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[Ichimaru Gin]

And it is at "the end of the day".

Now my plans are foiled!! No, darn you WW!!

[Witherweaver]

And it is at "the end of the day".

Now my plans are foiled!! No, darn you WW!!

You're exaggerating your defensive meta so much that you're creating strawman attacks against you to defend.

[Ichimaru Gin]

And it is at "the end of the day".

Now my plans are foiled!! No, darn you WW!!

You're exaggerating your defensive meta so much that you're creating strawman attacks against you to defend.

I'm trying to make light of the very suspicious tone in your last posts.

[Hydrad]

Personally I feel like gin has been getting slightly unfair treatment towards being scum. From what I have seen i'm certainly keeping in mind that he could be scum but at this point it almost seems like people are looking for the smallest possible reason that gin might be scum and not paying much attention to others.

Now this doesn't mean that gin is innocent I'm just saying I think we are ganging up a bit to much with such little evidence.

But at the same time i realize in this game you have to take risks and sometimes lynch people even if you don't know if they are scum or not. I just wanted to put in my opinion on this situation

[Beyond Awesome]

Personally I feel like gin has been getting slightly unfair treatment towards being scum. From what I have seen i'm certainly keeping in mind that he could be scum but at this point it almost seems like people are looking for the smallest possible reason that gin might be scum and not paying much attention to others.

Now this doesn't mean that gin is innocent I'm just saying I think we are ganging up a bit to much with such little evidence.

But at the same time i realize in this game you have to take risks and sometimes lynch people even if you don't know if they are scum or not. I just wanted to put in my opinion on this situation

Who are some of the other players that stand out to you as potential scum?

[Hydrad]

Personally I feel like gin has been getting slightly unfair treatment towards being scum. From what I have seen i'm certainly keeping in mind that he could be scum but at this point it almost seems like people are looking for the smallest possible reason that gin might be scum and not paying much attention to others.

Now this doesn't mean that gin is innocent I'm just saying I think we are ganging up a bit to much with such little evidence.

But at the same time i realize in this game you have to take risks and sometimes lynch people even if you don't know if they are scum or not. I just wanted to put in my opinion on this situation

Who are some of the other players that stand out to you as potential scum?

Hmm i'm really bad at this and will admit gin is one of the top of my list. I also don't feel 100% safe about archer? I don't know why i just get a feeling from him. The last one I feel is volt, I feel like hes scum and is trying to not draw any attention to himself.

Those are probably the top 3 on my list but I don't have any real reasons why I think that.

I was just saying above it seems like some people have decided that gin is scum and aren't giving him a chance at all. Which may be the correct thing to do who knows.

[liopoil]

Hydrad, you hedge a lot in your posts. By that I mean you emphasize how you really don't know. A lot of players do this at the beginning, and it's fine. But you don't need to say it over and over again, we know you don't know because none of us know! (except for scum). You say that people aren't giving ichimaru gin a chance, and that they have decided he is scum. None of them are absolutely sure ichi is scum, they just think he is the most likely to be scum, so they are voting for him. Just because they don't voice their doubt doesn't mean they don't have it. We've all been wrong plenty of times.

Personally, I think that in terms of rolling low, Voltaire just has to be scummier than Ichimaru. In terms of other reasons for suspecting ichimaru, I don't really agree. But I have not formed all my reads yet, so we'll see what I think once I do. When will that be? Sometime this weekend.

[Hydrad]

Ah thanks for telling me that

[ashersky]

vote: liopoil

[Voltaire]

I'm still here, just very busy recently. I like both lio and IG but I want to re-read to make sure that makes sense.

I liked lio more before ash voted for him.

[ashersky]

I'm still here, just very busy recently. I like both lio and IG but I want to re-read to make sure that makes sense.

I liked lio more before ash voted for him.

You need to get over your bias against me.

[Ichimaru Gin]

Volt actually seems more like scum!Volt here. (And it's not because he suspects me in an OMGUS'y sort of way--though that is suspicious).

I just don't see the same level of analysis and participation as town!Volt gives. He reads more like he did in Greater Idea to me.

[Voltaire]

I'm still here, just very busy recently. I like both lio and IG but I want to re-read to make sure that makes sense.

I liked lio more before ash voted for him.

You need to get over your bias against me.

Never.

I see I am picking up lots of scum heat (though no votes? worth noting) for meta reasons. This is what happens when I post less, and it's happened before. It's reasonable but wrong.

[ashersky]

I'm still here, just very busy recently. I like both lio and IG but I want to re-read to make sure that makes sense.

I liked lio more before ash voted for him.

You need to get over your bias against me.

Never.

I see I am picking up lots of scum heat (though no votes? worth noting) for meta reasons. This is what happens when I post less, and it's happened before. It's reasonable but wrong.

You realize I can use your bias to great effect as a way to protect scum partners, right?  Given you always award town points to anyone I suspect/vote for, it's pretty simple.

[Voltaire]

You realize I can use your bias to great effect as a way to protect scum partners, right?  Given you always award town points to anyone I suspect/vote for, it's pretty simple.

Trust me, I know.

[liopoil]

Why are you voting for me, ash?

[liopoil]

At least you aren't uselessly refusing to vote for anyone besides mail-mi today anymore.

[ashersky]

Why are you voting for me, ash?

Partner coaching disguised as friendly veteran advice to a newbie; or, fake friendly veteran advice to a newbie to give his feel good vibes and town cred about you.

[ashersky]

At least you aren't uselessly refusing to vote for anyone besides mail-mi today anymore.

I still want to lynch mail-mi.

I think mail-mi/PPS/liopoil or mail-mi/liopoil/hydrad at this point.

[liopoil]

Why are you voting for me, ash?

Partner coaching disguised as friendly veteran advice to a newbie; or, fake friendly veteran advice to a newbie to give his feel good vibes and town cred about you.

Or friendly veteran advice? I don't see how any of those can be seen as more likely than the others. And I believe that advice must have been helpful. If I hadn't said it, I bet someone else would eventually. It can't be anything but a null read.

PPE: ouch, you caught the scumteam!

[liopoil]

So, the three people voting for me (have any of them moved their vote? I don't think so) are voltaire, yuma, and ashersky. Each voted me in a post saying simply, "vote liopoil" with the syntax and bold and everything. Voltaire and ashersky explained their vote when I asked, I replied to that and neither have responded yet (although to be fair, ash hasn't had much time yet). Yuma I didn't ask because I assumed they were the same reasons as Voltaire, and he is also V/LA. The votes seem to be sort of policy votes, as in, "You weren't aware that it had been editted into the OP that there are exactly 3 mafia, so I vote for you" and "You gave advice to a new player, so I vote for you".

What's my point? Well, it is tempting to suspect them for this, but in this case I don't think it is necessarily scummy. Voltaire has brought it up a few times, ashersky already had his vote somewhere and was pushing it and just moved it. (Why did he move it if he still prefers lynching mail-mi? I guess just to express his suspicion of me? That's fair.) Yuma is V/LA. So they all have excuses. So I think what I draw from this is just frustration at being voted without explanation, and having to press people to provide flawed reasoning.

I don't see myself at much of a risk of actually being lynched yet (I expect some if not all of the 3 will see the light and move their vote), but if I am lynched by votes stating nothing but "vote liopoil", I will not be happy.

If any of the three I find suspicious for their vote, it is Voltaire. Volt has continued to mention his suspicion of me without further elaborating or pushing it - simply putting my name out there with one or two others, as if trying to see if there is support for my lynch before committing to it.

Yuma I would only find suspicious because usually he is right about me. Other than that it is just null - he probably just saw that post, got a scummy vibe off it and voted on it, because he didn't have time to look at everything.

Ash's vote I don't put any stock in either way at all, ash just votes on whims for stuff then combines them and calls a scumteam. As scum or town.

[ashersky]

So, the three people voting for me (have any of them moved their vote? I don't think so) are voltaire, yuma, and ashersky. Each voted me in a post saying simply, "vote liopoil" with the syntax and bold and everything. Voltaire and ashersky explained their vote when I asked, I replied to that and neither have responded yet (although to be fair, ash hasn't had much time yet). Yuma I didn't ask because I assumed they were the same reasons as Voltaire, and he is also V/LA. The votes seem to be sort of policy votes, as in, "You weren't aware that it had been editted into the OP that there are exactly 3 mafia, so I vote for you" and "You gave advice to a new player, so I vote for you".

What's my point? Well, it is tempting to suspect them for this, but in this case I don't think it is necessarily scummy. Voltaire has brought it up a few times, ashersky already had his vote somewhere and was pushing it and just moved it. (Why did he move it if he still prefers lynching mail-mi? I guess just to express his suspicion of me? That's fair.) Yuma is V/LA. So they all have excuses. So I think what I draw from this is just frustration at being voted without explanation, and having to press people to provide flawed reasoning.

I don't see myself at much of a risk of actually being lynched yet (I expect some if not all of the 3 will see the light and move their vote), but if I am lynched by votes stating nothing but "vote liopoil", I will not be happy.

If any of the three I find suspicious for their vote, it is Voltaire. Volt has continued to mention his suspicion of me without further elaborating or pushing it - simply putting my name out there with one or two others, as if trying to see if there is support for my lynch before committing to it.

Yuma I would only find suspicious because usually he is right about me. Other than that it is just null - he probably just saw that post, got a scummy vibe off it and voted on it, because he didn't have time to look at everything.

Ash's vote I don't put any stock in either way at all, ash just votes on whims for stuff then combines them and calls a scumteam. As scum or town.

I think I agree with all this here.  I bolded especially relevant things.

It's also a super super scummy post.  Calm, collected, clear.  You are now the Hannibal Lector of Mafia.  Scary.  Like you are going to eat my brains or something.

[pingpongsam]

Vote: liopoil

[Hydrad]

Vote: Voltaire

[Beyond Awesome]

Can we get a vote count? Thanks