I started rereading the thread, but stopped because, man, this game is huge. So, I'm looking more at the end of Day 4 up until now and responding/pointing out anything I see.
I had some dice stolen.
lies!
Yes, it's an arch/pps scumteam. Or if this is true I guess it's BA/ww, but that doesn't make as much sense.
Why would you think I was lying?
liopoil still hasn't answered this.
Okay found it:
I don't really care about the order for claiming.
I'm a Tactician. If I didn't roll or play any dice the previous day, the number of dice I roll the following is doubled. I may also play or store second die.
Fun fact: This is the exact same role I had the first game
Do you have the same QT as Mail-Mi's? Can you reveal how many dice you rolled those times? (Unless there is a compelling reason not to.) I'm a little confused why there's no mid ones.
Okay, today's is odd only. So 9 and 1.. no 3,5,7, 11 in how many dice? Possible, not all that unlikely unless he rolled a lot. What was Mail-Mi's monster? Only first instance of roll counts. BA starts playing 5, Mail-Mi plays 11 and 3. Maybe here he figured all rolls needed to be played anyway, so might as well play a low one, so stored some ones that were better than 3?
I don't know, just weird that it had the same pattern both times.
Does that description mean you can play two rolls and store two rolls on the double day? Or is it an exclusive or?
I didn't think anything was weird with my dice. I rolled 4 dice (so,
and got 1 9 1 4 2 10 10 12. When mail-mi rolled, he rolled 4 (so,
and got 11 1 3 11 1 1 3 3. Though actually, now that I look back, mail-mi getting all odds is a little strange. I did save the 12, but I sacrificed the 11 that mail-mi saved to the dice vendor.
I wasn't insinuating anything... just wondering, because you hardly ever mention arch, and he's your partner if you're scum.
Why are you bothering to mention repeatedly how I will learn something if I am town then? I guess it doesn't matter much, it's just weird.
I rolled two 8s, exactly the same as yesterday... ugh. Play: 8
I could be swayed to vote WW/BA but not by you, only hydrad, who I trust to not have an anti town agenda.
Pretty much the same with me. Just when I was getting ready to vote for pps/arch, I realize that Witherweaver has been pushing that the dice destroyer is factional and also came up with a crazy pps dice destroyer theory, all while he is the only player who could reasonably be the dice destroyer! So I too am torn.
Uh, I've been fighting the idea that the dice destroyed is factional. if I had the ability, why would I want to oppose people thinking it's factional?
WIFOM WIFOM WIFOM WIFOM
I rolled two 8s, exactly the same as yesterday... ugh. Play: 8
This is ridiculously scummy. You really had no stored odds that you could've played?
The only thing that's really stopping me from going gungho PPS/Lio is how quiet Arch has been since Day 4. Reminds me of WoT, where he sat back and let town mess up until he could just come in and tell them who to lynch.
Dude. I've been V/LA. I've considered asking for a replacement since I'll be gone this week, but instead I've decided to stay up late and put in the effort to try and win the game for Town.
Ok. Let's break this down. There are two possible scumteam: WW/BA or PPS/liopoil. Here's a couple of things to look at:
1) The Reward: This really only applies to WW/BA and is what links them together at all. They claim the reward is "Two random Town players are made Masons. The Masons, and two random other players, are then put into a QT. The Masons are given pseudonyms to speak under." The scum narrative for the reward is "Two Mafia players are put into a QT with two Town players. No one knows anyone's alignment and the Mafia are allowed to speak under pseudonyms". I originally thought the second possibility was unlikely, but after seeing two of the biggest supporters for a WW/BA lynch flip Town, I'm having second thoughts. If we're running with the second theory, scum have two options going into the following day when people start asking who was a part of the QT. They can lie and say they aren't Bob or Alice. This would result in the other two QT members claiming and assume that Bob and Alice are both scum since they didn't claim. This would make the other two QT members Masons and have some talk in the QT to go on to find scum. Or, scum could just claim being Bob and Alice. If they do, they may catch some heat for having pseudonyms. So, they could claim Masons instead. Maybe they thought Hydrad had figured out who they were, so they decided it would be best to just say they were Masons. Also, the fact that Ichimaru (one of the QT members) died and that WW initially denied being a part of the QT point more to WW/BA being scum. However, the first possibility seems more like a reward than the other. But, last nights reward was sort of weird that the second scenario isn't too farfetched.
2) The Powers: PPS and liopoil powers are both confirmed. I'm still wary of some sort of coordination between scum!PPS and scum!liopoil to cover up PPS's power, but I think(?) all of those theories have been debunked. None of liopoil's targets have been 'convenient' so to speak, but PPS saying that he hasn't used his power until last night has just got to be a lie. Swindler makes sense as a dice stealing role, but I'm pretty sure his role has been confirmed. I believe that BA is what he says he is. I find him much scummier than WW, but WW's claim itself is much scummier than his. Simply, we have one unclaimed "Dice Destroyer" most-likely-scum power and WW's power is unconfirmed. AND WW was the first person to coin the term "Dice Destroyer". AND WW's role name, Saboteur, sounds exactly like that: a dice destroyer. I wonder where WW came up with that term... There is the fact that the dice destroyer may be factional, but I find that to be a very unlikely factional power.
3) The Die Rolls:Compiled below with when they played it.
Note: Day 3 the order of when people played was relatively randomly decided after the first three.
BA:
D1 - 12 (second)
D2 - 5 (first)
D3 - 8 (seventh)
D4 - 2 (second)
D5 - None
liopoil:
D1 - 8 (third)
D2 - 6 (tenth)
D3 - 7 (second)
D4 - None
D5 - 8 (fourth)
Witherweaver:
D1 - 8 (fifth)
D2 - 12 (ninth)
D3 - 12 (fifth)
D4 - None
D5 - 5 (second)
PPS:
D1 - 8 (sixth)
D2 - 8 (eighth)
D3 - 9 (sixth)
D4 - None
D5 - 9 (first)
Archetype:
D1 - None
D2 - 11, 3 (second)
D3 - 9 (tenth)
D4 - None
D5 - 9, 1 (third)
Hydrad:
D1 - 7 (eleventh)
D2 - 1 (eleventh)
D3 - 7 (fourth)
D4 - 2 (first)
D5 - None
I think scum wants to play near the beginning of each day. So, very protown for WW to playing such high numbers. liopoil and PPS are in that safe "not too protown and not too scummy" area and BA is fairly scummy for his rolls. PPS did roll all 6 dice that one day, which is scummy.
4) The Play: Arguably, how they've played is what matters the most. The die rolls and claims do provide facts, but since roles are assigned independent of alignment and die rolls are luck-based, how they use their vote and their words are what I have to go on the most. I'll be looking at their behavior and nothing else.
PPS: Very, very scummy. His vote jumps around all the time and he changes his reads very quickly. Reads perfectly like scum going from day to day trying to get the easiest mislynch. However, he's been so scummy to the point where it's started to come full circle where he really could be Town because he has been so scummy. He also kind of reads like a SK to me.
liopoil: Very much so in the background. Ash hit the nail on the head with his very acti-lurking behavior and it's a definite scum tactic. He's been trying to get PPS lynched for a while, which could easily be him trying to soft bus. I don't find him as scummy as PPS, but they make sense as partners.
WW: I've had a townread on him since I subbed in. He's been very protown with how he's approached voting records and seems genuine in trying to scumhunt and analyze every possibility. I'm very confused why Ichimaru Gin instead of himself was killed the night after he claimed, but Ichimaru was pretty firmly Town in my mind too.
BA: Very classic scum play. He lead the mislynches on both chairs and ash and changes his mind a lot just like PPS. However, he has put a lot of work into trying to puzzle everything out and analyze things just like WW. I find him a bit Townier than PPS, but still scummier than liopoil.
--
Rereading a bit; thought I'd pull this up for some Voltaire wagon analysis:
I agree with a reroll on chairs.
Looking back at the end of D1, trying to formulate some reads:
I don't see how this isn't town Volt here. In Greater Idea he stood out to me as quite not-town Volt.. it really seemed like he was fabricating his town play. I don't see that here, he just seems like regular Volt. He could have learned from that, but I can't imagine voting for him today.
Would scum be this blatant about their partner? I could see someone like ash doing something like this, but not WW. I have a townread on him for this and his claim.
- I agree that there isn't really anything scummy about voltaire's play in general, however, I do have a scumread on him. Two reasons: 1) he rolled a 5, the lowest of everyone, and 2) The way he acted in regard to his vote on me was a bit strange.
Town points for this, especially considering the back and forth between him and Voltaire earlier in the day. I do find it scummy that despite expressing that read, he didn't end up on his wagon. So a slight scum read on him.
I'm not sure I follow why there's a big Voltaire wagon. What am I missing?
This reads to me as scum logging onto to see that his partner has a big wagon on him. I don't think I understand what's going on enough with these whole dice changing scores thing to justify giving a scumread to chairs. But that's what I thought in game 1 when he played a 1. He did seem like his normal jokey non-hesistant town!self earlier D1, but I still have a scumread on him.
yuma looks like town, so that's good.
Ichi's most recent posts are also on the townier side.
How about vote: Voltaire? He just feels like scum. Will look at this in more detail after the weekend.
Oh yeah, that's L-2.
Getting a strong town vibe from this post; it just doesn't read as scum trying to bus his partner. Also, while following along in the speccy, I had a townread on faust (which is rare - I always think faust is scum). When I subbed in and reread, I still had a townread on him and voted for him. And with the dice distribution thing, he's easily my top town read.
Vote: Voltaire
That is L-1.
This, however, does read like scum trying to bus their partner. Especially with the follow up post:
Voltaire is way outside his meta. I believe it unlikely he and ashersky are partners so his flip will be largely informative.
I also find him suspicious D1 for his confusion on his own claim. That just screams scum forgetting what they fakeclaimed. Scumread here.
vote: voltaire
ashersky's surprise hammer! I'm leaning scum because I can't think of what town!ash could gain from this. I can see where he'd do it just to see what would happen but, like someone else said, I could see ash doing that as either alignment. Light scumread.
vote: voltaire
Wait, was that the hammer!?
Dude, fake surprise is scummy.
This is not "fake surprise". So you just hammered without giving Voltaire a chance to claim, without warning--this early in the day.
Getting a town vibe from this. Genuinely reads as the model townie freaking out when the day is cut short from a quickhammer. Also been getting just a general townie read from him that I can't really explain.
Sorry two last nooby questions. If 8 votes are reached is the person lynched right away or does he have time for last words to get out of it.
Also f I die but town still wins later does that count as a win for me still?
Hydrad seems sort of oblivious to what's going on. Town read for him.
Sorry two last nooby questions. If 8 votes are reached is the person lynched right away or does he have time for last words to get out of it.
Also f I die but town still wins later does that count as a win for me still?
He dies, but if the thread is not locked immediately, he can still say last words. Typically, from what I have seen from my previous game, we allow the player a chance to claim before lynching them. This is only my second game though.
I believe that if you die then, yes, assuming you are town, if town wins, you also win.
BA seems more concerned with the monster's results than the outcome of the lynch. So, slight town for that.
Vote Count 1.7 - Final
Ichimaru Gin (1): Voltaire
Beyond Awesome (1): Witherweaver
Voltaire (eight): mail-mi, Hydrad, Ichimaru Gin, XerxesPraelor, Beyond Awesome, faust, pingpongsam, ashersky
Witherweaver (1): chairs
pingpongsam (1): yuma
mail-mi (1): liopoil
not voting (1): BoxOfDog
With 14 alive, it took 8 to lynch.
Voltaire has been lynched. He was a Mafia Roleblocker.
I'm not putting a vote quite yet - I'll wait for some response, but I'll have one down before I leave tomorrow.