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851
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Contest #52: Varying effect per-game
« on: November 21, 2019, 12:27:19 am »


FAQ:
- During a turn in which a Travelling Shop was played, all cards in the Item piles are considered to be in the Supply, and as a result can be gained by cards like Workshop and Altar (provided they fit all other restrictions, e.g. cost), not just bought.
- Items with "return this to the Supply" will be returned from the pile if and only if you also played a Travelling Shop earlier in the turn.
- You can use Teacher to move your tokens to an Item pile as long as you played a Travelling Shop (with e.g. Prince) before calling it. Likewise, you can also use Events to move your tokens to Item piles as long as you played a Travelling Shop before buying said Event. You can move Adventures tokens off of Item piles even if they are not in the Supply.
- Item piles do not count towards the game end conditions, even during a turn in which a Travelling Shop was played.

852
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: November 07, 2019, 10:39:54 am »

Impressment
$4 - Action
Reveal the top 2 cards from your deck. Play the revealed Action cards in any order and discard the rest.
If you haven't revealed any Action card, gain a card costing up to $4.


A mixup of Throne Room and Workshop with a hint of Golem/Ghost. Chainable.
This is too good.
Either it is a Workshop for $4 that cycles 2 cards. Slightly worse than Ironworks but still decent due to the cycling.
Or it is a cantrip Workshop with some cycling. That card would have to cost $5 and is probably a bit better than Cobbler.
Or it is a Lost City which is better than a $5.

I don't see the cantrip Workshop part. If it hits one Action card, it plays it and that's all it does. So if it's actually either Workshop+Cycling, Cantrip+Cycling, or Lost City. Lost City is by far the rarest option and you can't usually control which outcome you get, so I think Impressment is underpowered if anything because the Cantrip+Cycling effect is on par with Border Guard, if BG didn't have the artifacts.

853
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: November 05, 2019, 02:10:57 pm »
I won't disqualify cards that use "reveal" when they could use "look at," though I may take it into account.

Also, Cavern isn't strictly better than Hunting Grounds because Hunting Grounds has the on-trash ability.

It is, however, strictly better on play, and you don't exactly buy Hunting Grounds for its on-trash ability like you do for Fortress.

854
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: November 05, 2019, 01:09:26 pm »


Not sure if this qualifies of strictly better than Hunting Grounds

Cavern is strictly better than Hunting Grounds and costs less. Cavern has to cost at least .

855
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: November 04, 2019, 10:41:09 pm »
Young Smithy
cost $3 - Action
Reveal the top 3 cards of your deck. Discard one, and put the rest into your hand.

I don't think this really fits the challenge because there's no reason to have it be "reveal" instead of "look at," and the challenge specified "reveal."

856
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 29, 2019, 10:07:51 pm »
CONTEST - HEIRLOOM ENTRY

Just some funky ideas that kind of help each other out.

   
I like the Lute/Looter pun, if that was intentional.
i love it if it's unintentional

Are you worried that it'll mess with the opening at all? $2/$4 can be a rough start.

Getting / in a Chapel game would really suck.

857
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Stone Age Set
« on: October 28, 2019, 02:20:51 am »
Primordial village: i think you are mistaken. +buy comes after the coins even on woodcutter.



No it does not.

858
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Stone Age Set
« on: October 27, 2019, 06:58:50 pm »
I designed this set with an idea of "outdated" cards, where each merit they give comes with a some sort of a demerit. There are 4 main sub-themes: 1) Slavery - cards, that interact with Curses in your deck; 2) Self-destructive attacks - Hurt them more than yourself; 3) Alt-VP - Being useless until the end of the game is there own demerit and as such i decided to include them; 4) Vanilla cards with demerits - a variations on the Base set cards with some sort of demerits a user needs to overcome to properly apply a card in his deck. Each non-Victory pile has a 10 cards in it, with Victory piles having 8 copies for 2 players and 12 copies for 3 and more players. Exeptions numbers listed in figured parenthesis.

Slaves


{The number of slaves at the start of the game should be equal to the number of curses used in the game}

The problem with this type of drawback is that in games with trashing, you can easily break Slaves by trashing them and completely circumventing the drawback, and in games without trashing, the point penalty can vary between debilitating and meaningless. I've seen games lost with over 100 points and won with negative scores. I also think that Slaves is probably too weak anyway. It's just a free Silver+, and it isn't even a great Silver+. My biggest issue with Slaves, however, is that their presence in the Kingdom makes cursing Attacks way too powerful.

Slave market

This reaction is way too weak. It's effectively the same as +1 Action, cards cost $1 less this turn, which is already barely a -cost effect, but it also needs you to have multiple Buys in a turn and waste the first on a Curse in order to get that effect. Market Square, on the other hand, has a Reaction that is effectively +1 Action, gain a Gold (way better), can be drawn into, and reacts to something you'd already frequently want to do anyway.

Pagan Shaman

Rewording suggestion:
"Trash the card on the Exile mat. Put a card other than a Copper from your hand face up onto the Exile mat (or reveal you can't).

In games using this, at the start of your turn, if there is a card on the Exile mat, reveal your hand and discard all copies of it." This reduces the number of words in the text, makes it clearer, and keeps you honest (as you've worded it, there's no way to prevent players from pretending they have a hand full of Coppers). There's no way to get multiple cards onto the Exile mat at once, so you don't need to word Pagan Shaman as if you can.

Freeloader


{The number of Freeloaders at the start of the game should be equal to the number of curses used in the game}

You have to waste a buy to give your opponents Freeloaders, so I don't think it's worth doing unless it's the only -cost Kingdom card.

Omen Tracker

This is too powerful. If you discard a Victory card or a Curse, your opponents essentially have a 2-card hand on their next turn. I would reduce it to two cards topdecked and have it give + to the player to make it more like an oddball Militia variant.

Feud

This is way too swingy. You could very easily trash an Estate from your hand and hit an opponent's Province, leading to a 12-point swing in your favor.

Next is Alt-VP Split-pile. {4/4 copies for 2 players and 6/6 copies for 3 and more players.}

Top half:                                                Bottom half:

Ancestral rights                                      Border Lands

Nobody in their right mind would ever risk giving their opponent a ton of points by buying a Border Lands. Especially since Ancestral Rights isn't even hard to buy or play. And since nobody would buy Border Lands, Ancestral Rights would get left alone as well, considering that without Border Lands it's a double-cost Estate.

Free land

This doesn't really change the game in any interesting ways, imo.

Shared land

This is worded strangely. I assume that the player who has Shared Land chooses which Victory card it mimics, but as worded, it sounds like you choose a player at random at the beginning of the game and they decide which card Shared Land mimics. Here's how I would word it:
"When scoring, choose another Victory card in the Supply. This card is worth the same amount of as the chosen card."

Mound

Even in games with heavy trashing, I don't think this is going to be worth enough to make it worth , especially since it can only trash Treasures. It also needs to say "or reveal you can't" after "trash 2 Treasures from your hand" because it's possible that you play it while only having one Treasure in hand (or none in hand).

Primordial village

+Buys should come before +. Other than that, this is by far the best card in your post.

Pagan totem

This is too weak. It removes junk from your deck, but once you run out of cards to trash, it becomes significantly worse junk than any of the actual junk since it takes up space in EVERY hand for the rest of the game, and you Curse yourself if you try to trash it. Since you can easily play it every turn, it also really isn't that different from Cathedral if you think about it.

Chief's hut

This looks good on paper, but I think it's actually very weak. Many Actions are very bad and some are even useless if you have to discard your hand afterwards. The optimal targets for Chief's Hut are Actions that give + and +Buys, and considering that you need to play a non-terminal before CH works (because you need to have an Action left to play the CH), non-terminal coin is far too rare to make CH useful, especially when you also take into account the fact that the optimal targets also don't give +Cards because any cards you draw are wasted.

Shaman's hut

This compares too favorably to Forum to cost the same amount. They both give the same net handsize for the current turn, but Shaman's Hut improves your next turn as well. I would price Shaman's Hut at .

Tradional rite

Rewording suggestion:
"Reveal your hand and choose two cards from it that have the same cost. If you couldn't, trash this and gain a Curse. Otherwise, set aside both of them. Now and at the start of your next turn, trash one of the set aside cards and gain a card costing up to more than it."
Aside from the rewording, I feel like it should just fail to do anything if your cards all have different costs, since you can always just not play it. It also compares way too well to Remodel to cost . It is a conditional now-and-next turn Remodel, but you'd be hard-pressed NOT to be able to get that effect. I would price it at at the very least.

Chief


This is strictly better than Militia and therefore has to cost at least . I would actually suggest pricing it at .

For future reference, I would strongly recommend reading the fan card creation guide pinned to the top of this Variant and Fan Cards forum's front page. It was invaluable for me to learn how to get better at designing fan cards and avoiding common pitfalls.

859
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 27, 2019, 05:38:16 pm »
Hm, would you say the same about bureaucrat? Perhaps I should bump the price up to $4?
Bureaucrat gaining onto deck is weaker because it displaces another card in your next hand; gaining to hand doesn't displace anything.

I think as it is it's somewhere between $4 and $5; the reaction essentially serves as a discard for money like Secret Chamber, but it can also be used to avoid curses and such (and it makes gainers like Workshop a LOT more powerful). The reaction is definitely the more interesting part and it'd be cool to see that more accessible so maybe nerf the silver gaining somehow and make it $4.

Thank you, I totally agree and I appreciate your perspective. I actually think it'd be interesting to make the on-play lower hand size -- less synergy could be interesting. I'm thinking one of these variants:
1. Gain a silver to your hand, put a card onto your deck.
2. Put a card onto your deck, gain a silver to your hand.
3. Gain a silver to your hand, discard a card.
4. Discard a treasure card, gain a silver to your hand.
5. +1$ gain a silver to hand, discard 2 cards. (kind of horse traders)
Costing it 4 for all of these.
I'm leaning towards 1 right now.

Any thoughts?

I think #1 is best.

860
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 27, 2019, 04:08:47 pm »

I think this is a huge improvement. However, you want the card to be drawn after the reveal of your hand, otherwise that one card can screw things up. So I'd do it this way.

Quote
+1 Action, +1 Buy

If the revealed cards all have different names, +1 Card, +2 Actions. Otherwise, +1 Card.

That does say it better grr. Will make the change. Thank you



You could simplify it to
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Reveal your hand. If the revealed cards all have different names, +2 Actions. Either way, +1 Card.

861
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Stone Age Set
« on: October 27, 2019, 03:14:22 pm »
I can see why people would be upset by Harem, but what's wrong with Native Village?

862
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 27, 2019, 11:47:16 am »
Fur Trader is strong enough to cost imo, regardless of comparing it to cards like Explorer. Also, nitpick: The word "Silver" should be capitalized in both cards.

863


So different approach than the one I submitted. After making changes based on what majiponi said, it was basically a Band of Minions. Assembly by Gazbag was my favorite card, so I liked the idea of a Throne Room element.

Play up to two different Action cards from the Supply that have Student tokens on them, leaving them there.
-
When you gain this, put a Student token on a non-Command Action Supply pile costing up to $4.


So it does not permit a throne room double play, as you need to play two different cards or just play one. The token mechanism slows the card down, which I'm hoping justifies the cards's cost being at $4 instead of $5. Still very Band of Minions-ish, but the double play makes it more effective once you have two tokens out.

I would price this at at the very least. It only takes two Scholasticus gains to make it WAY better than BoM. Which means that just two or more people have to open with it and it suddenly becomes a broken card. I would probably price it at .
I'd go further and claim that this is broken at any price.
After two gains this is a e.g. double Lab in a Kingdom with Village and Smithy (and we know from the secret history that DXV was never able to make a double Lab work).
Advisor and Silk Merchant net draws 3 cards and yields an extra Buy. Mono-card-engine at a piece price of $4 is crazy.
The worst case is something like Pearl Diver and Moat but even then it is still a Lab.

It only takes up one card slot, so Pearl Diver + Moat is net +3 Cards and +1 Action, so that's actually slightly better than double Lab, and Village + Smithy is net +4 Cards and +2 Actions, or a triple Lab plus a Village.

Now that you've pointed this out, I completely agree that Scholasticus doesn't work at any price.

864
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 26, 2019, 12:31:35 pm »
I may as well have a go at this, even though my submission is basically guaranteed not to win. In the extremely rare event that I do win, I'd like to design the challenge, but let the runner up judge, since I am not at all good at that sort of thing. Without further ado;

Senator
$3
Action-Duration
+1 Card
+1 Action
At the start of your next turn, if you have 4 or less cards in hand, +2 Cards.
Heirloom: Bonds

Bonds
$2
Treasure-Heirloom
$2
When you play this, put your -1 Card token onto your deck.

The vast majority of the time, the only way to trigger Senator is to play it and Bonds in the same turn, and even when you do trigger it that way, the first +Card just gives you whatever you would have had without the -1 Card token, so Senator is effectively just a hard to trigger Caravan that doesn't stack. It's too weak compared to Caravan to cost . The problem with minus variants of cards that cost or less is that the difference between costs that low is almost negligible, so the difference has to be very small. The difference between Senator and Caravan is not small.

865
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Contest #49: Custom Heirloom
« on: October 26, 2019, 05:18:22 am »


Wizard acts like a cheap Witch, but you have to play your Grimoire once per Curse you want to give out.

Version History (Wizard):
v1.0: Original version.
v1.1: Reduced Cursing cost from two Spell tokens to one.
v1.2: Added +1 Buy to Wizard's vanilla bonuses.

Version History (Grimoire):
v1.0: Original version.
v1.1: Lowered cost to .

866


So different approach than the one I submitted. After making changes based on what majiponi said, it was basically a Band of Minions. Assembly by Gazbag was my favorite card, so I liked the idea of a Throne Room element.

Play up to two different Action cards from the Supply that have Student tokens on them, leaving them there.
-
When you gain this, put a Student token on a non-Command Action Supply pile costing up to $4.


So it does not permit a throne room double play, as you need to play two different cards or just play one. The token mechanism slows the card down, which I'm hoping justifies the cards's cost being at $4 instead of $5. Still very Band of Minions-ish, but the double play makes it more effective once you have two tokens out.

I would price this at at the very least. It only takes two Scholasticus gains to make it WAY better than BoM. Which means that just two or more people have to open with it and it suddenly becomes a broken card. I would probably price it at .

867



So you have 12 Kingdom cards instead of 10, but only 2 of those are available for purchase or gaining when Foreign Merchants is in play. This shifting of 2 piles from Supply and out of it allows for some interesting combos, but there is likely a problem with a card or five that I'm missing.

This is strictly better than a Woodcutter and thus has to cost at least . Based on my instincts, I would price it at even if Woodcutter never existed. I know that the comparison to Woodcutter isn't as big a deal since Woodcutter was removed, but having a card be strictly better than even a removed card at the same cost rubs some people the wrong way, and "some people" includes me. (Although since part of the point of this thread was to buff the removed cards, I wouldn't have brought this up if it didn't seem like a even without the Woodcutter comparison.)

Thanks Gubump. Made the change to Manoralism and that finally clarifies the cost clarity requests.

You should update the OP with all the updated cards. It says it has all the updated cards, but it doesn't, and the newest version of Manorialism isn't anywhere in this thread.

868
Thanks mate.

So I'm confused. Official cards never clarify the cost regarding potions or debt. I've always understood it that potion costs and debt costs don't factor in such cases. The wiki states such costs are orthogonal and have no official equivalency. So why does this keep popping up in comments on the board? Is this just a preference in the community? I'm late to this board so some things are still over my head in the community's ideas. Anyway, I'll phrase it as you said, "highest cost in coins ($)" to make it clear.



It's because of context. Official cards are either cards like Remodel which selects a specific cost based on some condition (for example, if you trash an Overlord, the cost Remodel selects as the limit is ), or cards with an if-clause like Chariot Race (if your card costs more than theirs), which is false if the two cards are incomparable. Your previous Feast, however, instructs you to select the card with the highest card, which is undefined if the costs are incomparable. I guess you could rule that it just fails to select a card in that case, but it's best to make things clear where you can.

tl;dr: Official cards don't usually clarify cost in because they still have defined behavior without that specification. Your previous version of Feast does not have defined behavior without that specification.

For Manoralism, how would this language work? "Once per turn, you may reveal any number of Estates or Duchies from your hand. If you do, cards cost $1 less per card revealed, but not less than $0." The beginning clause is used in some Events, and it would be really odd to execute this on another player's turn. I'm going to keep the end clause and wait till I see it changed in the Digital game.



That wording wouldn't quite work, because it needs to say that cards cost less per card revealed[, but not less than ] for the rest of the turn. Otherwise, it just says that card costs are reduced without saying for how long, so the cost reduction would apply for the rest of the game, which is clearly not what you intend.

869
So this is a new card.



I wanted to make a Treasure that could toy with Supply-Demand after seeing Tejayes's Rare Earth winner in Design Contest #4. This is my third take on it. To emulate the speculation crash of the Dutch Tulip madness, players can time the plays for big payouts but then someone is going to have to trash their cards.

Is it intentional that Tulips counts other players' Tulips?

870
Going to try this instead after feedback:



Each player (including you) reveals a card from their hand. Note the highest cost of the cards revealed. You may trash a card you have in play or in hand to gain a card from the Supply costing up to $1 more than it. Then all other players may trash a card from their hand to gain a card from the Supply costing up to $1 less than it.

The phrase "note the highest cost of the cards revealed." Was made so that the following sentences could refer to "it" rather than type that twice.



Okay, so now Estates and Duchies can act like Bridges, but to get this you need to pass up on buying a Province.

Feast needs to say something along the lines of "highest cost in ." Neither Overlord nor Estate cost more nor less than the other, so just "highest cost" is undefined in cases like that.

Manorialism needs to be rephrased, because as worded, you could just keep revealing the same Estate over and over again to make all cards free. Here's my suggested wording:
"Once during your turn, you may reveal any number of Estates or Duchies from your hand. All cards cost less per card revealed for the rest of the turn."*
*Doesn't need the "but not less than " clause due to the recent errata.

871
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 25, 2019, 02:02:03 pm »
Tinker can't do my favorite feature of Remodel, which is run down the Province pile (remodel province into province), and while it is non-terminal, it also doesn't have the support cards from things like Imp, Conclave, Throne Room, Scepter, etc, which make it not-a-stop card; You have to hang onto it and the target card until you're night phase. Those two play differences - both drawbacks, imo - make it different enough from Remodel to keep at the same price point.

You're right though, it does need the "from the Supply" specification. 

1. Considering that Remodel only costs , running down the Province pile is far from the main point of Remodel.
2. The second drawback you mention only comes into play in the late game, but Remodel and Tinker are both priced such that you can open with them. Needing to hang onto the target card until your Night phase doesn't make any difference unless you'd draw into the card you gain/receive since you wouldn't be playing the target card either way.
Two minor drawbacks do not override two major pluses.

I'm just not seeing it as a $5 card, that's my real issue here. You need the target card in-hand, which absent a draw engine, leaves you 3 other cards to buy or play; if you try to capitalize on the non-terminality, you've got one other card to buy or play. Even in a draw engine, these eat at what you've got available for the rest of your turn, which you've gotta play beforehand.
The non-terminality is simply far more important than Province-Province or drawing into the gained card during the same turn. The reason for the latter is again the limitedness of terminal space: you are rarely able to use a Remodel variant (not even Replace) mid-turn and then still have the Actions left to draw into the gained card (respectively you first gotta spend your draw power to draw into something you want to Remodel).

how do you draw into the gained* card in your night phase?

You don't. That's one of the only ways Tinker isn't strictly better than Remodel.

872
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 25, 2019, 01:54:04 pm »
A few editions ago, I posted the Mineworker, which was horribly wordy and broken. Here is the fixed version.



Quote
Mineworker (Action - Duration - Reaction; $5)

+1 Card
+1 Action
Now and at the start of your next turn: you may discard your hand for +5 Cards.

Before resolving the effect of a Duration at the start of your turn, you may reveal this. If you do, the effect will occur at the start of your next turn instead of this turn (the Duration will stay in play).

Mine Cart (Treasure - Heirloom - Reaction, $2)

$1
-
When you play a Duration, you may set this aside. If you do, at the start of your next turn, trash this. +2% per Duration you have in play.

Mineworker's reaction has to specify where it's being revealed from (I assume from your hand).

873
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 25, 2019, 01:52:06 pm »
Tinker can't do my favorite feature of Remodel, which is run down the Province pile (remodel province into province), and while it is non-terminal, it also doesn't have the support cards from things like Imp, Conclave, Throne Room, Scepter, etc, which make it not-a-stop card; You have to hang onto it and the target card until you're night phase. Those two play differences - both drawbacks, imo - make it different enough from Remodel to keep at the same price point.

You're right though, it does need the "from the Supply" specification. 

1. Considering that Remodel only costs , running down the Province pile is far from the main point of Remodel.
2. The second drawback you mention only comes into play in the late game, but Remodel and Tinker are both priced such that you can open with them. Needing to hang onto the target card until your Night phase doesn't make any difference unless you'd draw into the card you gain/receive since you wouldn't be playing the target card either way.
Two minor drawbacks do not override two major pluses.

I'm just not seeing it as a $5 card, that's my real issue here. You need the target card in-hand, which absent a draw engine, leaves you 3 other cards to buy or play; if you try to capitalize on the non-terminality, you've got one other card to buy or play. Even in a draw engine, these eat at what you've got available for the rest of your turn, which you've gotta play beforehand.

Remodel is worse because you don't even have the option to capitalize on its non-terminality because it doesn't have non-terminality. I agree that Tinker is too weak for , but even without the Heirloom I think it's too strong for . I think you'd be best off buffing Tinker into the range. My suggestion would be giving Tin Snips another +Coffers.

874
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 25, 2019, 01:16:34 pm »
Tinker can't do my favorite feature of Remodel, which is run down the Province pile (remodel province into province), and while it is non-terminal, it also doesn't have the support cards from things like Imp, Conclave, Throne Room, Scepter, etc, which make it not-a-stop card; You have to hang onto it and the target card until you're night phase. Those two play differences - both drawbacks, imo - make it different enough from Remodel to keep at the same price point.

You're right though, it does need the "from the Supply" specification. 

1. Considering that Remodel only costs , running down the Province pile is far from the main point of Remodel.
2. The second drawback you mention only comes into play in the late game, but Remodel and Tinker are both priced such that you can open with them. Needing to hang onto the target card until your Night phase doesn't make any difference unless you'd draw into the card you gain/receive since you wouldn't be playing the target card either way.
Two minor drawbacks do not override two major pluses.

875
Weekly Design Contest / Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« on: October 25, 2019, 11:39:39 am »
Some stiff competition already this week. I think I mostly want to play Fragasnap's entry because I'm p sure I can get Lord Rattington to masquerade some horseshoes over to me.

My entry: Tinker, Tin Snips



Quote
Tinker • $4 • Night
Exchange a card from your hand for a card costing up to $2 more than it.
Heirloom: Tin Snips
Quote
Tin Snips • $2 • Treasure - Reaction - Heirloom
$1
-
When you return a card to the supply, you may discard this from your hand for +2 Coffers

The Heirloom is pretty closely coupled to Tinker, but it also works with the Nocturne exchangers (bat/vampire/changeling) and Travellers, Ambassador, and vanishing cards (experiment, encampment, etc), although not with Not-In-Supply vanishing cards like Madman or Spoils.

I think that Tinker compares too favorably to Remodel. Tinker is both non-terminal and synergizes with Tin Snips, and exchanging isn't that different from trashing most of the time.
More importantly, Tinker needs to specify that you can only exchange for cards from the Supply. As worded, you can use Tinker to exchange an Estate for a Warrior.

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