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2651

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan Expansion: Guilds Part 2

« on: June 20, 2013, 04:00:22 pm »

The reaction on Paymaster seems ridiculous.  With cantrip +buy, you can just pick up five or six duchies at the end of the game.

Otherwise, I think the main issues have been pointed out by other people.  Investor might be too strong, but I'm still not sure how valuable coin tokens are.  You might want to change Blacksmith to force you to pay and gain (so if you pay $0 you have to gain Copper); I think 3 coin tokens for $5 is too much.

Most of these cards look interesting.

2652

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: A Guilds/Prosperity card

« on: June 19, 2013, 10:48:39 pm »

Maybe $4 would be better?  I think I originally had only 1 VP or 1 coin token and that seemed a lot worse than Monument, so I bumped it to $3, then ended up changing it to 2 VP and 2 coin tokens, but left it at $3.

Woodcutter is not a power card, but on big money, a strategy all other ways to play Dominion must compete with, it's okay to mix in a Woodcutter or two when you could get a Silver. Either way, even if Donald himself thought it was the crappiest card he ever made, you can't just make a card that is Woddcutter+ for 3$. You'd have to give it a drawback to balance that, and neither 2 VP nor 2 coin tokens are any worse than +2$ - in fact, VP tokens are worth about the same and coin tokens are much better.

I realize that; when I was writing that I hadn't realized that I made it strictly better than Woodcutter, I was thinking of it more like an Ironmonger-Spy or Noble Brigand-Thief sort of thing, where they share similarities, and one is almost always better than the other at the same cost.  I did not intend for the card to be strictly better than Woodcutter.  Now that I realize that it is, I would definitely price it at $4 or more.

2653

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Aqueduct & Rental (& Nouveau Riche & Parliament) - and the rest

« on: June 19, 2013, 07:39:56 pm »

In-pand
Put your discard piles top card back in the supply. Gain any number of cards from the trash that have the same total cost as the returned card and put them in your hand.

This is probably never worth getting if there is no other trashing card on the board.  The other two gain-from-trash cards we have have a way to get good stuff into the trash; this doesn't.

More importantly, this is probably not even worth getting on any board that doesn't have a card that cares about cost when trashing.  That is, if there is something like Chapel on the board, but not something like Remodel, then there are probably going to be only Coppers and Estates (and possibly Curses and Ruins) in the trash, and you probably don't want any of those.

I get that gaining a bunch of Copper from the trash into your hand could be cool, but Beggar gains Copper in hand, and look how popular Beggar is.  So I wouldn't be surprised if you tend to end up worse off by playing this card (being forced to gain Estates or Shelters) than you would by not playing it.

Anyway, it's an interesting idea.  Having something that cares about the top-card of your discard pile is whacky, but it could be fun.  I would suggest adding a vanilla bonus or something to counterbalance its weakness, and/or add something that gets good cards into the trash.

2654

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Crone

« on: June 19, 2013, 07:18:32 pm »

The on-play effect seems incredibly weak.  If it happens to be the $1 that bumps you up from $7 to $8, and you have a spare action, then you would probably play it.  But for the most part, it's a dead card once it's in your deck.

I think the on-gain effect is something that has been done on other fan cards, and I think it runs into some problems, although limiting it to only buying one Crone per turn might circumvent most of them.  Limiting to only one buy per turn might also prevent some problems that tend to arise with a $0 kingdom card.

The on-trash clause is weird and you would have to be a lot more explicit about it.  Where does it go if I can't trash it?  Does it go back into my hand like Fortress?  Or am I just not allowed to trash it at all if I can't?  And if it's the latter, then what happens if I play a card that forces me to trash, and Crone is the only card in my hand?  It also has the Throne Room/Moneylender wording problem of being forced to do something, but not requiring that you reveal your hand to prove that you can't do it, although that's a lot more minor.

There's a reason no cards have an on-gain (or on-trash) effect that give +buy or +coin (or +actions).  That reason is that you can gain cards not on your turn, and then it gets weird.  If my opponent Swindles my Copper into a Crone, then hey I gained a Crone so I get +1 buy, +$1.  But it's not my turn, so what happens to that bonus?  Is it saved until next turn, or does it just go away?

To fix this, you probably just want to make it an on-buy effect, rather than on-gain.  I came up with a card once that had an on-trash effect that was something like "When you trash this, set it aside.  At the start of your next turn, +$3 and move it to the trash pile".  I think you might be able to get a similar wording to work for +coin on-gain, but I don't think that would have the same effect as what you intended.

To criticize the card itself (and not just the wording issues), I think it's a very very weak card.  Most of the time, it will not be worth getting a dead card just to get $1 more to spend on this turn, especially because you (usually) have to pay $1 to trash it.  But then it really changes things when you hit that $7 hand near the end when you know you're not going to be re-shuffling anyway.

So everything I've said so far sounds very negative; I hope it didn't come off as harsh.  I do think that you did a good job realizing some of the potential problems with it and addressed them appropriately (limiting to one buy of Crone per turn, making it hard to trash), but overall I just don't think it would work as it is.  If you really like the card, then you should keep working on it and try to fix some of the problems I mentioned.  It's not necessarily a concept that can't work, but I think if this concept is going to be successful, the end result will end up looking quite different from the card you have here.

Edit: I wrote this assuming that the -1 VP was like a -VP token that you got each time you played it.  As noted by Warfreak2, if you mean to make it like a Curse, you should have a line separating the -1 VP.

2655

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Aqueduct & Rental (& Nouveau Riche & Parliament) - and the rest

« on: June 19, 2013, 06:40:55 pm »

I was thinking like "You may choose an action card from your hand costing up to $6.  Play it X times, where X is 6 minus the cost of the card, in coin."  I think the second sentence is a little clearer, and then the first sentence prevents playing potion-cost cards, as well as trying to play a $7 card negative one times (or Peddler negative two times).

2656

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: A Guilds/Prosperity card

« on: June 19, 2013, 06:18:28 pm »

Right, I think I confused myself between what would happen if you save coin tokens and what would happen if you spent them when I wrote that.  If you save them every time, you get +2 VP every other time you play it, but then the coin tokens aren't doing anything for you.  If you spend them every time, well, then you just get more coin tokens when you play it.

Maybe $4 would be better?  I think I originally had only 1 VP or 1 coin token and that seemed a lot worse than Monument, so I bumped it to $3, then ended up changing it to 2 VP and 2 coin tokens, but left it at $3.

2657

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: A Guilds/Prosperity card

« on: June 19, 2013, 05:39:06 pm »

I was working on a fan expansion that had a card to represent each pair of sets (e.g. an Intrigue-Seaside card, an Intrigue-Alchemy card, ..., a Dark Ages-Guilds card).  The Guilds-Prosperity card I came up with I think is quite interesting:

Name
$3 - Action
+1 buy
If you have more coin tokens than VP tokens, +2 VP.  Otherwise, take 2 coin tokens.

It probably compares too favorably to Woodcutter, but who cares, that's Woodcutter.  At first you look at it and think "+2 VP on a $3 card, man, that's too strong".  But even if you spend your coin tokens as soon as you get them every time, it only gives you +2 VP every other time you play it.  And it might be less frequently than that, if you're saving up the coin tokens.  The farther into the game you get, the harder it becomes for this card to give you victory points.

I could still be way off though, I can also see this being a super-powerful $3.  In particular, two coin tokens might be too much, I don't have enough experience with Guilds to really be sure about that.

2658

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Aqueduct & Rental (& Nouveau Riche & Parliament) - and the rest

« on: June 19, 2013, 05:26:13 pm »

Parliament
4$, Action
You may choose an action card from your hand. Play it X times, with X being what the card costs less then 6$.

My first thought is that this is very strong with cantrip $2s.  In particular, playing pawn for +4 cards, +$3, +1 action, and being able to make that flexible based on what you need at the time, seems like too much.  Being able to King's Court a $3 card might also be good in some cases, and throning $4s is exactly what throne room already does, so that's fine.  There's also Poor House which, even with the other three cards in your hand being treasures, becomes +$5, and assuming none of those treasures are HoP, drawing Parliament+Poor House guarantees Province.

There are clearly situations in which this card is an absolute powerhouse, but I wouldn't be surprised if many games see it getting less use than throne room.  As LastFootnote pointed out, it's usually $5s (or $6s or $7s) that you want to throne room, and this can't do that.

My initial impression of this is that it is either brokenly overpowered or completely useless, but I think I may have convinced myself that it's not so bad.  You can probably get some interesting engines that really focus on playing this with $2 and $3 cards on many boards, and I'm guessing on many boards there will be a temptation to try to set up such an engine, and it just won't work.  I think that's a good thing.  There will be some boards where it's absolutely dominant, but that's not really a problem, every card has boards where it shines.

I think that a re-wording would be necessary though, as well as clarification as to what happens with potion-cost cards.

2659

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas

« on: June 18, 2013, 03:33:52 pm »

Copper
$2 - Act
Copper produces an extra $0.5

Work
$1.5 - Act
Gain a card

Out
$2.5 - Act
You only draw 3 cards in this turn's Clean-up phase.

Philosopher
$1.5+half a potion - Trea
When you play this, count your deck and discard pile.

2660

Goko Dominion Online / Goko has Market Square with On-Trash Drawing Wrong?

« on: June 18, 2013, 03:39:47 am »

I recently played a game in which I opened Remake/Market Square.  Turn 3 I drew Remake, Overgrown Estate, and 3 Coppers.  I play Remake, trash Overgrown Estate, draw a card because I trashed Overgrown Estate, and hey that card is Market Square.  I get excited because now I can reveal Market Square, so I eagerly click on it to discard and gain a Gold...but it trashes it instead, as the second card trashed from Remake.  Goko never gave me an opportunity to reveal Market Square.

This is incorrect, right?  I should be able to reveal it, even though I drew it from the trashed Overgrown Estate?

2661

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Molecule Splitter+Ions

« on: June 18, 2013, 02:07:13 am »

The opportunity cost seems very high.  I pay $5 to buy it, then later when I play it, hopefully I have a $5 card in hand that I don't mind trashing.  The ions are gained to hand, that's nice, but after playing them I still only have a 5-card hand.  It's kind of like a cantrip that turns an expensive card in your deck into two labs.  That doesn't sound so bad, except that I need to have that expensive card in my hand at the time I play it, what are the odds of that, and maybe I would want to be playing that card anyway.

It's hard to say, but I think this would be weak.  It might also be interesting if the ions cost $5*, then they are one of the things that I can trash to get ions.

You would have a 7 card hand at the end.

Play the Splitter, trashing a $5.  Now you have 3 cards in hand.  Gain the two ions in hand.  Now you have 5 cards.  Play each one.  Now you have 7 cards.

Ah, that's right.  I double-checked that and still got it wrong.  That's a lot better then, although I'm still guessing the card is weak overall.

2662

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Molecule Splitter+Ions

« on: June 17, 2013, 11:03:48 pm »

The opportunity cost seems very high.  I pay $5 to buy it, then later when I play it, hopefully I have a $5 card in hand that I don't mind trashing.  The ions are gained to hand, that's nice, but after playing them I still only have a 5-card hand.  It's kind of like a cantrip that turns an expensive card in your deck into two labs.  That doesn't sound so bad, except that I need to have that expensive card in my hand at the time I play it, what are the odds of that, and maybe I would want to be playing that card anyway.

It's hard to say, but I think this would be weak.  It might also be interesting if the ions cost $5*, then they are one of the things that I can trash to get ions.

2663

Dominion General Discussion / Plaza/Poor House

« on: June 17, 2013, 08:37:50 pm »

This seems very powerful.  Each plaza you play gets you a coin token and makes poor houses each worth $1 more.  Having a Poor House in hand ensures that you can buy Plaza (assuming you didn't get a HoP for some reason), and you can almost always buy Poor House, so it needs very little support.  +Buy probably speeds it up.  Discarding attacks can hurt a little, but with multiple Poor Houses in hand it might actually benefit you.  I'm guessing cursing hurts a lot.

Thoughts?  Is this as awesome as it sounds?  How fast is it?  What counters it?