridge makes it clear that it affects "all cards", which I assume includes set aside ones too.
Logged

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3846
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2437
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #202 on: June 14, 2014, 09:32:24 am »
+3

Yeah, and I wondered why it took so long to point out "Prince of Monuments". And noone even mentioned the "Prince of Cellars". :(
Because Prince of Warehouses is better.
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #203 on: June 14, 2014, 09:52:34 am »
0

Yeah, and I wondered why it took so long to point out "Prince of Monuments". And noone even mentioned the "Prince of Cellars". :(
Because Prince of Warehouses is better.
yes, it's unlikely that you want to sift more than 3 cards from a 5card hand

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #204 on: June 14, 2014, 10:39:21 am »
0

(Anyhow, I see Donald X has answered the question at the root of this. Though I still don't really understand why Throne Room and Prince work differently in this respect.)

With Prince, the BoM is entering play, leaving play, and entering play again, as part of resolving Prince multiple times. When BoM enters play the second time, its text instructs you to pick a card for it to imitate.

With Throne Room, the BoM enters play, leaves play, and then is played again, but does not enter play again;

But, as I say above, Band of Misfits tells you what happens when you "play this", not when it "enters play".
Band of Misfits reverts to being a Band of Misfits when it leaves play, which happens when you set it aside (the set aside area is not "in play").

The same thing happens when Band of Misfits is trashed (as a Death Cart or Feast, e.g.), but that doesn't allow Throne Room to play Band of Misfits as Feast once and as something else the second time.

So when Card X plays Band of Misfits twice, and Band of Misfits leaves play between the two occasions, then Band of Misfits can be two different things if X is Prince but it has to be the same thing twice if X is Throne Room. Right?
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #205 on: June 14, 2014, 10:45:06 am »
+3

Did you ever know about Harald, the "Herald prince"?

Harold Prince



Reveal the top card of your deck. If it is an Action card costing up to $4, set aside this and the revealed card. Play the revealed card at the beginning of each of your turns, setting it aside when it is discarded from play.


…See, he produces a play.
Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #206 on: June 14, 2014, 10:51:29 am »
0

So when Card X plays Band of Misfits twice, and Band of Misfits leaves play between the two occasions, then Band of Misfits can be two different things if X is Prince but it has to be the same thing twice if X is Throne Room. Right?

TR does not put a card into play twice. It plays it twice, but puts it into play once (the first time). Prince puts the card into play several times, because it explicitly makes the card leave and enter play each time. I guess TR cannot put the card into play again because 1. it would not make sense if the card is in play, where TR left it. 2. it could not put it into play from anywhere else, because TR would have lost track of it.

Thus, what makes Prince able to change BoM is the fact that the card is put into play several times, not the fact that it leaves play in between. I guess while you are playing BoM the second time as Feast, the BoM in the trash is actually a BoM and costs $5.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #207 on: June 14, 2014, 10:58:47 am »
+1

So when Card X plays Band of Misfits twice, and Band of Misfits leaves play between the two occasions, then Band of Misfits can be two different things if X is Prince but it has to be the same thing twice if X is Throne Room. Right?

TR does not put a card into play twice. It plays it twice, but puts it into play once (the first time).

I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #208 on: June 14, 2014, 11:00:25 am »
0


I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.
"This is that card until it leaves play"
« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 11:02:16 am by silvern »
Logged

azadin

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 31
  • Respect: +28
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #209 on: June 14, 2014, 11:02:43 am »
0

So when Card X plays Band of Misfits twice, and Band of Misfits leaves play between the two occasions, then Band of Misfits can be two different things if X is Prince but it has to be the same thing twice if X is Throne Room. Right?

TR does not put a card into play twice. It plays it twice, but puts it into play once (the first time).

I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.

When it's played, it becomes the card you choose until it leaves play. If you throne room it, you play the BoM, choose a card, and now the BoM is that card. Throne Room says you play an action twice, so you play the card BoM has become, twice. It doesn't matter if the Throne Room has lost track of the card, the Throne Room doesn't care. It plays the action of the card (which BoM became) twice.

With Prince, it leaves play when it is set aside and is played again on the next turn.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #210 on: June 14, 2014, 11:03:36 am »
0


I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.
"This is that card until it leaves play"

It leaves play under Prince and under Throne Room as Feast.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #211 on: June 14, 2014, 11:06:12 am »
0

True enough. I guess it boils down to the whole Procession vs Throne Room thing again, i.e. with Procession, you gain a Six coin action according to the rule book, even though it should have "locked in" to what the card was just like throne room.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #212 on: June 14, 2014, 11:12:53 am »
0

So when Card X plays Band of Misfits twice, and Band of Misfits leaves play between the two occasions, then Band of Misfits can be two different things if X is Prince but it has to be the same thing twice if X is Throne Room. Right?

TR does not put a card into play twice. It plays it twice, but puts it into play once (the first time).

I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.

When it's played, it becomes the card you choose until it leaves play. If you throne room it, you play the BoM, choose a card, and now the BoM is that card. Throne Room says you play an action twice, so you play the card BoM has become, twice. It doesn't matter if the Throne Room has lost track of the card, the Throne Room doesn't care. It plays the action of the card (which BoM became) twice.

Throne Room doesn't say to play "the action of that card". It says "play it"—i.e., the card. Prince likewise says "play that Action". I don't understand why when Throne Room plays a Band of Misfits that it has played before but that is not in play now one thing happens, while when Prince plays a Band of Misfits that it has played before but that is not in play now a different thing happens.

Quote
With Prince, it leaves play when it is set aside and is played again on the next turn.

With Throne Room–Band of Misfits (Feast), it leaves play when it is trashed and is played again on the same turn.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #213 on: June 14, 2014, 11:15:38 am »
+1

From the "BoM as Feast?" thread:


Throne on a Band as a one-shot has a special ruling, unique to that situation, and that special ruling is why it works that way, in the technical sense. And the reason for that ruling was that the rulebook didn't address it, and I wanted it to work like people would think it would, and the other option (not doing anything the second time) was crazy counterintuitive.

« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 11:19:59 am by silvern »
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #214 on: June 14, 2014, 11:20:20 am »
0

I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.

No, it doesn't. It says, "Play this as if it were an Action card in the Supply…"
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #215 on: June 14, 2014, 11:40:08 am »
+1

From the "BoM as Feast?" thread:


Throne on a Band as a one-shot has a special ruling, unique to that situation, and that special ruling is why it works that way, in the technical sense. And the reason for that ruling was that the rulebook didn't address it, and I wanted it to work like people would think it would, and the other option (not doing anything the second time) was crazy counterintuitive.

Yep. So the situation is really, Prince on Band works one way because it does what the cards say, and Throne on Band as Feast works a different way because it does something different than what the cards say, because of this special-case ruling.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 01:09:16 pm by AJD »
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #216 on: June 14, 2014, 11:40:28 am »
0

I know that, but why does it matter? Band of Misfits tells you that you choose a card for it to impersonate when you "Play this", not when you put it into play.

No, it doesn't. It says, "Play this as if it were an Action card in the Supply…"

Right, not "Put this into play as if it were an Action card in the Supply".
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #217 on: June 14, 2014, 12:18:55 pm »
+1

Prince of Rats!   ;D
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #218 on: June 14, 2014, 12:22:18 pm »
0

It's funny, having read the whole thread, seeing people who post the same thing twice.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #219 on: June 14, 2014, 12:26:41 pm »
+16

It's funny, having read the whole thread, seeing people who post the same thing twice.

But the second time the post is not put into play again.
Logged

Beyond Awesome

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2941
  • Shuffle iT Username: Beyond Awesome
  • Respect: +2467
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #220 on: June 14, 2014, 01:00:47 pm »
0

Prince of Rebuild

Honestly, that would actually probably suck because you are missing a rebuild turn plus you paid $8 to buy a Prince, and how did you get $8 anyway if you're playing Rebuild.
Logged

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #221 on: June 14, 2014, 01:02:29 pm »
+4

I anticipate that prince will be much MUCH stronger in Colony games.
Also, is it just me, or does the guy in the picture look scarily close to baron?
« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 01:13:37 pm by silvern »
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #222 on: June 14, 2014, 01:25:32 pm »
0

The original post now quotes a response to the post itself?  theory, you need to do something before the spacetime continuum collapses!
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #223 on: June 14, 2014, 01:52:22 pm »
0

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Beyond Awesome

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2941
  • Shuffle iT Username: Beyond Awesome
  • Respect: +2467
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #224 on: June 14, 2014, 01:52:51 pm »
0

We can also have a Prince of Thieves!
Logged

enfynet

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1692
  • Respect: +1162
    • View Profile
    • JD's Custom Clubs
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #225 on: June 14, 2014, 02:12:57 pm »
0

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
I agree. It probably give you the chance to set up another Prince on a +Buy card.
Logged
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious."

silvern

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 126
  • Respect: +170
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #226 on: June 14, 2014, 02:14:53 pm »
0

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
I agree. It probably give you the chance to set up another Prince on a +Buy card.
+Buy certainly seems like it would be pretty important in some capacity in any Prince game--you have to make up the lost turns buying and connecting prince. Also why Colony games are better for Prince--you have more opportunities and more turns to make up the points.
Logged

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5477
  • Respect: +2860
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #227 on: June 14, 2014, 02:20:06 pm »
0

Why does the card have 'you may' at the beginning? I can't see why.  Because Golem needs the help?
Logged

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #228 on: June 14, 2014, 02:26:04 pm »
0

Why does the card have 'you may' at the beginning? I can't see why.  Because Golem needs the help?

Also Herald, HoP, Peddler, various fixed draw cards... But yeah, it probably would have been fine without the option.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #229 on: June 14, 2014, 03:25:19 pm »
0

It also helps with the accountability problem: now there are very few situations where someone would want to set it aside when they don't have an Action in their hand that they want to set aside.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #230 on: June 14, 2014, 03:29:02 pm »
0

Well, if it doesn't have "you may", you could be forced to set it aside with nothing!

I thought it was just a one-shot, that you had to keep both the Prince and the set-aside card set aside every turn.
But now I realize the Prince just gets cleaned up and you can set more cards aside with it, making it even more powerful.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #231 on: June 14, 2014, 03:30:39 pm »
0

Well, if it doesn't have "you may", you could be forced to set it aside with nothing!

I thought it was just a one-shot, that you had to keep both the Prince and the set-aside card set aside every turn.
But now I realize the Prince just gets cleaned up and you can set more cards aside with it, making it even more powerful.
???

I'm still thinking it is just a one-shot.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

scott_pilgrim

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1102
  • Respect: +2146
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #232 on: June 14, 2014, 03:39:00 pm »
+7

It's funny, having read the whole thread, seeing people who post the same thing twice.

I've been reading through the whole thread...it's funny to see people post the same thing twice.
Logged

brokoli

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1119
  • Respect: +787
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #233 on: June 14, 2014, 03:41:15 pm »
0

Well, if it doesn't have "you may", you could be forced to set it aside with nothing!

I thought it was just a one-shot, that you had to keep both the Prince and the set-aside card set aside every turn.
But now I realize the Prince just gets cleaned up and you can set more cards aside with it, making it even more powerful.
How ? I read nowhere that set aside cards get cleaned up.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #234 on: June 14, 2014, 03:41:43 pm »
0

Well, if it doesn't have "you may", you could be forced to set it aside with nothing!

I thought it was just a one-shot, that you had to keep both the Prince and the set-aside card set aside every turn.
But now I realize the Prince just gets cleaned up and you can set more cards aside with it, making it even more powerful.
???

I'm still thinking it is just a one-shot.
Oh yeah, it is, it doesn't mention cleaning up though.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

enfynet

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1692
  • Respect: +1162
    • View Profile
    • JD's Custom Clubs
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #235 on: June 14, 2014, 03:41:50 pm »
0

If I remember right, the FAQ says it stays set aside.
Logged
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious."

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6396
  • Respect: +25805
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #236 on: June 14, 2014, 04:13:13 pm »
0

Yep. So the situation is really, Prince on Band works one way because it does what the cards say, and Throne on Band as Feast works a different way because it does something different than what the cards say, because of this special-case ruling.
Throne/Band/Feast works the way it does because no-one having that experience was ever going to figure out that Band did nothing the second time. It was counterintuitive minus zero / no limit, and did not come up in time to put an answer in the FAQ. Prince does not have the same issue, it never tries to play Band from the trash.
Logged

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5477
  • Respect: +2860
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #237 on: June 14, 2014, 04:21:37 pm »
0

Why does the card have 'you may' at the beginning? I can't see why.  Because Golem needs the help?

Also Herald, HoP, Peddler, various fixed draw cards... But yeah, it probably would have been fine without the option.
I missed the Peddler and HoP interactions, thanks.
Logged

blaisepascal

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 30
  • Respect: +17
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #238 on: June 14, 2014, 04:43:44 pm »
+1

This is probably a stupid question: What happens to the Prince at the end of the game?

Island explicitly says (of the cards set aside) "Return them to your deck at the end of the game".

Native Village has a similar explicit statements, about cards on the Native Village mat returning to the deck.

Prince does not. Does that mean it and it's action card stays set aside at game end, and so you don't benefit from them for scoring?
If you Prince a Great Hall, do you get the Great Hall's victory point?
If you are playing Gardens, do you count the Prince and it's target as cards in your deck to score?
If you are playing Vineyards, do you count the Prince and it's target as actions in your deck to score?

Logged

soulnet

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2142
  • Respect: +1751
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #239 on: June 14, 2014, 04:45:41 pm »
0

You return Princes and whatever Princed cards to your deck before scoring, so yes, your Princed Great Hall would still give you 1 VP at the end, and both would count for Gardens and Vineyards. Same happens to Durations, cards set aside by Haven and Horse Traders, for instance, if they are still not in your deck at the end of the game.
Logged

RD

  • Thief
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 93
  • Respect: +70
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #240 on: June 14, 2014, 05:56:36 pm »
+1

I was really trying to make "King of X" work for King's Court but somehow it just isn't the same. Funny, that. All I managed to do was get "King of Wishful Thinking" stuck in my head.

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
This has been my thinking too. If you can get big draw reliably and draw up your other Actions, it's as good as Princing all of them. That's got to be your plan A, right? If it isn't available, then something else.

Of course the cool thing about Prince (and maybe the time it has the biggest impact?) is the ability to play cards when you don't have an engine, but you work with what's there.
Logged

pst

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 584
  • Respect: +907
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #241 on: June 14, 2014, 06:08:05 pm »
+1

This is probably a stupid question: What happens to the Prince at the end of the game?

Island explicitly says (of the cards set aside) "Return them to your deck at the end of the game".

Native Village has a similar explicit statements, about cards on the Native Village mat returning to the deck.

As I wrote in the rule thread it's in the basic rules of the game:

Quote
("Each player puts all his cards into his Deck ...".)
(I think the reason this basic rule sometimes is forgotten is that Island and Native Village say this explicitly as well.)
Logged

A Drowned Kernel

  • 2015 World Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1067
  • They/Them
  • Respect: +1980
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #242 on: June 14, 2014, 06:38:05 pm »
0

Totally different topic: this might be one of my favorite card arts.
Logged
The perfect engine
But it will never go off
Three piles are empty

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #243 on: June 14, 2014, 06:43:27 pm »
+4

Totally different topic: this might be one of my favorite card arts.
It's the same topic though. This is a totally different topic.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #244 on: June 15, 2014, 03:28:48 am »
+8

It's funny, having read the whole thread, seeing people who post the same thing twice.

I set my post aside, and then post it again at the start of every turn.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

ConMan

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1400
  • Respect: +1706
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #245 on: June 15, 2014, 04:47:38 am »
0

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
This has been my thinking too. If you can get big draw reliably and draw up your other Actions, it's as good as Princing all of them. That's got to be your plan A, right? If it isn't available, then something else.

Of course the cool thing about Prince (and maybe the time it has the biggest impact?) is the ability to play cards when you don't have an engine, but you work with what's there.
I think the other major case is where you Prince a +1 Action card to act as a guaranteed Village (or Prince a Village as a guaranteed Crossroads) to get an engine going.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #246 on: June 15, 2014, 06:18:36 am »
0

I think the other major case is where you Prince a +1 Action card to act as a guaranteed Village (or Prince a Village as a guaranteed Crossroads) to get an engine going.
Or Prince a Crossroads. Which probably is a pretty good idea for other reasons too, now that I think of it.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #247 on: June 15, 2014, 08:36:27 am »
+8

What you Prince often comes down to what it collides with. You really don't want to wait another shuffle to use it.
Logged

dan11295

  • Navigator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 75
  • Respect: +5
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #248 on: June 15, 2014, 09:01:50 am »
0

Given the opportunity cost (has to be better to get this than Province) it is certainly better in a Colony Game. Question is what cards work best with it. Ignoring cards it doesn't work on, and cursers (harder to get to 8 in cursing games and they will likely be almost empty before you could Prince one anyways). my thoughts are:

Militia - Leave your opponent with a 3 card hand for the rest of the game if no defense is available
Monument - +2 coin +1 vp every turn.
Smithy - 8 Card hand every turn.

These are cards you often want anyways so you are likely to collide them with Prince, as opposed to buying a card just to Prince it. Although Prince of Thieves and Pirate Ship would be nasty in games with limited sources of virtual money.

Prince of Throne Room could actually be dangerous with trashers on the board. Any hand with Remake and a Province = bad if you don't have another action to Throne.


Logged

brokoli

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1119
  • Respect: +787
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #249 on: June 15, 2014, 09:20:16 am »
0

Yeah, Prince of militia seems very painful.
Among the best prince-able cards, I like Oracle too. Spy effect + Draw every turn seems not bad at all. Or Prince of Courtyard. Interesting to note that Prince of menagerie is not that good, given that there are less chances to have only unique cards. But the most surprisingly powerful, beside Scheme, is probably Prince of herbalists.
Logged

RD

  • Thief
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 93
  • Respect: +70
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #250 on: June 15, 2014, 11:35:16 am »
0

I think my favorite 4 cost would in fact be something like a simple Smithy or Envoy.
Starting every turn with so many cards makes everything much easier.
This has been my thinking too. If you can get big draw reliably and draw up your other Actions, it's as good as Princing all of them. That's got to be your plan A, right? If it isn't available, then something else.

Of course the cool thing about Prince (and maybe the time it has the biggest impact?) is the ability to play cards when you don't have an engine, but you work with what's there.
I think the other major case is where you Prince a +1 Action card to act as a guaranteed Village (or Prince a Village as a guaranteed Crossroads) to get an engine going.
Well, Princing an ineffectual +1 Action card like say a Great Hall is almost strictly inferior to the next alternative. I mean if you have Prince of Great Hall in a Smithy engine, your hope is to draw a Smithy and play it with your first Action, thus winding up in the same position as if you had Prince of Smithy. Same if you replace Smithy with a non-drawing terminal. Whichever card you'd want to spend your first real Action on, you might as well Prince that one, at least if you get the chance to (and are willing to go one turn without playing it).

I'm inclined to think the same goes for Prince of Village. If it's a full-fledged engine you prefer to Prince the Smithy and hope to draw the Village, rather than vice versa. Big hands raise the chance things will go according to plan, I think it's as simple as that. If it's a non-engine scenario where Prince of Village would play like a Walled Village, well 3 actions is probably overkill anyhow.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2014, 11:38:12 am by RD »
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #251 on: June 15, 2014, 12:54:49 pm »
0

I'd rather start my turn with 8 cards and 1 Action than 6 cards and 2 actions in general. Most engines revolve about some kind of payload and seeing more cards helps to keep finding that payload.

Smithy and Village themselves do nothing, they enable other stuff and with 8 cards each turn it's easier to start your chain, finding more Villages and Smithies.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2014, 12:57:32 pm by Davio »
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

theblankman

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
  • Respect: +383
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #252 on: June 15, 2014, 01:38:34 pm »
0

Prince of Rebuild

Honestly, that would actually probably suck because you are missing a rebuild turn plus you paid $8 to buy a Prince, and how did you get $8 anyway if you're playing Rebuild.
Not to mention you need a cost-reducer to put Rebuild on Prince, so it's a three-card connection plus a delay, and the alternative (plain Rebuild + whatever) is very fast.  As much as we love edge cases around here, I dare say Prince of Rebuild might be too edgy even for us. 
Logged
it's a shame that full-random is the de facto standard

dondon151

  • 2012 US Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2522
  • Respect: +1856
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #253 on: June 15, 2014, 01:47:33 pm »
+2

You would want to Prince a cantrip if your terminal draw costs more than $4. And most terminal draw cost more than $4.
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #254 on: June 15, 2014, 02:08:06 pm »
+3

I sort of mentioned this previously -- and LastFootnote seems to have partially confirmed it -- but it seems that is will be difficult to really plan a deck around a specific Prince strategy, in the following sense.  If you want to King's Court a Mountebank, you get one of each and do what you can until they collide.  In the meantime though, you'll play the King's Court with Villages, Smithies, or whatever other card you happen to draw it with.  But with Prince you'd probably just play it immediately with whatever you can as soon as possible.  This seems to make the card extraordinarily swingy.  In fact, it may demand more flexibility from the players, since even mirror matches may suddenly diverge quickly when I Prince a Militia and you Prince a Smithy.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8172
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9631
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #255 on: June 15, 2014, 02:20:39 pm »
0

I think Prince will be good in engines where you want to draw your whole deck, but there's a lack of +Action - Prince can take care of certain terminals that you don't have any spare +Action to play every turn - like Merchant Guild or Goons or your terminal draw, if you so desire.
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #256 on: June 15, 2014, 02:29:59 pm »
0

Prince of Libraries is a wonderful counter to handsize attacks or in conjunction with Outpost.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #257 on: June 15, 2014, 02:30:52 pm »
+1

Prince of Libraries is a wonderful counter to handsize attacks or in conjunction with Outpost.
or watchtower or even JOAT if you don't have a cost reducer
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #258 on: June 15, 2014, 02:32:07 pm »
0

Prince of Libraries is a wonderful counter to handsize attacks or in conjunction with Outpost.
or watchtower or even JOAT if you don't have a cost reducer

Right, was just about to edit that post to Watchtower instead.  Keep forgetting the cost restriction.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Grujah

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2237
  • Respect: +1177
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #259 on: June 15, 2014, 02:32:23 pm »
0

Harem Prince.

A true pimp?


It's not an action :(
Logged

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #260 on: June 15, 2014, 02:46:02 pm »
0

Prince of Libraries is a wonderful counter to handsize attacks or in conjunction with Outpost.
or watchtower or even JOAT if you don't have a cost reducer
that's not very good though, watchtower likes small hands not big hands, that goes against the concept of prince. you will only draw 1 card, and even if you had to discard, you're only going to draw 3, which is just as much as with smithy. also, you can't use the reaction part of watchtower for anything.

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #261 on: June 15, 2014, 03:08:49 pm »
0

Prince of Libraries is a wonderful counter to handsize attacks or in conjunction with Outpost.
or watchtower or even JOAT if you don't have a cost reducer
that's not very good though, watchtower likes small hands not big hands, that goes against the concept of prince. you will only draw 1 card, and even if you had to discard, you're only going to draw 3, which is just as much as with smithy. also, you can't use the reaction part of watchtower for anything.

The concept of Prince is big hands?  I think that's your own mental construct.  Also, most kingdoms don't have Smithy.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #262 on: June 15, 2014, 03:14:46 pm »
+1

The concept of Prince is big hands?  I think that's your own mental construct.  Also, most kingdoms don't have Smithy.
Non-small hands are, though. Unless you're attacked, Princing a Watchtower is as good as Princing a Ruined Library, since the card itself doesn't disappear from your hand.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

blueblimp

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2849
  • Respect: +1560
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #263 on: June 15, 2014, 03:22:18 pm »
+1

The value of Prince is effectively two things:
  • A sort of hybrid City/Alchemist: +2 actions +2 cards that you top-deck after each turn.
  • Guaranteeing you get to play a certain card each turn, effectively top-decking it each turn.
Ignoring the "every turn" aspect, 1 is the effect of a one-empty-pile City, and 2 is the effect of a Scheme. Since effect 1 is strictly better than Laboratory, as a card alone it'd cost more than $5 even without the top-decking. On the other hand, we know that Scheme is strong but okay at $3.

Because of that, I argue that the real value of Prince comes from effect 1, which doesn't depend on which card you set aside with it. So as long as you pick a card to set aside that isn't outright bad to play each turn, it doesn't really matter which one you pick, since you still get effect 1.
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #264 on: June 15, 2014, 03:27:30 pm »
0

The concept of Prince is big hands?  I think that's your own mental construct.  Also, most kingdoms don't have Smithy.
Non-small hands are, though. Unless you're attacked, Princing a Watchtower is as good as Princing a Ruined Library, since the card itself doesn't disappear from your hand.

But the context in which we said it was good was precisely in response to discard attacks or with Outpost.  I've played plenty of games where I was bound to be hit with a Militia by at least one of my opponents every turn.  This is only more likely when they have access to Prince as well.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #265 on: June 15, 2014, 03:31:11 pm »
0

The value of Prince is effectively two things:
  • A sort of hybrid City/Alchemist: +2 actions +2 cards that you top-deck after each turn.
  • Guaranteeing you get to play a certain card each turn, effectively top-decking it each turn.
Ignoring the "every turn" aspect, 1 is the effect of a one-empty-pile City, and 2 is the effect of a Scheme. Since effect 1 is strictly better than Laboratory, as a card alone it'd cost more than $5 even without the top-decking. On the other hand, we know that Scheme is strong but okay at $3.

Because of that, I argue that the real value of Prince comes from effect 1, which doesn't depend on which card you set aside with it. So as long as you pick a card to set aside that isn't outright bad to play each turn, it doesn't really matter which one you pick, since you still get effect 1.

It is so much more than scheme -- not only do you "top deck" the card, but you effectively make it a cantrip as well.  Starting each turn with a cantrip Militia is significantly better than starting each turn with a Militia.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9191
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #266 on: June 15, 2014, 03:32:03 pm »
0

Prince of Watchtowers to counter the Prince of Militias.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3304
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4458
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #267 on: June 15, 2014, 03:32:39 pm »
+2

The value of Prince is effectively two things:
  • A sort of hybrid City/Alchemist: +2 actions +2 cards that you top-deck after each turn.
  • Guaranteeing you get to play a certain card each turn, effectively top-decking it each turn.
Ignoring the "every turn" aspect, 1 is the effect of a one-empty-pile City, and 2 is the effect of a Scheme. Since effect 1 is strictly better than Laboratory, as a card alone it'd cost more than $5 even without the top-decking. On the other hand, we know that Scheme is strong but okay at $3.

Because of that, I argue that the real value of Prince comes from effect 1, which doesn't depend on which card you set aside with it. So as long as you pick a card to set aside that isn't outright bad to play each turn, it doesn't really matter which one you pick, since you still get effect 1.

It is so much more than scheme -- not only do you "top deck" the card, but you effectively make it a cantrip as well.  Starting each turn with a cantrip Militia is significantly better than starting each turn with a Militia.

That's the part (1) of Blueblimp's post.
Logged

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #268 on: June 15, 2014, 03:36:10 pm »
+8

I think Prince and Outpost are going to really get along well. While you won't Prince the Outpost itself, the Outpost lets you squeeze significantly more value out of your Princes, which in turn provide the support Outpost needs to help you catch up after having diverted Province buys to Prince.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2014, 03:49:00 pm by SirPeebles »
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11830
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (´。• ω •。`)
  • Respect: +12910
    • View Profile
    • Birds of Necama
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #269 on: June 15, 2014, 03:36:37 pm »
0

But the context in which we said it was good was precisely in response to discard attacks or with Outpost.  I've played plenty of games where I was bound to be hit with a Militia by at least one of my opponents every turn.  This is only more likely when they have access to Prince as well.
Well, in those cases it's very good, but still only as good as Smithy. It's incredibly good against Torturer, though.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

heron

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1055
  • Shuffle iT Username: heron
  • Respect: +1196
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #270 on: June 15, 2014, 09:21:10 pm »
+2

Prince is sort of like King's Court-Scheme.
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9721
  • Respect: +10792
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #271 on: June 15, 2014, 10:14:57 pm »
+6

There's also a lot of boards that I think will be "too good" for Prince. Things like Scheme, Scrying Pool, or even just Village / Smithy engine with good trashing can build decks capable of reliably drawing itself every turn, and playing every action in the deck every turn. In these decks, Prince doesn't help at all (except increasing reliability; but that should only matter after heavy greening).
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

ehunt

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1528
  • Shuffle iT Username: ehunt
  • Respect: +1858
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #272 on: June 19, 2014, 04:45:31 am »
+12

Drawing another dead hand, desperately trying to line it up with your smithy while your opponent has just bought Province no. 3, sighing wistfully:

Some day my Prince will come.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4787
  • Respect: +3413
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #273 on: June 19, 2014, 06:48:26 am »
0

I wonder if Prince will be good enough to open Death Cart for, or whether you're better off with general building.

I mean, I don't open Death Cart to get King's Court, but $8 is significantly harder than $7 (not linearly harder).
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

DG

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4074
  • Respect: +2624
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #274 on: June 19, 2014, 07:53:30 am »
+1

Prince of coppersmiths could be a thing. The coppersmith gives you 8 coin hands and then the prince of coppersmiths lets you build a drawing deck for the rest of the game.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #275 on: June 19, 2014, 08:30:37 am »
0

Prince of coppersmiths could be a thing. The coppersmith gives you 8 coin hands and then the prince of coppersmiths lets you build a drawing deck for the rest of the game.

That's my favorite Prince so far.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=10337.msg387793#msg387793
Logged

enfynet

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1692
  • Respect: +1162
    • View Profile
    • JD's Custom Clubs
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #276 on: June 19, 2014, 11:12:32 am »
0

I just used Coppersmith IRL to get an early Province for Tournament.
Logged
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious."

silverspawn

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 5362
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +3311
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #277 on: June 19, 2014, 11:47:47 am »
0

Prince of coppersmiths could be a thing. The coppersmith gives you 8 coin hands and then the prince of coppersmiths lets you build a drawing deck for the rest of the game.
orly

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #278 on: June 19, 2014, 11:51:12 am »
0

I can tell that the analysis is maturing when we've moved from "Prince + X would be awesome!"  to "Prince + Y would be good, and Y helps you get Prince / pair them together"
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8172
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9631
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #279 on: June 19, 2014, 03:27:42 pm »
0

So who's going to write the Prince strategy article?
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 03:49:18 pm by werothegreat »
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

SirPeebles

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3249
  • Respect: +5460
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #280 on: June 19, 2014, 03:28:18 pm »
0

So how's going to write the Prince strategy article?

It's way too soon.
Logged
Well you *do* need a signature...

how

  • Pawn
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
  • Respect: +40
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #281 on: June 19, 2014, 03:33:16 pm »
+40

So how's going to write the Prince strategy article?

Yes, I will be writing it.
Logged

GeoLib

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 965
  • Respect: +1265
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #282 on: June 19, 2014, 04:34:34 pm »
+2

So how's going to write the Prince strategy article?

Yes, I will be writing it.

Solid first post for a good respect:post ratio
Logged
"All advice is awful"
 —Count Grishnakh

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #283 on: June 19, 2014, 04:40:27 pm »
0

So how's going to write the Prince strategy article?

Yes, I will be writing it.

Solid first post for a good respect:post ratio

I've seen a lot of first posts get a good respect:post ratio...
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

pacovf

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3501
  • Multiediting poster
  • Respect: +3841
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #284 on: June 19, 2014, 06:57:25 pm »
0

The question is... how is really who?

It could be wero, afterall he was the one that set it up. But my money is on Peebles.
Logged
pacovf has a neopets account.  It has 999 hours logged.  All his neopets are named "Jessica".  I guess that must be his ex.

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7868
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #285 on: June 19, 2014, 07:00:45 pm »
0

/inbefore Who's on First jokes.
Logged

sudgy

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3431
  • Shuffle iT Username: sudgy
  • It's pronounced "SOO-jee"
  • Respect: +2709
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #286 on: June 19, 2014, 07:10:13 pm »
0

The question is... how is really who?

It could be wero, afterall he was the one that set it up. But my money is on Peebles.

Theory can figure out.
Logged
If you're wondering what my avatar is, watch this.

Check out my logic puzzle blog!

   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8172
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9631
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #287 on: June 19, 2014, 07:42:00 pm »
0

The question is... how is really who?

It could be wero, afterall he was the one that set it up. But my money is on Peebles.

'Twasn't me.  If you'll notice, I fixed my typographical error.
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2479
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #288 on: June 19, 2014, 07:46:53 pm »
+5

The question is... how is really who?

It could be wero, afterall he was the one that set it up. But my money is on Peebles.

'Twasn't me.  If you'll notice, I fixed my typographical error.
oh wow, I missed the typo and thought that the "how" username was a play on the Dominion strategy articles written by the website ehow: http://www.ehow.com/how_4671616_use-bureaucrat-dominion.html
Logged

Axxle

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1664
  • Most Valuable Serial Killer
  • Respect: +1966
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #289 on: June 19, 2014, 08:10:51 pm »
+5

was it eHowcylon?
Logged
We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

WalrusMcFishSr

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 642
  • An enormous walrus the size of Antarctica
  • Respect: +1793
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #290 on: June 20, 2014, 11:39:31 pm »
+3

Edge case-y question (apologies if this has already been covered):

Suppose I Prince a Mining Village. Next turn, Prince plays it and I choose to trash it for cash. Then I Rogue it out of the trash, draw it back somehow, and play it again, all on the same turn. Does that mean that it will still be set aside for Prince next turn? If so, suppose I have multiple Mining Villages in my deck--how am I to determine which one was the Princely one, or would any old Mining Village do?
Logged
My Dominion videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/WalrusMcFishSr   <---Bet you can't click on that!

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10729
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #291 on: June 20, 2014, 11:45:19 pm »
+7

Edge case-y question (apologies if this has already been covered):

Suppose I Prince a Mining Village. Next turn, Prince plays it and I choose to trash it for cash. Then I Rogue it out of the trash, draw it back somehow, and play it again, all on the same turn. Does that mean that it will still be set aside for Prince next turn? If so, suppose I have multiple Mining Villages in my deck--how am I to determine which one was the Princely one, or would any old Mining Village do?

Donald actually answered this one for me. When you trash the Mining Village, you lose track. So even if you put it back in play on the same turn, Prince stops setting it aside and playing it.
Logged

Lord Humanton

  • Dominion Online Staff
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 35
  • Respect: +240
    • View Profile
Re: New Promo at Origins...
« Reply #292 on: June 21, 2014, 12:17:54 am »
0

Barring discard attacks and trash for benefit or multi-Prince shenanigans, princing a Scheme is strictly better than princing a Smithy because you can always at least Scheme the Smithy and play it as your first action each turn, which is functionally equivalent to princing a Smithy, but you can also choose to play something else first (say, Fishing Village - Watchtower) or scheme another card this turn. Hence a princed Scheme gives you greater flexibility.

I disagree that it's strictly better, because you're essentially sacrificing the Scheme card. In other words, if I'm using Prince of Schemes to play Smithy as my first action each turn, that takes up the Prince, Scheme, and Smithy cards from my deck to do it; whereas if I'm using Prince of Smithy, I still have the Scheme milling around in my deck (which is now fast-cycling) to use additionally on something else.

That said, Prince of Scheme is awesome when you have nice $5+ cards.
Logged