Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Voltaire]

Grr, quote fail.  Reply:

Sure, but I want to win.

What do you mean?

WW?

[Witherweaver]

I know from your point of view you don't know I'm town, buy *I* do, so I'm not considering the scenario where  I am.

In my mind, it's FaustU{ADK,Shraeye}.  I also need to consider the case where you're scum, and I think I'm at bigger risk than you.  This is my very first game (well, simultaneous) and I would not know how to get this level of accepted towniness if I tried.  I don't really know why I did.  I've just been posting what I think, and I'm starting to think that's not the best srategy because it shows scum um your hand

The bigger risk is an experienced player that is scum buddying me and getting me to go along with him.  So my exposure to you is much more than your exposure to me.

On the other hand, as a first-time

[Witherweaver]

Was on subway and on phone now.  Previous reply was to your question.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Not sure what to think of this. I guess faust really is the partner? I mean, maybe, MAYBE it's ww. But with volt, I don't think scum busses this hard, or this fast. I need to reassess.

[Voltaire]

OK, I was re-reading shraeye at the end of D2 after he showed up post-ADK claim. Let's look at this whole post:

whoa.  just saw that ADK claimed cop.  Well that should solve things.  Without a counterclaim, it's got to be Nik/faust then.  Perfect.

Voltaire, I have no idea why you will not look at Nik.  Check out the things I've posted this morning.  Nik is really really really suspicious.  Faust is also suspicious, but there are occasional saving graces.  I see no saving graces for Nik.  I mean, either one is a win.  So whatevs.

vote: Nik

this is not the kind of post the town cop makes. The town cop does not vote for a player they are uncertain about alignment-wise when they know 1 player is scum 100%. They don't don't don't don't don't. Sure, there's a narrative there, but it requires dangerous risky bad play that shraeye would never do.

Plus, if shraeye did do this dangerous, risky, bad thing then he needs to sell us on why. Which he has not done. Horribly. Just horribly.

Are Faust and Shraeye not going to claim now? 

What do you mean by this?  I thought we both did.

Also not this.

Oh, I see that I was the one who misread Faust. 

Faust, the cats out of the bag, whether you like it or not.  Are you cop? Or is ADK cop?

Or this.

A benefit to Nik, is that I think he's more likely to be scum with the super-off chance people.  Voltaire, maybe Wither.  I don't see faust/Volt.  I haven't thought about faust/wither, I guess.

Or this.

ADK, get in here and help sort things out.  We need you/Ichi as much as possible.

OR THIS!

Here are a few reasons ADK is obvscum;
1. He claimed cop yesterday, didn't get counterclaimed, but only only showed up at the very end to hammer Nik.  I know not everybody cruises the who's Online feature, but for about 5-10 minutes before popping in this thread and hammering Nik, ADK was cruising the RMM game that mail-mi is running.  There is no way that the actual cop, in danger of being lynched, an then forced to claim, does this.  Not direct ANY of the fallout at all?  If I were run up yesterday and had to claim, I would have been looking all up at my wagon to see who scum was.  Doing anything at all to contribute in any small way.  ADK just sat back and waited for real cop to out himself.  When that didn't happen, he just hammered without word.

2. His insta-post here.  Again, he was cruising the forums at 4pm, viewing this game's thread.  Teproc wasn't even online yet.  His goal was to force a mislynch on a false target, quickly, BEFORE the real cop could get in and wise up.  He only needs 1 townie to believe him.

Worst case EVAH

[Voltaire]

Not sure what to think of this. I guess faust really is the partner? I mean, maybe, MAYBE it's ww. But with volt, I don't think scum busses this hard, or this fast. I need to reassess.

Yup, it's faust/shraeye.

[Voltaire]

I know from your point of view you don't know I'm town, buy *I* do, so I'm not considering the scenario where  I am.

That makes sense. We're the two VTs, so we should have this same symmetrical view about each other.

[Voltaire]

ADK, walk me through why you investigated shraeye again.

[A Drowned Kernel]

During day two I had you as my biggest scum read, and that was still around in the night. I was feeling very towny on shraeye at the end of the day until Nik flipped town, and I looked back and realized shraeye had talked everyone into a mislynch. So I thought about it, and I decided he was worth investigating, since if shraeye was town that would narrow it down to you, faust, and ww, and I was pretty sure in that scenario you and faust was the most likely option, whereas if I investigated you I would have been way more in the dark on shraeye. Basically my read was stronger on you so I thought shraeye would give me more info.

What threw me off was that quote I pulled up earlier, about "faust understands". It seemed to me like the sort of thing scum would say to get a townie on their side, like "you and I are both good at this game, we got this bro". And now the way you're going after him, I mean, maybe that's some ridiculous scum tactic? It's just as brazen as shraeye's counterclaim. But again, maybe one more reread.

[Voltaire]

Nah, I don't need it.

I've just been posting what I think, and I'm starting to think that's not the best srategy because it shows scum um your hand

That's the perfect way to play. It's more important to prove to your fellow townies that you are town. Your play let me POE the scum team. Because I had it down to 4, and the 2 town were the cop and the doc! You're the reason that was possible, in my eyes the cop played very scummy and the doc didn't play quite town enough (I gave in to scum's fakecases on IG, sadly, and changed my read on him from town to null).

Anyway. If you're (referring to WW) scum, here's the game:

vote: shraeye

Otherwise, please hammer scum.

[Voltaire]

Oh, I see you answered ADK. That makes complete sense.

[Voltaire]

That is, the only thing I am betting against is ADK/WW, specifically. Makes me feel even better.

[Voltaire]

unvote

[Voltaire]

I saw WW popped back into the thread after reading another game, and I could never forgive myself in the 1% of the world where I am wrong.

Let me keep re-reading thinking the team is ADK/WW. It doesn't make any damn sense right now.

[Witherweaver]

I really blame Nik for all this.  If he hadn't double-posted that question, then the case against him would have fallen apart easily.   I didn't vote against him but I would have hammered before deadline if I had to.

No offense Nik

[Witherweaver]

I saw WW popped back into the thread after reading another game, and I could never forgive myself in the 1% of the world where I am wrong.

Let me keep re-reading thinking the team is ADK/WW. It doesn't make any damn sense right now.

What about ADK/Faust?  That's what I'm worried about. 

[Voltaire]

I saw WW popped back into the thread after reading another game, and I could never forgive myself in the 1% of the world where I am wrong.

Let me keep re-reading thinking the team is ADK/WW. It doesn't make any damn sense right now.

What about ADK/Faust?  That's what I'm worried about.

Oh! Right! Um...um...why wasn't I think about that?

Yeah, I'll check that out too.

You/ADK makes no damn sense (still re-reading)

[Witherweaver]

I know from your point of view you don't know I'm town, buy *I* do, so I'm not considering the scenario where  I am.

In my mind, it's FaustU{ADK,Shraeye}.  I also need to consider the case where you're scum, and I think I'm at bigger risk than you.  This is my very first game (well, simultaneous) and I would not know how to get this level of accepted towniness if I tried.  I don't really know why I did.  I've just been posting what I think, and I'm starting to think that's not the best srategy because it shows scum um your hand

The bigger risk is an experienced player that is scum buddying me and getting me to go along with him.  So my exposure to you is much more than your exposure to me.

On the other hand, as a first-time

Oh this got messed up.  The dangling phrase should have been part of a lead-in to the point where the bigger risk is scum leading me along.

[Witherweaver]

It felt like it would be more informative knowing if shraeye was scum or town. If I had investigated volt and gotten a scum result, I still would have had to find his partner. During the night I was pretty sure that volt was scum, so I thought I had to find the other one, or at least get more information.

I'm starting to regret that a little, as looking back I'm wavering a little on Volt being the other scum, considering how shraeye brought him up right away.

faust understands why I lied yesterday.

This could be him buddying with his partner, but it looks a lot like trying to get a townie on his side. Maybe I should just stick with my original gut read though.

Grr I replied before but it got lost.

Why would he buddy his partner?  For scum!Shraeye, a lynch against you is a winning mislynch.  That's the only point he needs to make.  If we instead (correctly in this scenario) lynch Shraeye, why would he wanted to have buddied Faust?

[Voltaire]

This is what shraeye wants, btw - us to tell him who his town result should be on.

[Witherweaver]

This is what shraeye wants, btw - us to tell him who his town result should be on.

That was my point with my frustrated posting before

[Witherweaver]

The big problem is that theory!Shraeye always seems to be correct!Shraeye.

[Voltaire]

The big problem is that theory!Shraeye always seems to be correct!Shraeye.

The fact that I am entertaining the idea of shraeye playing as horribly as him being town would require is sad sad sad. (and I am entertaining this idea, or I would be voting shraeye right now and risking your/faust's hammer)

I say, while I re-read the whole thread, can you do a specific re-read of the wagon on Nik yesterday, thinking of each team? (Hell, even do one involving me lurking away from it if it makes you feel better) That should be useful I would think.

[Voltaire]

Even though I started out with a null/townish read on shraeye D1, everything he has done since has just further and further driven him into scum territory, with the big capper being this alleged "I didn't counterclaim the cop" nonsense. I am willing to bet the game on shraeye not playing that badly as town (also because I can combine it with a million other reasons too).

[Witherweaver]

Faust looks scummiest.  I particular don't like his response to the claims and the "better Nik than me" vote. 

As for teams:

Faust/Shraeye argue with eachother.  Shraeye specifically implies the scum team is Nik/Faust:*

whoa.  just saw that ADK claimed cop.  Well that should solve things.  Without a counterclaim, it's got to be Nik/faust then.  Perfect.

Voltaire, I have no idea why you will not look at Nik.  Check out the things I've posted this morning.  Nik is really really really suspicious.  Faust is also suspicious, but there are occasional saving graces.  I see no saving graces for Nik.  I mean, either one is a win.  So whatevs.

vote: Nik

But with Nik's mistake, there's a really good chance of pushing a Nik lynch through.  A scum!Shraeye with scum!Faust partner believes he can push Nik through instead of Faust, but has committed to a position against Faust for towncred in case Faust actually does get caught.

Faust and Shraeye disagree about Voltaire too.  Faust is voting against Voltaire, Shraeye thinks he's town.  This makes sense as trying to undermine the validity of a Faust/Shraeye team, but that's because it makes sense as them not being a team.  So WIFOM type of thing.

ADK comes in and hammers out of nowhere, with 35 minutes left, and after I announced I'd be willing to do it before the deadline.  Without saying anything and not talking before.  Now, scum!ADK knows he lied and should know that Shraeye is the cop.  He therefore knows that (1) it's important to get a mislynch through today, and (2) Shraeye's claim tomorrow is going to be pretty hard to believe.  The question here is would scum!ADK hammer here?  I have trouble answering this question.

ADK/Shraeye not possible. 

ADK/Faust.. Well, that was my read back before ADK claimed.  There is very little interaction between ADK and Faust during the Nik wagon.  I can't decide if that makes that team more or less likely.  I think if I was scum!Faust knowing that scum!ADK just fake claimed, I'd want to minimize our interactions. But some scum players might want to have some back and forths to undermine that.  So WIFOM again.  Faust goes after Volt here in response to ADK and subsequent claims.  ADK also wants volt. 

Volt.. suspicious absent during the entire Nik discussion, when he was the most vocal Nik town person.  And even though that time is a normal high activity time (Shraeye nice enough to post those), and he knew the deadline was coming.  This is suspicious.

I don't think an ADK/Volt team is going to have Volt be so adamant about ADK.  ADK being adamant about volt makes sense, because Volt had no risk of being lynched and ADK can give Volt towncred it he goes down.  I don't see this likely though.

What about Shraeye/Volt?  I have trouble seeing this.  But... Shraeye super towncreds Volt than pushes the Nik lynch through while Volt (who would be obligated to argue) is gone. 

And Faust/Volt?  Not possible since one of scum needs to be Shraeye or ADK.

Okay.. most likely looks like Faust/Shraeye.  Then ADK/Faust, then Volt/Shraeye, then Volt/ADK.

*while cleverly leaving open the alternate interpretation that Nik/Faust is the choice for ADK's partner.  I have to give him props for this, whether he's town or scum.  He had this play planned before writing that post.  Note there are 10 minutes between his previous post and that one (~8:50 vs. ~9:00).  That's the time he used to figure out his strategy.